Frs Suggestions Please

1.5k · January 29, 2004

Just wondering if some out there can provide input on their idea of a good FRS unit? I am more concerned with quality than price; that said, I don't want it to cost more than my house, but I don't mind paying a fair price. I have looked at the usual Motorola/Cobra offerings in the $25.00 - $100.00 range, and really haven't seen anything that looks good to me. Thanks!

5.9k · January 29, 2004

Well they're pricy, but the Motorola Talkabout Distance DPS is what I use. I got a pair for $80 each. You're unlikely to find them that low but if you do then grab a couple. They have no LCD display and they a little big, but they push 2 watts and are commercial quality radios. Seven FRS and three GMRS channels are somewhat of a handicap.

This pic shows the setup, clipped to the sun visor with the outboard speaker/mike.

January 29, 2004

If price is not a major issue look over the new Garmin Rino 130.

http://www.garmin.com/products/rino130/

January 29, 2004

I have heard good things about the ICOM FRS and GMRS radios.

Their FRS Radio has probably the best antenna of any FRS radio around, which should help with range.

Their GMRS radio looks to be quite rugged. Bear in mind that GMRS requires a license.

I have Cobra radios that work great and seem to be lasting forever.

January 29, 2004

I own and use 6 Motorola Talkabout T5710’s. These are FRS/GMRS 15 channels are 1 watt and 7 are .5 watt. I have used them for about a year now, and have had no problems with them. Michelle and I use them on the Mountain Bikes, geocaching, Houston Livestock Show and Rodeo, Drum Corps Shows, and other events that I have been involved with.

I found them at Sam’s Wholesale Club as a ‘bundle” that included 2 radios, rechargeable battery packs, charger, and ear buds. One thing I like about them is when the rechargeable packs go out, I can use AAA batteries until I can recharge the packs. Sam’s and Costco have had the bundles for under $50.00.

as Criminal stated, your "best" sending and receiving will come from a 2 watt radio. But in hilly terain, any signall will be much shorter.

If cost is no issue, I think Motorola finally released their portable repeater system

1.4k · January 29, 2004

Just wondering if some out there can provide input on their idea of a good FRS unit?

While I don't have any, I don't think Motorola ever (or hardly ever) put their name on a bad model. If you decide to go the FRS/GMRS route, look for one that will do 2W on GMRS. Although 1W is twice the power of 0.5W FRS, that's not much of a signal increase.

Avoid rechargeable batteries unless you expect to use your unit frequently enough that battery consumption will become an issue. I don't have a feel for NiMH, but the old NiCads really didn't like sitting around. They wanted to work and would quietly die if left unchallenged in a low usage/low drain application.

January 29, 2004

I own and use 6 Motorola Talkabout T5710’s. These are FRS/GMRS 15 channels are 1 watt and 7 are .5 watt. I have used them for about a year now, and have had no problems with them. Michelle and I use them on the Mountain Bikes, geocaching, Houston Livestock Show and Rodeo, Drum Corps Shows, and other events that I have been involved with.

I found them at Sam’s Wholesale Club as a ‘bundle” that included 2 radios, rechargeable battery packs, charger, and ear buds. One thing I like about them is when the rechargeable packs go out, I can use AAA batteries until I can recharge the packs. Sam’s and Costco have had the bundles for under $50.00.

as Criminal stated, your "best" sending and receiving will come from a 2 watt radio. But in hilly terain, any signall will be much shorter.

If cost is no issue, I think Motorola finally released their portable repeater system

These are a good choice. I got the same from sam's club, they were $67.00 and also have a weather channel. On a side note, has anyone got the GMRS license?

5.9k · January 29, 2004

Forgot to mention, the Distance DPS radio has a removable antenna. If the geocachers in my area start monitoring FRS02 I'll get a rooftop antenna for the car.

The antenna is the key if you really want distance.

1.4k · January 29, 2004

The antenna is the key if you really want distance.

True, a *real* GMRS unit will have a removeable antenna. FRS units will not.

RadioShack used to have a neat unit for car use. (I can't find it on the website right now.) It was a mag mount for placing on top of the car with a remote to operate the radio from inside. Still a FRS but I bet it would match if not out perform any FRS/GMRS portable used in the car.

January 29, 2004

This topic was also recently discussed here.

9.5k · January 30, 2004

I recently picked up a Motorola T7200 with 2 watt GMRS / 1 watt FRS and I'm quite happy with it for standard FRS range. On the Olympia Cache Machine while on Hwy 8, the lunch meeting spot was about a beeline mile from the highway when I first made contact with someone and drove to about 2 miles away before I pulled over to finish the conversation. The signal was quite clear. I couldn't do that with a 0.5 watt FRS a couple years back. Heck... I was lucky to get 1/4 mile then. So 1/2 watt upgrade is significant enough for most usage. I'm with the others to go with a 2 watt GMRS / 1 watt FRS.

5.9k · January 30, 2004

If you have the money and want more punch, Pryme Radio makes a 4.5 watt all channel GMRS that ca nbe used to hit the repeaters, giving you all over town coverage. But you're looking at around $200 each. Google them if you're interested.

1.4k · January 30, 2004

I recently picked up a Motorola T7200 with 2 watt GMRS / 1 watt FRS

FRS is 0.5W maximum. If it's more then that, it's not FRS. Page 33 of the manual confirms this. I don't see any power settings, so it seems to be 2.0W or 0.5W depending on the channel. That could be a bit of a bummer since it would be nice to save the batteries and run 0.5W on channels 1-7 if that's all you need.

5.9k · January 30, 2004

I recently picked up a Motorola T7200 with 2 watt GMRS / 1 watt FRS

FRS is 0.5W maximum. If it's more then that, it's not FRS. Page 33 of the manual confirms this. I don't see any power settings, so it seems to be 2.0W or 0.5W depending on the channel. That could be a bit of a bummer since it would be nice to save the batteries and run 0.5W on channels 1-7 if that's all you need.

The Talkabout Distance puts out two watts on all available channels.

2.3k · January 30, 2004

I have a question... maybe this topic will get it answered, maybe it'll need a new post... we'll see!

I'd like to get a Rino -- will it work with the other FRS radios on the market? In other words, can you talk to other FRS radios with a Rino?

January 30, 2004

I have a question... maybe this topic will get it answered, maybe it'll need a new post... we'll see!

I'd like to get a Rino -- will it work with the other FRS radios on the market? In other words, can you talk to other FRS radios with a Rino?

Yes.

And (unrelated to your question) I found this FRS & GMRS FAQ that may be helpful to those in the market for radios.

January 30, 2004

I have a question... maybe this topic will get it answered, maybe it'll need a new post... we'll see!

I'd like to get a Rino -- will it work with the other FRS radios on the market? In other words, can you talk to other FRS radios with a Rino?

Yes you can. Most “major” FRS/GMRS radio manufacturers use the same set of FCC approved frequencies 467.???? And 462.????. I am not sure how this works when using the “privacy codes”, these are sub channels. You can go to the Garmin site and view the users manual for the rhinos. On page 74, of the Rhino 110 users guide, they have a list of the frequencies. I compared them to my Motorola T5710 frequencies.

Hope this helps you out.

9.5k · January 30, 2004

I recently picked up a Motorola T7200 with 2 watt GMRS / 1 watt FRS

FRS is 0.5W maximum. If it's more then that, it's not FRS. Page 33 of the manual confirms this. I don't see any power settings, so it seems to be 2.0W or 0.5W depending on the channel. That could be a bit of a bummer since it would be nice to save the batteries and run 0.5W on channels 1-7 if that's all you need.

You're right. My bad.

9.5k · January 30, 2004

I have a question... maybe this topic will get it answered, maybe it'll need a new post... we'll see!

I'd like to get a Rino -- will it work with the other FRS radios on the market? In other words, can you talk to other FRS radios with a Rino?

Yes you can. Most “major” FRS/GMRS radio manufacturers use the same set of FCC approved frequencies 467.???? And 462.????. I am not sure how this works when using the “privacy codes”, these are sub channels. You can go to the Garmin site and view the users manual for the rhinos. On page 74, of the Rhino 110 users guide, they have a list of the frequencies. I compared them to my Motorola T5710 frequencies.

Hope this helps you out.

The privacy codes can vary in frequency from manufacturer to manufacturer. When I had Southwestern Bell FRS radios, the hunt for a workable frequency between mine and another's Motorola had to take place before we could agree to use them.

5.9k · January 30, 2004

The freqs v channels are always going to be the same, just like CB radio. (CB CH 40 will always be 27.405 MHz, (or 27,405,000 cycles per second))

What does vary widely though, is the privacy tones. There is no agreement among manufacturers for these sub audible tones. For geocachers this means little, as we’ve decided on FRS02 with no tone selected.

There really isn’t any privacy with the tones despite the name. With your radio set on “no tone” (or tone code zero) you will hear all traffic on that channel, while Dick and Jane playing in their back yard, with FRS02 tone code 38, will only hear traffic from radios set with that same combination. Even if you are talking, it will not break their squelch, so they won’t hear you. (Well, unless they are depressing the “monitor” button on their radio at the same time as you’re transmitting.)

There are generally 38 sub audible tones. The radio can “hear” the tone (you can’t) and will open the squelch on your radio allowing the signal to reach the speaker. This feature prevents you from hearing transmissions from outside the talk group. (Two or more users that have agreed to use the same tone code) That’s what “open the squelch" really means, allowing the received signal to reach the speaker so you can hear it. Regardless of the tone you set, the radio is processing all the signals it receives on the selected frequency. Therein is the problem with “privacy tones”; when you mash down the talk button, you have no idea if there is already a transmission in progress on the channel. This is why the radio manufacturer suggests that you depress the monitor button before transmitting, to check to make sure the channel is clear.

If you were to be on a group cache hunt, you and the others on FRS02 could select a tone code if all radios in the group have compatible codes. (There is a workaround but you’d all have to bring your spec sheets with the tone frequencies and compare.) The advantage of doing this is to prevent you from being interrupted by unrelated transmissions from people outside your group.

Often, especially with low power FRS radios, you will hear a short squelch break with some unintelligible words. You assume it was a transmission meant for you and you ask them to repeat, they say “what?” and this wastes huge chunks of time. Flight Engineers have a saying, “You have to be smarter than what you’re working with.” Sometimes the person transmitting (kids are notorious for this) will begin speaking at the same time they mash the talk button. This results in only the last couple words being transmitted. The proper method is to mash the button, wait a second, and then start talking.

There is a disadvantage to using the tones on a group hunt. If a cacher from outside your group were to happen along with their FRS turned on to the standard geocaching channel, FRS02, they would be able to monitor your group’s transmissions. They might try to call you but your squelch will not open. To them, it will sound like your group is ignoring him/her. They could, however, use the trial and error method by cycling though all 38 tone codes until they picked the right one. Before geocaching, my family used FRS07 tone 37. (7-37, like the plane, easy to remember) Now, all my radios are on FRS02 no code unless I’m engaged in something not related to geocaching.

EDIT: Typos

Edited January 30, 2004 by Criminal

1.4k · January 30, 2004

The Talkabout Distance puts out two watts on all available channels.

The operative word being "available". You won't find a radio that will transmit with more then 0.5W on FRS 8-14. It also won't have a removable antenna if it can transmit on FRS channels 8-14. Again, FRS rules. (Ignoring for the moment commercial UHF radios that may have been custom programed by a radio dealer. Even if you did find one, it wouldn't be legal to use in normal situations.)

FRS channels 1-7 are shared with GMRS, so you can operate in the GMRS service on those frequencies.

5.9k · January 30, 2004

The Talkabout Distance puts out two watts on all available channels.

The operative word being "available". You won't find a radio that will transmit with more then 0.5W on FRS 8-14. It also won't have a removable antenna if it can transmit on FRS channels 8-14. Again, FRS rules. (Ignoring for the moment commercial UHF radios that may have been custom programed by a radio dealer. Even if you did find one, it wouldn't be legal to use in normal situations.)

FRS channels 1-7 are shared with GMRS, so you can operate in the GMRS service on those frequencies.

You are correct. The Distance series has only ten channels, FRS 1 - 7 and GMRS A - C.

After doing some googling last night I see these have been discontinued. Although they can be found, they are very expensive. I bought two and my friend Hormone Dave bought two, for $80 each. He sold his on Ebay after using them to cross the country with his wife in two cars. I think I should have bought them off him.

EDIT: dadgum I can't type today!

Edited January 30, 2004 by Criminal

1.4k · January 30, 2004

There are generally 38 sub audible tones. The radio can “hear” the tone (you can’t) ...

Nit pick: It depends on the radio. Most of the tones are in fact within the range of human hearing, so it depends on if the radio filters out those frequencies. If it doesn't filter it, you'll hear a low "hum".

They could, however, use the trial and error method by cycling though all 38 tone codes until they picked the right one.

Some units can scan for the tone that's being used.

There's also a another disadvantage to CTCSS: It takes the receiving unit a split second to decide if the transmission contains the right tone. This can add to the problem of clipped transmission mentioned.

Then there's DCS (Digital Coded Squelch) but off hand I don't know of any FRS units that use that.

January 30, 2004

I have a question... maybe this topic will get it answered, maybe it'll need a new post... we'll see!

I'd like to get a Rino -- will it work with the other FRS radios on the market? In other words, can you talk to other FRS radios with a Rino?

JoeFrog, I can tell you from experience that the RINOs use the same privacy codes as the Motorolas. The codes were also the same in the Cobra frs/gmrs unit that I bought, but then returned in exchange for Motorolas. There was a website somewhere that listed the various code sequences for cross-referencing.....let me see...nope, can't find it anymore.

-ST

January 30, 2004

In regards to "real" privacy, BTW........

The Motorola T6250s that I have do have a voice scrambling feature that reduces, but doesn't eliminate, the possibility of eavesdroping. So does the RINO 120. I have no idea whether these two are compatable, but at least you can see that the feature is available in the market.

-ST

5.9k · February 9, 2004

Well, it seems that if you had a Talkabout Distance DPS and ordered Motorola part number HAE9208A mag-mount antenna kit for $42.67, you would really add some range to your 2watt FRS signal.

Not that it would be legal or anything.... :lol:

February 10, 2004

I can't imagine that simply adding an antenna of any kind would make a radio illigal. A good antenna is your only hope to getting more 'range'.

February 10, 2004

I can't imagine that simply adding an antenna of any kind would make a radio illigal. A good antenna is your only hope to getting more 'range'.

Quote from FCC:

If you operate a radio that has been approved exclusively under the rules that apply to FRS, you are not required to have a license. FRS radios have a maximum power of ½ watt (500 milliwatt) effective radiated power and integral (non-detachable) antennas.

FRS radios can not legally have an external (detachable) antenna.

Edited February 10, 2004 by gbod

5.9k · February 10, 2004

My understanding of this is that I am legal with two watts and the external antenna as long as I'm operating on the FRS GMRS shared frequencies (FRS channels 1 thru 7) or GMRS exclusive frequencies, and have a current license. FRS 8-14 are FRS only and limited to one half watt and fixed antenna.

February 10, 2004

My understanding of this is that I am legal with two watts and the external antenna as long as I'm operating on the FRS GMRS shared frequencies (FRS channels 1 thru 7) or GMRS exclusive frequencies, and have a current license. FRS 8-14 are FRS only and limited to one half watt and fixed antenna.

Ah yes.. you are correct... thanks for pointing that out.

Quote from FCC:

If you operate a radio under the rules that apply to GMRS, you must have a GMRS license. GMRS radios generally transmit at higher power levels (1 to 5 watts is typical) and may have detachable antennas.

I guess I should have clarified that FRS exclusive radios are not allowed to have power or antennae modifications.

Edited February 10, 2004 by gbod

1.4k · February 10, 2004

Well, it seems that if you had a Talkabout Distance DPS and ordered Motorola part number HAE9208A mag-mount antenna kit for $42.67, you would really add some range to your 2watt FRS signal.

Not that it would be legal or anything....

2W FRS is illegal from the start. 2W is legal in GMRS, and as far as I know you can add an antenna and still be legal in GMRS. This would include the shared channels of FRS, but even then you'd still be considered GMRS and would need the license.

You last post is correct, I'm just disputing/correcting the quote back above.

1.4k · February 10, 2004

I guess I should have clarified that FRS exclusive radios are not allowed to have power or antennae modifications.

No, if a radio is to operate under FRS at all it can not have a removable antenna. If you find a radio with removable antenna, it would be a GMRS-only unit. But since GMRS shares the first 7 channels with FRS, you can legally operate on those frequencies if you have the license.

5.9k · February 11, 2004

I guess I should have clarified that FRS exclusive radios are not allowed to have power or antennae modifications.

No, if a radio is to operate under FRS at all it can not have a removable antenna. If you find a radio with removable antenna, it would be a GMRS-only unit. But since GMRS shares the first 7 channels with FRS, you can legally operate on those frequencies if you have the license.

Well, the Distance DPS operates on FRS 01 thru 07, and has a removable antenna. Do you think that's why they discontinued it?

1.4k · February 11, 2004

Well, the Distance DPS operates on FRS 01 thru 07, and has a removable antenna. Do you think that's why they discontinued it?

It does not run under the FRS rules. It runs under the GMRS rules. That's why it doesn't run on FRS 8-14. When it runs on FRS 1-7, it's still considered GMRS. It's just that GMRS and FRS share those frequencies.

Frs Suggestions Please

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