Warchalk Geocaching.

[Ben Pid]

 

I have been thinking abotu this for some time now. And I I have thought about the possibility of combining Warchalking with Geocaching.

 

How great would it be to have an online database of Waypoints to Wireless access points around the World!

 

Check this link to read about the ins and outs of Warchalking!

 

http://www.warchalking.org/

 

Whether the network's are locked down or not, it doesnt matter with Warchalking because you can use the international code to read what the WEP key is

 

Surely someone out there has the relevant knowledge to make something like this live.

 

Pid

[+stu_and_sarah]

Surely someone out there has the relevant knowledge to make something like this live.

I have the knowledge, but it's pretty dodgy ground. You are pretty much 'stealing' bandwidth from a company if you use their networks without their consent. Also, access to a system you're not meant to be on is a criminal offence (as far as I can tell, I'm not a lawyer)

 

Feel free to mark legal access points, but waypointing warchalked areas is probably a bad idea. If you're going to do that, make sure you have your tinfoil hat on.

 

Cheers,

 

Stu

[polar69]

 

I have thought about the possibility of combining Warchalking with Geocaching.

 

Pid

Two totally seperate things surely , I fail to see a connection

[+Team S-J]

It would make for a cool virtual cache. i.e. Log a find in the hotspot you're in.

Legal open access hotspots only. No pay to surf spots. Wouldn't want to give McD any more of my hard earned.

[Ben Pid]

I thought so too, Could make a cool Locationless!

 

Two totally seperate things surely , I fail to see a connection

 

Exactly....which is why making a connection is a good idea....IE a seperate website listing waypoints to Warchalks Virtual Geocache Warchalking has been born.

 

No seriously it is blatently illegal...but that doesnt nesscesarily mean it wouldnt be fun!

[+stu_and_sarah]

Exactly....which is why making a connection is a good idea....IE a seperate website listing waypoints to Warchalks Virtual Geocache Warchalking has been born.

 

No seriously it is blatently illegal...but that doesnt nesscesarily mean it wouldnt be fun!

We could ask Garmin to add the warchalk symbols into the selection available on their GPSrs....

[+Fangsy]

Considering that the Victoria's Post Boxes locationless cache was archived after the Men-in-slightly-darker- grey- suits contacted it's owner, I have a feeling that any listing of potentialy -MORE- useful to naughty people places, like free and hard to trace internet access points will generate a similar if not more directed response from the security agencies.

 

Call me a pessimist, but...

[+choccymandm]

NB. we, us, my etc refer to the company i work for and not me persoanlly!

 

Now i don't wanna sound like a boring old git, and i can only talk about personal experience having never even tried to hack a wireless network but ...

 

Ben, please go careful, it could be taken on the same lines as hacking and god knows what the penalties for hacking are these days.

 

Onto the legalities as stated by Warchalking ...

 

"In my dictionary, theft is defined as taking something from someone else without their permission with the purpose of preventing them from using it. Using someone's wireless network doesn't take anything -- they still have everything they had previously"

 

and

 

"Furthermore, if I'm simply checking email and visiting web pages, it's unlikely that I'll use up so much bandwidth that I will prevent the owner of the network from using the Internet"

 

"We" buy bandwidth from BT and "we" only buy what "we" need, if you're on that line then "our" system doesn't get the full bandwidth "we" need and have paid for so you are preventing "us" from using it to it's full - so theoretically your are stealing.

"We" had a problem sometime ago where one site was getting real slow response times because someone was hacking onto it and saping the bandwidth - a simple change of password sorted that out - but when you have to change the passwords on 1000+ sites and something like 10000+ access points although it doesn't physically cost anything to make the change it did cost in man hours, overtime payments etc and informing all the users that the passwords had changed.

 

You could always try something a little more innocent and start hunting for/logging wi-fi spots that allow public access?

 

PS. if i ever catch you on "my" rf network i'll kick your a** and send you a ... pair of my dirty old pants!!

 

<edit> I retract my virus comments!! my pants are worse!

Edited April 29, 2004 by choccymandm

[+stu_and_sarah]

PS. if i ever catch you on "my" rf network i'll kick your a** and send you a dirty old virus!!

I seriously wish people wouldn't use the "send you a virus" threat, even in jest. A virus rarely affects the person who has caught it that badly. What it does affect is the countless people who receive fake emails, denial-of-service attacks, and other disruption from the virus. If the virus affected the person who had caught it, then they would be much easier to eradicate.

 

Please don't anyone EVER send someone a virus to get at them. *ahem* Use WinNuke or something similar instead *ahem*.

 

I know choccy's comments were in jest, but it's really a very serious matter.

 

Anyway... back to geocaching...

 

Garmin could release a GPS with a directional WiFi finder which works like a goto arrow. Now that'd be cool!

[+The Hole-in-the-wall Gang]

 

I have been thinking abotu this for some time now. And I I have thought about the possibility of combining Warchalking with Geocaching.

 

How great would it be to have an online database of Waypoints to Wireless access points around the World!

 

Check this link to read about the ins and outs of Warchalking!

 

http://www.warchalking.org/

 

Whether the network's are locked down or not, it doesnt matter with Warchalking because you can use the international code to read what the WEP key is

 

Surely someone out there has the relevant knowledge to make something like this live.

 

Pid

As has been said it is probably best not to associate warchalking and geocaching, they are both fun (so long as nothing illegal occurs) but warchalking/netstumbling is definitely an 'underground' activity. Best not to give geocaching a 'bad' name

 

I have been considering the technical feasibility of running an access point as a virtual cache ( i.e. you turn up to a certain co-ord and get your WiFi enabled device out and associate with the network using the supplied WEP key. You could possibly sign the virtual log and could even up/download virtual swaps (non copyright music, games, calling cards etc )).

 

There seem to be 2 ways of doing this, you could either run an ad-hoc network using a dedicated pc running a web host and 802.11a/b/g network interface card (it would be unsecure so you would not really want to use it for any other purpose ) or you would need to run an access point which is capable of suporting the 802.1x standard which means that you could run your private network with full security that was 'hack resistant' plus a public interface that anyone could access but which would only return a simple web page containing the virtual cache/log/swaps. The only kind of access point which are 802.1x capable are fairly expensive beasts that are used by WiFi hotspot operators so that is unlikely to feasible so it is currently down to using an old laptop and a NIC.

 

It would be interesting to have a go at this some time, I wonder if it would get approval ?

 

John

[NeilFord]

Anyone interested in free public access points should check out http://consume.net/.

 

Warchalking was thought up as a way of marking such points. It's combination with wardriving/netstumbling is an unfortunate consequence of media attention.

 

Whilst I understand where Ben's coming from, I think geocaching keeping it's distance from the whole phenomina is probably for the best.

 

- Neil.

[Ben Pid]

I seriously wish people wouldn't use the "send you a virus" threat, even in jest. A virus rarely affects the person who has caught it that badly. What it does affect is the countless people who receive fake emails, denial-of-service attacks, and other disruption from the virus. If the virus affected the person who had caught it, then they would be much easier to eradicate.

 

Agreed on this....but to be fair the only viruses that could course me any damage are ones I would have to physically open in an .exe attachment and really and truly....I aint gonna be doing that

 

There seem to be 2 ways of doing this, you could either run an ad-hoc network using a dedicated pc running a web host and 802.11a/b/g network interface card (it would be unsecure so you would not really want to use it for any other purpose  ) or you would need to run an access point which is capable of suporting the 802.1x standard which means that you could run your private network with full security that was 'hack resistant' plus a public interface that anyone could access but which would only return a simple web page containing the virtual cache/log/swaps. The only kind of access point which are 802.1x capable are fairly expensive beasts that are used by WiFi hotspot operators so that is unlikely to feasible so it is currently down to using an old laptop and a NIC.

 

Now I would do it with a wireless airstation attached to a Router that is using NAT...Then supply the WEP Key. That way it isnt AD-Hoc and if it is hacked all they can see locally is the router....or better still use a wireless Airstation with built in Router.

 

Having said all this it is probably wise to leave Warchalking and Geocaching seperate...but needless to say it is still a seriously kool idea

 

Peace

 

Pid

[MCL]

Now I would do it with a wireless airstation attached to a Router that is using NAT...Then supply the WEP Key. That way it isnt AD-Hoc and if it is hacked all they can see locally is the router

I put this through the Google Translation service but it simply gave up....

[+The Hole-in-the-wall Gang]

Now I would do it with a wireless airstation attached to a Router that is using NAT...Then supply the WEP Key. That way it isnt AD-Hoc and if it is hacked all they can see locally is the router....or better still use a wireless Airstation with built in Router.

 

Pid , that should work ok. I guess that the only purpose of having a WEP key is to keep out warchalkers/netstumblers who don't geocache It would mean that your WiFi connection would be unsecure both ways so only 'surf' in the garden if you dont mind being snooped.

 

I guess that if the NAT router was WiFi enabled then you could have a private wireless network on the safe side of the firewall and have a second simpler access point on the WAN side of the NAT router which would allow public Wireless access but only to an address (web server) that you had setup in the NAT router.

 

I wonder if this has been done in the US yet ?

[Ben Pid]

I guess that if the NAT router was WiFi enabled then you could have a private wireless network on the safe side of the firewall and have a second simpler access point on the WAN side of the NAT router which would allow public Wireless access but only to an address (web server) that you had setup in the NAT router.

 

Not sure really.....the Built in hardware firewalls you get on these routers nowadays suck down your bandwidth hard! I was getting meerly 20meg out of a Broadcom PCIMA card and without firewall 54MB. shocking difference.

 

What you were saying about the WAN side of it etc.....I would assume you would have to forward a certain TCP port for this to work. I would however DMZ the Router to the relevent Webserver and use a software Firewall such as BlackIce to block any unsolicited traffic....I am sure it has been done in the US - Just a shame there are no "Published" Co-ordinates for it. lol.