Placing caches on native american reservations

[+Matt_B_Good]

I live near a Native Nation. I want to place a cache there but I'm not sure how to place one that gets published. The tribe owns all the land. Would I have to write the tribal councel and if so how would I ask in a way that they know what i am talking about? I'm just not sure how to go about this? There are caches on reservations but they are far and few between.

[+NanCycle]

You could contact the people who have placed the caches and ask them how they got permission.

Or you could ask your local reviewer who you should contact for permission.

[jholly]

Find out who the tribal chairman is, or better yet just walk into the trial offices and explain what you want to do. I'm sure the receptionist will find the right person. If they agree, get the name of a contact person and a phone number. Put this information in the reviewer note and put a sentence in the cache description that says this cache was placed with permission. I found my local tribe to be very co-operative and accommodating. Your mileage may vary.

 

Jim

 

Edit: I found I did not have to do lots of explaining. Also make sure you stay clear of any places that have religious or historical significance for the tribe.

Edited September 25, 2009 by jholly

[+Team Cotati]

Find out who the tribal chairman is, or better yet just walk into the trial offices and explain what you want to do. I'm sure the receptionist will find the right person. If they agree, get the name of a contact person and a phone number. Put this information in the reviewer note and put a sentence in the cache description that says this cache was placed with permission. I found my local tribe to be very co-operative and accommodating. Your mileage may vary.

 

Jim

 

Edit: I found I did not have to do lots of explaining. Also make sure you stay clear of any places that have religious or historical significance for the tribe.

 

Which of your cache hides are on reservation lands?

[+Renegade Knight]

...The tribe owns all the land....

 

It's like anywhere else. Permission where needed. On a reservation the land is normally owned by a person or business who in turn can give permission for a cache. Some land is owned by the tribal government same as some land is owned by city, state, county, federal governments. Nothing changes on who you to go for permission. It's who ownes (or controls via a lease etc.) the ground.

 

Some tribes choose to be politically hostile. Those tribes may impose an access fee for non members, wishing to be on the reservation without any particular reason. That's got nothing to do with you getting permission to place a cache. However you may be subject to it in order to wander about and place the cache yourself.

[+humboldt flier]

...The tribe owns all the land....

 

It's like anywhere else. Permission where needed. On a reservation the land is normally owned by a person or business who in turn can give permission for a cache. Some land is owned by the tribal government same as some land is owned by city, state, county, federal governments. Nothing changes on who you to go for permission. It's who ownes (or controls via a lease etc.) the ground.

 

Some tribes choose to be politically hostile. Those tribes may impose an access fee for non members, wishing to be on the reservation without any particular reason. That's got nothing to do with you getting permission to place a cache. However you may be subject to it in order to wander about and place the cache yourself.

I would suggest including a copy of any document granting permission inside the cache itself. I would also suggest validating continuing permission when situations change. Subsequent duly elected council executives may have differing thoughts on the matter of any cache located on tribal lands. As noted earlier common sense and respect are things to keep in mind. >>> Also, do not be and absent cache owner. And for Pete's sake no Fuzzy Co-ords which might result in cachers thrashing the locale.

[+Matt_B_Good]

Find out who the tribal chairman is, or better yet just walk into the trial offices and explain what you want to do. I'm sure the receptionist will find the right person. If they agree, get the name of a contact person and a phone number. Put this information in the reviewer note and put a sentence in the cache description that says this cache was placed with permission. I found my local tribe to be very co-operative and accommodating. Your mileage may vary.

 

Jim

 

Edit: I found I did not have to do lots of explaining. Also make sure you stay clear of any places that have religious or historical significance for the tribe.

 

Which of your cache hides are on reservation lands?

 

As of yet none. I am not Native American but I live less than a mile from a reservation. There are some pretty strange laws when you start talking treaties and compacts and the like they made with the United States. Certain things such as hunt and fish you can only do on tribal land if you are part of the tribe.

[+Matt_B_Good]

...The tribe owns all the land....

 

It's like anywhere else. Permission where needed. On a reservation the land is normally owned by a person or business who in turn can give permission for a cache. Some land is owned by the tribal government same as some land is owned by city, state, county, federal governments. Nothing changes on who you to go for permission. It's who ownes (or controls via a lease etc.) the ground.

 

Some tribes choose to be politically hostile. Those tribes may impose an access fee for non members, wishing to be on the reservation without any particular reason. That's got nothing to do with you getting permission to place a cache. However you may be subject to it in order to wander about and place the cache yourself.

 

No offense but I'm not sure that information is correct? Do you know this? Are you of a tribe or at least real familiar with the government structure? It does get a bit complicated. I'm not saying your wrong I'm just saying it doesn't sound right to me. I have been on several reservation lands and was never charged for it. Marinette county WI on the other hand they charge you an absorbent fee of $5.00 to park your car at the county park. Sure I've paid as high as $30.00 in Hollywood but parking was scarce. This county is not a reservation.

[jholly]

Find out who the tribal chairman is, or better yet just walk into the trial offices and explain what you want to do. I'm sure the receptionist will find the right person. If they agree, get the name of a contact person and a phone number. Put this information in the reviewer note and put a sentence in the cache description that says this cache was placed with permission. I found my local tribe to be very co-operative and accommodating. Your mileage may vary.

 

Jim

 

Edit: I found I did not have to do lots of explaining. Also make sure you stay clear of any places that have religious or historical significance for the tribe.

 

Which of your cache hides are on reservation lands?

 

GC18V46, it is archived because it was muggled.

 

Jim

[+popokiiti]

I would suggest you work with the First Nations, and, as has been stated, be sure to avoid religious, historical or sacred ground. We have to respect their lands and customs. Permission will have to be granted by Band and Council - same as permission being required for any cache on private land. I think I would place a small, or even a micro cache to be less obtrusive and to avoid swag deterioration. And I would make sure that my co-ords were accurate too.

[+Matt_B_Good]

I would suggest you work with the First Nations, and, as has been stated, be sure to avoid religious, historical or sacred ground. We have to respect their lands and customs. Permission will have to be granted by Band and Council - same as permission being required for any cache on private land. I think I would place a small, or even a micro cache to be less obtrusive and to avoid swag deterioration. And I would make sure that my co-ords were accurate too.

 

I have to admit when it comes to the terms your using I am a bit ignorant of their meaning. First Nations? band? Council? The last one I kind of think I know what your talking about. I'm not even sure HOW to get ahold of the tribal council? Oh boy, I might have to scratch this idea. The main reason I would like to place a cache on the Reservation other than because there are so few there is I would like to start a geocoin in a cache on that Reservation with the goal of visiting as many reservations or as I intend to put it native nations as possible. Kind of a way to recognize these nations within a nation. I guess what I am looking for is advice from those of you who have caches placed on Reservations especially those who are not of the tribe and were still able to get a cache published that was located on a Reservation. I want to know what steps you took to get it published besides the obvious normal stuff. I think the best advice on this thread was to ask those who placed caches on this same Reservation. There are so few caches on this reservation and the geocache maps do not show where the borders are. It is hard for me to tell for certain if any caches are on this particular Reservation with the exception of a virtual cache located at rock that is sacred to many of that nation. Some of caches from the Wisconsin Spirit quest series I think are on the Reservation but not much else.

[+briansnat]

Reviewers will not knowingly publish a cache that is on an Indian reservation without express approval the tribe's leadership. In most instances they will want evidnce of proof such as a scanned letter.

 

For the most part people who have approached reservation authorities about geocaching have been turned down, but there are rare instances where people have received approval, so I guess asking can't hurt.

[+webscouter.]

As somebody who spends a lot of time on reservations I can say that even with tribal approval they are not usually good places to place a cache.

 

There is still a considerable amount of animosity to outsiders and non native people being on the reservation. I have had several instances of verbal abuse from natives while working at a hospital supporting their doctors.

 

I can only imagine some of the issues one would have trying to use their land for "our" game. There are already feelings of betrayal that we have stolen their land from them and "given" them some of the worst land in the US and now a white man wants to take another small piece from them to play a game.

 

There is a good reason that you find so few geocaches on tribal lands. In my opinion perhaps until a native places the cache it should remain so.

[jholly]

As somebody who spends a lot of time on reservations I can say that even with tribal approval they are not usually good places to place a cache.

 

There is still a considerable amount of animosity to outsiders and non native people being on the reservation. I have had several instances of verbal abuse from natives while working at a hospital supporting their doctors.

 

I can only imagine some of the issues one would have trying to use their land for "our" game. There are already feelings of betrayal that we have stolen their land from them and "given" them some of the worst land in the US and now a white man wants to take another small piece from them to play a game.

 

There is a good reason that you find so few geocaches on tribal lands. In my opinion perhaps until a native places the cache it should remain so.

 

I don't disagree with what has been said, but it should be approached on a case by case basis. Around here there is a large non-native population living on the reservations. There is little to no friction. But there are some individuals that are quite anti-non-native, fortunately the council is not. If the tribe has a large casino they are probably more agreeable to non-native folks on the reservations. It would not hurt to ask. As for why in some areas there are few caches, we have large reservations that have miles of gravel roads. I would not be inclined to search out new locations on those types of roads.

 

Jim

[+Matt_B_Good]

As somebody who spends a lot of time on reservations I can say that even with tribal approval they are not usually good places to place a cache.

 

There is still a considerable amount of animosity to outsiders and non native people being on the reservation. I have had several instances of verbal abuse from natives while working at a hospital supporting their doctors.

 

I can only imagine some of the issues one would have trying to use their land for "our" game. There are already feelings of betrayal that we have stolen their land from them and "given" them some of the worst land in the US and now a white man wants to take another small piece from them to play a game.

 

There is a good reason that you find so few geocaches on tribal lands. In my opinion perhaps until a native places the cache it should remain so.

 

It gets better as time goes on but yes there is still a good level of animosity between native and non native peoples. For the most part it seems everyone gets along. Some people though and this is on both sides still have a high amount of animosity toward the other. I find this odd considering every single person of this particular tribe has a European ancestor and many people considered non native have a native ancestor and yes I have relatives that are of Native American decent. Anyway, about the cache I took a look again to see if there are any caches on the Reservation near me. There are a few where I can't tell because they are kind of near the line but only one for certain however it is a virtual. The owner of the cache does appear to be Native American. I sent him a message asking about it. I told him about the Geocoin I would like to start off. I may just have to wait until a member of the tribe gets one published. Geocaching is still relatively new so it just might take time.

[+popokiiti]

I would suggest you work with the First Nations, and, as has been stated, be sure to avoid religious, historical or sacred ground. We have to respect their lands and customs. Permission will have to be granted by Band and Council - same as permission being required for any cache on private land. I think I would place a small, or even a micro cache to be less obtrusive and to avoid swag deterioration. And I would make sure that my co-ords were accurate too.

 

I have to admit when it comes to the terms your using I am a bit ignorant of their meaning. First Nations? band? Council? The last one I kind of think I know what your talking about. I'm not even sure HOW to get ahold of the tribal council? Oh boy, I might have to scratch this idea. The main reason I would like to place a cache on the Reservation other than because there are so few there is I would like to start a geocoin in a cache on that Reservation with the goal of visiting as many reservations or as I intend to put it native nations as possible. Kind of a way to recognize these nations within a nation. I guess what I am looking for is advice from those of you who have caches placed on Reservations especially those who are not of the tribe and were still able to get a cache published that was located on a Reservation. I want to know what steps you took to get it published besides the obvious normal stuff. I think the best advice on this thread was to ask those who placed caches on this same Reservation. There are so few caches on this reservation and the geocache maps do not show where the borders are. It is hard for me to tell for certain if any caches are on this particular Reservation with the exception of a virtual cache located at rock that is sacred to many of that nation. Some of caches from the Wisconsin Spirit quest series I think are on the Reservation but not much else.

Sorry to confuse you Matt, just using the terms used in Canada. First Nations = Native Peoples. Band = Tribe. Council = same as in your town and mine. Go to the reservation and ask to be shown to the Band/Tribe Office and someone will help you. I would love to learn more about the First Nations, and I am lucky in that we can ask those questions of the band members from the reservation near us.

[+Astro_D]

I know we were planning a geocaching event in our area that highlighted the local history, and had approached the nearby Native American Tribe about placing caches on their land. They were open to it provided they were temporary (ie event caches only that would be promptly removed) and we could make arrangements to be accompanied by several tribal elders when we wanted to hide the caches to ensure we would not disrespect any areas and to stay far away from areas we shouldn't be. (It's hard to know what is and is not off limits just by looking). In the end, we did not have our event nor placed the caches.

[+Matt_B_Good]

I would suggest you work with the First Nations, and, as has been stated, be sure to avoid religious, historical or sacred ground. We have to respect their lands and customs. Permission will have to be granted by Band and Council - same as permission being required for any cache on private land. I think I would place a small, or even a micro cache to be less obtrusive and to avoid swag deterioration. And I would make sure that my co-ords were accurate too.

 

I have to admit when it comes to the terms your using I am a bit ignorant of their meaning. First Nations? band? Council? The last one I kind of think I know what your talking about. I'm not even sure HOW to get ahold of the tribal council? Oh boy, I might have to scratch this idea. The main reason I would like to place a cache on the Reservation other than because there are so few there is I would like to start a geocoin in a cache on that Reservation with the goal of visiting as many reservations or as I intend to put it native nations as possible. Kind of a way to recognize these nations within a nation. I guess what I am looking for is advice from those of you who have caches placed on Reservations especially those who are not of the tribe and were still able to get a cache published that was located on a Reservation. I want to know what steps you took to get it published besides the obvious normal stuff. I think the best advice on this thread was to ask those who placed caches on this same Reservation. There are so few caches on this reservation and the geocache maps do not show where the borders are. It is hard for me to tell for certain if any caches are on this particular Reservation with the exception of a virtual cache located at rock that is sacred to many of that nation. Some of caches from the Wisconsin Spirit quest series I think are on the Reservation but not much else.

Sorry to confuse you Matt, just using the terms used in Canada. First Nations = Native Peoples. Band = Tribe. Council = same as in your town and mine. Go to the reservation and ask to be shown to the Band/Tribe Office and someone will help you. I would love to learn more about the First Nations, and I am lucky in that we can ask those questions of the band members from the reservation near us.

 

Oh yes the subtle differences between American and Canadian English. It seems that caching on Reservations is a more touchy issue than I thought. Seems like it can be done but it is just a real pain in the rear end and will likely not get approved unless you are actually of that particular tribe. I think there are 7 Nations within the state of Wisconsin itself it looks like it takes alot of effort to get caches placed there so I guess I will scratch my idea of getting a geocoin to travel to them at least for now. Perhaps as the years go by there will be more caches on Reservations most likely placed by members of the tribe but for now the idea just won't work out. One reservation near me and Astro D team has a Walmart on it. So does the largest Navaho Reservation out in the western United States where the native language is still widely spoken. You would think placing geocaches would be a breeze.

[+Matt_B_Good]

I know we were planning a geocaching event in our area that highlighted the local history, and had approached the nearby Native American Tribe about placing caches on their land. They were open to it provided they were temporary (ie event caches only that would be promptly removed) and we could make arrangements to be accompanied by several tribal elders when we wanted to hide the caches to ensure we would not disrespect any areas and to stay far away from areas we shouldn't be. (It's hard to know what is and is not off limits just by looking). In the end, we did not have our event nor placed the caches.

 

It is a challenge to figure out where the line is when it comes to the Oneida nation of Wisconsin. it kind of blends in with the rest of Green Bay. You have to look for tell tale signs such as fire numbers and places that allow casino style gambling. I think a number of the Green bay area caches are on the Reservation but likely placed by tribal members.

[+Astro_D]

I know we were planning a geocaching event in our area that highlighted the local history, and had approached the nearby Native American Tribe about placing caches on their land. They were open to it provided they were temporary (ie event caches only that would be promptly removed) and we could make arrangements to be accompanied by several tribal elders when we wanted to hide the caches to ensure we would not disrespect any areas and to stay far away from areas we shouldn't be. (It's hard to know what is and is not off limits just by looking). In the end, we did not have our event nor placed the caches.

 

It is a challenge to figure out where the line is when it comes to the Oneida nation of Wisconsin. it kind of blends in with the rest of Green Bay. You have to look for tell tale signs such as fire numbers and places that allow casino style gambling. I think a number of the Green bay area caches are on the Reservation but likely placed by tribal members.

 

I know specifically two caches that are on reservation land and the owners are not tribal members. The others....I'm not sure. As for where the tribal land is and is not - it's confusing . Our one cache if looked at from a distance on map shows it to be on tribal land, but is in a park where the land is owned by the city not the tribe. As for having a Walmart on the tribal land - nope. I got the in for the event as it was going to highlight the tribal history and contributions and I was working through govt channels.

 

It wouldn't hurt to approach them and see if they have changed they mind. There are some beautiful areas and some great history to showcase if it would be allowed.

Edited September 28, 2009 by AstroD-Team

[+Matt_B_Good]

I know we were planning a geocaching event in our area that highlighted the local history, and had approached the nearby Native American Tribe about placing caches on their land. They were open to it provided they were temporary (ie event caches only that would be promptly removed) and we could make arrangements to be accompanied by several tribal elders when we wanted to hide the caches to ensure we would not disrespect any areas and to stay far away from areas we shouldn't be. (It's hard to know what is and is not off limits just by looking). In the end, we did not have our event nor placed the caches.

 

It is a challenge to figure out where the line is when it comes to the Oneida nation of Wisconsin. it kind of blends in with the rest of Green Bay. You have to look for tell tale signs such as fire numbers and places that allow casino style gambling. I think a number of the Green bay area caches are on the Reservation but likely placed by tribal members.

 

I know specifically two caches that are on reservation land and the owners are not tribal members. The others....I'm not sure. As for where the tribal land is and is not - it's confusing . Our one cache if looked at from a distance on map shows it to be on tribal land, but is in a park where the land is owned by the city not the tribe. As for having a Walmart on the tribal land - nope. I got the in for the event as it was going to highlight the tribal history and contributions and I was working through govt channels.

 

It wouldn't hurt to approach them and see if they have changed they mind. There are some beautiful areas and some great history to showcase if it would be allowed.

 

The Walmart west in Green Bay is on the Oneida reservation. People of the tribe can use a tax exempt card there. I talked with someone of the Menominee tribe. he said the reason it is so hard to get something like a physical Geocache placed there is that it falls under on of those issues that need the approval of the tribal council. All nine members of the council have to agree to it. If even one says no the answer is no. I am not going to even try. I will try and get one published very close to the line though. I have two spots in mind both are in Oconto county and you can see the reservation from them. I just need to get out there and do it. It might be awhile. I decided to still do the coin but change the goal just a tad to either visit or get as close as it can to those nations. If you would be as kind as to private message me some caches that are at least the size of a film canister that I can find I would appreciate it. Thanks