I know, no way to solve it

[+DeepButi]

My home non-micro nearest cache (not found by me I mean):

 

* glass container broken since 2006

* at least 3 NM logs

* dozens of "container broken, dangerous, be carefull, find it didn't sign as it was too dangerous to touch, ... etc"

* Someone changed the wet logbook.

 

Noone will ever post a NA because the camouflage seems really good and everybody loves it .

 

Maybe I will try to replace the container ...

[+Col. Flagg]

First you need to visit it and confirm it's condition. Have you tried contacting the owner. If your that concerned about it you could trying adopting it, but it would require the owners permission, but you should find the cache first, he could have actually fixed it.

 

Edit:spelling.

Edited December 1, 2009 by Col. Flagg

[+StarBrand]

Broken for a long time with multiple NM logs over time and no response from the owner (at all??)???

 

File a Needs Archived log on it and let a reviewer put it out of its misery.

[Andronicus]

Broken for a long time with multiple NM logs over time and no response from the owner (at all??)???

 

File a Needs Archived log on it and let a reviewer put it out of its misery.

 

Find it first! Got to get the smiley before it gets archived.

[GOF and Bacall]

Now THIS sounds like over use of the NM log. Time someone was slapping on a NA log. Once it is archived an active cacher can hide, and maintain, a new cache in the area.

[+sbell111]

A broken jar is so dangerous that someone can't get close enough to it to sign a logbook?

[Clan Riffster]

Well, yeah! Those pesky glass molecules leaping about willy nilly might poke your eye out!

[+brslk]

A broken jar is so dangerous that someone can't get close enough to it to sign a logbook?

 

Remember, some people cache with kids and we don't want children to be cut up. I have no idea why you would defend a broken glass container...

[+Crew 153]

Why now just go out there with a new container, log book and swaps and replace it yourself?

 

I did it to the oldest one in Queensland which disappeared after a flood.

[+TheAlabamaRambler]

Why now just go out there with a new container, log book and swaps and replace it yourself?

 

I did it to the oldest one in Queensland which disappeared after a flood.

Ditto.

 

Given the circumstances just deal with it.

 

Our local caching community has done that with a number of abandoned caches that were worth keeping alive.

 

The downside is you won't get NM logs emails (or any other!). Just set a watch on it or file an Needs Archived and once it's archived put your own cache there.

Edited December 2, 2009 by TheAlabamaRambler

[+Xaa]

A broken jar is so dangerous that someone can't get close enough to it to sign a logbook?

 

Remember, some people cache with kids and we don't want children to be cut up. I have no idea why you would defend a broken glass container...

 

Adults getting cut up is perfectly fine?

[+TheAlabamaRambler]

A broken jar is so dangerous that someone can't get close enough to it to sign a logbook?

 

Remember, some people cache with kids and we don't want children to be cut up. I have no idea why you would defend a broken glass container...

 

Adults getting cut up is perfectly fine?

GEOCACHING DOESN'T CARE ABOUT CHINLDREN.

[Mushtang]

A broken jar is so dangerous that someone can't get close enough to it to sign a logbook?

Maybe it's an old peanut butter jar. You know how deadly peanut butter is!!!!!! Edited December 2, 2009 by Mushtang

[+sbell111]

A broken jar is so dangerous that someone can't get close enough to it to sign a logbook?

 

Remember, some people cache with kids and we don't want children to be cut up. I have no idea why you would defend a broken glass container...

I have no idea why someone wouldn't simply clean up the pieces of broken glass, rather than complain about their existence in an international forum.

 

It isn't about defending a broken container. It's about solving a simple problem locally, rather than wringing our hands and kvetching about it.

[+Bad Duck]

Find it first. Don't put a needs archived on anything that you have not visited.

[+TheAlabamaRambler]

Find it first. Don't put a needs archived on anything that you have not visited.

That too.

[+Mudfrog]

Find it first. Don't put a needs archived on anything that you have not visited.

That too.

 

Right! Do not file a NA without going out there and checking it out first hand.

 

If you're really concerned, then go out and look for it yourself. Only thing is, finding the broken glass doesn't necessarily mean you found the actual cache. Probably unlikely but, there's always that slim chance that this may not even be the real cache.

 

I would say that if you did go out and look but only found the broken glass and wet log, and since NM logs seem to be going unanswered, that a NA log would be the way to go. This would result in getting action, either by the owner or by the reviewer...

 

Oh, if you do go for it, you might think about taking the supplies necessary to cito this broken glass.

[knowschad]

Noone will ever post a NA because the camouflage seems really good

See, this is the part that I don't get. Is it really a glass jar? And if so, what is this really good camouflage you speak of? Can a new jar still use this really good camo?

[+DeepButi]

sbell11,

sorry to "complain about their existence in an international forum".

 

Not all posts must be super-mega-deepthinking ones, and I just posted to know what others would think about it. If you don't like my post, ignore it.

 

I don't recall "complaining", but maybe my english is not good enough.

 

_______________

 

Kind Others ,

 

Yes, I will go there and try to fix it (read my first post). If I have not done it already is because I cannot find the appropiate container! That easy.

 

It's a broken glass container (the logs allow me to know for sure) inside "another thing". This "another thing" (I have also a very clear idea about what it is) is the camouflage that everybody likes. And accessing the container is what makes it dangerous. And of course, broken=>wet and probably some insects etc there.

 

A big issue? No, not at all.

 

And no, I will not post a NA either. The CO is active and should know the situation (not less than 20/30 logs +3NM).

[+sbell111]

sbell11,

sorry to "complain about their existence in an international forum".

 

Not all posts must be super-mega-deepthinking ones, and I just posted to know what others would think about it. If you don't like my post, ignore it.

 

I don't recall "complaining", but maybe my english is not good enough.

 

_______________

 

Kind Others ,

 

Yes, I will go there and try to fix it (read my first post). If I have not done it already is because I cannot find the appropiate container! That easy.

 

It's a broken glass container (the logs allow me to know for sure) inside "another thing". This "another thing" (I have also a very clear idea about what it is) is the camouflage that everybody likes. And accessing the container is what makes it dangerous. And of course, broken=>wet and probably some insects etc there.

 

A big issue? No, not at all.

 

And no, I will not post a NA either. The CO is active and should know the situation (not less than 20/30 logs +3NM).

My mistake for thinking that you were complaining. However, now that 'complaining' is off the table, I can't figure out what the point of the OP is.

[+StarBrand]

....

And no, I will not post a NA either. The CO is active and should know the situation (not less than 20/30 logs +3NM).

What does an active cache owner have to do with filing a NA log?? Failing to perform maintenance on a cache for a very long period of time is a guidelines violation.

 

....and like sbell - if you are willing to go replace the container and do a little CITO, then what are talking about??!!

[+DeepButi]

Ok, sorry to ask for opinions.

 

You can forget the whole thread.

[+sbell111]

What thread?

[+Renegade Knight]

Broken for a long time with multiple NM logs over time and no response from the owner (at all??)???

 

File a Needs Archived log on it and let a reviewer put it out of its misery.

 

Based on people being able to find it and log it, it looks viable to me. From the OP I couldn't tell if the container was broken, or the area had glass and the people thought that was the cache even though they didn't find it.

 

Regardless the log books in play.

[+Renegade Knight]

A broken jar is so dangerous that someone can't get close enough to it to sign a logbook?

 

Remember, some people cache with kids and we don't want children to be cut up. I have no idea why you would defend a broken glass container...

 

CITO the glass find the cache. The two issues are separate.

 

And while I don't want my kids cut up, I don't like it much either. I've sliced myself packing out glass before. That wasn't the caches fault, rather my trying to use a plastic bag to carry the glass, and that bag hitting my leg.

[Clan Riffster]

Remember, some people cache with kids and we don't want children to be cut up.

If I thought my kids were so lacking in cognitive skills that they were incapable of safely investigating the interior of a cannon barrel, without running afoul of anything that might be in it, (glass, spiders, mini space aliens, etc), I probably wouldn't let them stick their paws in it.

[+TheAlabamaRambler]

Ok, sorry to ask for opinions.

 

You can forget the whole thread.

?

Which answers did you not like?

[+DeepButi]

Will try to share my feelings and why I was asking opinions. Let me use this log of mine as a counter-example (I always log in at least two languages so international readers can understand it).

Even if you don't get all the details the main idea is it was placed by a cacher sporadicus (couple of finds, 1 hidden, then gone & lost forever). I had no philosophical problems: I fixed it the best I could.

 

Now the one I'm talking about:

* everybody finds it -> it's there

* everybody complains about container broken + several people complains about a broken glass + several glass container pictures -> glass container broken (first complaint in 2006!!!)

and the main point:

* CO is an active one, he logs daily -> he must know

 

so, rogue mode on (hope joke is allowed )

if CO doesn't care, why should I?

rogue mode off

 

See what I mean? Taking care of a cache in this situation looks somehow strange to me, that's why I asked your opinions. Sorry for not being able to present all of it on OP.

 

PS. Yesterday I found what perhaps is an appropiate container, will see if it fits in a couple of days (yes, there are even a log with the measurement of available space, and another one of someone that couldn't fit the container he had prepared ...).

[+sbell111]

Will try to share my feelings and why I was asking opinions. Let me use this log of mine as a counter-example (I always log in at least two languages so international readers can understand it).

Even if you don't get all the details the main idea is it was placed by a cacher sporadicus (couple of finds, 1 hidden, then gone & lost forever). I had no philosophical problems: I fixed it the best I could.

 

Now the one I'm talking about:

* everybody finds it -> it's there

* everybody complains about container broken + several people complains about a broken glass + several glass container pictures -> glass container broken (first complaint in 2006!!!)

and the main point:

* CO is an active one, he logs daily -> he must know

 

so, rogue mode on (hope joke is allowed )

if CO doesn't care, why should I?

rogue mode off

 

See what I mean? Taking care of a cache in this situation looks somehow strange to me, that's why I asked your opinions. Sorry for not being able to present all of it on OP.

 

PS. Yesterday I found what perhaps is an appropiate container, will see if it fits in a couple of days (yes, there are even a log with the measurement of available space, and another one of someone that couldn't fit the container he had prepared ...).

The truth is, I would be more likely to fix up a cache for an active player than for one who is long gone. With the exception of 'historical' caches and very good caches, I would just as soon see caches archived and removed if the owners are long gone and the caches have been destroyed.

[+DeepButi]

The truth is, I would be more likely to fix up a cache for an active player than for one who is long gone. With the exception of 'historical' caches and very good caches, I would just as soon see caches archived and removed if the owners are long gone and the caches have been destroyed.

Wow, that's curious. If a cacher is active he should take care of his caches, shouldn't he? If he doesn't, why should anyone else do? I'm not talking of doing it inmediatly, everybody has other life besides geocaching, but there are "please maintain" logs for the last 3 years .

 

I could agree with the other part of the sentence: let gone cachers caches to be archived. Ummmmm ... (the one on my log, I had a special reason to maintain because it was at that time -not anymore- the only one on the county).

 

I appreciate your answer, never thought at it that way ... will think about it.

[+sbell111]

The truth is, I would be more likely to fix up a cache for an active player than for one who is long gone. With the exception of 'historical' caches and very good caches, I would just as soon see caches archived and removed if the owners are long gone and the caches have been destroyed.

Wow, that's curious. If a cacher is active he should take care of his caches, shouldn't he? If he doesn't, why should anyone else do? I'm not talking of doing it inmediatly, everybody has other life besides geocaching, but there are "please maintain" logs for the last 3 years .

 

I could agree with the other part of the sentence: let gone cachers caches to be archived. Ummmmm ... (the one on my log, I had a special reason to maintain because it was at that time -not anymore- the only one on the county).

 

I appreciate your answer, never thought at it that way ... will think about it.

It's simple, really. Active cachers are your peers. They are people that you will continue to have interactions with regardless of what happens with that one cache. Therefore, it is wise to do them a favor, if you can.

 

Long gone ex-cachers are not your peers. You will likely never, ever actually interact with them. If you fix up their caches, you are not doing them a favor, at all. It is very likely that it would be better for the local community to have those caches gone and open up the area for caches placed by active caches (with obvious exceptions, as previously noted).

Edited December 3, 2009 by sbell111

[+The Blorenges]

I can understand DeepButi's annoyance that the apparently active cache owner isn't making any response to 3 year's worth of logs mentioning the glass problem and also 3 NM logs. I wonder how far away the CO lives? It would have been a step in the right direction if he had posted his own note along the lines of, "Sorry to see the comments about the glass near the cache. As I am unable to get back to the cache until (whenever) would any local cacher be able to help me out by clearing the glass for me? It would be much appreciated."

 

I also understand DeepButi's reluctance to reach for the NA gun because it seems to be a good cache in other respects.

 

I wonder whether a direct email to the CO, offering to repair and/or adopt the cache would have any effect?

 

Worth trying, maybe?

 

MrsB

[+Castle Mischief]

I'd have to hunt the cache first before making the call, but here's some assumption-based speculation.

 

Let's take the glass part out of the equation. Let's just address it as a broken container. Of what value is a container that no longer keeps out the elements and keeps the contents dry and safe? Zilch. It's just trash at this point. If I had a spare container with me, if I knew of the history of multiple NM logs, I'd likely replace it. I've had a container replaced on two of my caches and I greatly appreciated it.

 

If I didn't have a spare container on me, hadn't noticed the NM logs and just came across a cache and saw that the container was broken, I'd likely file a NA log once I got home and saw the multiple NM logs. Caches should be maintained by their owners. Unmaintained caches are no better than owner-less caches...

 

...which brings me to this. I like the idea of the community keeping up old "historic" caches. I like the idea that people of a shared interest can come together to keep things that they value up and running.

 

Too often, the reality is (your mileage may vary) that caches with owners that have dropped out of the game are sometimes not kept in tip top shape. What starts as a group effort seems to turn into Cacher A replacing a log one month, Cacher B replacing a container the next month, and then several months passing by while the cache falls apart and Cachers A and B are waiting for the rest of the community to pick up the slack.

 

I really feel that caches need owners. Honestly, in the case of an owner gone AWOL, I'd likely contact the reviewer outside of the NA process and get their opinion on the situation. I'd try to balance my belief that caches need owners with my desire not to alienate myself from the community by getting a precious "historical" cache archived.

Edited December 3, 2009 by Castle Mischief

[+Unkle Fester]

A broken jar is so dangerous that someone can't get close enough to it to sign a logbook?

 

Remember, some people cache with kids and we don't want children to be cut up. I have no idea why you would defend a broken glass container...

Broken glass needs love too!

 

I love lamp...

[GOF and Bacall]

The simple solution would have been to clean up the broken glass. Why is that so hard to realize?

[+WRITE SHOP ROBERT]

A broken jar is so dangerous that someone can't get close enough to it to sign a logbook?

 

Remember, some people cache with kids and we don't want children to be cut up. I have no idea why you would defend a broken glass container...

so...when a jar or glass gets broken in the kitchen, do you just cordon off the room, and live around it? There's nothing dangerous about a broken jar. Rusty metal is more dangerous.

[+WRITE SHOP ROBERT]

Find it first. Don't put a needs archived on anything that you have not visited.

That too.

OH, except that "year-ago" event that was still showing on the maps whan I was scanning my trip route for Events to attend.

[+brslk]

A broken jar is so dangerous that someone can't get close enough to it to sign a logbook?

 

Remember, some people cache with kids and we don't want children to be cut up. I have no idea why you would defend a broken glass container...

so...when a jar or glass gets broken in the kitchen, do you just cordon off the room, and live around it? There's nothing dangerous about a broken jar. Rusty metal is more dangerous.

 

Actually I would clean up the glass in the kitchen. I do not live anyway near the cache location so, that is not possible.

 

And seriously? there is nothing dangerous about a broken glass jar?

 

I have no idea what you are trying to say...

[+brslk]

Ugg.. double. sorry.

Edited December 4, 2009 by brslk

[+Castle Mischief]

Broken glass, from the makers of Nerf. I've seen the light, I'm going to start putting my hides in ammo cans covered in ultra-safe, rugged, kid-friendly glass shards. Heck, they're sparkly! I might even search for trash sites full of broken glass and toss one in there- perfect camouflage!

 

Seriously...

I can't count the times I've cut myself on glass just picking it up off the floor in our house. Unless I've got gloves and a sturdy enough bag to put it in, I'm not going to be hiking chunks of a pickle jar back down the trail because some knucklehead dropped out of the game or doesn't re-visit their caches.

 

Two halves of a chewed apart lock-n-lock? No problem. Ammo can half-eaten by rust monsters? If there're no sharp edges, sure thing. Hide-a-key torn up by a yeti? You bet.

[+larryc43230]

And seriously? there is nothing dangerous about a broken glass jar?

 

I have no idea what you are trying to say...

I can't speak for WRITE SHOP ROBERT (or, obviously, Castle Mischief :-)), but it strikes me that any responsible adult, using proper precautions, could pick up and dispose of that broken glass without much danger of injury. Goodness knows I've cleaned up plenty of broken glass in my day and never managed to injure myself. It's done all the time at CITO events. If I lived anywhere near the area in question, I'd be willing to clean up the mess in a heartbeat. What IS the big deal, anyway? It's just a broken jar, for heaven's sake.

 

--Larry

Edited December 4, 2009 by larryc43230

[+Castle Mischief]

And seriously? there is nothing dangerous about a broken glass jar?

 

I have no idea what you are trying to say...

I can't speak for WRITE SHOP ROBERT (or, obviously, Castle Mischief :-)), but it strikes me that any responsible adult, using proper precautions, could pick up and dispose of that broken glass without much danger of injury. Goodness knows I've cleaned up plenty of broken glass in my day and never managed to injure myself. It's done all the time at CITO events. If I lived anywhere near the area in question, I'd be willing to clean up the mess in a heartbeat. What IS the big deal, anyway? It's just a broken jar, for heaven's sake.

 

--Larry

 

That's what the glass jar manufacturers want you to think.

 

If I was properly prepared with gloves and a sturdy sack- say like during a CITO event, I'd pick it up. For general caching I might have gloves, but I don't often have a sack that won't get punctured on the trail. No way is it going in my backpack.

[Dj Storm]

The truth is, I would be more likely to fix up a cache for an active player than for one who is long gone. With the exception of 'historical' caches and very good caches, I would just as soon see caches archived and removed if the owners are long gone and the caches have been destroyed.

Unless the cache owner asks directly or indirectly, I won't fix someone else's cache by replacing a broken container. I will clean out the dirt, mold, water; I will add a dry replacement logsheet and ziplock; I'll drop several swag items if the cache is empty; if the cache fell from its hiding place, or the container and contents lay scattered on the ground, I'll do my best to put it together and hide it back.

Replacing containers and doing full maintenance on caches of non-caring active cachers only encourages them to hide more caches without thinking about maintenance. I would prefer such cachers will stop hiding caches.

 

...which brings me to this. I like the idea of the community keeping up old "historic" caches. I like the idea that people of a shared interest can come together to keep things that they value up and running.

 

Too often, the reality is (your mileage may vary) that caches with owners that have dropped out of the game are sometimes not kept in tip top shape. What starts as a group effort seems to turn into Cacher A replacing a log one month, Cacher B replacing a container the next month, and then several months passing by while the cache falls apart and Cachers A and B are waiting for the rest of the community to pick up the slack.

That's why, when I decide to maintain a historic cache, I maintain it as if it was my own cache. If the community wants to maintain a cache, then someone from the community should designate himself "maintainer" and do the job of the missing cache owner. After the second maintenance note, the community will know who's the real maintainer.

[+DeepButi]

Seems too many people are focusing on broken glass. That's not the point.

 

The point is ... if an active cacher doesn't bother to fix his cache after dozens of logs & 3NM for the last 3 years ... why should anyone else do it? In this particular case, fixing requires a new container.

 

From all the answers, I must admit I don't know what to do now!!!!! :laughing: Maybe I shouldn't have asked

 

Seriously, it's nice to see so many diferent points of view.

[GOF and Bacall]

Seems too many people are focusing on broken glass. That's not the point.

 

The point is ... if an active cacher doesn't bother to fix his cache after dozens of logs & 3NM for the last 3 years ... why should anyone else do it? In this particular case, fixing requires a new container.

 

From all the answers, I must admit I don't know what to do now!!!!! :laughing: Maybe I shouldn't have asked

 

Seriously, it's nice to see so many diferent points of view.

 

If it needs a new container, has repeated NM logs, and the owner isn't fixing it I'd post a NA log. If the CO has in effect abandoned the cache then it should be archived. let someone else have a shot at the location.

 

If it just has some broken glass near by I'd clean up the glass.

[+Castle Mischief]

Seems too many people are focusing on broken glass. That's not the point.

 

The point is ... if an active cacher doesn't bother to fix his cache after dozens of logs & 3NM for the last 3 years ... why should anyone else do it? In this particular case, fixing requires a new container.

 

From all the answers, I must admit I don't know what to do now!!!!! :laughing: Maybe I shouldn't have asked

 

Seriously, it's nice to see so many different points of view.

 

How are your contacts with the locals? Maybe you should get a feel from them if there's an interest in keeping the cache going. If you can't get any response from them, ask the local reviewer.

 

But find the cache first.

[+DeepButi]

Ok, done. While I was going there I decided not to change the container. After all, if CO doesn't care a dime about 7 (yes, 7) NM and dozens of logs, who am I to change it?

 

But on the very second I got it, I knew I could not pass it by. So I throw away the old broken glass jar container and replaced it with a plastic one. Some nasty inhabitants were CITOed aswell .

 

Now I know (another) one of my weak points: I'm not able to let a cache in bad shape if I can fix it .

 

And oh yes! the container is inside "another thing" that makes a great camouflage! In plain sight and nobody suspected anything for more than 4 years!!! I liked it .

[knowschad]

Ok, done. While I was going there I decided not to change the container. After all, if CO doesn't care a dime about 7 (yes, 7) NM and dozens of logs, who am I to change it?

But on the very second I got it, I knew I could not pass it by. So I throw away the old broken glass jar container and replaced it with a plastic one. Some nasty inhabitants were CITOed aswell .

Now I know (another) one of my weak points: I'm not able to let a cache in bad shape if I can fix it .

And oh yes! the container is inside "another thing" that makes a great camouflage! In plain sight and nobody suspected anything for more than 4 years!!! I liked it .

Wow... it was really that good, huh? In that case, bravo for you! Was your replacement container glass as well, or were you able to find a plastic one that fit?

[+Castle Mischief]

Ok, done. While I was going there I decided not to change the container. After all, if CO doesn't care a dime about 7 (yes, 7) NM and dozens of logs, who am I to change it?

But on the very second I got it, I knew I could not pass it by. So I throw away the old broken glass jar container and replaced it with a plastic one. Some nasty inhabitants were CITOed aswell .

Now I know (another) one of my weak points: I'm not able to let a cache in bad shape if I can fix it .

And oh yes! the container is inside "another thing" that makes a great camouflage! In plain sight and nobody suspected anything for more than 4 years!!! I liked it .

Wow... it was really that good, huh? In that case, bravo for you! Was your replacement container glass as well, or were you able to find a plastic one that fit?

 

It's just not your day is it?

[knowschad]

Wow... it was really that good, huh? In that case, bravo for you! Was your replacement container glass as well, or were you able to find a plastic one that fit?

It's just not your day is it?

No, I guess not.

 

Seriously... it was this supposedly "great" camo that held my interest in this thread, and I'm thrilled to see that it truely was as good as "they" said.