Plastic Sacks and Cache Containers

5k · June 2, 2002

Short rant and inquiry follows:

I recently took a 4-day, partly geocaching inspired roadtrip on my motorcycle to southern Louisiana. I noticed a strange phenomenon along the way that made me curious.

Four of the caches that I found in Mississippi/Louisiana were some sort of plastic tupperware-type container enclosed in a plastic sack. A couple of the sacks were black garbage sacks and a couple were Wal-mart bag style sacks.

In all cases except one, the plastic bags were torn and shredded beyond any usefulness and at two caches I saw no reason to try to replace the container back into the mess and decided instead to throw the bag into the nearest trash can.

A couple of the caches were placed by the same person, but not all of them. I'm wondering if this is a regional thing or what. A recent geocaching trip to Minnesota found no such thing.

Does this work? Do the bags hold up for a while and keep the contents dry? In my case, all the caches were mostly dry regardless of the condition of the bag.

Mostly, I wish people didn't do this, since it makes the cache very messy to try to open, and also makes it look very much like litter. But if this is a useful technique, maybe I can understand.

Any thoughts?

Jamie

June 2, 2002

Putting a rubbermaid tub into a black plastic bag or a brown plastic bag is an easy way to camouflage it effectively. If you're hiding it in a dark place (like in a crevice in a rock wall, or in a hollow under a log or stump) that darn black plastic bag can make it nearly impossible to see.

June 2, 2002

I think often similarities in techniques pop up in an area because people will do their caches the way they saw others done. The plastic bags do not hold up well and since it could easily be mistaken for trash, this may be why some are removed. For instance, JamieZ, I noted you had to chunk the plastic bag at the Windsor Ruins cache. I had replaced that bag when I was there and it hadn't been hit much in between. Trash bags just don't hold up to the elements and cramming into tight spots geocaching puts them through. If you wish to "camo" a container, you can try camo duct tape, spray paint, camo or dark pillowcases, etc. As far as keeping water out, just use a well sealed container.

Ever notice everybody is willing to give THEIR 2 cents worth but only offer a penny for YOUR thoughts?

June 2, 2002

It's become like a local joke, when people from northern oregon come down to find caches they're supprised to see that all of our caches are in black garbage bags. For me it's a two-fold reason. The biggest being it is VERY effective camoflauge, I can't tell you the number of times I've stood right over the cache and haven't been able to see it. Only sticking my hand in there reveals it. Second, it helps keep water out of the cache. Even if you use a water tight container there's still a chance that someone won't close it properly. The bag provides extra insurance.

Regarding them being ripped, it's true that they snag on just about everything, but after a while you get used to them and can generally move/rehide them without ripping them. And regarding them being seen as trash, true again there is more of a chance of people throwing them away without even looking inside, but if they are hidden well, then no one other than a geocacher should find it.

----

Duct tape is like the Force. It has a light side and a dark side, and it holds the universe together.

5k · June 2, 2002

Camoflauge...

That's something I hadn't considered.

Of course, the Wal-mart bags aren't camo, but the black trash bags sure do make it hard to see the cache inside some dark crevice.

I guess another reason I don't like 'em is that if the bag is wet, it's not very fun opening it up and reaching your hand in to get the cache.

What Pater said about duct tape is good, and might I also suggest smaller sacks so that I don't have to reach inside some 20-gallon plastic trash bag that's full of mud and water

I'm still a proponent of ammo boxes, and no cache I found during this trip was housed in an ammo box, but I think they would have been ideal for many of them.

Jamie

3.1k · June 2, 2002

Well trash bags are much less likely to be blown up by the bomb squad.

I had a cache in tupperware in plastic survive all winter under 8 feet of snow. No problem.

Never Squat With Yer Spurs On

2.6k · June 2, 2002

quote:
Originally posted by Jamie Z:
Short rant and inquiry follows:

Mostly, I wish people didn't do this, since it makes the cache very messy to try to open, and also makes it look very much like litter. But if this is a useful technique, maybe I can understand.

Any thoughts?

Jamie

I don't like them much either but they're around here too. If it's wet the folds of plastic act like little pockets for water to collect. There is nothing nastier than opening a cache that feels like a wet bag of garbage. I wish people would just pick up a nice ammo box.

As for camo... i think it's a waste. It makes the cache bulky, it's not hard to spot a big wad of plasic. What works better is to go to the hardware store and buy some actual camo paint, 2 or 3 colors are enough. And make your own camo pattern. It's not like it takes an artist.

Thumbs down for the black plastic.

george

Remember: Half the people you meet are below average.

June 2, 2002

I think it may be the overkill factor. Afterall, if a tupperware container is good, then a tupperware container wrapped in a Wal*mart sack _must_ be better.

Around these parts, you can always "sense" a Wal*mart in the vicinity by the sudden overabundance of shredded blue plastic sacks hanging on barbed wire fences. The minimum wage flunkies^H^H^H^H^H Associates at Wal*mart don't give two s#!ts about the land around their dumpsters and the "blue flu" is just one indicator.

Wal*mart is bad. If you work there, I'm very sorry and I hope you find a better (and better paying) job at a place that appreciates you. As for consumers, spend your $$$ at your local merchant and know that the money is going to someone who deserves it.

-E

--

N35°32.981 W98°34.631

[This message was edited by TresOkies on June 02, 2002 at 07:32 PM.]

5k · June 2, 2002

quote:
Originally posted by TresOkies:
Wal*mart is bad. If you work there, I'm very sorry and I hope you find a better (and better paying) job at a place that appreciates you. As for consumers, spend your $$$ at your local merchant and know that the money is going to someone who deserves it.

TO,

Thank you for voicing that. I feel the same. When I think about the service I get when I go to some local place and I can actually talk to the owner about the products he sells, I don't worry so much about the few dollars I could have saved had I gone to Wal-mart. Money isn't everything, consider the service and products.

Do you know that 5 of the 10 richest Americans are Waltons? Trust me, they don't need any more of your money.

It's too bad I have to run into Wal-mart bags while out 'caching, too.

Jamie

5k · June 2, 2002

quote:
Originally posted by TresOkies:
Wal*mart is bad. If you work there, I'm very sorry and I hope you find a better (and better paying) job at a place that appreciates you. As for consumers, spend your $$$ at your local merchant and know that the money is going to someone who deserves it.

TO,

Thank you for voicing that. I feel the same. When I think about the service I get when I go to some local place and I can actually talk to the owner about the products he sells, I don't worry so much about the few dollars I could have saved had I gone to Wal-mart. Money isn't everything, consider the service and products.

Do you know that 5 of the 10 richest Americans are Waltons? Trust me, they don't need any more of your money.

It's too bad I have to run into Wal-mart bags while out 'caching, too.

Jamie

3.1k · June 2, 2002

But where else can I park my 5th wheel for free? They have such a huge paved parking lot that they don't even notice my holding tank draining during the night.

Never Squat With Yer Spurs On

June 2, 2002

quote:
Originally posted by Lazyboy & Mitey Mite:
But where else can I park my 5th wheel for free?

I've heard that argument before, but there are signs all over my local Wal-Mart parking lot that forbid people to park overnight.

Fortunately for me, Berkeley has all sorts of locally owned stores that are run by small familes. We have chain stores as well but they're not the majority like in most places.

Unfortunately for me, they make me drive to a different city if I want to invest in chunks of evil metal.

You've missed out on the main point of shopping at local small stores instaed of a big-box. You can preach about geocaching to the owners without the concern that a video camera has captured an employee taking longer than 15.374 seconds to complete a transaction.

June 2, 2002

I have seen the glad-ware and plastic bag caches too--I used to rant about the glad-ware, and still don't think it's the best container to use, but if the cache owner does maintenance often, and keeps up with the logs, and thus replaces containers with broken lids, cracked bottoms, etc. then I can see why it could be more economically viable than spending a chunk of change on an ammo can that might possibly end up stolen.

www.1800goguard.com

June 2, 2002

quote:
Originally posted by Lazyboy & Mitey Mite:
But where else can I park my 5th wheel for free? They have such a huge paved parking lot that they don't even notice my holding tank draining during the night.

I parked my fiver behind a Burger King in Kayenta, AZ last week because there was no place to hook up within 50 miles. "Sarge and Marge" at the park in Cottonwood said that Wal*Marts are starting to prevent people from parking in their lots. Wouldn't know first hand because you can't drag me into one of those places.

Boy, have we gotten off-topic. Sorry 'bout that.

-E

--

N35°32.981 W98°34.631

5k · June 2, 2002

quote:
Originally posted by TresOkies:
Boy, have we gotten off-topic. Sorry 'bout that.

Fine with me... I think our Wal-mart discussion was pertinent since some cachers use their sacks.

Jamie

5k · June 2, 2002

quote:
Originally posted by TresOkies:
Boy, have we gotten off-topic. Sorry 'bout that.

Fine with me... I think our Wal-mart discussion was pertinent since some cachers use their sacks.

Jamie

June 3, 2002

In my opinion the use of trash bags should be seriously discouraged.

They look like garbage in a place where garbage shouldnt be found usually.

It gives Geocaches a BAD rap, especailly on federal land, where I have found several of these mostly in Mississippi.

They are NASTY when all wet, and they STINK.

They DONT keep water out..

They are uysually used to supplement the water resistance of a cheapo substandard cache container.

In my opinion, if your cache is thought thru so little that you have to supplement weather resistance with a garbage bag, then maybe your cache should have been subjected to more thought in the 1st place.

Ammo cans are CHEAP people...

They are water tight, and can be painted to whatever camo pattern you like..

I can promise you youll make it a much better experience for the people finding your caches if you use a proper container, and not use TRASH BAGS.

Thanks for bringin this up JamieZ I have been wanting to vent on this practice for a good while now..

Buck8Point

-------------------------

If I can't Fix it, It's Definately Broke.

June 3, 2002

Not so long ago, Buck8Point, Sydnie and I made a cache run to Mississippi. I can't remember if we found 3 or 4 that day...but I do remember they were ALL WRAPPED IN PLASTIC!!! It's just nasty! Especially down here, it's wet most of the time, and the water starts to smell when it's all trapped in a bag.

The first cache we found was one of those cheese containers with an attached lid that just clamps down and the lid didn't even lip over the bottom piece of the box and then it was wrapped in a walmart bag sitting under a log...with water, dirt, etc

The last one, I remember well...cuz I was getting a lil angry, sick and when we finally found the cache (if you can even call it that) I was READY TO GO HOME!!!!!! It was a Ice Cream bucket (flimsy plastic which is flexible, and pops open in the heat of the south! ) with water in the bottom of the actual bucket...all wrapped up in a black garbage bag, with more water trapped in it, stuffed behind a tree that was holding water itself. I was quite disappointed in that one!

Who wants to stick there hand in a bag and pull it out feeling like it's covered in algae?? or what if a slithery critter decides to crawl up in the bag and hide? Personally, I think it looks like GARBAGE and if we hide this kinda thing in parks, etc...you can't really blame the park authorities for not allowing geocaching in their areas!

Oh, and while I'm griping...those disposable gladware things just SUCK! They are thin plastic which can easily be eaten up by squirrels etc...ruining the cache! It's really not expensive to buy an ammo can, and a lil paint! And the caches seem to last longer too, unless of course it's the FBI that's hunting them!

=============

If life gives you lemons, squeeze the juice into a watergun and shoot other people in the eyes.

June 3, 2002

Not so long ago, Buck8Point, Sydnie and I made a cache run to Mississippi. I can't remember if we found 3 or 4 that day...but I do remember they were ALL WRAPPED IN PLASTIC!!! It's just nasty! Especially down here, it's wet most of the time, and the water starts to smell when it's all trapped in a bag.

The first cache we found was one of those cheese containers with an attached lid that just clamps down and the lid didn't even lip over the bottom piece of the box and then it was wrapped in a walmart bag sitting under a log...with water, dirt, etc

The last one, I remember well...cuz I was getting a lil angry, sick and when we finally found the cache (if you can even call it that) I was READY TO GO HOME!!!!!! It was a Ice Cream bucket (flimsy plastic which is flexible, and pops open in the heat of the south! ) with water in the bottom of the actual bucket...all wrapped up in a black garbage bag, with more water trapped in it, stuffed behind a tree that was holding water itself. I was quite disappointed in that one!

Who wants to stick there hand in a bag and pull it out feeling like it's covered in algae?? or what if a slithery critter decides to crawl up in the bag and hide? Personally, I think it looks like GARBAGE and if we hide this kinda thing in parks, etc...you can't really blame the park authorities for not allowing geocaching in their areas!

Oh, and while I'm griping...those disposable gladware things just SUCK! They are thin plastic which can easily be eaten up by squirrels etc...ruining the cache! It's really not expensive to buy an ammo can, and a lil paint! And the caches seem to last longer too, unless of course it's the FBI that's hunting them!

=============

If life gives you lemons, squeeze the juice into a watergun and shoot other people in the eyes.

38.2k · June 3, 2002

I admit to wrapping a few caches in plastic garbage bags to help protect them from the winter snow. I planned on removing the bags come spring, but when I went to the site to do it, I found someone else had already done so.

In retrospect, I realize it was probably a bad idea. The bags do get quite nasty and slimy when wet and if not re-wrapped properly, can collect water and make things worse. I've since converted to using ammo boxes, so snow and water are no longer an issue.

I also agree with Shy babe's assesment of Gladware containers. They don't last long and it's hard to get the lid to seal if the container is full.

Unless it's a high traffic, urban cache that is likely to be plundered, splurge for a decent RubberMaid container, or ammo box.

Anyway, thankfully here in the northeast, wrapping caches in plastic bags does not seem to be a common practice

June 3, 2002

Garbage bags give me the overall desire to trash out the cache.

3.1k · June 3, 2002

The bags will keep out water if a cacher remembers to twist the top closed on the bottom of the bag.

This is how you do it

Insert cache into bag

all the way to the bottom now

turn entire assembly upside down with opening now located at bottom

twist (doesn't matter direction) the top closed tight

place assembly in dark hole with twisted side down

You can do it kids. Those of us that live in snowed in areas know this will work. Unless you fail to reassemble the arrangement correctly.

What makes the authorities more nervous? Something from WalMart (plastic) or something from the US Army (ammo box).

Never Squat With Yer Spurs On

3.1k · June 3, 2002

The bags will keep out water if a cacher remembers to twist the top closed on the bottom of the bag.

This is how you do it

Insert cache into bag

all the way to the bottom now

turn entire assembly upside down with opening now located at bottom

twist (doesn't matter direction) the top closed tight

place assembly in dark hole with twisted side down

You can do it kids. Those of us that live in snowed in areas know this will work. Unless you fail to reassemble the arrangement correctly.

What makes the authorities more nervous? Something from WalMart (plastic) or something from the US Army (ammo box).

Never Squat With Yer Spurs On

1.1k · June 3, 2002

quote:
Originally posted by Kodak's4:
Putting a rubbermaid tub into a black plastic bag or a brown plastic bag is an easy way to camouflage it effectively. If you're hiding it in a dark place (like in a crevice in a rock wall, or in a hollow under a log or stump) that darn black plastic bag can make it nearly impossible to see.

I have a cache that's contained in a Rubbermaid container with a bright white lid (that I've painted over in camoflauge colors). However, paint doesn't seem to stick to the plastic very well, so a lot of it has rubbed off, making it quite easy to spot the cache from a distance. There are a few things I like about the current hiding place, so I don't really want to move the cache. But I know it's been accidentally discovered at least once.

I had considered putting the whole thing inside a tan Meijer's grocery bag (but after reading this thread, I'm glad now that I didn't), or trying to tape fake 'leaves' on the top, or something...but haven't figured out what would work well, and still hold up. I've used camoflauge duct tape on a couple of my smaller containers, but this lid is very large, and doesn't lend itself that that. (I thought about swapping the container out for an ammo can, but since I had another one stolen from a nearby park, I hate to lose a second one. )

Any other suggestions of how to more permanently mask the bright white lid?

-------

"I may be slow, but at least I'm sweet!"

1.1k · June 3, 2002

quote:
Originally posted by Kodak's4:
Putting a rubbermaid tub into a black plastic bag or a brown plastic bag is an easy way to camouflage it effectively. If you're hiding it in a dark place (like in a crevice in a rock wall, or in a hollow under a log or stump) that darn black plastic bag can make it nearly impossible to see.

I have a cache that's contained in a Rubbermaid container with a bright white lid (that I've painted over in camoflauge colors). However, paint doesn't seem to stick to the plastic very well, so a lot of it has rubbed off, making it quite easy to spot the cache from a distance. There are a few things I like about the current hiding place, so I don't really want to move the cache. But I know it's been accidentally discovered at least once.

I had considered putting the whole thing inside a tan Meijer's grocery bag (but after reading this thread, I'm glad now that I didn't), or trying to tape fake 'leaves' on the top, or something...but haven't figured out what would work well, and still hold up. I've used camoflauge duct tape on a couple of my smaller containers, but this lid is very large, and doesn't lend itself that that. (I thought about swapping the container out for an ammo can, but since I had another one stolen from a nearby park, I hate to lose a second one. )

Any other suggestions of how to more permanently mask the bright white lid?

-------

"I may be slow, but at least I'm sweet!"

5k · June 3, 2002

quote:
Originally posted by Zuckerruebensirup:
I've used camoflauge duct tape on a couple of my smaller containers, but this lid is very large, and doesn't lend itself that that.

Hmmm, you know, I can't imagine an object so large as to make it difficult to cover in duct tape. Z, four or five strips of duct tape ought to cover that lid quite well, I'd think.

quote:
Originally posted by Shybabe924:
The first cache we found was one of those cheese containers with an attached lid that just clamps down and the lid didn't even lip over the bottom piece of the box and then it was wrapped in a walmart bag sitting under a log...with water, dirt, etc

Shybabe, I found that cache too. Yuck.

B8P, while I was down south finding all the plastic trash bag wrapped caches, I kept seeing your name in the logbooks, so I'm sure it's the same caches we're talking about.

It seems, based on some of the folks who've responded that this may be a regional phenomenon concentrated in southern Mississippi, but has been observed elsewhere.

I think a good solution is to simply use good cache containers (cough, ammo box, cough) when you ("you" being a generic term) place a cache, thereby encouraging other local hiders to do the same. Maybe a suggestion in the online log about it might work too. I might amend my logs and suggest better containers for those wet, nastly caches.

Jamie

5k · June 3, 2002

quote:
Originally posted by Zuckerruebensirup:
I've used camoflauge duct tape on a couple of my smaller containers, but this lid is very large, and doesn't lend itself that that.

Hmmm, you know, I can't imagine an object so large as to make it difficult to cover in duct tape. Z, four or five strips of duct tape ought to cover that lid quite well, I'd think.

quote:
Originally posted by Shybabe924:
The first cache we found was one of those cheese containers with an attached lid that just clamps down and the lid didn't even lip over the bottom piece of the box and then it was wrapped in a walmart bag sitting under a log...with water, dirt, etc

Shybabe, I found that cache too. Yuck.

B8P, while I was down south finding all the plastic trash bag wrapped caches, I kept seeing your name in the logbooks, so I'm sure it's the same caches we're talking about.

It seems, based on some of the folks who've responded that this may be a regional phenomenon concentrated in southern Mississippi, but has been observed elsewhere.

I think a good solution is to simply use good cache containers (cough, ammo box, cough) when you ("you" being a generic term) place a cache, thereby encouraging other local hiders to do the same. Maybe a suggestion in the online log about it might work too. I might amend my logs and suggest better containers for those wet, nastly caches.

Jamie

5.9k · June 3, 2002

That gives me a great idea for a cache. Put your cache container in the bag with a couple soda-pop cans and a dirty diaper, leave the whole thing in the parking lot at the local wal-mart. Instant urban cache!

1.1k · June 3, 2002

quote:
Originally posted by Zuckerruebensirup:

I've used camoflauge duct tape on a couple of my smaller containers, but this lid is very large, and doesn't lend itself that that.

quote:
Originally posted by Jamie Z:

Hmmm, you know, I can't imagine an object so large as to make it difficult to cover in duct tape. Z, four or five strips of duct tape ought to cover that lid quite well, I'd think.

Yes, you're right, I could cover the lid in duct tape. I should have worded my statement more clearly, though, to say that "the lid is 1) very large, and 2) doesn't lend itself [to being covered in duct tape]."

Besides the fact that my hubby has complained every time I've 'borrowed' his camo duct tape (yeah, I know...I should just buy a roll of my own), I was thinking that the contours of the lid would make it difficult to add duct tape in a way that it would stay on for the duration and not interfere with opening/closing the lid.

2.6k · June 3, 2002

There are so many other containers that are better than something wrapped in plastic... and it doesn't even have to be an ammo box.

Large plastic mayo jars, just wash and paint camo, or any large plastic jar that held candy or food, the bulk sizes you get from Costco. Again, wash well and paint camo.

PVC constructed containers.

If your container doesn't hold paint well, try to primer it first then paint it camo.

george

Remember: Half the people you meet are below average.

1.3k · June 3, 2002

quote:
Originally posted by BrianSnat:

Anyway, thankfully here in the northeast, wrapping caches in plastic bags does not seem to be a common practice

Actually, I have seen a number of bagged caches in the Philly/Camden area and on Long Island. It depends on the context. Sometimes hiding a cache in plain sight as garbage is the easiest thing to do if the area already looks like a bit of a dump or the color of the bag may help blend the cache in with the leaves and branches.

It really isn't so bad if the cache owner checks the cache frequently and cleans out or replaces the bag. The problem is some of those caches are under-maintained and I have had to trash out some tattered bags.

5k · June 3, 2002

quote:
Originally posted by Zuckerruebensirup:
I was thinking that the contours of the lid would make it difficult to add duct tape in a way that it would stay on for the duration and not interfere with opening/closing the lid.

Ah, that was something I hadn't considered.

Like G&M already said, you might look for a different container, or try some primer before the final coat of paint.

Also, you might rough the surface a bit by rubbing it lightly with 100 grit (or higher) sandpaper. Just enough to get that shine off.

Jamie

June 3, 2002

Ammo cans solve all of the above-listed problems.

They're waterproof

They're already 'camo' base colored and easily painted

They're available in many sizes and shapes

They're fun to open

They have that 'military' odor when you pop the top

I will never use anything else.

---------------

Go! And don't be afraid to get a little wet!

June 3, 2002

Ammo cans solve all of the above-listed problems.

They're waterproof

They're already 'camo' base colored and easily painted

They're available in many sizes and shapes

They're fun to open

They have that 'military' odor when you pop the top

I will never use anything else.

---------------

Go! And don't be afraid to get a little wet!

June 3, 2002

Creativity is always good

1.1k · June 3, 2002

quote:
Originally posted by VentureForth:
Ammo cans solve all of the above-listed problems.

They're waterproof

They're already 'camo' base colored and easily painted

They're available in many sizes and shapes

They're fun to open

They have that 'military' odor when you pop the top

I will never use anything else.

It also hurts more when they get stolen.

For the most part, I like ammo cans best, too. However, Rubbermaid types have a frew advantages, as well. For example: 1) They're quieter to open/close, 2) Most are clear, so the contents are (semi) visible without having to open the container first, and 3) They come in many more shapes/sizes than ammo...cylindrical are handy sometimes.

-------

"Once bitten, twice shy!"

1.1k · June 3, 2002

quote:
Originally posted by VentureForth:
Ammo cans solve all of the above-listed problems.

They're waterproof

They're already 'camo' base colored and easily painted

They're available in many sizes and shapes

They're fun to open

They have that 'military' odor when you pop the top

I will never use anything else.

It also hurts more when they get stolen.

For the most part, I like ammo cans best, too. However, Rubbermaid types have a frew advantages, as well. For example: 1) They're quieter to open/close, 2) Most are clear, so the contents are (semi) visible without having to open the container first, and 3) They come in many more shapes/sizes than ammo...cylindrical are handy sometimes.

-------

"Once bitten, twice shy!"

1.1k · June 3, 2002

quote:
Originally posted by MattandLaura:

Creativity is always good

That's cool! (I wonder how long it will hold up to the elements and/or people who are less than careful when opening and closing it, though?)

1.1k · June 3, 2002

quote:
Originally posted by MattandLaura:

Creativity is always good

That's cool! (I wonder how long it will hold up to the elements and/or people who are less than careful when opening and closing it, though?)

June 3, 2002

As Lazyboy pointed out, when found by authorities checking on suspicious container calls, they are more likely to be nervous about an ammo can (or other sealed metal object) than they are a plastic type container, in a garbage bag or not. Cachers here are pretty nervous about using anything that may be construed as a bomb as one of our own was just convicted for placing an ammo can too close to a train tunnel (happened just after 9/11). He had to pay a huge fine and had other sanctions imposed.

I for one think ammo cans do not have any place in geocaching. Niether do pvc pipes (yes I've seen a few caches in these). I'd much rather see any type of tupperware/gladware/plasticware, in a garbage bag or not, than either of these.

----

Duct tape is like the Force. It has a light side and a dark side, and it holds the universe together.

38.2k · June 3, 2002

As has been pointed out in a number of forums, the cache container has little to do with the the "authorities" concern when they find it. The last time I looked, there have been 3 Geocaches that were such a concern to the authorities, that the bomb squad was called in to take them out. One of them was a clear Tupperware container and another was an ammo box "hidden" alongside railroad tracks, next to a tunnel.

I don't see why an ammo box, properly labeled (and all of the ones I've found and placed have been) would be any more of a threat to a non Geocacher, than an object wrapped in a plastic garbage bag.

The caches I place have the words GEOCACHING.COM, NO DANGER and my e-mail address stenciled on the ammo box. What is more threatening to someone who stumbles on a cache; that or some unidentifiable, heavy object wrapped in a plastic garbage bag?

Ammo boxes are the ideal cache container. Geocaching lesson #1 Mr. Gloom, et. al., if you don't want non Geocachers to find your cache, then don't place it where they can find it. Pretty simple.

And back to wrapping caches in plastic garbage bags...it's gross, its disgusting and it doesn't work. PLEASE put a little more thought into your cache and spend the extra dollar or two for a waterproof container. For you silly folk who are still anti-ammo box, try the clear RubberMaid containers with the blue rim. They should last a year or so.

[This message was edited by BrianSnat on June 03, 2002 at 09:47 PM.]

June 3, 2002

Unless this has become geotrashing.com, I'll just keep assuming that any bags left outside the container are to assist me in trashing out stuff.

Seriously, though, I have only seen two caches that were *worse* than the bagged caches I've seen, and those were archived or replaced because of it. If you can't hide a cache without a trash bag, you can't hide a cache there. You have two options: look for a better spot or decorate your container better.

If I were a land manager and I saw a plastic bagged cache, I'd ban caching faster than you can say NPS. Bagged caches should be as welcome as open peanut butter jars in caches. (And no, I'm not at all opinionated on this topic. )

June 3, 2002

Unless this has become geotrashing.com, I'll just keep assuming that any bags left outside the container are to assist me in trashing out stuff.

Seriously, though, I have only seen two caches that were *worse* than the bagged caches I've seen, and those were archived or replaced because of it. If you can't hide a cache without a trash bag, you can't hide a cache there. You have two options: look for a better spot or decorate your container better.

If I were a land manager and I saw a plastic bagged cache, I'd ban caching faster than you can say NPS. Bagged caches should be as welcome as open peanut butter jars in caches. (And no, I'm not at all opinionated on this topic. )

June 3, 2002

quote:
I used to rant about the glad-ware, and still don't think it's the best container to use, but if the cache owner does maintenance often, and keeps up with the logs, and thus replaces containers with broken lids, cracked bottoms, etc. then I can see why it could be more economically viable than spending a chunk of change on an ammo can that might possibly end up stolen.

I was able to order two ammo cans and have them delivered to my front door for under $15. Well, I shouldn't use past tense, I just ordered them and I'm still anxiously awaiting their arrival but it doesn't seem like an overwhelming expense. We've only found two geocaches in ammo cans so far but they were both bone dry and had plenty of room for contents. Made a believer out of me!

GeoMedic - team leader of GeoStars

June 3, 2002

quote:
I used to rant about the glad-ware, and still don't think it's the best container to use, but if the cache owner does maintenance often, and keeps up with the logs, and thus replaces containers with broken lids, cracked bottoms, etc. then I can see why it could be more economically viable than spending a chunk of change on an ammo can that might possibly end up stolen.

I was able to order two ammo cans and have them delivered to my front door for under $15. Well, I shouldn't use past tense, I just ordered them and I'm still anxiously awaiting their arrival but it doesn't seem like an overwhelming expense. We've only found two geocaches in ammo cans so far but they were both bone dry and had plenty of room for contents. Made a believer out of me!

GeoMedic - team leader of GeoStars

5k · June 3, 2002

quote:
Originally posted by BrianSnat:
For those of you idiots who are still anti-ammo box, try the clear RubberMaid containers with the blue rim. They should last a year or so.

BS,

While I agree with most of the points in your post, I don't think it's necessary to resort to disparaging names.

I think ammo boxes are the all-around best container, but plastic certainly has its place.

quote:
Originally posted by Zuck:
It also hurts more when they get stolen.

The small (commonly referred to as 30-caliber) ammo boxes around here sell for $3. One surplus store I stopped at had a bunch of less-than-ideal condition (some rust and dents)small ammo boxes for a dollar each. I bought a couple, sanded them down and they're waiting to be painted.

Maybe ammo boxes are more expensive in your area, but I can't see how $1, or even $3 hurts.

quote:
Originally posted by ClayJar:
If I were a land manager and I saw a plastic bagged cache, I'd ban caching faster than you can say NPS.

That's how I feel too. I'm glad you brought that up. Bagged caches simply look like trash, but a sturdy, presentable container gives some legitimacy to the game to someone who's never played.

Jamie

June 3, 2002

Again CJ....

Very Well Said...

Buck8Point

PS: Having to agree with your opinions latley is hindering my Debating Skills... hehehhe J/K

Buck8Point

-------------------------

If I can't Fix it, It's Definately Broke.

June 3, 2002

Again CJ....

Very Well Said...

Buck8Point

PS: Having to agree with your opinions latley is hindering my Debating Skills... hehehhe J/K

Buck8Point

-------------------------

If I can't Fix it, It's Definately Broke.

June 3, 2002

quote:
Originally posted by BrianSnat:
As has been pointed out in a number of forums, the cache container has little to do with the the "authorities" concern when they find it.

Your points are well taken, however, and I guess I wasn't as clear about this as I should have been, think of the average hiker, park user, whatever when they come across a not very well hidden cache. If they see a metal ammo container I'd imagine they're more likely to think 'What the hell is that doing here' and call the bomb squad, than if they see a black plastic garbage bag to which I'd imagine the most common response is 'It's just more trash' then either leave it alone, or throw it away.

Now, don't get me wrong, I'm not saying plastic bags are good, in fact I hate them, even though I've used a couple. I'm merely saying that I think they pose less of a threat than ammo cans. I do agree that they are gross and disgusting when wet and that they are too easily mistaken for garbage.

Your point about properly labeled ammo cans being safer doesn't really add up. From what I understand all of the caches that were blown up WERE labeled as geocaching containers, yet blown up anyway. And by putting the word 'danger' on your contain, even to say 'no danger' raises even more suspicion about it's contents.

Regarding your thoughts that if we don't want caches to be found, then we should hide them better, you're right, a lot of caches I've seen could be hidden better. But the fact remains, people who are not geocachers are going to find caches no matter how well they are hidden. I seriously doubt that any cache out there could not be found by a non-geocacher if they got lucky. It's just a matter of time. But I'm glad you seem to think hiding them so no one else can find them is 'Very Simple.' Since you think so, can you please give me and everyone else a lesson on how to PROPERLY hide a cache? I'd be interested in seeing how it's done.

quote:
For those of you idiots who are still anti-ammo box, try the clear RubberMaid containers with the blue rim

Please try to refrain from the name calling. This, so far, has been a civilized discussion. Just because someone doesn't agree with YOUR point of view does not make them an idiot.

----

Duct tape is like the Force. It has a light side and a dark side, and it holds the universe together.

June 3, 2002

I don't like black garbage bags. They are used alot around the Sacramento, CA area. I usually find them with many holes and rips so I can't imagine they are very water proof. Also, I don't think they are good camoflage because the plastic is very shiny. I have had no problems spotting caches wrapped in plastic. It is much better to spray paint the container a flat black if you want to camo it. Just my 2 pennies.

Plastic Sacks and Cache Containers

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