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New Hazard Attribute Request


Poke'Frog
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I recently placed a cache in an area that is absolutely beautiful in the summer, though to get to it is a long, windy road with drop offs along the way. Well, I placed it in the winter and the road is HORRIBLE!!! Although it has been plowed, it is a pure sheet of ice and very dangerous at this time. I put the terrain rating as a 5, added the cliff attribute, and wrote big warnings throughout the page asking people not to try to get this cache in the winter without a four wheel drive vehicle. So far, my precautions have worked well, but it would be very nice if we had a "Bad Road" hazard attribute to apply to caches such as these.

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I recently placed a cache in an area that is absolutely beautiful in the summer, though to get to it is a long, windy road with drop offs along the way. Well, I placed it in the winter and the road is HORRIBLE!!! Although it has been plowed, it is a pure sheet of ice and very dangerous at this time. I put the terrain rating as a 5, added the cliff attribute, and wrote big warnings throughout the page asking people not to try to get this cache in the winter without a four wheel drive vehicle. So far, my precautions have worked well, but it would be very nice if we had a "Bad Road" hazard attribute to apply to caches such as these.

 

Adding seasonal attributes would be good.

Also, a variable terrain rating would be great. One that can be set to automagically change based on the months (as the CO sets).

 

Would be a good addition.

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I recently placed a cache in an area that is absolutely beautiful in the summer, though to get to it is a long, windy road with drop offs along the way. Well, I placed it in the winter and the road is HORRIBLE!!! Although it has been plowed, it is a pure sheet of ice and very dangerous at this time. I put the terrain rating as a 5, added the cliff attribute, and wrote big warnings throughout the page asking people not to try to get this cache in the winter without a four wheel drive vehicle. So far, my precautions have worked well, but it would be very nice if we had a "Bad Road" hazard attribute to apply to caches such as these.

 

Adding seasonal attributes would be good.

Also, a variable terrain rating would be great. One that can be set to automagically change based on the months (as the CO sets).

 

Would be a good addition.

All of that was well discussed when attributes were first mentioned. The majority at that time thought that rating the cache for the worst average conditions was still appropriate. Especially when you consider that we all know things like mud, snow, ice and summer vegitation make any cache more difficult to get to. Those things are just a "given".

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I recently placed a cache in an area that is absolutely beautiful in the summer, though to get to it is a long, windy road with drop offs along the way. Well, I placed it in the winter and the road is HORRIBLE!!! Although it has been plowed, it is a pure sheet of ice and very dangerous at this time. I put the terrain rating as a 5, added the cliff attribute, and wrote big warnings throughout the page asking people not to try to get this cache in the winter without a four wheel drive vehicle. So far, my precautions have worked well, but it would be very nice if we had a "Bad Road" hazard attribute to apply to caches such as these.

 

Adding seasonal attributes would be good.

Also, a variable terrain rating would be great. One that can be set to automagically change based on the months (as the CO sets).

 

Would be a good addition.

All of that was well discussed when attributes were first mentioned. The majority at that time thought that rating the cache for the worst average conditions was still appropriate. Especially when you consider that we all know things like mud, snow, ice and summer vegitation make any cache more difficult to get to. Those things are just a "given".

 

When were attributes first implemented? I think things may have evolved a little since then.

 

I know what you are saying by knowing the differences in terrain for different seasons. I guess that is how it becomes that you can pick up a 4.5 terrain cache as a park and grab. In the winter a dirt road may be so muddy that you can't even travel it in the best of 4WD vehicles but in the summer you could just drive up in your Nano TaTa and make a quick find.

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I put the terrain rating as a 5, added the cliff attribute, and wrote big warnings throughout the page asking people not to try to get this cache in the winter without a four wheel drive vehicle.

 

If someone misses all of that information then I suspect an attribute won't get noticed either.

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I put the terrain rating as a 5, added the cliff attribute, and wrote big warnings throughout the page asking people not to try to get this cache in the winter without a four wheel drive vehicle.

 

If someone misses all of that information then I suspect an attribute won't get noticed either.

 

LOL! That's probably true! Good point DanOCan.

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Isn't winter-no.gif (not available in Winter) sufficient?

 

No, not for this cache, because it is very much available in the winter with a four wheel drive vehicle!

I imagine quite a few of the winter-no.gif caches are still there and available to the found in the winter, if you have the time, equipment and perseverance.

 

That may very well be true Prime Suspect, but I was suggesting this new attribute so that we didn't have to use poor-fitting attributes - that's the whole point. To me, using a "Not available in Winter" attribute for a cache that is available in the winter is just as poor fitting as using the "Cliff nearby" attribute for a bad road. Another idea would be to have a special equipment attribute for "four wheel drive vehicle" to access the cache.

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I put the terrain rating as a 5, added the cliff attribute, and wrote big warnings throughout the page asking people not to try to get this cache in the winter without a four wheel drive vehicle.

 

If someone misses all of that information then I suspect an attribute won't get noticed either.

 

LOL! That's probably true! Good point DanOCan.

For those that are paperless, most of the paperless software doesn't support attributes, so a cache could have all the attributes available and people won't see it. That's starting to change a bit with the GPX changes, but the best way is to put a big warning directly in the description. I'd make it the first thing people read.

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For those that are paperless, most of the paperless software doesn't support attributes, so a cache could have all the attributes available and people won't see it. That's starting to change a bit with the GPX changes, but the best way is to put a big warning directly in the description. I'd make it the first thing people read.

 

That's a good perspective, so I am glad that I did just that as well. The whole listing is filled with warnings, including right up front. That's also why I rated it a 5 on terrain, hoping people wouldn't just head out on a level 5 without reading it first. Still, more accurate attributes would also be nice.

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Not that I am not enjoying talking to people, but I kind of feel like I am just repeating myself! LOL! I posted this as a feature request - did I do that correctly? Do the moderators actually read these and bring it up to the council, or whatever :D , as a possible idea for improvement?

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Do the moderators actually read these and bring it up to the council, or whatever :D , as a possible idea for improvement?

 

That is a VERY good question, for which I have yet to see an answer.

 

As far as I can tell, there is no formal feature request submission process.

 

Meanwhile, back on topic, I'd set the DEATH attribute on a questionable cache. Its COOL.

 

danger-yes.gif

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Do the moderators actually read these and bring it up to the council, or whatever :( , as a possible idea for improvement?

 

That is a VERY good question, for which I have yet to see an answer.

 

As far as I can tell, there is no formal feature request submission process.

 

Meanwhile, back on topic, I'd set the DEATH attribute on a questionable cache. Its COOL.

 

danger-yes.gif

 

LOL! I actually considered that one! :D

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I think that it has been demonstrated that TPTB, or lackeys thereunder, do read through this forum. If a problem demands immediate attention, they set the hamsters to work. If it is something that sounds great, it gets filed under 'next update'. If it sounds like an interesting idea, it is probably put in the file with other interesting ideas, to be acted upon when the hamsters are charged, but not much else needs to be done. With variations thereof.

Myself, I think a far more useful attribute would be "large and dangerous animals also search for caches in this vicinity'. Forty percent of my hides are in areas that are home to bear, coyotes, and possibly mountain lions (though, those are considered mythical in New Jersey). Generally, the bear won't bother you, unless you annoy them, though one almost gave me a heart attack. (I missed stepping on him by about four feet.) The closest attribute that I can find is "Watch for livestock".

So, I would like to request an attribute for 'large and dangerous animals also search for caches in this vicinity'.

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I think that it has been demonstrated that TPTB, or lackeys thereunder, do read through this forum.

 

I haven't been here long enough to see an entire forum-idea-implemented-by-hamsters cycle complete. Any way to quantify the temporal interval? Is there an example that would be a good representation of that process - a thread that shows an idea being suggested, right through to its implementation?

 

So, I would like to request an attribute for 'large and dangerous animals also search for caches in this vicinity'.

 

If we are going to make this a new-attribute-suggestion topic, and at the risk of forking this thread, can I ask if anyone has suggested a Needs CITO attribute?

 

Like this:

 

attribute_needs_cito.jpg

 

Or it could be tied to a log entry type, like the Needs Maintenance and would make an attribute like this:

 

flag_needs_cito.jpg

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All of that was well discussed when attributes were first mentioned. The majority at that time thought that rating the cache for the worst average conditions was still appropriate. Especially when you consider that we all know things like mud, snow, ice and summer vegetation make any cache more difficult to get to. Those things are just a "given".

 

Yep, I'm not sure that cache conditions have changed all that much since attributes were implemented.

 

I live in Iowa. It rains, it snows, it blows, why would I need to update my cache page for a rainy day.

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Do the moderators actually read these and bring it up to the council, or whatever :ph34r: , as a possible idea for improvement?

 

That is a VERY good question, for which I have yet to see an answer.

 

As far as I can tell, there is no formal feature request submission process.

 

Meanwhile, back on topic, I'd set the DEATH attribute on a questionable cache. Its COOL.

 

danger-yes.gif

 

LOL! I actually considered that one! :ph34r:

 

Well, I think the fair answer to the moderator question is NO, they do not read these and do not do anything about it. About a month and a half ago, I had posted this attribute request as well as a glich report, yet both issues were never even read by any moderator. I really have my doubts that reporting site issues here actually get things fixed, since nobody ever even replied to either this attribute request or the site glich post....and the friends' boxes have never been fixed!! Hello? Any moderators listening??

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Well, I think the fair answer to the moderator question is NO, they do not read these and do not do anything about it. About a month and a half ago, I had posted this attribute request as well as a glich report, yet both issues were never even read by any moderator. I really have my doubts that reporting site issues here actually get things fixed, since nobody ever even replied to either this attribute request or the site glich post....and the friends' boxes have never been fixed!! Hello? Any moderators listening??

That is definitely not a fair answer. Please don't expect a formal response to every bug or feature thread. Sometimes the community does a fine job on its own. Sometimes Groundspeak is "thinkin' about it" (and then the suggestion is magically implemented four updates later). Sometimes (as in your other thread) the issue has already been identified and thoroughly discussed. Sometimes the suggestion doesn't fit the development plans.

 

But, the suggestions are read.

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Another opinion (same, yet different)...

 

From what we see in cache logs mostly (and a local cache that boldly says not to drive into the sand -- the towing services LOVE that cache), ours and MANY others, is that "not-so-many" people truly even read the cache page for approach instructions, parking suggestions, where not to look instructions, etc., I really rather doubt that an added attribute for what the OP suggests would be heeded either! Add to that the fact that the attributes are not even available to (many) paperless cachers!

 

IMO a four-wheel drive is just as dangerous on ice as another other wheeled vehicle, moreso because a good number of people with 4X4's think their vehicle is invincible and can do anything. Wrong -- ice is ice is ice!

 

I doubt that you would be able to change whether somebody will attempt the find when they really shouldn't, attribute to that effect or no. :ph34r:

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Well, I think the fair answer to the moderator question is NO, they do not read these and do not do anything about it. About a month and a half ago, I had posted this attribute request as well as a glich report, yet both issues were never even read by any moderator. I really have my doubts that reporting site issues here actually get things fixed, since nobody ever even replied to either this attribute request or the site glich post....and the friends' boxes have never been fixed!! Hello? Any moderators listening??

That is definitely not a fair answer. Please don't expect a formal response to every bug or feature thread. Sometimes the community does a fine job on its own. Sometimes Groundspeak is "thinkin' about it" (and then the suggestion is magically implemented four updates later). Sometimes (as in your other thread) the issue has already been identified and thoroughly discussed. Sometimes the suggestion doesn't fit the development plans.

 

But, the suggestions are read.

 

This answer would have been appreciated at the time of the post rather than the post being ignored until months later. Thank you for your answer.

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This answer would have been appreciated at the time of the post rather than the post being ignored until months later. Thank you for your answer.

I am sorry about overlooking your threads from December 21st. On that date, I was traveling to spend what turned out to be my last Christmas holiday with my Mom. With her funeral now a few weeks behind me, I did notice your posts when you bumped the threads. I then tried to provide helpful and courteous advice. I regret that it wasn't sufficient. I will leave future replies to your posts in the hands of others who can provide better service.

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When I hunt by myself (Bob here) I don't have the benefit of paperless. My I finder Expedition C gives me the hint and little other info. I have often thought it would be a good idea to somehow "flag" the cache name to alert the cacher that important info is available on the cache page. The ability to "raise the the flag" from the cache logging page would be a nice option as conditions change. For example there was a cache in my area that previous cachers had reported finding used syringes.

 

I haven't seen any numbers but I would think a substantial number of folks out there are not paperless, an attempt to notify them of a possibly hazardous situation would be a good idea.

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It would be nice to have attributes for nearby road surfaces, especially now that attributes are included in GPX files. Maybe something like "Gravel Road", "Dirt Road". I'd like to have "Well Maintained Gravel Road" and "Buuuuuuuummmmpppyy Gravel Road", but that may be too picky.

Yes but you must admit that traveling any road is simply not necessary to get to any cache. I can choose to park anywhere my vehicle allows and then walk from there. Might be a very long hike but doable. (large bodies of water in between excepted)

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