The map that shows up when you hide a cache, does it not factor in mystery caches?

[+WoodlandAlliance]

I scoped out an area for a cache. The reviewer said it is too close to a mystery cache and they couldn't tell me where it was. I pulled up the map under the "hide" menu again, and my cache is definitely not in any of the red circles.

 

Does this map not factor in mystery caches? And if not, how do I account for these when hiding a cache?

[+Max and 99]

6 minutes ago, WoodlandAlliance said:

I scoped out an area for a cache. The reviewer said it is too close to a mystery cache and they couldn't tell me where it was. I pulled up the map under the "hide" menu again, and my cache is definitely not in any of the red circles.

 

Does this map not factor in mystery caches? And if not, how do I account for these when hiding a cache?

This Help Center article will answer those questions:

https://www.geocaching.com/play/guidelines

 

In particular:

Don’t rely only on the Geocache Planning Map to choose a location. Multi-Caches, Mysteries, Wherigos, and Letterbox Hybrids can have hidden physical waypoints.

 

 

Edited August 8, 2022 by Max and 99

[+WoodlandAlliance]

So if that map is incomplete, how do I actually verify a cache location is available prior to hiding?

[+Hügh]

9 minutes ago, WoodlandAlliance said:

So if that map is incomplete, how do I actually verify a cache location is available prior to hiding?

 

You can 'Ask a reviewer to check coordinates' prior to hiding your cache. 

 

https://www.geocaching.com/help/index.php?pg=kb.chapter&id=22&pgid=199

Edited August 8, 2022 by Hügh

[+WoodlandAlliance]

So the process to hide a cache is:

 

1 - Find a general location

 

2 - Submit a fake geocache with approximate coordinates to make sure the location is available

 

3 - Once the reviewer approves the temp cache, hide the cache and submit again with final coordinates

 

Is that right?

 

 

[+Hügh]

3 minutes ago, WoodlandAlliance said:

So the process to hide a cache is:

 

1 - Find a general location

 

2 - Submit a fake geocache with approximate coordinates to make sure the location is available

 

3 - Once the reviewer approves the temp cache, hide the cache and submit again with final coordinates

 

Is that right?

 

 

 

Pretty much. Make sure it is very clear that the temp cache should not be published. 

[+TeamRabbitRun]

30 minutes ago, Hügh said:

47 minutes ago, WoodlandAlliance said:

So the process to hide a cache is:

 

1 - Find a general location

 

2 - Submit a fake geocache with approximate coordinates to make sure the location is available

 

3 - Once the reviewer approves the temp cache, hide the cache and submit again with final coordinates

 

Is that right?

 

 

 

Pretty much. Make sure it is very clear that the temp cache should not be published. 

 

Hügh's right, but let me suggest a tweak or two.

 

First of all, attitudinally, don't think if it as a 'temp cache'. You'd be filing 'Step One' of your actual cache, consisting of a 'Coordinate Check'. 'Step One' is standard practice for me, but should be done whenever there's a possibility of a conflict; even if the red circles appear to come SO close to touching.

 

Next, don't use approximate coordinates. DON'T, as you say, 'find a general location'. Your C-Check should have FINAL coordinates. Fuzzy, approximate coords could put you inside or outside of your neighbor's circle, and then you could either get denied later or unnecessarily denied now. Tell your reviewer exactly where you're planting. They will not approve a 'temp cache'.

 

You can even title the cache something like "COORDINATE CHECK ONLY, PLEASE" and rename it later when you request publication. That COULD get you faster service if there's a backlog on the reviewer's end.

 

Tell your reviewer EVERYTHING in your submission note, including why you think you might be in conflict. They're in the business of helping us get stuff hidden (according to the guidelines), not busting our ____ for sport. Think of it as a partnership, and not at all adversarial.

 

Good luck!

[+CAVinoGal]

1 hour ago, WoodlandAlliance said:

So if that map is incomplete, how do I actually verify a cache location is available prior to hiding?

 

As others have said, create your potential cache hide with coordinates of where you want to place it, and submit for coordinate check only.  

 

If the location is in conflict with a mystery or a multi final, look at nearby puzzlesor multis and try to solve them and find them; then you will know where the locations are and can work around them.  One of my first cache placements had this issue, and we were able to solve the puzzle and see the cache was about 50 feet from where I wanted to put mine!  Knowing that location, though, I was able to find an alternate spot that was in an acceptable location.

[+WoodlandAlliance]

3 hours ago, TeamRabbitRun said:

 

Hügh's right, but let me suggest a tweak or two.

 

First of all, attitudinally, don't think if it as a 'temp cache'. You'd be filing 'Step One' of your actual cache, consisting of a 'Coordinate Check'. 'Step One' is standard practice for me, but should be done whenever there's a possibility of a conflict; even if the red circles appear to come SO close to touching.

 

Next, don't use approximate coordinates. DON'T, as you say, 'find a general location'. Your C-Check should have FINAL coordinates. Fuzzy, approximate coords could put you inside or outside of your neighbor's circle, and then you could either get denied later or unnecessarily denied now. Tell your reviewer exactly where you're planting. They will not approve a 'temp cache'.

 

 

If I knew my final location coordinates, I would just submit the cache with them. Seems unnecessary to submit a coordinate request then the real cache if it's all set up already, unless I'm misunderstanding something. 

 

Like this weekend I'm going to a town about an hour away to hide a few caches. I'll submit approximate locations ahead of time, but I won't know the exact location until I go out there and actually place them. I'm not going to drive out there, get the exact location, drive back, submit a coordinate check, then drive out there again to place the cache.

 

I know nobody in this thread decides on the website features, but it does seem unusual that there is no simple way to check for existing caches ahead of time.

[+CAVinoGal]

15 minutes ago, WoodlandAlliance said:

I'm not going to drive out there, get the exact location, drive back, submit a coordinate check, then drive out there again to place the cache.

 

You *could* place the cache, submit the coordinate check, and if all is well, submit the cache for publication.  The added bonus is that the cache is already in place, and you can see how safe and secure it might be  - will it get muggled?  Will critters carry it away? Etc.

 

Look in the town and surrounding area for puzzles and multis - solve them (and/or find them when you are in town) so you know where the locations are and you can plan your hides accordingly.

20 minutes ago, WoodlandAlliance said:

it does seem unusual that there is no simple way to check for existing caches ahead of time.

It would be too easy for folks to connect the dots and get final coordinates for mysteries if their locations were shown on the map like that.  Think of it as a challenge to solve the puzzles!  We have one hider in a town nearby that does almost nothing but puzzles and the map of the town is all question marks....it's very hard to hide a cache in that town!

[+Max and 99]

44 minutes ago, WoodlandAlliance said:

 

If I knew my final location coordinates, I would just submit the cache with them. Seems unnecessary to submit a coordinate request then the real cache if it's all set up already, unless I'm misunderstanding something. 

 

Like this weekend I'm going to a town about an hour away to hide a few caches. I'll submit approximate locations ahead of time, but I won't know the exact location until I go out there and actually place them. I'm not going to drive out there, get the exact location, drive back, submit a coordinate check, then drive out there again to place the cache

If this is an inconvenience already, how will you handle any maintenance issues that arise, if they do? 

[+WoodlandAlliance]

46 minutes ago, Max and 99 said:

If this is an inconvenience already, how will you handle any maintenance issues that arise, if they do? 

I'll happily make the drive when I need to do maintenance.

[+Max and 99]

1 hour ago, WoodlandAlliance said:

I'll happily make the drive when I need to do maintenance.

👍

[+TeamRabbitRun]

5 hours ago, WoodlandAlliance said:

 

If I knew my final location coordinates, I would just submit the cache with them. Seems unnecessary to submit a coordinate request then the real cache if it's all set up already, unless I'm misunderstanding something. 

 

Like this weekend I'm going to a town about an hour away to hide a few caches. I'll submit approximate locations ahead of time, but I won't know the exact location until I go out there and actually place them. I'm not going to drive out there, get the exact location, drive back, submit a coordinate check, then drive out there again to place the cache.

 

I know nobody in this thread decides on the website features, but it does seem unusual that there is no simple way to check for existing caches ahead of time.

 

Well, then, there is an aspect to this you're not getting yet. You can't tell a reviewer "I'm going to put a cache somewhere in this field."

 

No point to it; they'll tell you to come back when you have a precise position. Then, you take your chances when you DO submit that the spot's OK.

 

You say you'll submit approximate locations, then go out and scout out a specific tree. Why? To what end? Don't bother; just go.

 

Asking for a C-check just saves you the effort of doing all the work of creating a cache, writing it up and placing it only to find out you're standing in someone else's shadow.

 

And, the reviewer will just tell you "No"; they won't tell you where the other cache is, for the same reasons!

 

Wasted time.

 

If you don't mind being told after the fact that you can't publish in that spot, then don't bother with the C-check.

 

-------------------------------

 

As for your point about not being able to check for existing caches, how exactly would you propose that they do that? As CAVinoGirl said above, if the website told you if a specific spot was clear or not, you could 'Battleship" your way into the final coordinates of any mystery/puzzle cache.

 

So how would you do it?

 

[+Hynz]

10 hours ago, WoodlandAlliance said:

I'll happily make the drive when I need to do maintenance.

May I - in all humbleness - ask you if you are even *aware* that half of your caches have been archived because you apparently have refused doing maintainance 

[+barefootjeff]

12 hours ago, WoodlandAlliance said:

Like this weekend I'm going to a town about an hour away to hide a few caches. I'll submit approximate locations ahead of time, but I won't know the exact location until I go out there and actually place them. I'm not going to drive out there, get the exact location, drive back, submit a coordinate check, then drive out there again to place the cache.

 

All my hides have had several visits to the site before I actually place the cache and submit the listing. The first is usually just a reconnaissance trip to see if the location in general lives up to expectations (often a feature on a satellite image or something on a map that caught my eye). Sometimes I'll find the ideal hiding place then and there and take its coordinates, but sometimes that needs a second trip after I've given a bit of thought to the theme the location might inspire. Once that's done, it's time to start composing the cache page and assembling the container, which I can only do once I've settled on a hiding place and picked something suitable to put in there. Creating the cache page also gives me the GC code to put on the label. Finally it's another trip to GZ, this time to both place the container and recheck the coordinates I took on my earlier visit. If there's a discrepancy of more than a few metres, I'll likely come back again for another check and some more extensive averaging before clicking Submit.

 

In the months after publication, I'll likely visit the site a few more times to make sure everything's going well. I've been caught out a few times when what I thought was a dry hiding place turned into a watercourse after heavy rain, so after it's weathered its first storm it'll get a check too.

[+WoodlandAlliance]

5 hours ago, Hynz said:

May I - in all humbleness - ask you if you are even *aware* that half of your caches have been archived because you apparently have refused doing maintainance 

Yes, I got into Geocaching 10+ years ago. Long story short a pedophile who I thought was my friend joined me as a way to get closer to my sister so he could groom her. When it all came to light it ruined the hobby for me so I let all my caches rot. That's not going to happen again.

[+OusKonNé & Cétyla]

On 8/8/2022 at 11:35 AM, WoodlandAlliance said:

So if that map is incomplete, how do I actually verify a cache location is available prior to hiding?

 

My area is saturated with near-impossible-to-solve Mystery Caches whose final coordinates are unknown to me.

 

Result: Every time I try to place a new cache, it's refused because it's too close to a mystery cache.

 

I recently had a new cache denied six times in a row. Very frustrating. So I decided to give up.

Edited August 10, 2022 by OusKonNé & Cétyla

[+Isonzo Karst]

Late to this, but here's the text above the planning map: "The map below displays visible locations that are already taken by existing geocaches. The map does not display hidden waypoints..."

 

It cannot show  hdden parts of staged caches, as that would provide an easy method to work out where they are; do some triangulation on the planning map. ;-)

 

An oddity of the map is that it won't show the posted coords of Mystery or LBH, even when they're indicated as physical. (Most challenge caches for example).  On the other hand, some Multi-caches offer all of their coords, other than the final, visibly on the cache page. Those will be shown on the planning map  https://coord.info/GC82A4H.

 

Step 1 of a pre-check. Enter your proposed coords into search.  Limit to 2 miles, and see what's there.  personally, I only asked for physical staged: Mystery, Multi, Letterbox, Wherigo.  The trads I can see readily.  The more staged you see, the more likely you are to have an issue.  Of course, you can just be unlucky too.