Log Etiquette & Hints

[+JohnTee]

What is etiquette regarding logs & requests for hints?

 

I have apparently come up with a good micro cache and had a request for additional hints. I initially posted a Log Comment with encrypted info for an additional hint. Got an e-mail that said he had already done what was in the hint and could I please give him another. Replied to his e-mail with additional hint and offer for more if needed. Didn't want to just COMPLETELY give it away! Then deleted my Logged Comment.

 

I wanted this to be a challenging micro, so purposely did not use a 35mm film cannister, borrowed from ideas I'd seen and didn't leave a strong hint.

 

Questions:

 

Should I leave a better hint?

Is responding in the Log appropriate?

Was deleting my own log entry appropriate?

Should I respond just by e-mail instead of the Log?

 

My son SAID he thought this was an evil micro. Guess I shoud have listened!

 

JohnTee

[+5¢]

What is etiquette regarding logs & requests for hints?

 

I have apparently come up with a good micro cache and had a request for additional hints. I initially posted a Log Comment with encrypted info for an additional hint. Got an e-mail that said he had already done what was in the hint and could I please give him another. Replied to his e-mail with additional hint and offer for more if needed. Didn't want to just COMPLETELY give it away! Then deleted my Logged Comment.

 

I wanted this to be a challenging micro, so purposely did not use a 35mm film cannister, borrowed from ideas I'd seen and didn't leave a strong hint.

 

Questions:

 

Should I leave a better hint?

Is responding in the Log appropriate?

Was deleting my own log entry appropriate?

Should I respond just by e-mail instead of the Log?

 

My son SAID he thought this was an evil micro. Guess I shoud have listened!

 

JohnTee

 

I would say, that since the cacher has a pretty low find count, that person might not have learned to think outside the box yet. I would just tell him to keep looking. Now if a few cachers who have five hundred to a thousand finds came through and couldn't find it, I would up the difficulty and tell them to keep looking. Don't feel pressured to give someone a find.

Edited February 11, 2006 by 5¢

[+Puzzzler]

It sounds like this may be more difficult than the 2 you gave it. However, since only one person has tried to find it, you can't go on his experiences alone. You may want to raise the difficulty level at first and see how people fare against it. Also, with a higher rating, you won't need to give any extra hints. Your current hint says that it is not a film cannister. That's pretty vague. Maybe you could say something about its size as compared to a film cannister. But the bottom line is, it's your cache and you do not need to give out any extra hints if you don't want to.

[+wiseye]

Generaly reply in Email. Everything 5 cent says is correct. Don't give up your secretes to the first person to come by. I usually wait untill someone is FTF before giving any other hints.

[+dshawk]

Personally, I would approach the situation as follows:

 

I wouldn't add another hint. You wanted it to be a challenge, so leave it as a challenge. (Maybe if many people have some trouble, you could up the difficulty a bit).

 

Responding in the logs/deleting the logs is your choice. My preference is to respond to requests with an email only, so as not to give everyone more help. In this case, I'd probably try and give the cacher some more help, since he/she hasn't found many.

 

Also, I wouldn't judge the difficulty of this cache with a single cacher. The cacher who logged the DNF hasn't had many finds, and probably hasn't come across a micro like yours. Wait until someone who's found a significant number comes across it, and ask them to help you rate it. Remember that sometimes, its just the cacher...I can spot a fake bolt rated 3.5/1 quickly, but I've been to a 2/1 film canister 3 times and haven't found it yet.

 

*All of this is what I would do, but you should make your own decisions. Giving help is your choice, as well as the way you choose to do it.

[+JDandDD]

I would answer in email only. Since there is only one log on the cache it could be just this cacher. We all have blind spots when caching and find some harder than others.

 

That said, like others have said, I'd wait for a few more loggers to show up before worrying about it. Then you'll get a better idea of how hard it really is and be in a better position to decide if a hint is needed and/or the difficulty rating needs to be changed.

 

JDandDD

[Lt32]

The only thing I have to add..... If you recieve more than three to four DNFs in a row go check the cache to make sure it is still there, and hasn't been moved or muggled.

[CoyoteRed]

You only have one DNF on that page.

 

Folks around here probably wouldn't give any additional hints until the first finder. Some folks like hard caches and will really work'em until they find it. They can get a bit peeved if they then discovered someone found it from a hint you gave them. I know I would.

 

Yes, yes, I know it's the cache owner's prerogative, yada, yada...

 

I'm saying that's how I'd feel.

 

I say, no additional hints at least until the first finder.

 

You know, evil caches are supposed to be hard!

 

"What? You want me to come hold your hand and point at it, too?"

[+Tsmola]

yeah I'd say wait till someone with more experience comes by. I recently put out a challenging micro it took 2 of the more experienced area cachers 600+ and 800+ finds respectively. 4 trips to get it,

I gave some additional hints in email, and also to one of them in person at the cache site. Eventually they both found it, but I upped the rating to a 3, then to a 4 at their suggestions, and added a few more hints after after thinking about it for a bit.

 

I asked on the cache page to not give away spoilers, but I will email people with additional hints if they are having trouble.

 

Like someone else said it all depends on the cacher, I've found 3/1 micros on the first try, but I still have a 1.5/1.5 nano that eludes me close to home.

[+4leafclover]

I would say, that since the cacher has a pretty low find count, that person might not have learned to think outside the box yet. I would just tell him to keep looking. Now if a few cachers who have five hundred to a thousand finds came through and couldn't find it, I would up the difficulty and tell them to keep looking. Don't feel pressured to give someone a find.

 

Heck...I have over 600 finds, and I still have trouble with challenging micros. I'd like to think I have learned to think outside the box by now...but alas. I still get stumped by one/ones.

 

I agree, just encourage him to keep looking, and be satisfied that you have developed a challenge.

[+JohnTee]

Guys, thanks for all the input. As you can see from my low find count, I'm also inexperienced. Knew I could count on your guidance. I gave this initial user an additional hint yesterday by e-mail, but didn't give it totally away yet.

 

I think I'll do the following:

 

1. If he continues to have difficulty, I'll ask him to just sit on it for a while

2. Change the rating to a '3' and then see if any power cachers have advice either up or down from there.

3. Just to be on the safe side, check just to make sure it's still there. I'm willing to bet it is . . . I can do that driving by. I'm going to the South bound rest area to set up another micro tomorrow. Have to drive past the North bound rest stop to catch a crossover and get back on South bound I-55.

 

Having fun! Thanks.

 

JohnTee

[+JohnTee]

Man, have you guys got it pegged!

 

February 11 by Know Future (360 found)

Guess I'm FTF on this one. Pretty clever, but I spotted it right away. More proof that the most common items are sometimes the hardest to see. TFTC!

 

Know Future

[view this log on a separate page]

 

February 9 by e_pie (29 found)

I stop here often when I have to work in cape or sikeston. I looked for about an hour in the cold and came up with nothing. I sure could use a hint. I'll try again next time I stop by.

 

Guess there's no need to check on it. Might even leave it at a 2 for the time being.

 

JohnTee

[+wimseyguy]

One of the ironic aspects of finding a lot of caches and living in an area where we are constantly trying to out evil one another is that I sometimes miss a basic hide because I'm expecting something creative and diabolical.

My point is that no matter what our experience level is, we approach each cache with different expectations than someone else might.

Edited February 12, 2006 by wimseyguy

[+Confucius' Cat]

My only concern is that this is a rest area cache and people probably expect a park-and-grab.

 

Many who will seek it will only pass through once.

 

Also rest areas typically can only be accessed from one direction and thus require a lot of driving for someone who is really committed to finding it in multiple trips.

 

Therefore, I think it is particularly EVIL to hide a toughie at a rest area. But it is your perogative to hide EVILLY if you so desire- in which case, I would not give any more hints but perhaps bump the stars a bit and mention in the short description that this is not your typical rest area park-and-grab.

 

Perhaps we need more like this, but I wonder what the one-time passerby would think if they didn't know it was a toughie.

Edited February 12, 2006 by Confuse-A-Cat

[+Camper17]

I have a new Cache that I put out a week ago. So far only 3 people have posted logs and only 1 cacher has found it after repeated tries. But I know that at least 8 cachers have searched for it. I originally had it listed as a 1.5/1.5 because I didn't think it was that difficult. But instead of adding a hint, I just upped the difficulty rating to 2.5 .

 

On other caches, I have received requests for additional hints and I go and look at the users profile to see how many caches they have done. If they are really new to Geocaching, I'll give them a nudge in the right direction without giving it away. I don't want them to get disappointed with the geocaching and quit. I want them to learn to enjoy the hunt

 

~Camper17

 

[Editted for spelling]

Edited February 12, 2006 by Camper17

[+dshawk]

I have a new Cache that I put out a week ago. So far only 3 people have posted logs and only 1 cacher has found it after repeated tries. But I know that at least 8 cachers have searched for it. I originally had it listed as a 1.5/1.5 because I didn't think it was that difficult. But instead of adding a hint, I just upped the difficulty rating to 2.5 .

 

On other caches, I have received requests for additional hints and I go and look at the users profile to see how many caches they have done. If they are really new to Geocaching, I'll give them a nudge in the right direction without giving it away. I don't want them to get disappointed with the geocaching a quit. I want them to learn to enjoy the hunt

 

~Camper17

 

The best part of that is the first part of the cache page: "This should be an easy find"

[+Harmony Smurf]

Micros (even traditional ones) can be a big challenge. I know the first day I went caching we almost gave up. We were not "thinking 4th dementionally". Now I know to do a lot of looking with your hands...

 

I would have just let the request for a hint go by, unless there are a large amounts of DNF's.