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Caches containing Ammo


ihorn
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although I do have a problem with the attitude that you are displaying about ammunition in a cache. I don't care if they said, "should not", or if they said "dude, you will be foreever banned if you do"... the intention and spirit of what the guidelines mean is glaringly obvious and you are simply being obstinate.

 

My attitude is that people are going to do what they want whether you approve of it or not. Especially when there is no legitimate justification as to why.

 

**I'm NOT implying that's my intent, only that it's a part of human nature...

 

(Child making racket)

Parent: "Don't do that"

Child: "Why?"

Parent: "Because I said so"

Child: "Why?"

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What happens when you are CITOing that bullet, and get stoped by a cop? Could make your "I'm just geocaching" story a little harder to explain.

 

Lucky for me, I live in a country where the mere possession of a bullet is not illegal.

Illegal or not, the cop may not believe you that you are all inocent sneeking around and all when you are carrying ammo around.

 

Not sure why! Perhaps the ammo is for the 9mm thats attached to my hip.... oh never mind... it was a .22 round.

 

That being said... the ammo does not belong in a Geocache. It belongs in my Magazine!

Edited by Right Wing Wacko
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although I do have a problem with the attitude that you are displaying about ammunition in a cache. I don't care if they said, "should not", or if they said "dude, you will be foreever banned if you do"... the intention and spirit of what the guidelines mean is glaringly obvious and you are simply being obstinate.

 

My attitude is that people are going to do what they want whether you approve of it or not. Especially when there is no legitimate justification as to why.

 

**I'm NOT implying that's my intent, only that it's a part of human nature...

 

(Child making racket)

Parent: "Don't do that"

Child: "Why?"

Parent: "Because I said so"

Child: "Why?"

My attitude is that MOST people will not*. A very few stubborn people will always go against the flow... that is their nature, its true. But I see you arguing FOR them, thus the tone of my reply.

 

The legitimate justification is indeed the perception of land owners & managers. Most of the guideline document has been written by experience, and much of it from complaints by land managers. Or so say the powers that be, and I have to trust them. Bottom line, IMO, is... why NOT follow these guidelines?

 

* And MOST of them will respond favorably to social pressure. A few will not. We have labels for them.

Edited by knowschad
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....

So you're saying that it's not about the safety aspect, but more about land owners' perceptions and local laws? Well then I could hide a cache at the local WMA shooting range (behind the line) which has dozens if not hundreds of leftover .22lr rounds laying around. And since they have no problems with caches or with ammo in caches it's okay? After all "should not" is not the same as "do not."

 

We "should not" place a cache every 528 feet just because it's possible, but the rules don't say "do not".

It (the guidline) is not there just so that the land owner of your cache think there is no ammo. It is so that every CO can say, hand over their heart, "No sir, there is never ammo in a cache" when the subject come up with any land owner. Your special "Ammo" cache at a shooting range could change the proseption of caching in the eyes of land owners elswhere. And would make it hard for COs to convince them that "that is just a special cache. Every other cache has no ammo in it".

 

Why would they want to say that if not to give the perception that there was no live ammo in caches? :laughing:

I have added some text to my quote. Maybe it will be more obvious what my intent was.

Edited by Andronicus
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(Child making racket)

Parent: "Don't do that"

Child: "Why?"

Parent: "Because I said so"

Child: "Why?"

 

A more accurate example for the last few posts would be...

 

(Child making racket)

Parent: "Don't do that"

Child: "Why?"

Parent: "Because you will wake your sister"

Child: "Why?"

Parent: "Because the neighbors will complain"

Child: "Why?"

Parent: "Because I've asked you to and given you the reasons."

Child: "But...why? I'm going to make the racket anyway, why should you try and stop me?? It's only human nature that I make racket because I'm a child."

 

You've been given the reasons for the guideline, but you're putting your fingers in your ears and saying "na na na na I can't hear you na na na."

 

Would you like to now argue that the "no alcohol and drugs" portion of the guidelines is just a whimsical suggestion? After all, it does say "shouldn't"...

 

:laughing:

Edited by Castle Mischief
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....

So you're saying that it's not about the safety aspect, but more about land owners' perceptions and local laws? Well then I could hide a cache at the local WMA shooting range (behind the line) which has dozens if not hundreds of leftover .22lr rounds laying around. And since they have no problems with caches or with ammo in caches it's okay? After all "should not" is not the same as "do not."

 

We "should not" place a cache every 528 feet just because it's possible, but the rules don't say "do not".

It (the guidline) is not there just so that the land owner of your cache think there is no ammo. It is so that every CO can say, hand over their heart, "No sir, there is never ammo in a cache" when the subject come up with any land owner. Your special "Ammo" cache at a shooting range could change the proseption of caching in the eyes of land owners elswhere. And would make it hard for COs to convince them that "that is just a special cache. Every other cache has no ammo in it".
Why would they want to say that if not to give the perception that there was no live ammo in caches? :laughing:
I have added some text to my quote. Maybe it will be more obvious what my intent was.

Please don't do that. You didn't just add a word or two. This is the same issue I have with people "fixing" other people's posts. At least when it occurs in the next post, people can still easily see the original post. But this one occurs several posts later and on another page. Please at least highlight the additions you made in a "quote".

 

Since the added text changes the quote so much, here is the original:

 

I is not just the perseption of the land owner of your Ammo cache. It is so that every CO can say, hand over their heart, "No sir, there is never ammo in a cache" when the subject come up with any land owner.

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(Child making racket)

Parent: "Don't do that"

Child: "Why?"

Parent: "Because I said so"

Child: "Why?"

 

A more accurate example for the last few posts would be...

 

(Child making racket)

Parent: "Don't do that"

Child: "Why?"

Parent: "Because you will wake your sister"

Child: "Why?"

Parent: "Because the neighbors will complain"

Child: "Why?"

Parent: "Because I've asked you to and given you the reasons."

Child: "But...why? I'm going to make the racket anyway, why should you try and stop me?? It's only human nature that I make racket because I'm a child."

 

You've been given the reasons for the guideline, but you're putting your fingers in your ears and saying "na na na na I can't hear you na na na."

 

Would you like to now argue that the "no alcohol and drugs" portion of the guidelines is just a whimsical suggestion? After all, it does say "shouldn't"...

 

:laughing:

 

You're equating alcohol and drugs(which have laws regulating them) to be on the same level as a little .22lr round (which in itself is harmless)? You sure you're not a holophobe? :huh:

 

Please explain "You've been given the reasons for the guideline" since your only answer so far is "because the rules say so." Give me something other that a circular answer and maybe you'll get more than a circular response.

Edited by jrou111
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For those that are wondering what a "holophobe" is, I would refer you to Wikipedia.

In particular, though, I like this part:

 

The term hoplophobe has been used to encourage constituent letter writing and to raise funds by at least one gun rights advocacy group. They have employed the term hoplophobe to characterize their opponents as outrageous fear-mongerers, and as being irrationally fearful.

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For those that are wondering what a "holophobe" is

 

Yeah, I had to go look it up as well. I thought it was someone afraid of holograms and it just didn't make sense within the context it was presented. :laughing:

;)

 

I wonder if the term comes from "bullet hole", as in, an irrational fear of having a bullet hole in your chest. :huh:

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You're equating alcohol and drugs(which have laws regulating them) to be on the same level as a little .22lr round (which in itself is harmless)? You sure you're not a holophobe? :)

 

Please explain "You've been given the reasons for the guideline" since your only answer so far is "because the rules say so." Give me something other that a circular answer and maybe you'll get more than a circular response.

 

Hey, here's a fun fact: Federal law regulates ammunition. Just like alcohol and drugs.

 

Federal law imposes several restrictions on the transfer and possession of firearm ammunition. The law prohibits the possession of ammunition by convicted felons, controlled substance users, and anyone subject to a domestic violence restraining order, among others, and it prohibits transferring ammunition to such persons as well. It prohibits the sale or transfer of (1) long gun ammunition to anyone under age 18 and (2) handgun ammunition to anyone under age 21. It also strictly regulates armor-piercing handgun bullets.

 

It's the "F" in ATF. Maybe you've heard of them?

 

Reasons? Here you go:

 

Ammunition is a regulated product. For some people it's illegal to have in their possession and it's illegal to give (or sell) it to some groups of people. Just like (wait for it) prescription drugs and alcohol.

 

In some parks and forests it's illegal for anybody to enter with guns and ammunition (as well as knives, fireworks/firecrackers, explosives, tobacco, prescription drugs, and alcohol).

 

Geocaching is open to everybody- all ages and backgrounds. You can't leave a regulated item inside a cache for the next person to pick up because that person could be a minor or other person that is prohibited by law to possess the item.

 

There are plenty of areas where the local cachers have had to fight tooth and nail to retain the privilege to place physical caches. Often these areas are the same ones that have strict prohibitions against what you can and can't bring into them. When regulated items like knives, ammo, cigarettes, booze and drugs start showing up in other caches (regardless of "permission" or location) and word gets around to the land managers of these locations that may be all the reason they need to deny future caches or ban existing caches.

 

For what it's worth, I own a gun so you can stop flashing around your Buzzword of the Day.

Edited by Castle Mischief
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You're equating alcohol and drugs(which have laws regulating them) to be on the same level as a little .22lr round (which in itself is harmless)? You sure you're not a holophobe? :)

 

Please explain "You've been given the reasons for the guideline" since your only answer so far is "because the rules say so." Give me something other that a circular answer and maybe you'll get more than a circular response.

 

Hey, here's a fun fact: Federal law regulates ammunition. Just like alcohol and drugs.

 

Federal law imposes several restrictions on the transfer and possession of firearm ammunition. The law prohibits the possession of ammunition by convicted felons, controlled substance users, and anyone subject to a domestic violence restraining order, among others, and it prohibits transferring ammunition to such persons as well. It prohibits the sale or transfer of (1) long gun ammunition to anyone under age 18 and (2) handgun ammunition to anyone under age 21. It also strictly regulates armor-piercing handgun bullets.

 

It's the "F" in ATF. Maybe you've heard of them?

 

Reasons? Here you go:

 

Ammunition is a regulated product. For some people it's illegal to have in their possession and it's illegal to give (or sell) it to some groups of people. Just like (wait for it) prescription drugs and alcohol.

 

In some parks and forests it's illegal for anybody to enter with guns and ammunition (as well as knives, fireworks/firecrackers, explosives, tobacco, prescription drugs, and alcohol).

 

Geocaching is open to everybody- all ages and backgrounds. You can't leave a regulated item inside a cache for the next person to pick up because that person could be a minor or other person that is prohibited by law to possess the item.

 

There are plenty of areas where the local cachers have had to fight tooth and nail to retain the privilege to place physical caches. Often these areas are the same ones that have strict prohibitions against what you can and can't bring into them. When regulated items like knives, ammo, cigarettes, booze and drugs start showing up in other caches (regardless of "permission" or location) and word gets around to the land managers of these locations that may be all the reason they need to deny future caches or ban existing caches.

 

Thank you, that's all I was looking for.

 

 

For what it's worth, I own a gun so you can stop flashing around your Buzzword of the Day.

 

Just because you own a gun doesn't mean jack. Chuck Schumer and Richard Dailey own guns, as does Michael Bloomberg.

Edited by jrou111
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Thank you, that's all I was looking for.

 

Glad I could help.

 

Just because you own a gun doesn't mean jack. Chuck Schumer and Richard Dailey own guns, as does Michael Bloomberg.

 

Does it matter if I sleep with it next to me in my bed and call it Vera? What, you want me to celebrate its her birthday?

Edited by Castle Mischief
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What happens when you are CITOing that bullet, and get stoped by a cop? Could make your "I'm just geocaching" story a little harder to explain.

 

Lucky for me, I live in a country where the mere possession of a bullet is not illegal.

Illegal or not, the cop may not believe you that you are all inocent sneeking around and all when you are carrying ammo around.

 

Not sure why! Perhaps the ammo is for the 9mm thats attached to my hip.... oh never mind... it was a .22 round.

 

That being said... the ammo does not belong in a Geocache. It belongs in my Magazine!

 

Field & Stream, I presume.

 

Too funny.

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