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Jeremy

Feature Concept - The Social Find

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Ooooo - I've got a nice combination on this....

 

Since these "met" logs will have either coordinates or a GC number, what about handing a TB or coin off to someone at a meeting. Logging it this way would allow the bug to go into the cache from the current holder and out into the inventory of the new holder with one log.

 

The new log would read "I met mtn-man at GC628E at gave him TBJ6XW". The TB page would say "Markwell gave Ninja Force White to mtn-man at GC628E and it accumulated 472.14 miles"

 

But it could also work for just handing someone a TB at a parking lot. Like what happened here, but it gets the miles.

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I don't. I don't like the fact that as the findee you have to run through many verification emails just to get someone to mark you as met. It's tedious and unnecessary. The code allows you to greet someone and offer them an easy way to log you.

 

I've already answered that problem.

 

This whole code thing keeps giving me visions of "cacher code lists" like that of archived caches and geocoins. Unless the owner of the code is on top of his game you will have folks logging others who they've never met. Using the code scheme is just setting us up for more angst down the road.

To get rid of the code, allow cachers to delete bogus finds. I would presumably receive an email when someone has claimed to have found me. If I didn't really meet them I could delete their log.

 

I wish everyone would stop calling this "FINDS"... It's making me feel icky. Can we call it something else? I sure hope this isn't going to increase find counts. Can someone in charge say "NO, IT WONT" so I feel better about myself?

 

Thanks! :blink:

Found, met, discovered, whatever. I'm sure the semantics will be addressed too, but that doesn't change the principle of the idea.

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Markwell's idea sounds cool, and I like the overall idea too. Of course it will be abused, but who cares? It's a better implementation than personal Geocoins, which are abused, but not that big of a problem.

 

The codeword sounds like the best idea, and it slightly dampens the "pass around the codewords" idea: you actually have to know to whom the word belongs. You couldn't look it up, because people might have the same code.

 

Oh, and even though I'm a premium member I agree that this should include non-premium members too. Maybe they get an alphanumeric, non-customizable code or a default icon or whatever, but they should at least be able to participate.

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I just found this thread. Thanks for your thought and proactiveness in this Jeremy. This idea has plenty of merits and will be welcomed by many. I do feel that the PM's would be cheated if they were not able to find NPM's, so the idea of each PM getting to upload their own icon would be a nice touch. The Bookmarking of cachers would be a nice PM feature also. I do like that thought of making logs and posting coords and photos and the ability to pass off TB's and Coins too.

 

Again, Thanks for being Proactive in this.

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I think it would be cool if you can see what events your friends will be attending based on their "will attend" logs.

 

Nate the Great will attend Otaku's Cache-tacular on 06/20/06

Raine has no upcoming events

Jeremy will attend South Seattle CITO on 07/01/06

etc.

 

-Nate

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Why yah gotta single me out for not having any events?!?

 

Dang.. just not right

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I think it would be cool if you can see what events your friends will be attending based on their "will attend" logs.

 

Nate the Great will attend Otaku's Cache-tacular on 06/20/06

Raine has no upcoming events

Jeremy will attend South Seattle CITO on 07/01/06

etc.

 

-Nate

 

Hopefully this will be optional for a bit privacy's sake.

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I think it would be cool if you can see what events your friends will be attending based on their "will attend" logs.

 

Nate the Great will attend Otaku's Cache-tacular on 06/20/06

Raine has no upcoming events

Jeremy will attend South Seattle CITO on 07/01/06

etc.

 

-Nate

 

Hopefully this will be optional for a bit privacy's sake.

 

Perhaps you need to re-evaluate who your friends are then. Just try not to include stalkers as your buddies :(

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I think it would be cool if you can see what events your friends will be attending based on their "will attend" logs.

 

Nate the Great will attend Otaku's Cache-tacular on 06/20/06

Raine has no upcoming events

Jeremy will attend South Seattle CITO on 07/01/06

etc.

 

-Nate

 

Hopefully this will be optional for a bit privacy's sake.

 

Perhaps you need to re-evaluate who your friends are then. Just try not to include stalkers as your buddies :(

Maybe you don't know who they are when you give out your code. Maybe your code gets passed around before you change it.

 

This sounds more like a feature for buddy lists.

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Hopefully this will be optional for a bit privacy's sake.

 

Perhaps you need to re-evaluate who your friends are then. Just try not to include stalkers as your buddies :(

 

Better yet - don't post a message on a public web site that you plan to attend an event if you don't want anyone to know.

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I think it would be cool if you can see what events your friends will be attending based on their "will attend" logs.

 

Nate the Great will attend Otaku's Cache-tacular on 06/20/06

Raine has no upcoming events

Jeremy will attend South Seattle CITO on 07/01/06

etc.

 

-Nate

 

Hopefully this will be optional for a bit privacy's sake.

 

Perhaps you need to re-evaluate who your friends are then. Just try not to include stalkers as your buddies :(

Maybe you don't know who they are when you give out your code. Maybe your code gets passed around before you change it.

 

This sounds more like a feature for buddy lists.

 

It's not like they will be able to find your home address or something. If I want to find out you are attending an event, all I have to do is go to the event page and look. I guess I don't understand where you are going with this? Also, I think the idea of buddy lists is close enough to the person "MET" idea that they would go together easily.

Edited by ReadyOrNot

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Also, I think the idea of buddy lists is close enough to the person "MET" idea that they would go together easily.

 

Sure, they go together, but not everyone I've met is a buddy. I don't need or want to track everyone I've met.

 

On the flip side, I don't particularly care for everyone knowing exactly what I'm doing. I'd like to participate without it feeling like Big Brother is watching. Just like the stats I'd like to hide, it's just not everyone's business.

 

What I'm asking for is the option. The ability to turn on and off certain features of the site as it pertains to me.

 

Quite frankly, I think if there is no option to not be tracked as mentioned above I'd just simply opt out all together. I'm know of others who would probably so the same.

 

Heck, if it goes the way that Jeremy is describing it I'm probably going to opt out anyway. It's just too much of a hassle to generate codes and pass them around.

Edited by CoyoteRed

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Jeremy

 

I think this is an excellent addition to the social side of Geocaching. I think as events continue to evolve and more and more people become "travelers" to distant regions and lands, this feature will help break the ice with many new cachers and "new to the area" cachers. Thank you for keeping this aspect in mind. I agree that the task option to get someones code should be left up to the individual code giver.

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This really has been a tangle to try to figure out exactly what the proposal is at this stage. Maybe at this point Jeremy could summarize how he sees it after all this so we all know we are talking about the same thing.

 

The psychologist in me says there also needs to be some consideration given to the potential divisiveness of something like this at events. There will be those who choose not to participate. That's as is it should be but whenever there are participaters and non-participaters in any activity a division tends to naturally develop between the two groups and they tend to not mingle.

 

That effect can already be seen in the geocoin trading. Those who don't believe in it and those who do tend to separate into distinct groups at both official and non-official events. That effect is likely to be even more pronounced in this initiative since it involves a bit of personal information being shared , and regardless of the fact that the information isn't particularly signifcant, there will be lots who are reluctant to reveal anything personal but will find themselves under pressure at events to do so. Even with participaters, there will be pressure to share you code with others that you do not want to share it with. Yet another possible point of schizm.

 

So, I guess I'm saying that its important to make sure that the whatever develops promotes the social activities of geocaching and doesn't create something that creates schizms.

 

So its even more important to get a summary at this point so we are all talking on common ground. Could you do that Jeremy?

 

JDandDD

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1. The geocacher would be able to change his/her code at any time

The Code concept I like. It means some cachers can opt out and not have a code. Then the game is focused on the ones that like to play that game.

2. Goofy tasks to get the code once you meet them should be ok (but that task should be the same for everyone)

I'd have to see how this plays out. It can go a lot of directions.

3. The code should be rated G

Anything you hear on public TV. That's leaves a lot of ability to express yourself. That works.

4. Any geocacher can log a user but only Premium and Charter members can generate their own codes. (Sorry... we have to support the site somehow).

This method makes it so that premium members don't have access to the pool of regular members. Off the top of my head I can't see how to fix it, but it's backwards from the MO cache concept where Members can find them all.

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Back OT-I'd like to see this 'met you/social finding' concept become part of something a little bigger and more complex. One of the pocket lint caches that was shut down from GW4 was 'touch me feel me' that was sort of like geocacher bingo. You needed to get your game card of 25 squares signed by a cacher who fit one of the criteria in that square (from out of state, left handed), or performed that task (thumb wrestle, belly laugh). This is an idea way beyond a simple "I met you can I have your code?", and would continue to develop the social fabric of the geocaching community. The OP concept seems overly simplistic, like valentine's day in second grade to me.

 

The user can hold back the code until the task is complete. It seems to fit that design snugly. Or perhaps I'm missing something.

I think this is a cool idea! But I think having some validation method would be nice. Perhaps you could have a queue on your profile page with the people that have entered your code and are claiming that they have met you! You review and click and they get a social smiley! :laughing:

 

It would also be cool to see a map of the US/World showing the locations of all the people that you've met! :laughing:

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3. The code should be rated G

Anything you hear on public TV.

 

Anything you hear on public TV in the US. Otherwise you're in for a nasty surprise :laughing:

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I don't. I don't like the fact that as the findee you have to run through many verification emails just to get someone to mark you as met. It's tedious and unnecessary. The code allows you to greet someone and offer them an easy way to log you.

 

I've already answered that problem.

 

This whole code thing keeps giving me visions of "cacher code lists" like that of archived caches and geocoins. Unless the owner of the code is on top of his game you will have folks logging others who they've never met. Using the code scheme is just setting us up for more angst down the road.

To get rid of the code, allow cachers to delete bogus finds. I would presumably receive an email when someone has claimed to have found me. If I didn't really meet them I could delete their log.

 

I wish everyone would stop calling this "FINDS"... It's making me feel icky. Can we call it something else? I sure hope this isn't going to increase find counts. Can someone in charge say "NO, IT WONT" so I feel better about myself?

 

Thanks! :laughing:

I know what you mean. I almost expect to see a suggestion for a DNF log type. For when you're both at the same event and never get meet or you happen tomjust miss each other visiting same cache.

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Another idea for Premium Members. Allow them to create a list of one time use only code numbers.

 

I could see a situation where someone has their code number shared to more than just the people they actually met (think mega event). If they change their code number then those who hadn't logged yet can't but if the code number isn't changed then there will continue to be lot of fake logs to clean up later.

 

A list of codes that are made invalid as they are used would stop something like this from happening. I'm sure there are other uses for single use codes also.

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The user can hold back the code until the task is complete. It seems to fit that design snugly. Or perhaps I'm missing something.

 

I now I'm missing something. Why does everything have to turn into a game? Why couldn't it be a straight "I met this person" type of thing?

 

I agree with JDandDD, from the way I'm reading it developing, it's going to get divisive. I can picture the events or meetings on the trail. "Hey, how ya do'n." "Hi ya!" ... "So, you got a code?" "Sure, but you gotta stand on your head." "?" "Stand on your head or you don't get my code." "No thanks." "What, I'm not good enough for you to stand on your head?" "Obviously." "&%$@ you." "&%$@ you back." ...

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Just a thought that occurred this morning...

 

a mega-event like GW5 could generate around 100,000 met logs, with pictures and such...can the servers deal with that additional load, or will the "met" logs be housed on a separate server (or do I not understand things like this well enough, and it's not a problem...that seems likely :laughing: )?

 

Jamie - NFA

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Cool, so now I can become a "living cache" - I hide someplace in the woods and wait until a cacher comes find me and logs me... :laughing:

 

Seriously, I like the idea and especially in combination with TBs, being able to give someone TBs with such a log.

 

Olaf

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The user can hold back the code until the task is complete. It seems to fit that design snugly. Or perhaps I'm missing something.

 

I now I'm missing something. Why does everything have to turn into a game? Why couldn't it be a straight "I met this person" type of thing?

 

I agree with JDandDD, from the way I'm reading it developing, it's going to get divisive. I can picture the events or meetings on the trail. "Hey, how ya do'n." "Hi ya!" ... "So, you got a code?" "Sure, but you gotta stand on your head." "?" "Stand on your head or you don't get my code." "No thanks." "What, I'm not good enough for you to stand on your head?" "Obviously." "&%$@ you." "&%$@ you back." ...

Seriously CR do you really think cachers that meet on the trail would ask such a thing. I have meet plenty of cachers while out and about caching and I always had a positive experience.

I saw it posted (not in these exact words) that if one does not participate in these forums they won't be heard and only the regulars are the ones that TPTB be hear. (Something like that). I’m going venture out into these forums and try to start being heard. (Very scary) I’m a regular cacher and I think the concept is awesome and I look forward to the day it’s implemented. When we are events it would be a great way to break away from the regulars you know and meet up with someone you have never meet. Great icebreaker indeed, although I’ve really never had a problem meeting and talking to folks this would be fun, love it the ever evolving GC.com working hard for us, the cachers.

 

Pepper

Happy Cacher!

See ya on the trail.

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I think it would be cool if you can see what events your friends will be attending based on their "will attend" logs. ...

Hopefully this will be optional for a bit privacy's sake.

It already is optional. You have the option of telling the world that you will be attending a future event. You can still go to the event if you don't post a 'will attend'.

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4. Any geocacher can log a user but only Premium and Charter members can generate their own codes. (Sorry... we have to support the site somehow).
This method makes it so that premium members don't have access to the pool of regular members. Off the top of my head I can't see how to fix it, but it's backwards from the MO cache concept where Members can find them all.
In a later post, Jeremy stated that he was becoming convinced that this feature could be opened up to all cachers, but with special benefits to premium members.

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I think it would be cool if you can see what events your friends will be attending based on their "will attend" logs.

 

Nate the Great will attend Otaku's Cache-tacular on 06/20/06

Raine has no upcoming events

Jeremy will attend South Seattle CITO on 07/01/06

etc.

 

-Nate

 

Hopefully this will be optional for a bit privacy's sake.

 

I think that CR has some valid concerns here…..

 

If I remember correctly, in the DFW metroplex we had an issue of cache thieves and bug thieves, which also started showing up at events and taking pictures of the cachers that they were stealing from.

 

Although all they would have to do is watch event pages to find the same information, putting someone’s event itinerary in one convenient place will just make their jobs easier.

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I think it would be cool if you can see what events your friends will be attending based on their "will attend" logs.

 

Nate the Great will attend Otaku's Cache-tacular on 06/20/06

Raine has no upcoming events

Jeremy will attend South Seattle CITO on 07/01/06

etc.

 

-Nate

 

Hopefully this will be optional for a bit privacy's sake.

 

I think that CR has some valid concerns here…..

He's just being paranoid.

 

If I remember correctly, in the DFW metroplex we had an issue of cache thieves and bug thieves, which also started showing up at events and taking pictures of the cachers that they were stealing from.

 

Although all they would have to do is watch event pages to find the same information, putting someone’s event itinerary in one convenient place will just make their jobs easier.

If you don't want people to know you're coming to an event, don't post that fact on a public web site. If you want just a few people to know, email them. And as you pointed out - people often post notes to event pages that indicate they're going and nobody has complained that this is an invasion of privacy.

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With the clarification that only premium members can be logged (because only they can generate a code to be logged in the first place), I think you know where I'll stand on this.

Yeah, me, too.

 

Sad, really, if that turns out to be the case.

 

So exactly what planet do you come from where servers, bandwidth and developers are free? Just askin' is all. :D

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It sounds like a great idea to me. I like the idea of PMs having first crack at it to provide incentive for NPMs to pony up the pittance required to support gc.com.

 

[off topic]

While on the subject of PMs.... in our neck o' da woods - we highly encourage people to pay (to the point that we have actually PAID for some whose funds were severely limited) because we very much enjoy geocaching and want to make sure Groundspeak is a lucrative company. Is this a "suck up" post? Not at all - it is purely selfish because a company that makes a profit will stay in business, provide upgrades, and other things which will make the game more fun. More fun for geocachers = more paying members = more upgrades = more fun for ME!

[/off topic]

 

Back on topic: To all those who are worried about the (possible) negative aspects of this proposed feature: relax! Let's not pick this thing to death! Every good thing (on Earth) may have a hidden thorn if ever so tiny. I've never met a geocacher in person (and I've met hundreds) that I had a bad experience meeting.... of course the protection of the keyboard has made online meetings a different story! (sadly)

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Seriously CR do you really think cachers that meet on the trail would ask such a thing.

 

Well, I would not have ever thought someone would be required to jump through hoops--that has nothing to do with find verification--simply to log a cache, either. Apparently, it happens and some folks demand the right to do it.

 

There are a lot of things I never would have thought would have happened, but it does.

 

I was being facetious when I mentioned maybe I should bring a cache to an event so folks can log it in response to folks bringing books full of geocoins to event to be logged. While I was being facetious and trying to demonstrate how ridiculous is was, some folks thought it a grand idea!

 

Now, I wouldn't put it past anyone to do just about anything that isn't specifically prohibited.

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With the clarification that only premium members can be logged (because only they can generate a code to be logged in the first place), I think you know where I'll stand on this.

Yeah, me, too.

 

Sad, really, if that turns out to be the case.

 

So exactly what planet do you come from where servers, bandwidth and developers are free? Just askin' is all. :D

 

What does that have to do with anything? Besides, you're a little behind the times. Might want to read the whole thread.

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To all those who are worried about the (possible) negative aspects of this proposed feature: relax! Let's not pick this thing to death! Every good thing (on Earth) may have a hidden thorn if ever so tiny.

 

The problem is not all of the ideas being floated are "tiny thorns." Let's not go down a road we wish we hadn't. Now is the time to fully develop the concept, not after a lot of effort in the wrong direction.

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With the clarification that only premium members can be logged (because only they can generate a code to be logged in the first place), I think you know where I'll stand on this.

Yeah, me, too.

 

Sad, really, if that turns out to be the case.

 

So exactly what planet do you come from where servers, bandwidth and developers are free? Just askin' is all. :D

 

What does that have to do with anything? Besides, you're a little behind the times. Might want to read the whole thread.

 

Sorry, I guess I took your (no less than) three posts decrying making portions of this functionality available to PM's only as some sort of indication you were against it. Surely you can see how I could make such a mistake with something like

Oh, please don't say this is how it's going to work. We'd be back to the whole MOC (in this case, Members Only Cachers) debate.
.

 

I also forgot I need your permission to speak and have an opinion (see disclaimer).

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Sorry, I guess I took your (no less than) three posts decrying making portions of this functionality available to PM's only as some sort of indication you were against it. Surely you can see how I could make such a mistake with something like

 

In the meantime the concept had been opened up to the everyone making my comment obsolete. You were commenting on an obsolete statement.

 

I also forgot I need your permission to speak and have an opinion (see disclaimer).

One, I wasn't speaking to you. If I were, I'd likely be quoting you, not someone else.

 

Two, you might want to got back and read where I was coming from.

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Unfortunately, sometimes if your post is the last one on the page, I think it tends to get overlooked. I made this post at the end of the workday yesterday - and I think it may have been glossed over.

 

Does anyone really think that the ability to log a person with a "found it" (or ANY of the premium features being suggested in this thread) will push people over the edge to buy a premium membership?

Edited by Markwell

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I edited the OP, so quit bickering already. Or take it to private mail.

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Unfortunately, sometimes if your post is the last one on the page, I think it tends to get overlooked. I made this post at the end of the workday yesterday - and I think it may have been glossed over.

 

I do like the idea of doing an initial test with premium members though, with the idea that it would be opened up to others.

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Why yah gotta single me out for not having any events?!?

 

Dang.. just not right

 

You need to get out more.

 

:D

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This is an interesting idea, although it's unlikely I'll use this new feature very much.

 

I'll echo NFA's concerns about potential server load, especially since I foresee people having too much fun with this. :D Have TPTB considered setting up a separate server like Waymarking? I dunno... call it GeoMeeting or GeoGreeting or something.

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Hopefully this will be optional for a bit privacy's sake.

I won't diss your concerns for privacy, so hopefully, TPTB comes up with a reasonable implementation to prevent abuse.

 

FYI: people who stalk don't know what to do with their time and/or money, and are incapable of doing anything else. Their actions prove your superiority since they are more interested in your life than their own. :D

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Hopefully this will be optional for a bit privacy's sake.

I won't diss your concerns for privacy, so hopefully, TPTB comes up with a reasonable implementation to prevent abuse.

 

I will. Posting a message that you're attending an event on a public site then being concerned about privacy? Sorry. Doesn't make sense to me. Not to mention you gave the dude your code to log you.

Edited by Jeremy

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Why yah gotta single me out for not having any events?!?

 

Dang.. just not right

 

You need to get out more.

 

:D

Not until he finishes caches along a route. And the social finds feature. And the friends group feature. And a cache details page redesign. And... that secret project he's not saying much about.

 

Hey Raine, want to find a cache in November?

 

(Keep up the great work!!!!!)

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Hopefully this will be optional for a bit privacy's sake.

I won't diss your concerns for privacy, so hopefully, TPTB comes up with a reasonable implementation to prevent abuse.

 

I will. Posting a message that you're attending an event on a public site then being concerned about privacy? Sorry. Doesn't make sense to me. Not to mention you gave the dude your code to log you.

 

Yeah, glad you're listening to your users. I see you're not working on your customer service skills.

 

Privacy and one's own ability on how much information is put out there and how is apparently no concern to you. No wonder some folks aren't logging online. It's your way or the highway. Because of your obstinance they choose the highway.

 

You're already working it so some folks won't participate. Good job.

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Yeah, glad you're listening to your users. I see you're not working on your customer service skills.

 

 

Don't be sore. I'm listening to you. I just don't agree with you.

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Hopefully this will be optional for a bit privacy's sake.

I won't diss your concerns for privacy, so hopefully, TPTB comes up with a reasonable implementation to prevent abuse.

 

I will. Posting a message that you're attending an event on a public site then being concerned about privacy? Sorry. Doesn't make sense to me. Not to mention you gave the dude your code to log you.

 

You're already working it so some folks won't participate. Good job.

 

Isn't it innevitable that some people won't participate regardless of what the "Feature" is? If it was ever possible to please everyone, you would probably be the last person pleased :D

 

EDIT: I just realized I joined the problem and am going Off topic. Adjusted my steering and am back. Sorry :ninja:

Edited by ReadyOrNot

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Hopefully this will be optional for a bit privacy's sake.

I won't diss your concerns for privacy, so hopefully, TPTB comes up with a reasonable implementation to prevent abuse.

 

I will. Posting a message that you're attending an event on a public site then being concerned about privacy? Sorry. Doesn't make sense to me. Not to mention you gave the dude your code to log you.

 

You're already working it so some folks won't participate. Good job.

 

Isn't it innevitable that some people won't participate regardless of what the "Feature" is? If it was ever possible to please everyone, you would probably be the last person pleased :D

 

EDIT: I just realized I joined the problem and am taking the topic OT. Sorry, back OT.

 

Don't mistake me being one of the few that is vocal as it's just me. There are plenty who feel the same as I do but won't post because they don't want to deal with being targeted with snide remarks.

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Yeah, glad you're listening to your users. I see you're not working on your customer service skills.

 

 

Don't be sore. I'm listening to you. I just don't agree with you.

 

So, you don't agree folks should have options? You don't agree folks should be able to meet someone without that other person being able to track your movements?

 

I guess it's along the same lines as find counts. If you don't want to be visible, don't participate.

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Yeah, glad you're listening to your users. I see you're not working on your customer service skills.

 

 

Don't be sore. I'm listening to you. I just don't agree with you.

 

So, you don't agree folks should have options? You don't agree folks should be able to meet someone without that other person being able to track your movements?

 

I guess it's along the same lines as find counts. If you don't want to be visible, don't participate.

 

Yes. That's what I'm saying. Folks shouldn't have options :D

 

What I'm saying is that if someone says they are attending an event and give you a code to log you, it would silly to expect privacy since you are announcing to the world that you are attending an event. It's a non-issue as far as I can see.

 

You have the option not to give out your code.

You have the option to remove someone from your lists of meetings

You have the option to change your code so the person can't relog you

And yes, you have the option not to announce ahead of time that you plan to go to an event.

 

Sorry to diss your argument about privacy concerns, CoyoteRed, if that is your real name, but from here there seems to be all sorts of options at your disposal.

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I have to go with Jeremy on this issue of privacy if he wants to put the next event you plan on attending at the end of the buddy list/thing.

 

The only thing he's dereferencing is a "Will Attend" log on an event. I don't need his buddy list feature to see if you've added a "Will Attend" log on any event cache.

 

If people want to get a list of all of your logs for all of your submitted geocaching activity to this site, it's available to them. Simply rearranging the display of that data isn't a privacy concern. You've already opened the door to having that information publicly available.

 

I don't even have to meet a person right now to track their geocaching movements if I were to choose. Having their "will attend" records pop up on a buddy list is hardly cracking open a clam shell of privacy around them.

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