Dangerous cache site?

[+bananaskin]

I visited a cache site this morning, the last of a short series fairly local to me. Found it OK but it was sited within a few feet of some beehives which were very active such that I had to leg it. Even then I got stung! To be fair, the cache owners hint included a reference to beehives and although it was published 3 weeks ago, a find about 2 weeks ago suggested that the bees were not active at that time. They certaianly are now!

 

What would be the correct thing to do now? I am aware that for some people, bee stings can be quite dangerous and the first thing I did (apart from chucking the cache into the hedge from some distance away) was to email the cache owner suggesting that the cache be relocated. No response so far. I have also made a note as part of my find log that fellow cachers be aware of a bee presence. What more can one do?

 

You hear and see caches which are almost impossible to retrieve due to location (I have even paddled across a small river to retrieve a cache)but do you think these are in the same league as caches that may (in some people) be very risky indeed.

 

Fellow cachers thoughts very welcome as I don't know if I've done the right thing.

 

Thanks

 

Bananaskin

[+The_Street_Searchers]

I would stick a needs maintenance note on it.

 

A bees nest appeared next to one of my caches - about a year after publication and a fellow cacher and his family got stung a few times - I felt really bad and wouldn't want anyone else to go through that so I archived the cache straight away.

 

Log here

[+Red Duster]

Hi Bananaskin,

 

The log was a good first step, and the suggestion of a NM log would be a good back up.

 

Red Duster

Volunteer UK Reviewer for geocaching.com

UK Geocaching Information & Resources website www.follow-the-arrow.co.uk

Geocaching.com Knowledge Books

Edited May 10, 2011 by Red Duster

[+thehalibutkid]

Yeah what they said.

 

As far as worrying about people being allergic to bee stings. Well I wouldn't worry too much about them. Bee stings happen pretty often in the summer months. People who are allergic should carry an adrenalin shot with them (especially if the are participating in an outdoors activity like geocaching).

 

I would hope that the CO would put a warning on the cache page though.

[+JCTate]

thehalibutkid got it right

allergic folks know their plight.

sometimes best to walk away

after all, tis a game we play.

 

was it a wild hive which may move on?

or an apiary on someone's lawn?

messaging owner was right fine

hope owner answers you line

[+bananaskin]

Thanks for all the advice. I did log an NM as suggested. No response yet from CO.

 

Bunch of hives in (fairly) open woodland.

[team tisri]

One cache I attempted a while back had an issue with (I think) wasps, certainly some kind of flying stinging insect. From what I recall the CO posted a note on the cache page saying that he would accept a Find log if people could describe the area in adequate detail to make it clear they had been there, so they could get close enough to see the area without disturbing the bugs. Then when the bugs moved on he updated it again to say that regular requirements for Find logs were back in place.

 

I agree with what others have said - if someone is allergic to bee stings they should have provisions for themselves in case they get stung. If you go too far down the "nobody must ever be hurt, in any way, ever, while caching" where do you draw the line? I got a mosquito bite while caching yesterday so should the cache be disabled in case someone had a bad reaction to a mosquito bite?

 

If there's a large bees' nest nearby perhaps the cache might be disabled until the bees have moved on, or perhaps the CO would rather just mention the bees and let people decide for themselves whether to attempt it. It might not hurt to raise the difficulty rating, even if only to encourage people to read the cache page before attempting it (it's not unreasonable to expect a 1/1 cache to be the kind of thing you can approach easily with no pre-planning, but as the D/T ratings rise so it becomes more and more reasonable to expect something a little unusual)

Edited May 11, 2011 by team tisri

[+Cache U Nutter]

Contact the owner and get them to 'up' the grading to 5/5.

They could then contact me so that I can add it to my bookmark listing of extreme caches !

Disapointingly I'm a little outside of the area to do it myself however.......... :rolleyes:

[+Chief301]

One cache I attempted a while back had an issue with (I think) wasps, certainly some kind of flying stinging insect. From what I recall the CO posted a note on the cache page saying that he would accept a Find log if people could describe the area in adequate detail to make it clear they had been there, so they could get close enough to see the area without disturbing the bugs. [/quote}

 

How about "The place is full of %@*$! wasps!" Would that be an adequate description?

 

I agree with what others have said - if someone is allergic to bee stings they should have provisions for themselves in case they get stung.

 

True enough, those with such allergies should be prepared for it if they go out into the outdoors. But the CO stated in the hint that there were beehives. So they intentionally placed the cache in an area where bees would be a problem (as part of the challenge, I guess?). That's the part I kind of have a problem with.

[Richard P]

One cache I attempted a while back had an issue with (I think) wasps, certainly some kind of flying stinging insect. From what I recall the CO posted a note on the cache page saying that he would accept a Find log if people could describe the area in adequate detail to make it clear they had been there, so they could get close enough to see the area without disturbing the bugs. [/quote}

 

How about "The place is full of %@*$! wasps!" Would that be an adequate description?

 

I agree with what others have said - if someone is allergic to bee stings they should have provisions for themselves in case they get stung.

 

True enough, those with such allergies should be prepared for it if they go out into the outdoors. But the CO stated in the hint that there were beehives. So they intentionally placed the cache in an area where bees would be a problem (as part of the challenge, I guess?). That's the part I kind of have a problem with.

 

No i dont agree with the comments about "people who react to stings shopuld be prepared" there are people at all ages that dont know how they react to stings espicially Bee Stings as there are lots of different variants of Bees with different degrees of the affect of the sting and reaction...

 

I react to stings and all of my towns doctors will not perscribe a eppy pen to me, they dont just give them out for fun....

 

This should be ARCHIVED.....

[roger-rabbit]

One cache I attempted a while back had an issue with (I think) wasps, certainly some kind of flying stinging insect. From what I recall the CO posted a note on the cache page saying that he would accept a Find log if people could describe the area in adequate detail to make it clear they had been there, so they could get close enough to see the area without disturbing the bugs. [/quote}

 

How about "The place is full of %@*$! wasps!" Would that be an adequate description?

 

I agree with what others have said - if someone is allergic to bee stings they should have provisions for themselves in case they get stung.

 

True enough, those with such allergies should be prepared for it if they go out into the outdoors. But the CO stated in the hint that there were beehives. So they intentionally placed the cache in an area where bees would be a problem (as part of the challenge, I guess?). That's the part I kind of have a problem with.

 

No i dont agree with the comments about "people who react to stings shopuld be prepared" there are people at all ages that dont know how they react to stings espicially Bee Stings as there are lots of different variants of Bees with different degrees of the affect of the sting and reaction...

 

I react to stings and all of my towns doctors will not perscribe a eppy pen to me, they dont just give them out for fun....

 

This should be ARCHIVED.....

I thought it was a silly place to put a cache, when I found it in April although there were no bees about then. As the hives are close to the Holdingham Leasingham cycle route perhaps the owner should be made to move them. Where ever the CO moves the cache you are still going to walk past them.

[team tisri]

One cache I attempted a while back had an issue with (I think) wasps, certainly some kind of flying stinging insect. From what I recall the CO posted a note on the cache page saying that he would accept a Find log if people could describe the area in adequate detail to make it clear they had been there, so they could get close enough to see the area without disturbing the bugs. [/quote}

 

How about "The place is full of %@*$! wasps!" Would that be an adequate description?

 

I agree with what others have said - if someone is allergic to bee stings they should have provisions for themselves in case they get stung.

 

True enough, those with such allergies should be prepared for it if they go out into the outdoors. But the CO stated in the hint that there were beehives. So they intentionally placed the cache in an area where bees would be a problem (as part of the challenge, I guess?). That's the part I kind of have a problem with.

 

No i dont agree with the comments about "people who react to stings shopuld be prepared" there are people at all ages that dont know how they react to stings espicially Bee Stings as there are lots of different variants of Bees with different degrees of the affect of the sting and reaction...

 

I react to stings and all of my towns doctors will not perscribe a eppy pen to me, they dont just give them out for fun....

 

This should be ARCHIVED.....

 

The question then becomes one of just what should be allowed and at what point people are expected to take responsibility for themselves when caching. We don't expect caches to be archived because nettles grow very tall in the summer, or because there might be ticks, or mosquitoes, or mine shafts nearby.

 

A caching buddy of mine ended up on some pretty severe medication that meant he couldn't go out in the sun for three weeks because he had a suspected case of Lyme's disease after being bitten by a tick while caching. Should we archive all caches that aren't in urban areas as a precaution?

 

I fell down the side of a riverbank while attempting a cache earlier this week. I was lucky I didn't fall in the water. Should the cache be archived, or should I just accept that if I attempt a 5/5 nightcache and attempt to climb down the side of a riverbank in the dark I might misjudge my footing?

 

Where do you draw the line, beyond making sure hazards that are known at the time of placing are mentioned in the plain text of the cache page (i.e. requiring more than "watch out for angry hornets" in the hint) and expecting people to cache within their own abilities?

[+MartyBartfast]

 

This should be ARCHIVED.....

 

Can't agree with that, as long as the hives are noted on the cache page I can't see the problem. Personally I'm allergic to being hit by fast moving cars, but I wouldn't expect every roadside cache & dash to be archived because of it, I expect to take responsibility for my own safety when caching.

[Richard P]

 

This should be ARCHIVED.....

 

Can't agree with that, as long as the hives are noted on the cache page I can't see the problem. Personally I'm allergic to being hit by fast moving cars, but I wouldn't expect every roadside cache & dash to be archived because of it, I expect to take responsibility for my own safety when caching.

 

And is it listed on the Cache Page...???....And you cant really compare a roadside cache which you can easily see that it is on a road from the route/map/co-ords but you cant with Bee hives....can you..??..

Edited May 12, 2011 by Richard P

[Richard P]

 

The question then becomes one of just what should be allowed and at what point people are expected to take responsibility for themselves when caching. We don't expect caches to be archived because nettles grow very tall in the summer, or because there might be ticks, or mosquitoes, or mine shafts nearby.

 

A caching buddy of mine ended up on some pretty severe medication that meant he couldn't go out in the sun for three weeks because he had a suspected case of Lyme's disease after being bitten by a tick while caching. Should we archive all caches that aren't in urban areas as a precaution?

 

I fell down the side of a riverbank while attempting a cache earlier this week. I was lucky I didn't fall in the water. Should the cache be archived, or should I just accept that if I attempt a 5/5 nightcache and attempt to climb down the side of a riverbank in the dark I might misjudge my footing?

 

Where do you draw the line, beyond making sure hazards that are known at the time of placing are mentioned in the plain text of the cache page (i.e. requiring more than "watch out for angry hornets" in the hint) and expecting people to cache within their own abilities?

I agree with most of what you have said but the difference is with the Tick incedence is you cant see them you dont know they are there and your friend was unlucky but Bee Hives which have been placed there purposly in my opinion is a different matter....but hey ho

Edited May 12, 2011 by Richard P

[+Amberel]

One cache I attempted a while back had an issue with (I think) wasps, certainly some kind of flying stinging insect. From what I recall the CO posted a note on the cache page saying that he would accept a Find log if people could describe the area in adequate detail to make it clear they had been there, so they could get close enough to see the area without disturbing the bugs. Then when the bugs moved on he updated it again to say that regular requirements for Find logs were back in place.

Just to clarify that, as I was the cache owner concerned, there were a number of factors which made that course of action, in my view, acceptable.

 

The first was that it was a puzzle cache, so it is almost certain the cache page with the warning would have been read before the visit. As well as the warning I described exactly where the nest was, and that it was possible to reach the cache without disturbing the wasps, as I had done myself on 3 or 4 occasions - if you didn't disturb the nest, the wasps ignored you. And I would accept the description/photo as an alternative to the log for that period.

 

The second was that due to the nature of the puzzle there really was no possible alternative location.

 

I'm just hoping they don't come back this year .

 

Rgds, Andy

[+MartyBartfast]

 

And is it listed on the Cache Page...???....And you cant really compare a roadside cache which you can easily see that it is on a road from the route/map/co-ords but you cant with Bee hives....can you..??..

 

No, but bees (and wasps and hornets and ticks and bulls and horses and adders and...) live in the countryside, if you venture out into the countryside you should be expect to come across such nasties and take responsibility for your own safety.

 

Perhaps my car analogy was a bit flippant, so let me comare the orignal cache with one which is on a path which passes throught a field of cows, would you have all those archived too? after all you can't see from a map that there are likely to be cows in the field (and yes people are regularly injured and even sometimes killed by cattle as a search past posts in this forum will confirm).