Hints

[+sbukosky]

Yeah, I know the approvers have enough to do but this one has been burning me for a few years now. Useless hints, useless cute comments and a lack of hints in general.

 

My philosophy on hiding a cache or waypoint marker is for a cacher to be able to find them but a casual hiker to not notice them. In respect for people's time, I have always provided good hints for all but the most obvious of caches. As further demonstration for the need of good hints, I've seen far too many areas trashed by people trying to find a waypoint. Deep in the woods is one thing. In sight of a trail is horrible for our image. Lets have the approvers check on the hints too. If obviously inappropriate, don't approve it. If one is not desired to be added, so be it. But I'd like to see hints required for each waypoint.

[+Jamie Z]

Pardon me if I'm reading too much into your post, but you say that you think hints should be required, and that the hint should tell you where the cache is.

 

On that, I totally disagree. Part of the interest from geocaching is that it's not a 100% game. In fact, my find percentage is (when I last figured it out) about 85%. That is, about 15% of the time when I go look for a cache, I log a DNF.

 

On the two caches I have hidden, I have not included a hint because I know that a lot (most?) of cacher read the hint before they even get to the location.

 

I agree with you that useless of cute comments in the hint is dumb. It's especially weird because on the cache submission page it says, "Please keep your hints short, so decoding it on the trail is easier. If you don't have a hint, leave it blank."

 

But making a hint required? Count me out.

 

Jamie

[+Team DEMP]

Always a touchy subject when it comes up.

 

I agree that hints such as:

You're kidding right?

No hints here, move along.

Parking coords

etc.

 

are useless if you're out in the woods looking for a cache and can't find it. Decoding (unless you just print things out ahead of time already decoded) is sort of frustrating to someone that can't find it and is at the spot.

 

Maybe a good warning on the page in red bold about please only provide useful hints would help.

 

Not sure what an approver goes through on a checklist, but I think I'd check the hints too, at least on the initial approval, to make sure they were helpful and appropriate.

[+mrking]

Yeah, I know the approvers have enough to do but this one has been burning me for a few years now.  Useless hints, useless cute comments and a lack of hints in general.

 

My philosophy on hiding a cache or waypoint marker is for a cacher to be able to find them but a casual hiker to not notice them.  In respect for people's time, I have always provided good hints for all but the most obvious of caches. As further demonstration for the need of good hints, I've seen far too many areas trashed by people trying to find a waypoint.  Deep in the woods is one thing.  In sight of a trail is horrible for our image.  Lets have the approvers check on the hints too.  If obviously inappropriate, don't approve it.  If one is not desired to be added, so be it.  But I'd like to see hints required for each waypoint.

Hmmmm, in some respects yes but in others no.

 

If it was about saving time for the cacher, why not just tell them they can log it after reading the hint and be done with it. I could do at least 50 or more a day that way.

 

For me GC is all about going out and looking for the little box. I take great satisfaction in not reading hints and do not think they should be a requirement for a log listing.

 

I read hints in one situation - when I have spent over 30 minutes looking carefully for the cache. Nothing pisses me off the most when there is no hint and the cachers has improper coordinates and the cache ends up being 25 meters or more away from the coords. GRRRRRRRRRRRRR, that makes me mad!!

 

However. when I do read hints they should be descriptive. If I take the time to decode them I want them to mean something. From that point of view it would be nice for approvers to make sure the hint area just doesn't say crap like "No hints required" or "Under the log in the forest" or the best yet "This is an easy cache" I mean WTF is with that. I would like to smack the cacher upside the head when I read crap like that.

 

So no, don't make hints a requirement for cache listing, but yes, the approver should make sure it is a real hint and just not a silly message if one is provided.

 

mrking

Edited February 20, 2005 by mrking

[+Fattuhr]

So no, don't make hints a requirement for cache listing, but yes, the approver should make sure it is a real hint and just not a silly message if one is provided.

 

mrking

Ditto.

Just useful hints if needed.

[+Lazyboy & Mitey Mite]

I always thought that long winded rambling have nothing to do with a hint type of hints were silly but, it doesn't bother me to the point that I want more rules.

[Keystone]

When listing a cache, I will sometimes delete "hints" like "This one's so easy, you don't need a hint."

 

It is easy enough for the owner to add it back in later.

[+TotemLake]

My philosophy on hiding a cache or waypoint marker is for a cacher to be able to find them but a casual hiker to not notice them....

 

...But I'd like to see hints required for each waypoint.

This goes to bending the game to be played your way by all... and that isn't the way I see the game should be played.

 

Yes it can be frustrating to find the hint is useless, but then that's part of the intended challenge by the hider.

 

The bottom line is, because of the variety of ways the game can be played, the variety of ways the descriptions and hints can be utilized or not, makes this a worthy sport for anybody getting involved. If we were to go all vanilla on an aspect of the game, such as requiring useful hints for all waypoints, then you've taken the variety out of the challenges. It becomes less fun to some, and more about the numbers.

 

Don't suggest to restrict how the game is played just because you're frustrated at not being able to find it. You will eventually lose interest in the sport and stop playing it while leaving behind a legacy that took away the challenge that some folks prefer and enjoy. Instead, change your perspective on what is causing you to stop having fun.

[+sbukosky]

If we were to go all vanilla on an aspect of the game, such as requiring useful hints for all waypoints, then you've taken the variety out of the challenges. It becomes less fun to some, and more about the numbers.

 

No one has to read the hint. My biggest point is any hint given should be reviewed by the approver for being worthy of spending the time with a cache sheet, decoding each letter.

 

Elsewhere I make a case for requiring hints. But again, no one has to decode them. If you are really interested in a challenge, sell your GPSR and use a topo map and a compass.

[+IV_Warrior]

Even better, I once saw a virtual cache where the logging requirement was the encripted hint. If you didn't decode the hint, you had no idea what you had to do, to log the cache.

[+TotemLake]

If you are really interested in a challenge, sell your GPSR and use a topo map and a compass.

Funny... but it's not the level of challenge I choose for myself and that's where you and I differ. Here and in the other thread you're asking to have hints be more useful and more, even required on all waypoints. That's a level of challenge the hider has the ability to choose for his/her style of gaming which is what you want to change and even stifle with your suggested changes. I'd rather not take away that choice of creativity. You would rather it was taken away.

 

Point in fact, sometimes hints that are given are perceived as useless because the searcher doesn't understand the reference or relevance. If you decode the hint and find it says "None given cuz it isn't needed," then you're probably thinking too hard on the condition of the hide. If it says something to the effect of "Buahahaha! no hints will be given," then you have to take the level of difficulty into consideration for the lack of a hint.

 

Let's be realistic here... it takes mere minutes for a hint to be decoded. So the amount of time "wasted" really isn't all that much to begin with and some folks find themselves chagrined because it wasn't a dead give away like they had hoped for, that's usually when they bemoan the uselessness of the hint. Instead of complaining, smirk and take it as part of the challenge.

Edited February 21, 2005 by TotemLake

[+ChileHead]

When listing a cache, I will sometimes delete "hints" like "This one's so easy, you don't need a hint."

 

It is easy enough for the owner to add it back in later.

It's funny how often people have those kind of hints. When I first started, I did that once or twice, and then decided it was too annoying.