Upcoming destruction of an cache

[+Beefcake The Mighty]

Didnt really see any topics covering this topic. There is a .50 ammo container in a small wooded area across the highway from me. It was one of my first finds. Recently I've noticed a lot of activity in the area. Surveyors, contractors and now they are marking the woods off and putting stakes in the ground. This area is growing and this cache will soon be destroyed. I've emailed the owner but do not expect a reply as he hasnt logged on since 2011. Any suggestions on how to save this cache?

 

oops "a" cache not "an"

Edited January 14, 2014 by Beefcake The Mighty

[+Traditional Bill]

If the area is being built up, there's not really anything that can save the cache if GZ will be lost. You may want to pick the ammo can up and hold onto it for a while to see if the CO claims it. If not, re hide it somewhere else......at least that's what I would do. Caches come and they go, unfortunately some go sooner than others. By the sounds of it, the CO has abandoned the cache and it may be best to just let this one go.

[+NeverSummer]

If the area is being built up, there's not really anything that can save the cache if GZ will be lost. You may want to pick the ammo can up and hold onto it for a while to see if the CO claims it. If not, re hide it somewhere else......at least that's what I would do. Caches come and they go, unfortunately some go sooner than others. By the sounds of it, the CO has abandoned the cache and it may be best to just let this one go.

Email the owner again, and email the local Reviewer.

 

If you've got some info that the area will be changed, and the cache compromised, then I think you're well within reason to grab the ammo can and hang onto it for the owner.

 

But, email the owner, email the Reviewer, and post your Needs Maintenance/Needs Archived log to the cache page.

[+geodarts]

Apart from sitting down in front if the bulldozers or suing for a more complete environmental report, I agree that the location is gone. If you decide to rescue the ammo box from certain destruction you should also post a Needs Archive log and explain what happened to the cache.

[+wmpastor]

If the area is being built up, there's not really anything that can save the cache if GZ will be lost. You may want to pick the ammo can up and hold onto it for a while to see if the CO claims it. If not, re hide it somewhere else......at least that's what I would do. Caches come and they go, unfortunately some go sooner than others. By the sounds of it, the CO has abandoned the cache and it may be best to just let this one go.

Email the owner again, and email the local Reviewer.

 

If you've got some info that the area will be changed, and the cache compromised, then I think you're well within reason to grab the ammo can and hang onto it for the owner.

 

But, email the owner, email the Reviewer, and post your Needs Maintenance/Needs Archived log to the cache page.

....along with a note that you're holding the cache, so that someone doesn't go out to seek it.

[+T.D.M.22]

I agree-grab the cache, email the owner and reviewer, and leave a note on the cache page. Best case-you save the CO's cache and he's thankful, worst case-no reply from the CO and you keep the ammo can. Come to think of it, maybe hearing from the CO isn't the best case...

[+Beefcake The Mighty]

I'm gonna chain myself to a tree and boycott the clearing of the woods! Thanks for the replies, I was looking for proper way of rescuing this cache. I'll give the owner a few days to see if he replies.

 

Also, forgive my noobness, but who and what is the Reviewer? Ive been doing this about six months, have lurked here, but never heard of this.

[+NeverSummer]

I'm gonna chain myself to a tree and boycott the clearing of the woods! Thanks for the replies, I was looking for proper way of rescuing this cache. I'll give the owner a few days to see if he replies.

 

Also, forgive my noobness, but who and what is the Reviewer? Ive been doing this about six months, have lurked here, but never heard of this.

The Reviewer is a superhuman, wait, nonhuman...er dog. It's a dog.

 

But seriously, if you can give a link to the cache, we can help identify who we are talking about.

 

Volunteer Reviewers are the folks who help check the caches people submit to the website against the guidelines for the game, local, state, regional and national laws, etc. They then help the cache owner to get their listing published on Geocaching.com

 

Start your learning about these volunteers at this link. (http://www.geocaching.com/volunteers/)

[Clan Riffster]

Beefcake, when you hide a cache, and submit the form to Groundspeak to create the cache page, a Reviewer checks the listing to ensure it is in compliance with the guidelines. If it does, they publish the cache page, making it visible to the rest of the caching world. In most cases, you can scroll through the logs to the very first one. If the entry says "Published", you've most likely found the Reviewer for that area.

[+niraD]

Geocache listings are reviewed by volunteers. These volunteer reviewers make sure your new geocache meets the guidelines. They can also intervene in situations where the cache owner doesn't address cache problems appropriately.

[+dprovan]

It's fine to contact the owner directly, but the important thing to do is file a log entry on the cache. It should be a Note if you think there might be a problem but aren't sure, a Needs Maintenance if you think there's going to be a problem but the cache is safe for now, or a Needs Archived if you (or the construction workers) took the cache and GZ is no longer there. Your goal is tell everyone, not just the CO. Those logs are as good if not better as the way to tell the CO, but you can send private mail, too, if there's something you don't want to tell everyone else.

 

I'm not quite sure why people are suggesting contacting the reviewer. The reviewer should only be involved if it needs to be archived, and they'll be informed about that automatically when you make that decision and post the needs archive log.

 

The big lesson here is that caches come and go. You'll always have your memories, but the cache might not be there forever.

[the3gmen]

I agree-grab the cache, email the owner and reviewer, and leave a note on the cache page.

 

This exactly.

 

If you don't hear from the owner in a timely manner, post a needs archive log with an explanation. Then you can create a brand new cache with the ammo can.

[+Beefcake The Mighty]

Thanks everyone for helping with my question. I'm sure the cache will be fine for at least a week. Its about 100 yards away from the current activity. Here's the link:

 

http://www.geocaching.com/geocache/GC1N0CA_tb-hostel-at-las-colinas?guid=f104ea27-ee32-45ac-8c0e-6ef8a1d0d712

[+K13]

Thanks everyone for helping with my question. I'm sure the cache will be fine for at least a week. Its about 100 yards away from the current activity. Here's the link:

 

http://www.geocachin...0e-6ef8a1d0d712

 

Scroll down the cache page to find 'Prime Reviewer' and click on that user-name to send a message. This is the second log on the page, so you have to keep scrolling down until you get to the end beginning.

[+Manville Possum]

Last Visit by the CO was Saturday,15 October 2011?

That poor puppy needs a new home. Save that ammo can!

[+NeecesandNephews]

It's fine to contact the owner directly, but the important thing to do is file a log entry on the cache. It should be a Note if you think there might be a problem but aren't sure, a Needs Maintenance if you think there's going to be a problem but the cache is safe for now, or a Needs Archived if you (or the construction workers) took the cache and GZ is no longer there. Your goal is tell everyone, not just the CO. Those logs are as good if not better as the way to tell the CO, but you can send private mail, too, if there's something you don't want to tell everyone else.

 

I'm not quite sure why people are suggesting contacting the reviewer. The reviewer should only be involved if it needs to be archived, and they'll be informed about that automatically when you make that decision and post the needs archive log.

 

The big lesson here is that caches come and go. You'll always have your memories, but the cache might not be there forever.

 

The reason to contact a Reviewer, in my opinion, would be so that Reviewer can assess the situation and decide to disable temporarily, or archive the cache.

 

People don't always (usually?) read the logs before hunting, and I am not sure if the new free app that's causing such an uproar even allows you to view the logs.

 

As long as the cache is still in place and findable, this is not an issue, but it sounds like that will not be the case shortly.

 

I would attempt to save the container is it faces certain destruction, but I would also make every effort to return it to the CO.

 

 

[7rxc]

It's usually not to hard to contact the job supervisor, and usually easy to get some rough scheduling information.

That might help 'rescue' the can before it gets taken up with the slash piles. Waiting too late might prevent you from getting in there at all if they fence it off. Explaining your concern might help as well, since you are willing to remove it and get it at least disabled in the short term. That will help reduce the number of finders trying to locate it... and thus his problems with shooing them off his/her site.

 

Doug 7rxc

[+dprovan]

The reason to contact a Reviewer, in my opinion, would be so that Reviewer can assess the situation and decide to disable temporarily, or archive the cache.

What does the reviewer know that the OP doesn't know? If the cache needs to be archived, the OP is the person in a position to decide that.

 

People don't always (usually?) read the logs before hunting, and I am not sure if the new free app that's causing such an uproar even allows you to view the logs.

 

As long as the cache is still in place and findable, this is not an issue, but it sounds like that will not be the case shortly.

Yes, as long as the person on the scene, the OP, thinks it's OK, then it doesn't matter whether the cache is enabled or disabled. Once the cache is gone, for whatever reason, the OP should file a Needs Archived report, and then the reviewer knows to disable the cache.

[Space*Cadet]

I'm gonna chain myself to a tree and boycott the clearing of the woods! Thanks for the replies, I was looking for proper way of rescuing this cache. I'll give the owner a few days to see if he replies.

 

Also, forgive my noobness, but who and what is the Reviewer? Ive been doing this about six months, have lurked here, but never heard of this.

 

Here is a link to the reviewer of the cache you are concerned about: http://www.geocaching.com/profile/?guid=82dbf47d-7961-48e1-8309-cf1af70fc628

 

I agree that you should probably remove the cache, at the first available opportunity, and also post a "Log Note" that you have removed the cache to keep it safe. And then email the CO again to let them know you have their cache and also request a "Needs Archived" log on the cache page. That's what I would do.

[+dprovan]

I agree that you should probably remove the cache, at the first available opportunity, and also post a "Log Note" that you have removed the cache to keep it safe. And then email the CO again to let them know you have their cache and also request a "Needs Archived" log on the cache page. That's what I would do.

I don't understand why you talk about posting a Note when you're also, quite correctly, saying that a Needs Archived should be posted. The note is extraneous, and I can't even imagine how the two would say anything different. And once the NA has been posted, emailing the CO is redundant, too. There's nothing wrong with dropping him a personal note if there's anything else to say, although personally I prefer to say everything publicly in the NA, including any expressions of sympathy and appreciation.

[+NeverSummer]

The reason to contact a Reviewer, in my opinion, would be so that Reviewer can assess the situation and decide to disable temporarily, or archive the cache.

What does the reviewer know that the OP doesn't know? If the cache needs to be archived, the OP is the person in a position to decide that.

 

People don't always (usually?) read the logs before hunting, and I am not sure if the new free app that's causing such an uproar even allows you to view the logs.

 

As long as the cache is still in place and findable, this is not an issue, but it sounds like that will not be the case shortly.

Yes, as long as the person on the scene, the OP, thinks it's OK, then it doesn't matter whether the cache is enabled or disabled. Once the cache is gone, for whatever reason, the OP should file a Needs Archived report, and then the reviewer knows to disable the cache.

The Reviewer might know the owner, can view the history of Reviewer Notes, and/or can unarchive or re-enable if the cache site is only temporarily disturbed. The Reviewer knows more about this issue than we do here in the forums, no?

 

Emailing the Reviewer is also helpful outreach for a newer cacher to learn how the local Reviewer likes to handle these issues. There might be something none of us here in the forums could guess about permissions, processes, and the like. The Reviewer has local context, and could give better advice than we can beyond telling the OP to log a NM/NA to the cache listing and emailing the owner if they "rescue" the ammo can.

 

Better question is, why not email the Reviewer?

[+Don_J]

I agree-grab the cache, email the owner and reviewer, and leave a note on the cache page. Best case-you save the CO's cache and he's thankful, worst case-no reply from the CO and you keep the ammo can. Come to think of it, maybe hearing from the CO isn't the best case...

 

I'd welcome the opportunity to meet another geocacher, even it is just to return the ammo can.

[+dprovan]

The Reviewer might know the owner, can view the history of Reviewer Notes, and/or can unarchive or re-enable if the cache site is only temporarily disturbed. The Reviewer knows more about this issue than we do here in the forums, no?

The reviewer has additional resources, yes, but those are useful after the person with eyes on GZ makes a determination. The reviewers don't run things. We run things. The reviewers are there to deal with those behind the scenes issues when we need them to. If there's something the CO or the reviewer knows that the OP doesn't that makes this impending destruction different than it appears, that should come out once the OP files the appropriate log.

 

The NA log entry is best way to alert a reviewer of a problem even if the reviewer knows something that mitigates the concern. I'm still not seeing any case to send a secret e-mail instead.

 

Emailing the Reviewer is also helpful outreach for a newer cacher to learn how the local Reviewer likes to handle these issues.

I'm sorry, but I just don't think it would be reasonable for a reviewer to want to handle this issue secretly, and that's the only option that would be facilitated by sending the reviewer private mail.

 

Maybe this is one of those local culture issues. Do reviewers in other areas act like dungeon masters or something? In my area, they're just bouncers -- well respected bouncers, but still bouncers -- and I think everyone, including them, likes it better that way.

[Keystone]

As a reviewer who's archived nearly 10,000 listings, I've developed a decent sense of what action to take (or not take) based on reading the logs. When I'm notified of an issue, I will either disable the listing to give the owner a few weeks to deal with the problem, or do nothing (I have a form letter saying that I'm treating the Needs Archived log as if it were a DNF or NM log), or do nothing (because the owner has already taken appropriate action). In rare cases I will archive the listing immediately (land manager or law enforcement complaints, mostly).

 

Most of the time, I am taking action based just on my instincts rather than personal, first-hand knowledge gained from visiting the cache. It's my job. If I took inappropriate action regularly, I'd expect people to complain to Geocaching HQ, who would then send Signal's cousin "Guido the Frog" to pay me a visit.

 

Prime Reviewer has published (and archived) even more caches than I have, so he's quite capable of reacting to a report about this cache with an apparently absent owner.

 

I am indifferent between being alerted to a problem via private email or via a Needs Archived log to the cache listing. Both types of reports get to me, so no need to be repetitive by using both methods. Some people prefer private email because they're concerned that the CO or others in the local community will react negatively towards a person who reports a problem by logging "Needs Archived." What some call a "Cache Cop," others call a "Responsible Geocacher."

 

Thank you to the OP for being a Responsible Geocacher, and for asking here for assistance.

[+dprovan]

What some call a "Cache Cop," others call a "Responsible Geocacher."

I suppose I'm negative about sending back channel e-mail to the reviewer precisely because I want to encourage people in this position to think hard about whether they're being a responsible geocacher or just a cache cop.

 

Thank you to the OP for being a Responsible Geocacher, and for asking here for assistance.

Yeah, fortunately in this case it's clear the OP is doing a good deed, which is one reason I want the proceedings carried out in public on the log. Not only does the OP get the public credit he deserves for being a Responsible Geocacher, he also sets a good example for others.

[+NeverSummer]

What some call a "Cache Cop," others call a "Responsible Geocacher."

I suppose I'm negative about sending back channel e-mail to the reviewer precisely because I want to encourage people in this position to think hard about whether they're being a responsible geocacher or just a cache cop.

 

Thank you to the OP for being a Responsible Geocacher, and for asking here for assistance.

Yeah, fortunately in this case it's clear the OP is doing a good deed, which is one reason I want the proceedings carried out in public on the log. Not only does the OP get the public credit he deserves for being a Responsible Geocacher, he also sets a good example for others.

Oh, oh dprovan...

It's like you think the suggestion to email a Reviewer is becoming a "tattle-tail". It isn't!

 

Read slower to my posts then. I recommended that they post a proper log, and recommeded that they contact the Reviewer (suggested because they are a reasonably new geocacher, and they didn't even know what a Reviewer was. It's helpful as a new cacher to build rapport with someone with the knowledge of the game at a level to be a Reviewer, no?).

 

But, email the owner, email the Reviewer, and post your Needs Maintenance/Needs Archived log to the cache page.

 

"Secret email"?! This isn't about being all cloak-and-dagger about cache issues. At some point you need to realize that this game has nuance, and that it can be helpful to make a more formal contact with another human who isn't a "dungeon master", but instead a keyholding volunteer. Many keys to open many doors.

 

God forbid a new cacher not only "does what is right" as a responsible geocacher by posting a NM/NA log and rescues a cache container, but also reaches out to a mentor (of sorts) to learn more about how situations like this are handled by this individual Reviewer. This would make a quite well-rounded cacher, IMHO, and not a "cache cop" vigilatne who runs wild over the sacred game™ with little-to-no knowledge about nuance.

 

Plus, everybody knows that Jeremy is Gozar, and the Lackeys and Reviewers are the gatekeepers and keymasters, not dungeon masters.

Edited January 17, 2014 by NeverSummer

[4wheelin_fool]

It could be weeks, months, or even years before anything happens. Even so, its possible that the property is only being surveyed and nothing else. I would wait until heavy equipment shows up and the land is being cleared before doing anything. You know, the ammo can could go missing, but it doesn't belong to anyone but the cache owner. If it goes missing, it's on him.

[+Beefcake The Mighty]

Couple days ago I couldn't resist. I parked the truck and walked to one of the workers to ask when the woods were to be destroyed. Boy did they look at me weird. But glad to here they are just laying fiber optics or some other sort of line and will be gone in a week!

[+Don_J]

 

I am indifferent between being alerted to a problem via private email or via a Needs Archived log to the cache listing. Both types of reports get to me, so no need to be repetitive by using both methods. Some people prefer private email because they're concerned that the CO or others in the local community will react negatively towards a person who reports a problem by logging "Needs Archived." What some call a "Cache Cop," others call a "Responsible Geocacher."

 

Thank you to the OP for being a Responsible Geocacher, and for asking here for assistance.

 

One consideration that I have on this is that I, as well as Dprovan live in a very busy area and we each have three reviewers. If it is an important issue, a NA log goes into the queue where the first of the three will see it and take the appropriate action. There are issues that come up where I would rather not put my name in public, but I don't see why that would be an issue with the situation described in the OP.