Garmin 78 marine series features paperless geocaching

[+Redwoods Mtn Biker]

In case you missed it, Garmin announced a new handheld marine series this morning, the successor to the 76 series. It includes paperless geocaching as a feature...

 

https://buy.garmin.com/shop/compare.do?cID=...reProduct=63603

[Grasscatcher]

I had to hunt to find whether or not it was WAAS compatible.....I now wonder if that feature will actually work.

 

Can anyone find out what chipset?

 

What kind of antenna?? .....Quad ? or ceramic like Oregon series ?

 

External antenna capable?

Edited April 23, 2010 by Grasscatcher

[+Redwoods Mtn Biker]

I added a screenshot of a new menu system to my post this morning:

 

http://gpstracklog.com/2010/04/garmin-gpsm...-handhelds.html

[+coggins]

External antenna capable?

Yes, MCX connector.

[+Redwoods Mtn Biker]

Another note -- Interesting that they didn't bump the resolution (though they did go from 256 colors to 65,000). Looks like the market is going to (at least in part) be for those wanting a very bright screen.

[Grasscatcher]

See if you can find a view of the back of the unit where we can tell if there is still a "4 post connector plug" for serial connection. Not for map data transfer but for NMEA data output.

[Grasscatcher]

External antenna capable?

Yes, MCX connector.

 

Coggins,

Where did you find that info?

 

This may be the best thing since sliced bread , sex, and stuff like that were invented!

[+coggins]

External antenna capable?

Yes, MCX connector.

 

Coggins,

Where did you find that info?

 

This may be the best thing since sliced bread , sex, and stuff like that were invented!

Product page->Accessories tab->Antennas

 

Looks like it also has an RS-232 serial port as well.

Edited April 23, 2010 by coggins

[Grasscatcher]

Another note -- Interesting that they didn't bump the resolution (though they did go from 256 colors to 65,000). Looks like the market is going to (at least in part) be for those wanting a very bright screen.

 

Just a comment along those lines..... what the useful purpose of being able to have multiple maps, GB's of data and such if you can't see it? That's the problem with the Oregon/Dakota series.

Yeah, users can "get by" and they can "make do" because of all the other features, but screen visibility definitely needs MAJOR improvement.

 

I'll have an Oregon 550 that will get sold or traded in a heartbeat!

[+Redwoods Mtn Biker]

I wish I had been able to test the 450 and 550 side by side, but going on memory, the 450 is MUCH better than the 550.

[Grasscatcher]

Kinda like me WANTING WAAS to be working better so much that I think that it IS every time an update comes out ....but then reality sets in and....NO, not yet....

...and I don't think they will get it (WAAS) working correctly until they change chipsets and/or antenna. THEY say it's "antenna design"... I don't know, but that's the basis for my first questions on the 78 series.

? Chipset ?Antenna

[+ryan3295]

I would not be surprised if they have the same chipset as the oregon series, as they use the term "hotfix" in their product description. I will not hold out hope for a sirf chipset, unless they forgot to put the sirf logo at the bottom of the page.

[+Hank30721]

Since the 76 and 60 series had the same guts, I wonder if a new "62" is on the way?

[+DonB]

In case you missed it, Garmin announced a new handheld marine series this morning, the successor to the 76 series. It includes paperless geocaching as a feature...

 

https://buy.garmin.com/shop/compare.do?cID=...reProduct=63603

Great! I just ordered a 76CSX

[Forkeye]

I remember a post from a long time ago with a write up and photos of a wish list of screens/funtions for the 76,since it was supposed to be a marine unit, most had to do with tides and moon phase for navigation.I wonder if this new unit will have some of those or just be more geared toward geo caching.The 3 axis compass will sure be nice to have.

Edited April 24, 2010 by Forkeye

[+coggins]

I remember a post from a long time ago with a write up and photos of a wish list of screens/funtions for the 76,since it was supposed to be a marine unit, most had to do with tides and moon phase for navigation.I wonder if this new unit will have some of those or just be more geared toward geo caching.The 3 axis compass will sure be nice to have.

Garmin has this screen shot on their product page showing Tide Stations, I would also be pretty sure the units also have the Sun and Moon page.

[Grasscatcher]

Specs say that it does have Sun & Moon page......

 

This is a puzzle to me..... Specs say "no camera" and no photo viewer, but that it can navigate to geotagged photos......

 

I guess just to the coordinates of the spot where photo was taken by another camera and that data was transferred to the 78 ???? That would be just like navigating to any other waypoint wouldn't it?

 

Or, maybe viewer to be added later? Anyone got any other ideas?

[+Red90]

No they mean photos with coordinates in the exif data.

[Grasscatcher]

No they mean photos with coordinates in the exif data.

 

How does a unit with no camera or viewer "handle " photos?

 

Wouldn't the "coordinates in the exif data" be interpreted as just a "location" or "waypoint" ?

What am I missing here? Maybe I'm having a "DUH" moment.....

Edited April 24, 2010 by Grasscatcher

[+Red90]

You can view photos in any of the new units. I assume you will be able to navigate to the photo ike a waypoint if it has the exif data.

[Grasscatcher]

I'm beginning to think that the 78 series is essentially a repackaged Oregon 450.

 

Essentially same form factor as the 76 series- with serial port and ext antenna port, same screen size as 76's

 

Operational buttons and brighter non-touch screen replaces visibility problem touch screen .

 

More internal memory than O 450 but remainder of specs about the same, with no games

 

Better battery life probably due to different screen.

 

Have to wait and see which chipset and antenna........sure hope it's different than Oregon or else it will be just another Garmin model that doesn't do WAAS

[Forkeye]

Do the new units not recieve waas signals?

[Grasscatcher]

Oregons / Dakotas only rarely get a WAAS lock, and even then won't maintain that lock. Sometimes, when trying to obtain a lock, the units seemingly don't have a clue about what they are looking for or what they are supposed to do with it when they eventually stumble across it.......

 

If compared to 60 / 76 series units, the Oregons don't even come close to being a "WAAS capable unit",........as they are advertised.

[+Hank30721]

Does anyone know what antenna configuration the 78 series will have?

[Grasscatcher]

I am trying to find out , but even the service reps at Garmin say they don't know.

 

I've asked about chipset and also antenna type and design. Supposedly they will send me an e-mail when they find out.....at least they said they would.

[+g-o-cashers]

I'd be very surprised to find that the guts of the GPSMAP 78 are any different from the Oregon x50 and Dakota. Investment in developing and shaking out new hardware and software platforms is expensive and in the past Garmin has shown that they like to leverage their R&D across many different models with only slight differences in features.

 

To me this looks like an Oregon / Dakota with a 76CSx display (w/slight improved color specs). You might see a quad helix antenna but that would be about it IMHO.

 

GO$Rs

[MtnHermit]

I'd be very surprised to find that the guts of the GPSMAP 78 are any different from the Oregon x50 and Dakota. Investment in developing and shaking out new hardware and software platforms is expensive and in the past Garmin has shown that they like to leverage their R&D across many different models with only slight differences in features.

+1

 

To me this looks like an Oregon / Dakota with a 76CSx display (w/slight improved color specs).

Actually the 64K colors are already part of the CO, OR & DK further making GO$Rs point.

 

You might see a quad helix antenna but that would be about it

Since the QH provides a higher S/N ratio compared to a patch antenna, and is the distinguishing feature of the 60 series, I'd be surprised if it were omitted. It's on the CO which was supposed to supersede the 60/76. But thanks to an incredibly poor roll-out, we're left with the CO 300, whose days are numbered.

 

I see the 62/78 as a cost cutting and feature improving step for Garmin. I'll bet the 62/78 have a manufacturing cost 25% lower than the 60/76 and have higher average selling prices based on the feature tiers. Kudos Garmin.

 

It's increasingly clear to Garmin that selling road warrior boxes is going to fade. Whereas handhelds still have huge profit margins and much less chance of being obsoleted by Google, et al. Free Topo maps are actually a reason to buy a Garmin.

[+Redwoods Mtn Biker]

It's increasingly clear to Garmin that selling road warrior boxes is going to fade. Whereas handhelds still have huge profit margins and much less chance of being obsoleted by Google, et al. Free Topo maps are actually a reason to buy a Garmin.

 

Couldn't have said it better myself.

[Grasscatcher]

I couldn't understand when they bypassed the QH for the Oregon series. They tried the ceramic for that model and the WAAS bug bit them in the kazoo.

 

Did you notice the $449 pricepoint for the 78S (all the bells and whistles but minus the coastal maps). Load it up with free maps and hit the trails!

 

As soon as they hit the market, a really easy and quick test would be to take a 76CSx to a sales outlet and compare WAAS acquisition times with the 78s

[+g-o-cashers]

It's increasingly clear to Garmin that selling road warrior boxes is going to fade. Whereas handhelds still have huge profit margins and much less chance of being obsoleted by Google, et al. Free Topo maps are actually a reason to buy a Garmin.

 

Couldn't have said it better myself.

 

Agreed. But Garmin desperately needs to get some sort of wireless connectivity into their outdoor line up before someone figures out how to build a good ruggedized Android phone. It doesn't necessarily need to have 3G built in but it should be able to tether to a phone via Bluetooth and/or Wifi so that they can start providing integrated online services (search, sharing, updates, etc).

[MtnHermit]

But Garmin desperately needs to get some sort of wireless connectivity into their outdoor line up before someone figures out how to build a good ruggedized Android phone. It doesn't necessarily need to have 3G built in but it should be able to tether to a phone via Bluetooth and/or Wifi so that they can start providing integrated online services (search, sharing, updates, etc).

Afraid I don't understand. Most of the Garmin's currently have a wireless handshake mode, but I'm sure you're not talking about that. Are you talking PN-60 <-> Spot wireless or something else? Examples?

[+DENelson83]

So, these new 78-series handhelds look to be the "Floating Oregons", or "Hawaiis" as I call them (even though they use the conventional buttons instead of a touchscreen).

Edited April 27, 2010 by DENelson83

[+Red90]

So, these new 78-series handhelds look to be the "Floating Oregons", or "Hawaiis" as I call them (even though they use the conventional buttons instead of a touchscreen).

 

Not really. It is closer to a Colorado...with a much smaller, lower resolution screen. Unless they are cheaper, it does not make a lot of sense, but Garmin marketting never did.

[MtnHermit]

Not really. It is closer to a Colorado...with a much smaller, lower resolution screen. Unless they are cheaper, it does not make a lot of sense, but Garmin marketting never did.

I disagree, especially the for 60/62. I'm continually astonished how many people who continue to buy the 60CSx. My only conclusion is the manly style, form over function. Garmin sells a ton of these and they'd be foolish to tinker with the formula.

 

While you and I value the smaller, lighter Colorado with the vastly larger screen, its a much better GPS in all measurable ways. But, you can't measure style and clearly the 60 has what many people want. The same people will buy a Jeep CJ, and you own a Red 90.

[+ecanderson]

But Garmin desperately needs to get some sort of wireless connectivity into their outdoor line up before someone figures out how to build a good ruggedized Android phone. It doesn't necessarily need to have 3G built in but it should be able to tether to a phone via Bluetooth and/or Wifi so that they can start providing integrated online services (search, sharing, updates, etc).

Afraid I don't understand. Most of the Garmin's currently have a wireless handshake mode, but I'm sure you're not talking about that. Are you talking PN-60 <-> Spot wireless or something else? Examples?

Sounds like he's looking for data over GSM or CDMA on a handheld GPS from Garmin so that it can access data from gc.com on a live basis (where there's cell coverage, anyway) - or at least BT capability to allow the Garmin to use a cell phone as a tethered DUN device to access the net.

 

As he notes, if someone comes up with a truly decent phone/gps combo - one that emulates most of the best of what a purpose built GPS can do, life could get interesting. I'd note that this is what TomTom has attempted to do with their "Live" series. Rather than depend upon tethering to a million different brands and models of cell phones, often with strange results, they took the cellular function and built it into a road nav GPS itself so they could control the environment and make it easier on the users to configure. The primary purpose was life traffic (something that RDS doesn't do all that well in the U.S.) but also offers other "live" net features.

Edited April 27, 2010 by ecanderson

[Forkeye]

I couldn't understand when they bypassed the QH for the Oregon series. They tried the ceramic for that model and the WAAS bug bit them in the kazoo.

 

Did you notice the $449 pricepoint for the 78S (all the bells and whistles but minus the coastal maps). Load it up with free maps and hit the trails!

 

As soon as they hit the market, a really easy and quick test would be to take a 76CSx to a sales outlet and compare WAAS acquisition times with the 78s

I'll be waiting for your report on this comparrison :)My 76csx works great but that 3 axis compass would be cool if it worked well.

[Grasscatcher]

I couldn't understand when they bypassed the QH for the Oregon series. They tried the ceramic for that model and the WAAS bug bit them in the kazoo.

 

Did you notice the $449 pricepoint for the 78S (all the bells and whistles but minus the coastal maps). Load it up with free maps and hit the trails!

 

As soon as they hit the market, a really easy and quick test would be to take a 76CSx to a sales outlet and compare WAAS acquisition times with the 78s

I'll be waiting for your report on this comparrison :)My 76csx works great but that 3 axis compass would be cool if it worked well.

 

It (the test) will definitely happen..... I'm in Grand Junction , CO and there is an REI here and a brand new Cabelas that will open about the last part of May.

 

I have a 76CS, a 76CSx, an Oregon 550, and an old Trimble Geo Explorer II, (previously had a 76S and others...)

 

So......I'm familiar with the 76 series (use the 76CS with APRS radio) and know how WAAS reception is SUPPOSED to work (the 76CSX), enjoy the 3 axis compass and camera (the 550). Principle uses are mapping Hiking, ATV, and Snowmobile trails and finding Benchmarks.

 

I just hope that Garmin will start spending more time on GPS accuracy and features instead of the "GC game" features.

[Forkeye]

Garmin is headed the same direction as General Motors,too many models with too many problems,too many bells and whistles that dont come out of the box working like the flashy sales brochure says they should.

[jholly]

Garmin is headed the same direction as General Motors,too many models with too many problems,too many bells and whistles that dont come out of the box working like the flashy sales brochure says they should.

 

Think they will get a bail out?

[freeday]

Do not forget that the software on the 78-Series will be working as designed in about a year and not earlier.

It is always a pitty, that garmin let test their users the system and solve the bugs afterwards.

This will take about 9 months....

 

So if you want to avoid pain, spring 2011 will be the earliest time to buy the unit.

Edited April 28, 2010 by freeday

[+Red90]

Do not forget that the software on the 78-Series will be working as designed in about a year and not earlier.

It is always a pitty, that garmin let test their users the system and solve the bugs afterwards.

This will take about 9 months....

 

So if you want to avoid pain, spring 2011 will be the earliest time to buy the unit.

 

Except, it will be using the Oregon software right off the bat, adjusted for button use.... Whether or not that is good or bad, you can decide.

[+Hank30721]

I couldn't understand when they bypassed the QH for the Oregon series. They tried the ceramic for that model and the WAAS bug bit them in the kazoo.

 

Did you notice the $449 pricepoint for the 78S (all the bells and whistles but minus the coastal maps). Load it up with free maps and hit the trails!

 

As soon as they hit the market, a really easy and quick test would be to take a 76CSx to a sales outlet and compare WAAS acquisition times with the 78s

I'll be waiting for your report on this comparrison :)My 76csx works great but that 3 axis compass would be cool if it worked well.

 

It (the test) will definitely happen..... I'm in Grand Junction , CO and there is an REI here and a brand new Cabelas that will open about the last part of May.

 

I have a 76CS, a 76CSx, an Oregon 550, and an old Trimble Geo Explorer II, (previously had a 76S and others...)

 

So......I'm familiar with the 76 series (use the 76CS with APRS radio) and know how WAAS reception is SUPPOSED to work (the 76CSX), enjoy the 3 axis compass and camera (the 550). Principle uses are mapping Hiking, ATV, and Snowmobile trails and finding Benchmarks.

 

I just hope that Garmin will start spending more time on GPS accuracy and features instead of the "GC game" features.

 

I've owned a 76Csx for almost three years. It's been used on a boat, in a jeep, and on the trail. Very rarely have I had WAAS reception problems.

[+g-o-cashers]

Based on the photos I've found on the FCC site it looks like this unit has a patch antenna and is _probably_ based on the STM Cartesio like the Oregon and Dakota.

 

So if I were to characterize the new unit, it would be:

 

- Oregon x50/Dakota GPS (STM Cartesio) and electronics (3-axis compass, sensors)

- Oregon x50/Dakota OS and software with some design changes to work with hard keys

- Patch antenna

- GPSMAP60/76 screen (dimensions and resolution are the same) with enhanced color depth (256 vs 65k)

- New ruggedized / floating industrial design

 

There seems to be a GPSMAP 62, 62s, 62st in the works as well. Which as other have speculated will probably be a non-floating design based on the same electronics and software above.

[+Red90]

Can you provide a link to these FCC photos?

[+g-o-cashers]

FCC photos and links to the PDFs are here:

 

http://www.gpsfix.net/garmin-gpsmap-62

[jholly]

Interesting. Navigadget.com seems to think it is a SiRF chip. Wonder who is right. Well, guess we will find out soon enough.

[Grasscatcher]

Thanks!

Something funny....a check on REI site for 78 Series

78sc- --$549

78s---$399

78---$349

(yes, in that order)

I'll bet that gets changed quickly

Edited April 28, 2010 by Grasscatcher

[MtnHermit]

Something funny....a check on REI site for 78 Series

78sc- --$549

78s---$399

78---$349

(yes, in that order)

I'll bet that gets changed quickly

Don't think so.

 

I just opened my 50-page spring catalog, it shows the 78s = $399.95.

 

It makes sense, the 78s will be the volume leader and REI doesn't necessarily get a fixed discount on all units.

[Grasscatcher]

I thought they nearly always went with strictly "List price" except for sales.

[MtnHermit]

On sale out of the gate. BTW the OR 450 = $399.95, same page. No mention of the rebate.