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mkyral

Missing some ponds on geocaching map layer

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Hi,

I'm not sure, where to report, but there are missing some ponds on map, e.g.: the biggest Czech pond Rožmberk. It is issue on the gc map layer. Ponds are visible on others layers, like openstreetmap.org. I've checked tags in OSM, but it seems, that there is nothing wrong.

https://www.geocaching.com/map/default.aspx?lat=49.048217&lng=14.7638#?ll=49.03249,14.76086&z=14

https://www.geocaching.com/map/default.aspx?lat=49.048217&lng=14.7638#?ll=49.03249,14.76086&z=14

Could you check please?

Thanks

gc_map.png

osm.png

Edited by mkyral
fix typo
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Hi Mkyral.

I think all you need to do is wait.  That map is based on OSM, but - in spite of good intentions - hasn't been updated since it was first introduced about a year and a half ago. I think Groundspeak found updating more of a challenge than expected.


My guess is that those lakes were added more recently to OSM.


EDIT: yeah, had a peek; they look recent. And what an improvement to the map in just a year and a half in that area! Very impressive. Back then, heck, the roads didn't even connect.


I'm patiently waiting too, but since I use an app with up-to-date OSM, I don't mind.

Edited by Viajero Perdido

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I'm using the standard OSM.org map as well. But my friend asked me, if I can fix it. And I can't, as there is nothing to fix in OSM directly. I hoped, there is some normal refresh interval. OSM data are changing a lot. So no refresh interval is really bad news.

Marián

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Hello, @Groundspeak

After half of year, map still not updated :-( Are there plans to do it?

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If it's that important to you and you don't want to wait for Groundspeak to update  their maps then got could install GME, from here http://geo.inge.org.uk/gme.htm

It gives you many more map choices, and it uses the OSM source data so always displays the latest OSM maps.

 

 

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Fixes like that only help those of us determined enough to find the good maps.  I'd love to see up-to-date maps for everybody.

There's something gratifying about seeing your newly-mapped trail, the one that goes right past the cache and the one you added to OSM the day after you found the cache (and trail), show up right on the cache page for everybody to see.  In happier times that actually happened.

The Groundspeak maps are almost two years out of date now.  That's eternity in map time.

Almost two years ago I mapped the trail going past this cache, for example.  And countless others since then.

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We've been limited on updates due to issues with our tile provider. However, those have been resolved and are testing on our staging site. A release to production should occur soon.

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I had a look around the new maps on the staging site.  I like what I see.  Job well done!

Before everybody goes looking...  Those new maps aren't "live" just yet.  But in a quick bit of unofficial beta testing, I can find no fault with them, and much to like.  VP Seal of Approval.

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The plans I've heard talked about indicated a monthly update schedule, but the person I can check with to confirm is out today.

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37 minutes ago, Moun10Bike said:

The plans I've heard talked about indicated a monthly update schedule, but the person I can check with to confirm is out today.

I think monthly is a good balance. It doesn't put as much of a burden on the HQ staff or resources as if it was weekly or daily, but is still often enough that people won't have to wait too long to see changes from the OSM database.

I'll have to take a look at the rendering in the staging site. I had previously pointed out a number of possible improvements to the "Trails" style, so I'm hoping some of those have been considered.

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On ‎3‎/‎5‎/‎2018 at 3:13 PM, The A-Team said:

I'll have to take a look at the rendering in the staging site. I had previously pointed out a number of possible improvements to the "Trails" style, so I'm hoping some of those have been considered.

I've looked at the new rendering and found my original post from September 2016 with my suggestions and a follow-up suggestion, and here's what I've found.

From my list in 2016, it doesn't seem like any improvements have been made. Critical features like distinguishable trails, stairs, one-way arrows, parking, and some administrative boundaries are still missing.

On the plus side, the addition of hill-shading and contour lines will be handy.

However, there are some new issues:

  • Road naming is inconsistent. Some roads may have "Road" or "Avenue" spelled out, while others are abbreviated as "Rd." or "Ave." (even though the name is fully spelled out in the OSM database). I suspect the style is abbreviating names over a certain length, but it doesn't look good and should be consistent one way or the other.
  • highway=service roads are given undue importance and prominence. They're rendered the same as "residential" and "unclassified" roads starting at zoom 14, when they should be narrower and rendered only at higher zoom levels.
  • highway=residential and highway=unclassified roads are rendered at zoom 14, but are so incredibly thin as to be nearly invisible. At zoom 13, they aren't rendered at all, which means a loss of context in areas with lots of these roads and not as many with higher classifications.
  • Information boards (tourism=information + information=board) with names are rendered too prominently. They're now rendered starting at zoom 15, when they started at a much more reasonable zoom 17 in the old style.

There are also a couple of issues that were present in the old style, but I forgot to mention:

  • Labels are broken at tile boundaries. Using this location as an example, you can see that the labels for "Westshore Town Centre" and "Shoppers Drug Mart" are cut off. There should be a setting available in the renderer that can allow these labels to be rendered across tile boundaries.
  • Bridges on trails are rendered in something of a grey colour, which is even harder to distinguish than the yellow trails. Similarly, tunnels are grey and thinner, making them even harder to see. The new style improves bridges slightly by making them a bit wider than previously, but tunnels haven't been changed. Both of these could be greatly improved by the use of black and dashed casings, respectively, like they are in the Standard OSM style, both on trails and roads.

I'll keep an eye out for any other suggestions I can make, but addressing the ones from my earlier posts and the ones I've listed here would allow the map to take a huge leap forward.

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If Groundspeak is using a 3rd-party tile provider (MapBox?), there maybe limited scope to customize; it may be one of the off-the-shelf offerings.  And I understand there may be tradeoffs; you can't jam everything onto a map, so someone gets to choose which things to prioritize.

That said, I'll mention that parking and access=no areas/roads would be very useful in this game, more contrast for trails as already mentioned likewise, and it strikes me as odd that landcover disappears in protected areas.  The protected area renders as all green and overrides the rest, so any distinction between forest/meadow disappears, as do any wetlands.  For example, here; I made sure to map that swamp.  (Good luck reaching my event, heh heh...)

220px-Sievi_Boots_%282%29.jpg

But I looove the contour lines and shading, and the prospect of monthly updates.

Edited by Viajero Perdido

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On 3. 3. 2018 at 6:38 PM, Moun10Bike said:

We've been limited on updates due to issues with our tile provider. However, those have been resolved and are testing on our staging site. A release to production should occur soon.

Great. Thanks for the info.

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On 3/3/2018 at 10:38 AM, Moun10Bike said:

We've been limited on updates due to issues with our tile provider. However, those have been resolved and are testing on our staging site. A release to production should occur soon.

Was today meant to be switchover day?  That was my guess: start of the month, possibly a new billing cycle from a map provider.

The map tiles don't seem to be working at all now.  Not on my Firefox, either on Linux or the Android tablet.  (re-EDIT: http://status.geocaching.com/ doesn't seem to know about it.)

Awkward when the start of a month coincides with a holiday.  Hope this doesn't mean people are suddenly called in.  Good luck guys!

Edited by Viajero Perdido

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What if anything do the Geocaching tiles offer over the OpenStreet tiles?

I use the OpenStreetMap German Style tiles and don't see anything on the Geocaching maps that isn't on the OpenStreetMap tiles I *do* see trails on the OSM tiles that aren't on the Geocaching - they might be new or just not included in the GC ones.

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As you might know, OSM is just a database, and various maps show it in different ways.  The "Geocaching" (or "Trails") map tiles are indeed the OSM data, but at the moment woefully out of date.  That's about to change, so I'm kind of excited about that.

Hosting huge numbers of tiles (millions I'm sure) isn't free, and a company like Groundspeak can either buy hosting from a service like MapBox or Thunderforest (purveyors of the popular OpenCycleMap), or choose to generate the tiles in-house and host them either in-house or on a simple hosting service like Amazon.  Anyway, it's either complicated or expensive, or both.  I can understand their troubles.

I don't think there's a charging mechanism for any of the three OpenStreetMap-titled choices including German Style, so I'm guessing usage is tolerated simply if it isn't "too much".   So to answer your question, the advantage (to Groundspeak) of their own style is, cachers can use as much of that style as Groundspeak can afford to pay for, without the risk of being suddenly cut off.  It happened; remember MapQuest?  I know Thunderforest has a tiered charging scheme for their styles, but I'm guessing it was deemed too expensive.  Dunno about the others.

TLDR: Geocaching map == OSM, soon to be more up-to-date.

Edited by Viajero Perdido

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I find OSM is good, but far from perfect.  If you want Great (and who doesn't?) you can get Locus Pro and have access to all manner of online maps, some of which you can download and use for offline (like when you are between mountain ranges and there's no mobile service no matter how much you wish there was.)

I've installed Locus on my little Samsung Galaxy Tab S2 8, which I've become massively dependent upon for navigation and planning.  It's what gets me there and the hand-held unit is for walking around in a 5 metre radius circle muttering to myself and tapping the device like it's defective because the cache should be right ... 

Edited by DragonsWest

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