Geocaching Myths

[+hukilaulau]

When I first started geocaching I saw a number of suggestions or statements in the "newbie" threads that I took for granted because I saw them repeated over and over. After a year and a half and 555 finds I've come to question some of these oft repeated bits of wisdom. What do you think?

1) Myth: Because of gps error on the part of the hider and the finder, it's not uncommon to find a cache 30-60 feet off the posted coords.

Fact: In my experience that's VERY unusual. 80-90% of my finds have been within 12 feet once I let the gps settle. I once wrote this about my finding technique: "I set my backpack down at GZ, search in expanding circles outward to about 40 feet, then go back and look under my backpack, and pick up the cache."

2) Myth: Containers that have had food in them always make bad cache containers.

Fact: I've found dozens of coffee cans, peanut butter jars, candy containers etc. that have been in the field for as much as a couple of years with no adverse effects. I've NEVER found one that has been destroyed by animals. (Although I'm certainly not saying it doesn't happen on occasion.)

3) Myth: Magellan gps' have a "slingshot effect" that will make you overshoot a cache.

Fact: With the two Maggies I have used, as long as you slow down once you get within 60 feet or so, they will lead you right to GZ.

4) Myth: Although they may be fine for storing food, Gladware containers make terrible geocaches.

Fact: They are terrible for storing food, too.

 

Is that enough to start a discussion?

[+Renegade Knight]

1). It's not uncommon to find that the cache is 30 or more feet away from ground zero. The Majority of my finds the GPS is within 20'. The two facts are not incompatable.

 

2). Of the two containers that I have seen eaten one was a former food and one was a film canister. They liked the plastic.

 

3) Magellans do have a slingshot effect. It is possible to compensate for it as you have noticed from your post. What causes the slingshot effect aslo makes them more stable under tree cover. However the newer magellans don't seem the suffer from this like the older ones. The sport track series definitly has this. The explorist seems to have adapated.

 

4) Hmmm....I've actually used them for food...

Edited May 1, 2006 by Renegade Knight

[+rjb43nh]

1) most caches are fairly close to the posted coordinates but I have found one 0.3 miles off and one 0.75 miles off. Probably wasn't GPS error!

2) Animals do like yogurt, see photo

3) My Magellan Meridian Platinum would overshoot aproximately 150 feet if I didn't slow down near the cache.

4) Glad containers and caching don't mix

[+briansnat]

3) Myth: Magellan gps' have a "slingshot effect" that will make you overshoot a cache.

Fact: With the two Maggies I have used, as long as you slow down once you get within 60 feet or so, they will lead you right to GZ.

 

The Meridian I've used certainly does. In the beginning I'd get to ground zero, put it down and start searching. After 10 fruitless minutes, I'd pick it up and see its 150 feet back the way I came. Its also noticable on group hunts, when I'd see the Magellan users all head to one spot some distance away, while the Garmin users would go directly towards the cache. Then I'd see the Maggie users making their way back towards the Garmin users.

I hear it is not an issue with the eXplorist units but it certainy is with Meridian and Sportrak units.

 

3) Myth: Magellan gps' have a "slingshot effect" that will make you overshoot a cache.

Fact: With the two Maggies I have used, as long as you slow down once you get within 60 feet or so, they will lead you right to GZ.

4) Myth: Although they may be fine for storing food, Gladware containers make terrible geocaches.

Fact: They are terrible for storing food, too.

 

Well said!

[+Glenn]

<snip>

 

3) Myth: Magellan gps' have a "slingshot effect" that will make you overshoot a cache.

Fact: With the two Maggies I have used, as long as you slow down once you get within 60 feet or so, they will lead you right to GZ.

 

So true. On another note I recently lost my Magellan due to a dip in the ocean. I bought a little yellow Garmin, because it was the cheapist, to get back to caching till I have a chance to research the new units. Once my Magellan settled down it would be solid. This Garmin however never settles down for me. I get to within' 5 feet then if I move even one foot the reading will jump anywhere from 2 to 10 feet. Not a big deal since 5 feet is good enough for geocaching it is just really annoying.

 

4) Myth: Although they may be fine for storing food, Gladware containers make terrible geocaches.

Fact: They are terrible for storing food, too.

<snip>

 

. Sooo true.

Ammo cans are the only way to go. If an ammo can is too large for your hide then your not being creative enough.

[+BadAndy]

When I first started geocaching I saw a number of suggestions or statements in the "newbie" threads that I rdtook for granted because I saw them repeated over and over. After a year and a half and 555 finds I've come to question some of these oft repeated bits of wisdom. What do you think?

1) Myth: Because of gps error on the part of the hider and the finder, it's not uncommon to find a cache 30-60 feet off the posted coords.

Fact: In my experience that's VERY unusual. 80-90% of my finds have been within 12 feet once I let the gps settle. I once wrote this about my finding technique: "I set my backpack down at GZ, search in expanding circles outward to about 40 feet, then go back and look under my backpack, and pick up the cache."

2) Myth: Containers that have had food in them always make bad cache containers.

Fact: I've found dozens of coffee cans, peanut butter jars, candy containers etc. that have been in the field for as much as a couple of years with no adverse effects. I've NEVER found one that has been destroyed by animals. (Although I'm certainly not saying it doesn't happen on occasion.)

3) Myth: Magellan gps' have a "slingshot effect" that will make you overshoot a cache.

Fact: With the two Maggies I have used, as long as you slow down once you get within 60 feet or so, they will lead you right to GZ.

4) Myth: Although they may be fine for storing food, Gladware containers make terrible geocaches.

Fact: They are terrible for storing food, too.

 

Is that enough to start a discussion?

 

1) Myth: Because of gps error on the part of the hider and the finder, it's not uncommon to find a cache 30-60 feet off the posted coords.

 

Numerous scientific studies have concluded that only garmin users experience this problem. Magellan users zero in to within a couple feet.

 

2) Myth: Containers that have had food in them always make bad cache containers.

 

This myth is actually a marketing ploy by the Acme ammocan company. They produce authentic looking milsurp ammocans and market them though socalled "Army Navy" stores.

 

3) Myth: Magellan gps' have a "slingshot effect" that will make you overshoot a cache.

 

This is actually true of many Sportrak and Meridian series units. When you're travelling it "predicts" where you are. This compensates for the lag inherent to gpsr's that show you where you were (at high rates of speed"

 

4) Myth: Although they may be fine for storing food, Gladware containers make terrible geocaches.

 

Leftovers are nonexistant at my house...so I wouldn't know. I'm an ammocan kinda guy personally.

[+Runaround]

1) Myth: Because of gps error on the part of the hider and the finder, it's not uncommon to find a cache 30-60 feet off the posted coords.

 

My personal experience has led to many caches that are off by 30-60 feet, even after the GPS has settled down. This is not just a local phenomenon.

 

2) Myth: Containers that have had food in them always make bad cache containers.

 

To general. Some food containers are OK provided the cache owner cleaned them out well. Nearly all of the caches I've found that have been chewed by animals were former food containers. The two exceptions were a Rubbermaid where a newbie left some doggie treats as a trade item and a Lock-n-lock with a raspberry scented candle.

[adrianjohn]

When I first started geocaching I saw a number of suggestions or statements in the "newbie" threads that I took for granted because I saw them repeated over and over. After a year and a half and 555 finds I've come to question some of these oft repeated bits of wisdom. What do you think?

 

Snip

 

3) Myth: Magellan gps' have a "slingshot effect" that will make you overshoot a cache.

Fact: With the two Maggies I have used, as long as you slow down once you get within 60 feet or so, they will lead you right to GZ.

 

 

I have recently compared my Magellan Meridian and my old 315, and the slingshot effect was less pronounced in the 315. I have decided to use the Meridian to navigate on the road and the 315 for the hunt. Using this technique on my last few caches I found the cache quicker than using the meridian alone.

[CoyoteRed]

3) Myth: Magellan gps' have a "slingshot effect" that will make you overshoot a cache.

 

As others have done already, I'd confirm this myth. (Shades of Myth Busters.) There is a pronounced lag, but is easily compensated for as you have mentioned. We use SporTraks and have seen this plenty of times and have long ago learned to slow down or stop 70-50 feet out. Like BS, I put the unit down and start searching. As I search, the reading becomes more stable and "accurate" giving a rock solid and very close reading.

[+BigWhiteTruck]

3) Myth: Magellan gps' have a "slingshot effect" that will make you overshoot a cache.

 

This is actually true of many Sportrak and Meridian series units. When you're travelling it "predicts" where you are. This compensates for the lag inherent to gpsr's that show you where you were (at high rates of speed"

 

If you are overshooting the cache, it sounds to me like it is showing you to be where you were. How long does it take to walk 150 feet? If the gps were compensating for some delay, seems to me that you would undershoot the cache.

 

It sounds like the GPS is doing some type of auto-averaging of the previous X number of samples.

[+StarBrand]

In my experience about 70% of caches were within 20 feet of GZ. But it is not unusual to find one 30 to 50 feet away either and in a few cases - as much as 150 feet away (clue got me there).

 

I've not seen a lot of old food containers around here but the 3 caches I can clearly remember as being pretty chewed up were either coffer containers or peanut butter jars.

 

Here's another myth that I don't put a lot of stock in: "New cachers need to find 20-30 caches before placing one in order to get a better hide" - fact is - most newbie cachers actually make excellent hides. (please note "most" not all)

[+BadAndy]

3) Myth: Magellan gps' have a "slingshot effect" that will make you overshoot a cache.

 

This is actually true of many Sportrak and Meridian series units. When you're travelling it "predicts" where you are. This compensates for the lag inherent to gpsr's that show you where you were (at high rates of speed"

 

If you are overshooting the cache, it sounds to me like it is showing you to be where you were. How long does it take to walk 150 feet? If the gps were compensating for some delay, seems to me that you would undershoot the cache.

 

It sounds like the GPS is doing some type of auto-averaging of the previous X number of samples.

 

This "predictive" mode was meant for when you are driving down the road at 65 mph. When you stop it can overshoot your location by as much as a couple hundred feet. If the road takes a tight turn, you can also overshoot the turn.

 

When you're on foot, it's not as pronounced, but it is noticable.

[+BigWhiteTruck]

This "predictive" mode was meant for when you are driving down the road at 65 mph. When you stop it can overshoot your location by as much as a couple hundred feet. If the road takes a tight turn, you can also overshoot the turn.

 

When you're on foot, it's not as pronounced, but it is noticable.

 

Example one: You are driving and stop suddenly, the GPS shows you to be ahead of your actual location due to prediction

Example two: You are walking to a certain point, you overshoot it because the gps says that you are behind your actual location

 

aren't those total opposites?

[+welch]

When I first started geocaching I saw a number of suggestions or statements in the "newbie" threads that I took for granted because I saw them repeated over and over. After a year and a half and 555 finds I've come to question some of these oft repeated bits of wisdom. What do you think?

1) Myth: Because of gps error on the part of the hider and the finder, it's not uncommon to find a cache 30-60 feet off the posted coords.

Fact: In my experience that's VERY unusual. 80-90% of my finds have been within 12 feet once I let the gps settle. I once wrote this about my finding technique: "I set my backpack down at GZ, search in expanding circles outward to about 40 feet, then go back and look under my backpack, and pick up the cache."

Yes 30 foot and under is not uncommon, but 50 or 60ft is not impossiable either. I'm not sure there is an easy number, skyline, leaf cover, placer and seekers patience and percision all effect how far 'off' it a cache is. It seems like its much easier to just say it maybe be off by up to 60ft then write a paragraph about things that might make the reading 'better' or 'worse'.

 

2) Myth: Containers that have had food in them always make bad cache containers.

Fact: I've found dozens of coffee cans, peanut butter jars, candy containers etc. that have been in the field for as much as a couple of years with no adverse effects. I've NEVER found one that has been destroyed by animals. (Although I'm certainly not saying it doesn't happen on occasion.)

I've never seen one that exploded just because it was a food container , but several plastic containers that have been chewed on, even threw. But I've seen this even on brand new ones and ones that never food in them (film tubes for one thing). I'm not sure if some plastics just taste good, or maybe mice just habitually chew on everything in their area, and being plastic they can do damage. I have no doubt that scented ones add to this problem.

The other problem about food containers is that they often don't last that long (6-12months at most). Butter dishs and cottage cheese tubs tend to chip and crack in flex points, especially in cold climates. Coffee cans (at least the older metal ones) the clear lids would start crack and split in the center after flexing many times.

 

3) Myth: Magellan gps' have a "slingshot effect" that will make you overshoot a cache.

Fact: With the two Maggies I have used, as long as you slow down once you get within 60 feet or so, they will lead you right to GZ.

I don't have a magellan so I don't really know.

What I've heard repeatly is that using a magellan you'll overshoot the caches if you try walking straight to it. Something about the unit liking to kick into averaging even at low walking speeds. The given work around is to stop before you get there and wait for a minute so the units stops averaging and gives you an accurate distance.

 

4) Myth: Although they may be fine for storing food, Gladware containers make terrible geocaches.

Fact: They are terrible for storing food, too.

Is that enough to start a discussion?

I tend to avoid gladware so I wouldn't know.

[+JohnnyVegas]

THe older Magellans do have a sling shot effect. But if you are use to it it is not and issue. WHile I have had to slow while driving to a drive up cache, when I am walking I have not had this problem.

 

I also have an Explorist 500, the new Magellans do not have the sling shot effect.

[+BadAndy]

 

Example one: You are driving and stop suddenly, the GPS shows you to be ahead of your actual location due to prediction

Example two: You are walking to a certain point, you overshoot it because the gps says that you are behind your actual location

 

aren't those total opposites?

 

When I refer to overshooting, I'm talking about the gps overshooting. Example 2 would be undershooting.

 

To minimize the overshooting, the time honored trick was to stop and take a few steps back to cancel out the predictive function, or to keep the gps stationary for a minute or so and let it setlle in.

[Jeremy]

 

2) Myth: Containers that have had food in them always make bad cache containers.

Fact: I've found dozens of coffee cans, peanut butter jars, candy containers etc. that have been in the field for as much as a couple of years with no adverse effects. I've NEVER found one that has been destroyed by animals. (Although I'm certainly not saying it doesn't happen on occasion.)

 

There are no animals in New York.

 

Seriously, if you clean something thoroughly enough it can lose any trace of food smell. It is the food smell that attracts animals. Sometimes soaking it in a mixture of bleach and water can clear out the smell but it is more than reasonable to consider alternate options than food containers.

 

I think the problem with the above statement is the user of "always." You shouldn't use always when you make suggestions with so many environmental factors.

[+G-Squad]

I use a Map330. My way to combat the "slingshot effect" is to set the proximity alarm to 100 feet. When it goes off, I stop moving and stay in place for about 30 seconds. By then, it has settled down. I also change from the map screen to the compass screen. I take my bearing and estimate about where the cache should be. I go to that spot and start hunting. If no cache after a few minutes, I check the Map330 again. Repeat until found.

[+Night Stalker]

The biggest myth I have seen is that 1/1 rated caches mean that it is handicapped accessable and that it is so easy it shouts "I am over here". I have more no finds on 1/1's than any other rated caches.

[+hukilaulau]

 

2) Myth: Containers that have had food in them always make bad cache containers.

Fact: I've found dozens of coffee cans, peanut butter jars, candy containers etc. that have been in the field for as much as a couple of years with no adverse effects. I've NEVER found one that has been destroyed by animals. (Although I'm certainly not saying it doesn't happen on occasion.)

 

There are no animals in New York.

 

Heh... Please refer to the new "Gay cruising" thread and then search "Caches in Central Park"

You'll find yer animals!

As I hoped, I've learned more from this thread than I knew when I started it. I understand the "slingshot effect" better. Funny, though, I use my SporTrak on the road, and it seems to predict 90 degree turns accurately.

The main point about food containers: You can do MUCH WORSE than a clean coffee can or peanut butter jar.

(Yes, I'm ragging on Gladware again. There is just no situation or climate where they will hold up.)

[+Team Maccabee]

The biggest myth I have seen is that 1/1 rated caches mean that it is handicapped accessable and that it is so easy it shouts "I am over here". I have more no finds on 1/1's than any other rated caches.

 

Indeed! Read the fine print on the caches!

 

This has been discussed ad nauseum in other forums, but since we're bringing up myths:

1. Myth: micros are always/usually bad caches.

2. Myth: the best caches are always/usually ammocans.

 

Let's face it. The type of cache container really has no bearing on the quality of the hide and the quality of the cache. There are some people out there who like to trade everytime they go to a cache, so they won't try for micros ( although I have seen trade items in micros -- really small swag). But I would go out on a limb, and say that most cachers really appreciate a well thought-out hide/cache. A micro in a bush is usually not well thought-out, but a micro hanging from a pedestrian bridge or hidden in a fake bolt is usually appreciated for its time/effort/creativity. At the same time, ammocans hidden behind a tree don't by themselves make a good cache. Sure you can trade, but where's the fun in the hunt (yes, I know that's my bias...). The hider of a high-quality cache takes the time, effort and creativity to match the container with the cache and terrain.

 

Just my humble opinion, not an attempt to hijack the thread... really.

 

Team Maccabee

[+Confucius' Cat]

1

3) Magellans do have a slingshot effect. It is possible to compensate for it as you have noticed from your post. What causes the slingshot effect aslo makes them more stable under tree cover. However the newer magellans don't seem the suffer from this like the older ones. The sport track series definitly has this. The explorist seems to have adapated.

 

 

I have used a Meridian Platinum since the first month I started caching. I have learned to stop about 150' before GZ and "let the cache come to me". I also agree that it works GREAT where others post "poor readings due to tree cover".

 

I have considered trying a newer unit, but I can't justify the cost of repalacing something that is not broke.

[+Vinny & Sue Team]

The biggest myth I have seen is that 1/1 rated caches mean that it is handicapped accessable and that it is so easy it shouts "I am over here". I have more no finds on 1/1's than any other rated caches.

 

Much like you, I have far more DNFs on caches rated 1.5/1.5 and lower than any other type.

[+Harry Dolphin]

 

2) Myth: Containers that have had food in them always make bad cache containers.

Fact: I've found dozens of coffee cans, peanut butter jars, candy containers etc. that have been in the field for as much as a couple of years with no adverse effects. I've NEVER found one that has been destroyed by animals. (Although I'm certainly not saying it doesn't happen on occasion.)

 

There are no animals in New York.

 

Dunno. "Is that the cache?" is usually answered by "No, that's a rat poison container." I've only seen three or four rats while caching in The City, but I'd seen hundreds of rat poison containers.

 

My Garmin Etrex definitely has a boomerang effect. I've walked a hundred a fifty feet by several caches. I guess I walk too fast. It's more noticeable when driving and benchmarking. I can drive .20 past a benchmark before the Etrex catches up with me.

Edited May 3, 2006 by Harry Dolphin

[Clan Riffster]

You forgot the greatest geomyth of all, to wit;

"Film canisters in Burger King shrubs are kewl caches"

 

I know opinions are like....uh.....never mind. Family forum. You get the idea? Anywho....It's always been my opinion that a cache was originally defined as a hiding place used especially for storing provisions, a place for concealment and safekeeping, as of valuables, and/or, a store of goods or valuables concealed in a hiding place. Granted, those who like micros would probably consider a damp bit of paper as qualifying as "provisions/valuables", so I reckon to each his/her own.

[+Jared_and_Tanis]

My Garmin Etrex definitely has a boomerang effect. I've walked a hundred a fifty feet by several caches. I guess I walk too fast. It's more noticeable when driving and benchmarking. I can drive .20 past a benchmark before the Etrex catches up with me.

 

You might want to go into your GPS settings and check to see if your eTrex is in "Battery Save" mode. This mode takes readings much less often than "Normal," lengthing your battery life. It also works fine on the road, or when you know where you're travelling, but I find that I like mine set to normal when trying to zero in on a cache. Just don't set it to "Demo" - I don't think that would help much.

 

As for caches being 50-60 feet off, I didn't see anyone mention other geocachers. Caches don't always get hidden in the exact same spot, and I've seen some like have migrated several feet (or at least to a place where the hint doesn't make much sense). Granted, 50-60 is a lot, but if you include your normal GPS variance...

[+supertech]

My Garmin Etrex definitely has a boomerang effect. I've walked a hundred a fifty feet by several caches. I guess I walk too fast. It's more noticeable when driving and benchmarking. I can drive .20 past a benchmark before the Etrex catches up with me.

 

You might want to go into your GPS settings and check to see if your eTrex is in "Battery Save" mode. This mode takes readings much less often than "Normal," lengthing your battery life. It also works fine on the road, or when you know where you're travelling, but I find that I like mine set to normal when trying to zero in on a cache. Just don't set it to "Demo" - I don't think that would help much.

 

As for caches being 50-60 feet off, I didn't see anyone mention other geocachers. Caches don't always get hidden in the exact same spot, and I've seen some like have migrated several feet (or at least to a place where the hint doesn't make much sense). Granted, 50-60 is a lot, but if you include your normal GPS variance...

DEMO... java script:emoticon('', 'smid_13')

that's funny.

 

As for the bat'save thing... Thanks. I forgot that. I need to go check something then...

 

This is the first I heard about magellan having a sling shot effect, but I am now glad I've used garmins mostly. I had a Maggy 410 for a while and I am starting to miss the 'averaging' feature on it. I think hiders should always visit the new site a few times and average the coords over those visits. I did and I really think it helped my first hide be more accurate. Maybe to hide, a person should have at least two brands of GPSr to check coords against.

 

another myth: Muggles are the enemy.

 

I've gotten several PPL interested in caching while heading for a find. In fact, I was a geomuggle and even had a GPSr for about a year. When I heard I could so something with my technology I was pumped..

[+Glenn]

<snip>

Maybe to hide, a person should have at least two brands of GPSr to check coords against.

<snip>

 

That is another myth. Just because someone hid a cache using a Magellan doen't mean that it is easier for Magellan user to find it than someone using a Garmin.

[CoyoteRed]

To get back on topic:

 

Myth: You can't get a buried cache listed.

 

Truth: While it is not a good idea to bury a cache in most circumstances, there are exceptions. Clear permission from the landowner is paramount.

 

Myth: Caches in National Parks are illegal.

 

Truth: Caches in National Parks without the ranger's permission is illegal. As of the last time I checked there was no national policy prohibiting geocaches in National Parks. The local authority does have the latitude to approve the placement of a cache. However, there are at least 3 Federal crimes you could be charged with if you place a cache without permission.

 

Note: this is different from National Wildlife Refuges. Geocaching is not seen as compatible with wildlife conservation.