Paper Logs inside caches

[BinaryBlues]

I'm new to Geocaching and I don’t yet fully understand the concept of the paper logs within the caches. I’ve found a cache yesterday in which the paper log was really a series of crumpled 3-inch pages. I started to unfold them all, organize chronologically, and then refold them, but I gave up halfway through. Considering the maintenance required on the paper logs contained within each cache and the “real” logs we post onto the Geocaching website where we can also add a story to the log, what is the real purpose of the paper? What do cache owners do with the paper logs once they are filled?

I’m considering added a cache of my own soon in a place that I find interesting and beautiful. Do I consider the paper log sort of like a trophy list or do Cache owners toss them anyway? Some insight would help me. Thanks.

[+Mr. 0]

The purpose of the log is for cachers to prove they were physically at the cache. As for what to do with them when they're filled up, it's really up to the cache owner. In theory the CO should audit the online logs with the logbook. Some do that and delete the "fake" finds. Some scan the logbooks and post the pictures on the cache page. Others do nothing with them and just throw them out.

Edited September 10, 2012 by Mr. 0

[+L0ne.R]

I'm new to Geocaching and I don't yet fully understand the concept of the paper logs within the caches. I've found a cache yesterday in which the paper log was really a series of crumpled 3-inch pages. I started to unfold them all, organize chronologically, and then refold them, but I gave up halfway through. Considering the maintenance required on the paper logs contained within each cache and the "real" logs we post onto the Geocaching website where we can also add a story to the log, what is the real purpose of the paper? What do cache owners do with the paper logs once they are filled?

I'm considering added a cache of my own soon in a place that I find interesting and beautiful. Do I consider the paper log sort of like a trophy list or do Cache owners toss them anyway? Some insight would help me. Thanks.

 

It's the best evidence we currently have to show that a finder found the cache.

 

Personally, my logbooks are souvenirs. I keep everyone of them (I have 4 shoeboxes full over 10+ years of hiding) and I read through them.

 

 

It's too bad when COs treat logbooks as afterthoughts, something they would rather not have to deal with. It sends the message that they don't care about the finders experience at the cache. Electronic logs are great, but there's something about sitting at the cache and putting pen to paper to write about the moment.

 

When you plant your own cache, I recommend a good size logbook to encourage people to write something. I find that about 40% of people will actually write their thoughts if provided with a nice logbook with plenty of room. The dollar store moleskin knock-offs make an excellent logbook:

 

[+kunarion]

If the spot is a great place to stop and write a story, a log book (spiral notebook or inexpensive bound journal) is good. Is yours likely to still be in place ten years from now? Lots of stories by lots of cachers might be great reading by then. I found a cache log book from a cache that had been missing in a forest for 2 years, it had scales of a shed snake skin on it, and signatures dating back to 2006 when it was placed. That's pretty cool, and I returned the book to the Cache Owner.

 

A couple of torn notebook pages gives the impression of a temporary cache. A pill bottle with its label half torn off, under a lamp post skirt in a parking lot, may not encourage lots of fun stories of adventure, so room for only initials is OK. If instead, it's a nice hike to an unexpected serene place with a park bench, maybe cachers will hang out and take time to write something.

 

Cachers expect to have a place to sign when they find the container. Whatever you use, be sure there's always space to sign, either because you swap the paper out often, or there are a lot of pages.

[+Chief301]

It's the only way to prove you were physically at the cache site. Occasionally we will get fake found logs on the online cache page. I had one awhile back where someone had created an account that week and logged caches in several states and a few foreign countries overseas within a couple of days. Sounded fishy to me so I deleted the find, but I did check for his signature next time I checked on the cache, just to make sure.

 

It's not important that you get your signature in the correct chronological order on the paper log.... If it's already all disorganized or maybe the paper is too wet to unfold it without tearing it up, just get your mark on there somewhere. If the log is in really bad shape or too full for any more signatures, post NM (needs Maintenance) log so the cache owner will know to come fix it.

[+knowltonGeo]

I found one log going back 7 years in a recent find.

 

It was really neat to see some of the entries. Some folks had a lot to say!

[+AKStafford]

I use the Rite in the Rain notebooks for the log books in my caches... They are less likely to fall apart if being signed in the rain.

[+kunarion]

I use the Rite in the Rain notebooks for the log books in my caches... They are less likely to fall apart if being signed in the rain.

Two of my caches have those. They're dry, durable, and expensive. If one of them gets trashed or stolen, I might just go with the crumpled 3-inch pages.

[BinaryBlues]

I really appreciate the responses and the insight about this topic. L0ne R, that is truly an inspiring collection you’ve got there and I will check out the Moleskin knock-off. The logs that I have found so far were crumpled bits of paper and/or crammed into a tiny container thus leaving no room for anyone to share more than a quick name and date. I live near Milwaukee and there are some choice spots on the beaches and parks along Lake Michigan I have come to explore over my years living here that I can’t wait to place a cache for people to check out. I too believe that taking some pride in each cache placed in important. I wonder if the trouble with placing decent logs within hides is simply due to the fear of stuff being muggled. I’ll probably have to find some more remote caches to uncover any quality ones.

[+niraD]

When there is room in the log (i.e., a good-sized log book rather than a log sheet or a tiny log book), I sometimes take time to write a few comments about my adventure. I do this more often for "destination" caches than for caches of convenience, and I do it more often for puzzle caches where I want to write something that would be inappropriate to include in the online log (even rot13 encrypted).

 

I've seen "log cabins" and "log houses" that others have built from old cache logs, and then turned into TBs. So that's another option for cache owners besides the options of keeping or discarding them.

[+briansnat]

I found one log going back 7 years in a recent find.

 

It was really neat to see some of the entries. Some folks had a lot to say!

 

Not long ago I retired a 10 year old cache that still had its original logbook. What is interesting is how the length of the logs have shortened over the years. In the first few years logs could take up a full page of a 3" x 5" logbook and occasionally spill onto the second page. You rarely saw less than at least a full paragraph.

 

By the mid 2000's the longest logs were usually down to a paragraph or two and many were simply a sentence or two. Starting around 2007 they were little more than a sentence and by about 2009 you largely saw nothing more than a name and date and if lucky, they added a TFTC.

 

I think a big part of the reason was that in the early years there weren't that many caches, so each cache hunt was a special experience. That find might have been your only find that day, or even that week. You'd write about the walk there, the beautiful spot, the people you were with, etc.

 

As the number of caches increased the specialness of each cache lessened and with that, so did the length of logs.

 

Today the same cache that brought glowing logs 9 years ago is just 1 of 30 on a numbers run and means little more than a +1 to the finder and the logs reflect that.

Edited September 12, 2012 by briansnat

[BinaryBlues]

Briansnat,

I have to wonder if the digital age is just taking precedence over handwriting within paper logs. Rather than think this is a discouraging thing that people are choosing to share less and less over the years on the paper logs, perhaps people are more comfortable instead writing about it on the official forums here or in their online logs where the log where the log will never get muggled or saturated with rain/mud. Ten years ago, the internet was a totally different place. People are more comfortable here than with a piece of paper in front of them.

People who post nothing on either place… you are right; it is a shame.

[+Understandblue]

I'm new to Geocaching and I don't yet fully understand the concept of the paper logs within the caches. I've found a cache yesterday in which the paper log was really a series of crumpled 3-inch pages. I started to unfold them all, organize chronologically, and then refold them, but I gave up halfway through. Considering the maintenance required on the paper logs contained within each cache and the "real" logs we post onto the Geocaching website where we can also add a story to the log, what is the real purpose of the paper? What do cache owners do with the paper logs once they are filled?

I'm considering added a cache of my own soon in a place that I find interesting and beautiful. Do I consider the paper log sort of like a trophy list or do Cache owners toss them anyway? Some insight would help me. Thanks.

 

It's the best evidence we currently have to show that a finder found the cache.

 

Personally, my logbooks are souvenirs. I keep everyone of them (I have 4 shoeboxes full over 10+ years of hiding) and I read through them.

 

 

It's too bad when COs treat logbooks as afterthoughts, something they would rather not have to deal with. It sends the message that they don't care about the finders experience at the cache. Electronic logs are great, but there's something about sitting at the cache and putting pen to paper to write about the moment.

 

When you plant your own cache, I recommend a good size logbook to encourage people to write something. I find that about 40% of people will actually write their thoughts if provided with a nice logbook with plenty of room. The dollar store moleskin knock-offs make an excellent logbook:

 

 

Oh boy - I wish I could find some of yours! I absolutely would sit down and write if I were presented with a nice journal like this. For me, signing the log is the "real" moment of fun of finding and accomplishment. I'd hate to see it go away. And I love seeing who has been there before me - little kids, cachers I keep coming behind by a day or two (I've been following in the steps of SwensonianInstitute a lot lately), and people who draw or stamp things. I especially like ones that go back several years. There's just something very fun about all that.

Edited September 12, 2012 by Understandblue

[+kwcahart]

Signing the paper log is just one of the fun things about geocaching to me. If you don't have time to sign the log you may not really like geocaching, that is part of it. I look at the logs in my owned ones to see if you have actually been there. If no signature, your smiley is taken away. Some of us like real things that are not binary, like ice cream, baseball, apple pie and cache logs.

[+dprovan]

I usually write a line or two when there's a true log in a cache, but I really have no expectation that anyone will ever read it. So it's not that I myself didn't consider the experience special enough to write a detailed log entry, it's more that we as a community -- COs as much as seekers -- no longer consider the paper log important beyond the hypothetical signature checking process.

 

And I'm find with that. I find the on-line logs much more useful, so I have no problem with people saving their comments for that. On the other hand, I don't want to discourage COs from having nice log books for seekers to write in to their hearts' content.

[+Chief301]

Kind of hard to write a nice wordy log on that tiny scroll of paper in a blinkie or bison tube....which is about 90% of what we get around here.

 

If presented with a nice full sized log book in a Regular sized cache (and the peace and privacy to do it), I'd be inclined to write a little more.

 

I do strive to write descriptive online logs, which I think is where you should really put your effort. That way everybody from the CO to past finders to future finders, can read it.

[+knowltonGeo]

It would seem that the game has evolved somewhat from it's beginnings.

 

I always find it interesting that some activities take on a life of their own apart from what the founders intended.

 

Like - people who are just interested in getting 30 caches per day. Did the founders ever imagine that would be possible? (I wonder what the most found in a day record is...)

 

Or - that log entries would get smaller and smaller?

 

Or that there would be permutations like multi-caches, puzzle caches and a host of other -cache derivatives!

 

And yeah...I'm sure the convenience of the internet has also changed the original game dramatically from what was originally conveived.

 

Not to mention the military. I am sure they are pleased as punch to find out we are using their billion dollar system to "find hidden tupperware in the woods". Thank you, Pentagon!

[BinaryBlues]

As a result of this discussion and as a newbie interested in contributing, here's an idea for an addition to the Premium Membership: How about the option to upload a read-only PDF file of scanned paper logs onto the cache page available for viewing. There could be an additional option under the “Navigation” section for those. I suppose the CO would have to choose to do this after performing maintenance on the cache when it’s time to place a new log book inside. This sort of blends and archives a potential 10-year old paper log book (which would otherwise be destined for natural degradation over time or loss due to other factors such as being filled up and replaced by CO) and the online log (easy to read, automatically sorted chronologically, includes pictures, etc).

Think of it this way. Today, if the CO removes a completed log book with all that history and juicy stories with a fresh one, those experiences are gone to any new visitors who might like to see it. Premium Member would have that additional benefit of checking out the archived paper log online for nostalgiic purposes.

[+niraD]

As a result of this discussion and as a newbie interested in contributing, here's an idea for an addition to the Premium Membership: How about the option to upload a read-only PDF file of scanned paper logs onto the cache page available for viewing. There could be an additional option under the “Navigation” section for those. I suppose the CO would have to choose to do this after performing maintenance on the cache when it’s time to place a new log book inside. This sort of blends and archives a potential 10-year old paper log book (which would otherwise be destined for natural degradation over time or loss due to other factors such as being filled up and replaced by CO) and the online log (easy to read, automatically sorted chronologically, includes pictures, etc).

Think of it this way. Today, if the CO removes a completed log book with all that history and juicy stories with a fresh one, those experiences are gone to any new visitors who might like to see it. Premium Member would have that additional benefit of checking out the archived paper log online for nostalgiic purposes.

How would this be significantly different from just uploading scans/photos of the old paper log as images? Anyone can do that now.

[+Off Grid]

I use the Rite in the Rain notebooks for the log books in my caches... They are less likely to fall apart if being signed in the rain.

Two of my caches have those. They're dry, durable, and expensive. If one of them gets trashed or stolen, I might just go with the crumpled 3-inch pages.

 

G'day mate a solution to that problem is buy the Rite in the Rain paper and make you own books (less attractive then pinching a real book)

[+Off Grid]

I found one log going back 7 years in a recent find.

 

It was really neat to see some of the entries. Some folks had a lot to say!

 

I think a big part of the reason was that in the early years there weren't that many caches, so each cache hunt was a special experience. That find might have been your only find that day, or even that week. You'd write about the walk there, the beautiful spot, the people you were with, etc.

 

Makes sense as I have been to many caches that are nothing more then the cache, no special spot or reason to come there (One here locally is under a MC Donald's garbage can!?