Ugh! Stop the Javascript already!

[+KnC]

Is it just me or are Mobile6 & Palm Treo users being pushed off geocaching.com? The links are getting broken at a very fast rate. I can not look at maps, or user profiles from my smart phone anymore.

 

Come on Groundspeak... get with the mobile platform. It is where the future is at?

 

Are any other mobile devices being pushed out with all this Javascript and IE favortism (yes, Firefox on my PC is breaking too.) madness? Chime in, and let the developers know.

 

IE on Mobile6 iPaq NoWorky.

 

Blazer on Treo 680 NoWorky.

 

Blazer on Treo 650 NoWorky.

 

Xiino on Treo 680 NoWorky.

 

Just verified OperaMini NoWorky also.

Edited March 5, 2008 by KnC

[+The Leprechauns]

Are any other mobile devices being pushed out with all this Javascript and IE favortism (yes, Firefox on my PC is breaking too.) madness?

That is funny, to someone who has followed the development history and watched cool features that had to be scaled back in order to work properly on Innernet Exploder. Worked fine on Firefox, looked cool, but Bill Gates said "no can do." Generally the site works much better for me on Firefox.

[+Thrak]

I can't comment on the mobile issues since I'm a lowly gov't employee and can't afford such luxuries. However, as far as IE vs. Firefox goes, I haven't used IE in a very long time. I only use Firefox and the site functions quite nicely for me.

Edited March 5, 2008 by Thrak

[+Miragee]

I also cannot comment on the mobile issues, but I have never used IE. I went from Netscape to the Opera browser many years ago and the site works fine for me. Firefox is too slow for my dialup connection . . .

 

That is distressing that OperaMini is also "No Worky."

[Moun10Bike]

The site seems to work fine with my WM6 Smartphone (Motorola Q9h).

[+Monkeybrad]

No problems at all using Firefox on my Mac or Safari on my iPhone. I wonder if the recent spate of complaints has more to do with individual users configurations than an actual hardware/software issue?

[+Klatch]

No problems at all with Firefox. I cannot see the pictures or maps on the cache pages with my Blazer browser and my Palm T|X. Using Opera Mini I cannot see the pictures, but the maps display. This is connected wireless or bluetooth. Edit: to say the profiles can be viewed with no problems.

Edited March 5, 2008 by Klatch

[+sataraid1]

Safari FTW, yo.

[+KnC]

It very well can be a configuration issue with FireFox. I have "NoScript" running with FireFox, as this is mandated by my work. I can disable it for the site, but then I violate my work's security policies.

 

I do use Safari on my Mac through a SSH tunnel, but this can slow things down. It can't be tracked, but I enjoyed being able to access maps & links from my phone in the field too. With Blazer or OperaMini, when I click on a users profile & then try to view thier GeoCaches, Trackables, or Gallery the screen refreshes, but it stays on the same page. Plus no cut & paste with OperaMini.

 

Anyway, Javascript has a lot of vulnerabilities, and there are other ways to accomplish whatever tracking that might be dependent on Javascript being used.

 

And yes, I am AntiMicrosloth, so IE is not an option.

Edited March 6, 2008 by KnC

[+Prime Suspect]

yes, Firefox on my PC is breaking too.

It very well can be a configuration issue with FireFox. I have "NoScript" running with FireFox, as this is mandated by my work. I can disable it for the site, but then I violate my work's security policies.

So, no, Firefox is not "breaking". You can't purposely disable something, then blame the site for your (or your company's) actions.

 

Javescript is not only not going away, it's becoming more and more an integral part of the web experience, especially as sites move towards AJAX-like interfaces. Sounds like your company needs to find a non-sledgehammer solution, or pretty soon employees won't be able to open any web page more complex than craigslist (which I have no doubt they've blocked).

[+KnC]

So, no, Firefox is not "breaking". You can't purposely disable something, then blame the site for your (or your company's) actions.

 

Javescript is not only not going away, it's becoming more and more an integral part of the web experience, especially as sites move towards AJAX-like interfaces. Sounds like your company needs to find a non-sledgehammer solution, or pretty soon employees won't be able to open any web page more complex than craigslist (which I have no doubt they've blocked).

 

I disagree. You can achieve much more with CSS, without the security risks associated with Javascript. Most AJAX programmers (or any web developer for that matter) that I know are looking at the mobile environment right now. That was my main emphasis. GC is alienating mobile platforms? This does not have to be the case.

 

And for the record... The settings I use on FireFox work fine on Sites like Yahoo, Google, eBay, and even YouTube. (These sites also use a limited amount of Javascript, but they provide other options on critical features, so my Scripting settings in FireFox are not as critical as you portray, and don't even come into consideration when I am mobile.) And Unfortunately, my work is governed by Clients like the US Government, and Very Large Corporations who require multiple classifications, and security audits every year. I don't think they will be lightening their standards for a platform that has been intensely critisized, and rejected by most secure environments?

 

Anyway, I didn't mean to bring in the question whether a technology was valid or not. I am simply soliciting Mobile Geocachers to report what works, and doesn't work. It doesn't make since to change anything on one persons observation... Summarizing my original question to the forums:

 

"What other mobile platforms are failing, and which ones work with the standard geocaching.com site?"

 

[+KnC]

The site seems to work fine with my WM6 Smartphone (Motorola Q9h).

 

If you login, and go to your Friends list. Click on a cachers Profile link. Can you view their "Geocaches", "Trackables", "Gallery", or "Bookmark" Lists? Does the Hide & Seek a Cache Page work? (Both of these items fail on my Treo & Mobile6 devices.)

[+Prime Suspect]

I disagree. You can achieve much more with CSS, without the security risks associated with Javascript. Most AJAX programmers (or any web developer for that matter) that I know are looking at the mobile environment right now. That was my main emphasis. GC is alienating mobile platforms? This does not have to be the case.

The approach this site has taken is to develop a separate portal for mobile devices, that is accessible from both WAP devices, and mobile web devices.

Edited March 6, 2008 by Prime Suspect

[Moun10Bike]

The site seems to work fine with my WM6 Smartphone (Motorola Q9h).

 

If you login, and go to your Friends list. Click on a cachers Profile link. Can you view their "Geocaches", "Trackables", "Gallery", or "Bookmark" Lists? Does the Hide & Seek a Cache Page work? (Both of these items fail on my Treo & Mobile6 devices.)

 

I double-checked to be sure and yes, all of these function fine on my Q.

[+KnC]

I double-checked to be sure and yes, all of these function fine on my Q.

 

UGH! I guess I will have to try this device out. I just hate having to have multiple devices, and another MS device... !

 

Temporarily going Off Topic: Can anyone recommend a decent SSH client for Mobile6, and do you know of a Mac conduit, or is ActiveSync still only Windows? (I have a PPC6700 & it constantly lost calendar & contact info... one of the reasons I switched to Palm/Missing Sync. )

 

Thanks for the info.

 

Any others?

[+Driver Carries Cache]

So, no, Firefox is not "breaking". You can't purposely disable something, then blame the site for your (or your company's) actions.

 

Javescript is not only not going away, it's becoming more and more an integral part of the web experience, especially as sites move towards AJAX-like interfaces. Sounds like your company needs to find a non-sledgehammer solution, or pretty soon employees won't be able to open any web page more complex than craigslist (which I have no doubt they've blocked).

 

I disagree. You can achieve much more with CSS, without the security risks associated with Javascript. Most AJAX programmers (or any web developer for that matter) that I know are looking at the mobile environment right now. That was my main emphasis. GC is alienating mobile platforms? This does not have to be the case.

 

And for the record... The settings I use on FireFox work fine on Sites like Yahoo, Google, eBay, and even YouTube. (These sites also use a limited amount of Javascript, but they provide other options on critical features, so my Scripting settings in FireFox are not as critical as you portray, and don't even come into consideration when I am mobile.) And Unfortunately, my work is governed by Clients like the US Government, and Very Large Corporations who require multiple classifications, and security audits every year. I don't think they will be lightening their standards for a platform that has been intensely critisized, and rejected by most secure environments?

 

Anyway, I didn't mean to bring in the question whether a technology was valid or not. I am simply soliciting Mobile Geocachers to report what works, and doesn't work. It doesn't make since to change anything on one persons observation... Summarizing my original question to the forums:

 

"What other mobile platforms are failing, and which ones work with the standard geocaching.com site?"

 

I develop websites for a living (over 10 years now). We specialize in websites for financial institutions and online stock trading, so security is of the utmost importance. JavaScript isn't inherently insecure. Security will depend heavily on your implementation. BTW... CSS and JavaScript are used for two completely different things. Frequently they're used together, but they are not interchangeable.

 

DCC

[+KnC]

I develop websites for a living (over 10 years now). We specialize in websites for financial institutions and online stock trading, so security is of the utmost importance. JavaScript isn't inherently insecure. Security will depend heavily on your implementation. BTW... CSS and JavaScript are used for two completely different things. Frequently they're used together, but they are not interchangeable.

 

DCC

 

So you understand the insecure & unstable nature of passing off functions to the client. And the superiority of server side languages?... Something that is compatible with all platforms?

 

 

What was the purpose of this thread again?

[+ChileHead]

The site seems to work fine with my WM6 Smartphone (Motorola Q9h).

 

If you login, and go to your Friends list. Click on a cachers Profile link. Can you view their "Geocaches", "Trackables", "Gallery", or "Bookmark" Lists? Does the Hide & Seek a Cache Page work? (Both of these items fail on my Treo & Mobile6 devices.)

 

That works fine on my Treo 650 with Blazer and with Opera Mini.

[+KnC]

If you login, and go to your Friends list. Click on a cachers Profile link. Can you view their "Geocaches", "Trackables", "Gallery", or "Bookmark" Lists? Does the Hide & Seek a Cache Page work? (Both of these items fail on my Treo & Mobile6 devices.)

 

That works fine on my Treo 650 with Blazer and with Opera Mini.

 

OK, now I am trippin out... What version of Blazer or Opera are you using. I enabled cookies, and Javascript, and it still doesn't work. This is really bizzare. My 680 is on ATT, and my 650 is on Sprint. iPaq is WiFi.

 

Is there some setting in my profile? This doesn't make sense to me.

[+Klatch]

 

That works fine on my Treo 650 with Blazer and with Opera Mini.

Fine with my TX. Blazer 4.3 and Opera 4.0.98

[+ChileHead]

If you login, and go to your Friends list. Click on a cachers Profile link. Can you view their "Geocaches", "Trackables", "Gallery", or "Bookmark" Lists? Does the Hide & Seek a Cache Page work? (Both of these items fail on my Treo & Mobile6 devices.)

 

That works fine on my Treo 650 with Blazer and with Opera Mini.

 

OK, now I am trippin out... What version of Blazer or Opera are you using. I enabled cookies, and Javascript, and it still doesn't work. This is really bizzare. My 680 is on ATT, and my 650 is on Sprint. iPaq is WiFi.

 

Is there some setting in my profile? This doesn't make sense to me.

 

Blazer 4.3.2 and Opera 4.0.10406

[+KnC]

Palm must of broke something when they upgraded. I am using Blazer 4.5.

 

I just upgraded Opera to 4.0.10406. It is going to take some getting use to. It is pretty slow, and the initial settings are definitely not friendly to the Treo. I finally found the mobile settings button, and I can read the text. AND the links mentioned above work. ()

 

Still stuck without cut paste, which is a major bummer, but at least I can view the pages I want. Thanks for the info.

[+ChileHead]

Still stuck without cut paste, which is a major bummer, but at least I can view the pages I want. Thanks for the info.

 

Which is why I use Blazer most of the time, instead of Opera. The lack of cut&paste is a problem sometimes.

[+Driver Carries Cache]

I develop websites for a living (over 10 years now). We specialize in websites for financial institutions and online stock trading, so security is of the utmost importance. JavaScript isn't inherently insecure. Security will depend heavily on your implementation. BTW... CSS and JavaScript are used for two completely different things. Frequently they're used together, but they are not interchangeable.

 

DCC

 

So you understand the insecure & unstable nature of passing off functions to the client. And the superiority of server side languages?... Something that is compatible with all platforms?

 

 

I don't find server side scripting to be superior... server side is useful (and preferential) for some uses and client side is as well. The right tool for the right job. What I said is there's nothing inherently insecure about JavaScript. What creates most insecurity is a lack of knowledge of the platform and O.S. you're serving from, an incomplete knowledge of the language you're programming in and most of all... poor execution.

 

DCC

[+ShowStop]

If you login, and go to your Friends list. Click on a cachers Profile link. Can you view their "Geocaches", "Trackables", "Gallery", or "Bookmark" Lists? Does the Hide & Seek a Cache Page work? (Both of these items fail on my Treo & Mobile6 devices.)

I can purposely cause those links to fail with my browser (Firefox) if I override the user agent settings. So that tells me the script checks the browser type and if it doesn't recognize it, the script fails.

[+tozainamboku]

If you login, and go to your Friends list. Click on a cachers Profile link. Can you view their "Geocaches", "Trackables", "Gallery", or "Bookmark" Lists? Does the Hide & Seek a Cache Page work? (Both of these items fail on my Treo & Mobile6 devices.)

I can purposely cause those links to fail with my browser (Firefox) if I override the user agent settings. So that tells me the script checks the browser type and if it doesn't recognize it, the script fails.

It tells me that the server checks the browser type and returns Javascript that is customized to work on a particular browser. A non-ECMA compliant browser probably gets a slightly different script that contains some constructs your ECMA compliant browser sees as a error. The problem is that the site might not be recognizing the dialect to use for some mobile devices which often don't support all the features of the standard. I agree with KnC that the site should have a fall back for devices that don't support the necessary feature or where someone disables script - even it is just a link to the wap.geocaching.com site.