Eglin air force base reservation PASS

[+DIVERED]

HELLO I WAS JUST HOPING TO GET SOME HELP. IN NWFL THERE IS A Eglin air force base reservation. WE DO ALOT OF CACHING THERE HOWEVER IT REQ. A PASS I HAVE HAD LOGS ON MY CACHES THAT THE GARDS ARE SAYING THAT TO MANY GEO-CACHERS ARE NOT GETTING A PASS. AND THEY ARE STARTING TO GET PISSED ABOUT IT. I DON'T KNOW WHY YOU WOULD FAIL TO GET A PASS WHEN GOING ON TO GOV. LAND. AND WOULD LIKE TO KNOW IF ANYONE HAS ANY IDEAS ON HOW TO STOP THIS SO WE ALL CAN KEEP OUR PLAYING FEILD. BEFORE WE LOSE IT THANKS DIVERED

 

P.S. IF YOU LOOK UP MY CACHES YOU WILL SEE WHAT I MEAN

[+ArtieD]

The first thing to do would to try typing in lowercase letters and not in all CAPS...

 

Next, I dunno...maybe make a pic of the pass a requirement for logging?

[+NorthWes]

Having grown up on Air Force bases I have complete understanding about passes, etc. However, many who travel with me are clueless about why the military feels the need to exercise control (including areas where "use of deadly force is authorized") over lands they manage. Beyond the very obvious signs advertising boundaries and penalties, who'd want to wander across land that could be the impact area for a gunnery range or the operations area for a training exercise? Finally, living in a country that's at war (remember that?) I'm stunned constantly by how many folks don't understand 'security at government facilities' and why the military would want to know who you are and where you're going on their land.

 

Your cache page seems to be very clear about the need for a pass; unfortunately you can't force people to act responsibly. If enough geocachers act irresponsibly you'll be forced out of Eglin soon.

[+gof1]

One part of the problem could be cachers "Flying Blind", that is to say hunting without reading the cache page. Perhaps you could make a puzzle out of it. That way the posted coords could be of base.

You could also try it as a multi, with the first leg off base. Add a reminder to the first leg to get that pass.

[+Isonzo Karst]

I'd recommend you build a bookmarked list of all the Eglin caches. Then contact all those cache owners with the warning that you put on the top of your cache page.

 

For those reading the forums here a link to one of the relevant log with mention of annoyed guards.

[Keystone]

Since this AFB is in Florida, I'm moving this thread to the South and Southeast Forum so that the cachers in that area are more likely to see it.

[+Crow T Robot]

You might also try posting in the forums at the Tallahassee Area Geocachers website and the Florida Geocaching Association website.

[+wesleykey]

Am I missing something? Caches are not allowed on military bases.

[+wesleykey]

Am I missing something? Caches are not allowed on military bases.

 

Off-limit (Physical) Caches

 

Caches may be quickly archived if we see the following (which is not inclusive):

 

. Caches near or on military installations.

[+DIVERED]

Am I missing something? Caches are not allowed on military bases.

 

Off-limit (Physical) Caches

 

Caches may be quickly archived if we see the following (which is not inclusive):

 

. Caches near or on military installations.

 

Yes you are!!! Eglin air force base reservation is a lot of land set aside for the use of the public the hunt fish and play on. It is allowed to be used to GEOCACHE as long as you pay the $7.00 a year pass fee. Yes the land is owned by the gov. but the public is allowed to play on it. Btw Eglin air force base owns about 204 miles2 of land and that includes probably 10% of the towns around here. So it is okay to GEOCACHE there and where you get the pass they know and allow it.

Edited March 15, 2007 by DIVERED

[nise188]

Am I missing something? Caches are not allowed on military bases.

 

Off-limit (Physical) Caches

 

Caches may be quickly archived if we see the following (which is not inclusive):

 

. Caches near or on military installations.

 

Yes you are!!! Eglin air force base reservation is a lot of land set aside for the use of the public the hunt fish and play on. It is allowed to be used to GEOCACHE as long as you pay the $7.00 a year pass fee. Yes the land is owned by the gov. but the public is allowed to play on it. Btw Eglin air force base owns about 204 miles2 of land and that includes probably 10% of the towns around here. So it is okay to GEOCACHE there and where you get the pass they know and allow it.

[nise188]

Most "Guards" know about geocaching. You should always state that a recreation permit at the least (or hunting permit or fishing permit, if they want) is required to enter the Eglin Reservation. And tell them where Jackson Guard is located to purchase their permits.

[+SgtSue]

Having recently visited the area I was surprised to see the large amount of caches on Eglin AFB and even one on the nearby Tyndall AFB. One thing I was unsure of was do military members need to get the recreational pass? Being unsure and having more caches than time I just left those on Eglin alone. But in case I do have the opportunity to return I would like to know as many of them seemed quite interesting.

[+DIVERED]

Having recently visited the area I was surprised to see the large amount of caches on Eglin AFB and even one on the nearby Tyndall AFB. One thing I was unsure of was do military members need to get the recreational pass? Being unsure and having more caches than time I just left those on Eglin alone. But in case I do have the opportunity to return I would like to know as many of them seemed quite interesting.

YES I BELIVE EVERYONE NEEDS A PASS.

[Clan Riffster]

I've never been to Eglin. Are the access points not controlled? Seems like a funny way to run a military instalation if they are not. If they are controlled, how are all these geocachers getting in without the pass?

[+flarose516]

The reservation is seperate from the actual base and there are no access points or designated entrances on the reservation. The reservation spans across 3 counties and is over 400,000 acres and about half the area is closed which only military can access. Most of the major highways used to travel town to town here is surrounded by the reservation. It's pretty much everywhere!

 

Now to the problem......

 

I didn't realize this was a problem. I just placed a cache on the reservation today. Maybe we should do like Arther & Trillian said and require proof of an actual permit. I love caching on the reservation and if they decide to ban it....... we have nowhere else. All the caches in the area would end up micros in Walmart and fast food parking lots! Maybe just require a picture of the permit on one log and then give the link to it in the other Eglin caches you log? I'm not sure but we do need to resolve this ASAP. Eglin Resources are not people to make mad, they will ban geocaching just like they've banned other things in the past.

[+SgtSue]

Was thinking of this and possible ways to minimize those caching without permits. Coordination and cooperation is important among the hiders. I would also make sure your local reviewer knows about the problem so he/she can help to insure whatever is decided upon is implimented into future caches.

 

1. Have an "Obtain a Permit" Event for the locals to obtain their permits - this could be done now and then again at the beginning of each federal fiscal year. You can get no heat lamination pages to help preserve the pass since it is good for a year. If you talk to those who issue the passes in advance (good idea for a crowd) they can be prepared and maybe even do it at an alternate location which might be better for them especially if their office is small.

 

2. Have an additional waypoint for the place to obtain a permit on cache page

 

3. Make it a multi with the first point the place to obtain a permit and then an additional waypoint being the cache location

 

4. Require proof of pass (photo of pass at cache site)

 

edit to add - Recreational passes are required for military and retired miltary members to cache on Eglin. I called the Jackson Gate personnel to verify this. Everyone over 16 must have a pass and those under 16 must be accompanied by an adult with a recreational pass. It would be a real good idea to put that on all the pages for caches on base.

Edited March 19, 2007 by SgtSue

[+gravelshot]

Wow! This explains why I've had so much trouble setting up a "cache in trash out event" there. Nobody will return my calls!! I see why now!

 

I'm really bothered at geocachers who won't follow the rules on this. It's $7 bucks... if you own a GPS, you can afford to get the permit. Get it done!

 

I love geocaching on the reservation with my wife (who also has her own permit) and children. My favorite geocache, "Turkey Creek Still," is on the reservation. I'd hate to see this privilage get banned because of lazy and inconsiderate geocachers.

 

I love sgtsue's suggestion about holding an "Obtain a permit" event. The new passes start on 10/1/07.

 

We need to spread the word...

 

Geocache owners, if you have a cache on the reservation, add the link about the annoyed guards and put in bold that "geocachers may lose the privilage to geocache if they break the rules and not get a permit" on your geocache page.

 

Let's work together and not let this great place to geocache go away.

[+SgtSue]

Remember most cachers do not read the national forums. Put this into your regional forums and spread by word of mouth. Don't wait until Oct to get moving on this. Talk it up at all local events. Talk it up at your CITOs. Talk it up at GW5. Start to email those with caches requiring the permits. Have an event to register everyone as soon as you can then do it again every October. Making it easy and a party will increase the numbers of those who comply.

[+gravelshot]

I got an email this morning suggesting that the reservation caches should be listed "members only." Sounds like a good idea. Do you think that would help?

 

Thoughts?

[+Cardinal Red]

Yes, that would probably cut down on the number of cachers entering the area without a pass. It would also be possible for the local Premium Member cachers to share cache information with non PM's if they have a pass. There is a back door logging method that would even allow them to get credit for the find. If it's a choice between that or having cache placements banned completely, it's worth trying. But never assume that just because someone is a PM that they also have a pass.

[The Bully's]

This seems to be a problem of Jackson Guard not thouroughly enforcing their requirement to have a pass...I.E fine the tresspasser. Most (if not all) of the geocaches listed as being on the Eglin reservation have statements stating that Eglin Reservation passes are required, provide Jackson Guard phone number, address, and some even have the Jackson Guard lat/long coordinates.

 

I don't think Eglin Natural resources can disallow Geocaching unless of course they shut the reservation down completely (to include hiking, fishing, 4-wheeling, etc)...doesn't make sense. What does make sense is to strictly enforce the requirement to have a pass for each person found to be on the reservation.

 

I don't have my reservation pass in hand but perhaps there is a way to tie your cache location using coordinates that can only be found on a reservation permit? Thereby allowing only folks with permits the ability to find the cache....just a thought.

 

Aloha

 

Derry

The Bully's

[+samirsky]

This issue has been of great concern to me as well. I have placed many geocaches on Eglin, and was very disturbed by 2 recent logs (all my caches on Eglin now have links to those logs) indicating a guard was annoyed with geocachers. The 400,000 acres of Eglin property is a natural treasure that I enjoying playing in, and is GREAT for geocaching.

 

Before a few weeks ago when the logs were posted, I had no idea it was a problem. In fact, I still have no way of knowing how big of a problem it really is. It is entirely possible that both logs were referring to the same guard, and his opinion is not shared by all who manage Eglin land. Or it could be a major problem, and they are planning to ban geocaching as we speak. I do not know.

 

I have spoken to Erica Schnarr (850-883-1177) of Jackson Guard, Natural Resources branch. She is the one to contact to get assistance (dumpster) for a CITO event. She said she does not know of any problem with geocachers not getting passes. However, she also admitted that she probably wouldn't be the one told about it. She suggested I call the ladies that issue the passes. I called them at Jackson Guard and they said they didn't know of any problem, that I should call Range Patrol. This issue may be limited to one or two guards (maybe not), but at least it is not such a big problem that people all over Jackson Guard know about it. I tried calling Eglin Range Patrol and got no answer.

 

I had not thought of the issue someone in this thread mentioned that cachers may be geocaching "blind", not seeing the cache descriptions (and therefore the permit requirement) before finding a cache on the Eglin Reservation. The only suggestion I have heard that would help with this situation is to make it a multi, where the first coordinates aren't on the reservation (maybe Jackson Guard where you get the pass, except for the cache isolation issue; maybe the closest road not on the reservation, again possible cache isolation issue but less), or to require some math or something where you add numbers from the pass (phone number to Jackson Guard? coordinates?) to find the cache coordinates. At least this would help with the people who cache blind (I do sometimes when I am out of town, and we get a lot of tourists here) and force them to read the description to find the cache.

 

Of course all of these ideas create a "hassle factor". Some for the person hiding the cache, and some for the cacher finding it. But we definitely want to keep caching legal on the Eglin Reservation. And by the way, they can ban ANY activity they want on Eglin. If they do, you wont be allowed to post a cache through geocacing.com if the reviewer does his job. Many national forests have already banned geocaching. I agree that permit enforcement/fines are part of the answer, but I do not want Eglin seeing geocaching as the source of the problem. That is not good for anybody.

 

Perhaps a CITO event would help build the positive image.

 

Thanks to all who have given many helpful suggestions in this thread. Keep 'em coming.

 

Sam

[Clan Riffster]

Another question of the "cuz I'm clueless" variety:

Would Joe Schmoe, travelling from out of town, following the arrow on his Garmin, have any way of knowing he needed a permit to hunt a cache? Someone mentioned earlier that there is a large chunk of Eglin that has no gates or guards. Are there signs posted saying "STOP!" "GET A PERMIT!", or does this info mainly travel word of mouth?

I know to the regulars, this might seem like a stupid question, but I've never been there.

 

[RANT]Something else that burns my backside is how some land managers treat geocachers differently from other land users. Hikers, campers, mountain bikers, kayakers, equestrians, et. al. can break any rule they want and the managers deal with the individual. But when a cacher violates the rules, they target the group. That makes me madder than Bill having to vote for Hillary![/RANT]

[+SgtSue]

At the nearby Tyndall AFB there are signs posted stating a "Recreational Pass" is required when entering certain of the "open" areas. I would venture a guess the same is at Eglin, but I don't know. The sign itself does not give a lot of detail and I personally wondered if it applied to me as a current military member. I have since found out it does, but would not have guess that to be true.

 

This might be a good use of the "additional waypoint" feature. Entering the point where the pass can be obtained as an additional waypoint would most likely alert the cacher to the fact there is more info than just the cache site. I know I am always happy to see those "parking location" and "trail head" points and therefore would read the "Required Pass Office" waypoint.

[+gravelshot]

samirsky,

I've tried for the past month to get a hold of Erica at Jackson Guard... how'd you do that?

 

I was trying to put a CITO event together there, but I have given up. I am still working on a location, but it may have to be pushed back from the April 14th date because of the slow/no response from the base.

 

Thanks!

[+samirsky]

samirsky,

I've tried for the past month to get a hold of Erica at Jackson Guard... how'd you do that?

 

I was trying to put a CITO event together there, but I have given up. I am still working on a location, but it may have to be pushed back from the April 14th date because of the slow/no response from the base.

 

Thanks!

 

I called at about 10am on a Thursday. 850-883-1177.

Try again Monday at 10am.

 

Or maybe just try every hour on the hour starting at 8am.