A cache that you can't take anything from?

[+Ecylram]

It has the same value as your diamonds or a cherished knick knack. Who don't understand that when you tell a young child that they have to put back the one item they focused on it's like, well, taking candy from a baby. Grabbing a piece of 8 from a treasure hunter; who just unearthed it. Seeing Mickey Mouse and not being allowed to say hello. It’s why I would never take my son without a trade item to leave. (and now that I know better a few items to slip in a large cache that has none before he sees that,) I still get the magic that some of you forgot.

 

Sometimes its painful to be a parent. I wasn't caching when my daughter was young but in many ways this is no different than taking her to the grocery store. Kids want "EVERYTHING" and sometimes they make a scene in an attempt to get their way. It isn't always feasible or reasonable to give in to every childish whim.

 

There are a lot of lessons our kids can get from caching:

 

Doing the right thing, even when nobody is looking.

Wants are not needs.

Enjoy the journey, not just the destination.

We can't have everything.

If we want something, we need to do something to get it.

There's a lot of mystery out there to explore.

How to handle disappointment.

Responsibility - if you want to trade, then remember to bring a trade item.

Ownership - learning what is and isn't ours.

Etc.

 

A kid who grows up learning these things will be better prepared for life and caching can be one tool in that learning process.

 

Sometimes the most loving thing we can do is say "no".

[Andronicus]

... I often add value for unique items when I trade for them and as someone pointed out it looks like the OP has a record of trading up. I think many people with kids do because they realize that to children the items truly are treasure. A mctoy, an eraser, a bouncy ball they become something wondrous when a child discovers them hidden in a box set out just for them to find. I feel sorry for those of you who don't get that. Who can't seem to comprehend that for a short time that is their prized possession. It has the same value as your diamonds or a cherished knick knack. Who don't understand that when you tell a young child that they have to put back the one item they focused on it's like, well, taking candy from a baby. Grabbing a piece of 8 from a treasure hunter; who just unearthed it. Seeing Mickey Mouse and not being allowed to say hello. It’s why I would never take my son without a trade item to leave. (and now that I know better a few items to slip in a large cache that has none before he sees that,) I still get the magic that some of you forgot.

 

I hope that the responses given here haven’t driven someone who just wanted answers away from the boards. But I fear they have. Over what? .

WOW! I have a totaly different parenting style than you! I am going to leave it at that because I would likely get in trouble if I say what I want to say in reply to that statment.

[+thedeadpirate]

The Co is new at hiding, you are relatively new at caching. I too had once double-found a cache and was corrected (?) for it. Happy that the CO corrected me, we are now good friends.

 

From the OP, it does look like you took but failed to trade -- as seen often in the forums, it is usually a partial story that we are provided with. You now say that you did trade, I am sure it was just an oversight, but you can now see how postings are read.

 

I think the CO has made a **mistake** by putting such things out in a "view only" cache. He/she is gonna learn from that.

 

I think too, that you are overplaying the "I deserve this because" card also! You deserve only to sign a virgin logbook as an FTF prize (and the right to claim that FTF), nothing more as there seems to be no denoted FTF prize in the cache.

 

Whether you return the items or not is your choice -- I am not even going to state what I would do, it doesn't matter. I do think however, that you should not let your kids "rule" the way you play the game.

I think you should explain to your kids what the intentions of the cache was (a non-trade cache). Explain it to them. Should they decide they want to keep them (as you so eloquently stated that they "so rightfully fought over... ???"), that is their choice, but you also have a choice to make. Just what is it that you want them to learn? You're the parent, BTW! In other words, NO you should not have the CO tell your kids they have to put the stuff back. If anyone does tell them such, that is YOUR responsibility!

 

Lastly, "attacking" a cache w/o reading the page for whatever information may/may not be there IMO, is bad, bad and bad. Reading first avoids 'problems' as this, as well as many other possibles.

 

In your support, I do think you should do what you feel is best. Nobody here should dictate anything to you.

You came here, asking for suggestions. That is what you have gotten.

I still think this is the best response.

[+Chokecherry]

... I often add value for unique items when I trade for them and as someone pointed out it looks like the OP has a record of trading up. I think many people with kids do because they realize that to children the items truly are treasure. A mctoy, an eraser, a bouncy ball they become something wondrous when a child discovers them hidden in a box set out just for them to find. I feel sorry for those of you who don't get that. Who can't seem to comprehend that for a short time that is their prized possession. It has the same value as your diamonds or a cherished knick knack. Who don't understand that when you tell a young child that they have to put back the one item they focused on it's like, well, taking candy from a baby. Grabbing a piece of 8 from a treasure hunter; who just unearthed it. Seeing Mickey Mouse and not being allowed to say hello. It’s why I would never take my son without a trade item to leave. (and now that I know better a few items to slip in a large cache that has none before he sees that,) I still get the magic that some of you forgot.

 

I hope that the responses given here haven’t driven someone who just wanted answers away from the boards. But I fear they have. Over what? .

WOW! I have a totaly different parenting style than you! I am going to leave it at that because I would likely get in trouble if I say what I want to say in reply to that statment.

 

If the object wasn't theirs to take then I would likely have the child put it back. But really from the get go when my children started "rightfully" fighting for said object no child of mine would be leaving a cache with any toy after that kind of behavior. It would have been a non-issue in my house.

[+BlueDeuce]

 

This thing about kids and how they should be allowed to do whatever they want regardless of the CO's wishes reminds me of a Travel Bug I sent to the Arctic Circle. On its way back it got stuck in Oregon. After a few months I wrote and asked the guy to turn it loose. He replied that his dog liked it for a chew toy so he was keeping it!

 

That would piss me off so much if that happened to me.

 

Yeah, me too. At least I would know that it was taken out of the game and could re-release it, instead of wishful thinking that after saving the children from the burning bus the cacher was going to wake from his coma and move my bug.

[+BlueDeuce]

The Co is new at hiding, you are relatively new at caching. I too had once double-found a cache and was corrected (?) for it. Happy that the CO corrected me, we are now good friends.

 

From the OP, it does look like you took but failed to trade -- as seen often in the forums, it is usually a partial story that we are provided with. You now say that you did trade, I am sure it was just an oversight, but you can now see how postings are read.

 

I think the CO has made a **mistake** by putting such things out in a "view only" cache. He/she is gonna learn from that.

 

I think too, that you are overplaying the "I deserve this because" card also! You deserve only to sign a virgin logbook as an FTF prize (and the right to claim that FTF), nothing more as there seems to be no denoted FTF prize in the cache.

 

Whether you return the items or not is your choice -- I am not even going to state what I would do, it doesn't matter. I do think however, that you should not let your kids "rule" the way you play the game.

I think you should explain to your kids what the intentions of the cache was (a non-trade cache). Explain it to them. Should they decide they want to keep them (as you so eloquently stated that they "so rightfully fought over... ???"), that is their choice, but you also have a choice to make. Just what is it that you want them to learn? You're the parent, BTW! In other words, NO you should not have the CO tell your kids they have to put the stuff back. If anyone does tell them such, that is YOUR responsibility!

 

Lastly, "attacking" a cache w/o reading the page for whatever information may/may not be there IMO, is bad, bad and bad. Reading first avoids 'problems' as this, as well as many other possibles.

 

In your support, I do think you should do what you feel is best. Nobody here should dictate anything to you.

You came here, asking for suggestions. That is what you have gotten.

I still think this is the best response.

 

 

yep

[Clan Riffster]

If you place something in a cache, it's probably gone forever.

True dat! Everything I leave in my caches is written off the moment I mark the coords and walk away.

Although, in the cache owner's defense, they never even hinted at people not taking stuff. What they did, (naively), was ask "Please do not remove the items unless you trade similar Revolutionary War artifacts/items". I'm betting the cache owner is someone like myself, who reads every cache page, and assumes, unlike myself, that other cachers do the same thing.

[+thedeadpirate]

If you place something in a cache, it's probably gone forever.

True dat! Everything I leave in my caches is written off the moment I mark the coords and walk away.

Although, in the cache owner's defense, they never even hinted at people not taking stuff. What they did, (naively), was ask "Please do not remove the items unless you trade similar Revolutionary War artifacts/items". I'm betting the cache owner is someone like myself, who reads every cache page, and assumes, unlike myself, that other cachers do the same thing.

 

He's updated the listing. I just deleted my note since it now looks very clear what his intentions are.

[+sbell111]

There are two problems with this situation.

 

First, the cache owner did a poor job of letting people know about his trading requirement. He could have listed the cache as a mystery cache, bolded the requirement, and left a note in the cache box. He did none of these.

 

Second, people in this thread drastically overreacted. It is just insane that some actually called the OP a thief because she did not follow the requested theme with her trade (not to mention those posters that took off on the incorrect assumption that she did not trade at all.) It is shameful how some of you chose to behave.

[+niraD]

First, the cache owner did a poor job of letting people know about his trading requirement. He could have listed the cache as a mystery cache, bolded the requirement, and left a note in the cache box. He did none of these.

ALRs aren't listed as mystery caches any longer. They are no longer requirements, they are now merely requests, and the cache is listed as whatever type it would normally be without the ALR.

 

I think the most important thing the CO could have done would have been to label the artifacts, so those who missed the trading request on the cache page would understand his intent. Also, that would make it clear which items were for display only, and which items were trade items. (Even if the CO didn't stock the cache with trade items, someone else may come along and leave a trade item in the cache anyway.)

[+thedeadpirate]

ALRs aren't listed as mystery caches any longer. They are no longer requirements, they are now merely requests, and the cache is listed as whatever type it would normally be without the ALR.

I think you're missing the point of making it unknown. Sbell, as well as I and a few others, suggested this because it forces the finder to actually read the listing before getting the coordinates to the cache.

[+Bear and Ragged]

ALRs aren't listed as mystery caches any longer. They are no longer requirements, they are now merely requests, and the cache is listed as whatever type it would normally be without the ALR.

I think you're missing the point of making it unknown. Sbell, as well as I and a few others, suggested this because it forces the finder to actually read the listing before getting the coordinates to the cache.

The cache is new, so isn't loaded onto a Geomate.

BUT.

It does fit the criteria to be loaded on a Geomate. (So could well be in the near future)

 

Geomates DO NOT have any cache descriptions...

[+thedeadpirate]

ALRs aren't listed as mystery caches any longer. They are no longer requirements, they are now merely requests, and the cache is listed as whatever type it would normally be without the ALR.

I think you're missing the point of making it unknown. Sbell, as well as I and a few others, suggested this because it forces the finder to actually read the listing before getting the coordinates to the cache.

The cache is new, so isn't loaded onto a Geomate.

BUT.

It does fit the criteria to be loaded on a Geomate. (So could well be in the near future)

 

Geomates DO NOT have any cache descriptions...

 

I'm not sure what point you are trying to make.

 

If you're saying that even if it's an unknown that Geomate will still load it without the description, then that is kind of the point.

 

The Geomate might load the coordinates. But if it was made into an unknown, then he could put bogus coords for the listing and put the real coords along with the special request in the description.

 

If someone loaded a bunch of coords, they would not be able to find the cache because it wouldn't be at the coords listed. They would HAVE to read the cache page to get the real coords.

 

Of course, the simplest and probably best solution is to put the special items in a bag in the cache with a note explaining what they were and how the CO wanted them to be treated.

[+Bear and Ragged]

As a Traditional, the co-ords are in Geomate.

As an Unknown/Puzzle it wouldn't be.

 

If the co-ords make it in to a Geomate, it's open to all finders with Geomates, with no description.

Who all believe in "Take something, leave something"

[+Ecylram]

...

Second, people in this thread drastically overreacted. It is just insane that some actually called the OP a thief because she did not follow the requested theme with her trade (not to mention those posters that took off on the incorrect assumption that she did not trade at all.) It is shameful how some of you chose to behave.

 

At no point in this discussion was the word "thief" used.

 

Here's part of what the OP said:

 

...

But the fact that I was FTF and did NOT receive something "great" really stinks....

 

I may have to give back the things that I only wanted because my children were there. I would have taken something with or with out them.....

 

I guess I want to make up excuses for NOT giving them back. Newbie or not, you don't do geocaching to only find the cache itself. ...

 

Soooo what should I do??? Or are you all going to tell on me????

(Emphasis mine.)

 

The OP asked for peoples opinions. Several people, including myself, stated that keeping something that doesn't belong to you is stealing and recommend that she return the items. That's not an "insane" response, that's a valid response to the OP's question.

[+thedeadpirate]

As a Traditional, the co-ords are in Geomate.

As an Unknown/Puzzle it wouldn't be.

 

If the co-ords make it in to a Geomate, it's open to all finders with Geomates, with no description.

Who all believe in "Take something, leave something"

 

Then again, making it a puzzle would help make sure anyone finding it reads the description. Since Geomates apparently don't load unknowns, the failure to load descriptions is a moot point.

 

The fact that all believe in "Take something, leave something" is at the heart of this issue.

 

This isn't a case of "took something, left nothing". This is a case of "took something the CO didn't want someone to take unless they left something in the same theme". (it was originally please don't take the items at all)

[+thedeadpirate]

The OP asked for peoples opinions. Several people, including myself, stated that keeping something that doesn't belong to you is stealing and recommend that she return the items. That's not an "insane" response, that's a valid response to the OP's question.

First, saying that someone stole something is the same as calling that person a thief. Let's not mince words here.

 

Second, the OP TRADED for the items. Trading is kind of common in caches ya know.

 

Third, with the new revision of the cache listing, it is clear that the cache is meant to be a themed cache. The intent of the CO is not for people to not take the items at all. It is for items that relate to the theme of the cache to be traded in and out.

 

Lastly, though there were errors both on the part of the CO and the OP, none of what transpired rises to the level of theft.

 

Finally, no matter what the CO puts on the cache listing, the themed items are not going to remain. Many have tried it and few have succeeded. I've done several themed caches. Only 1 actually succeeded in keeping with the theme.

[+Castle Mischief]

ALRs aren't listed as mystery caches any longer. They are no longer requirements, they are now merely requests, and the cache is listed as whatever type it would normally be without the ALR.

I think you're missing the point of making it unknown. Sbell, as well as I and a few others, suggested this because it forces the finder to actually read the listing before getting the coordinates to the cache.

 

I don't disagree with you to the point that I think it would be "wrong" to change it to a "?" cache, but I still don't think that a mystery cache forces anybody to do anything. It would be a red flag- for those that know to look for such things- but for the initiated... not so much. But yeah, it might help. On the Grand Scale of Helpfulness, it would make the needle twitch in the right direction.

 

The best solution is for the CO to not put anything in the cache that they can stand to part with and realize that there's no controlling the actions of people that find your cache no matter how hard you try.

Edited July 26, 2010 by Castle Mischief

[+Castle Mischief]

It is shameful how some of you chose to behave.

 

[+thedeadpirate]

but I still don't think that a mystery cache forces anybody to do anything. It would be a red flag- for those that know to look for such things- but for the initiated... not so much. But yeah, it might help. On the Grand Scale of Helpfulness, it would make the needle twitch in the right direction.

 

The best solution is for the CO to not put anything in the cache that they can stand to part with and realize that there's no controlling the actions of people that find your cache no matter how hard you try.

 

You are, of course, correct. I think I worded it better in my subsequent post.

Then again, making it a puzzle would help make sure anyone finding it reads the description.

No one can really force anyone to do anything.

 

I also agree that the best solution is not to put anything in a container and place it out in the wild if you don't want it to go bye-bye.

 

What really bothers me is that I can't keep myself from defending someone who has chosen not to defend herself.

[+Ecylram]

Finally, no matter what the CO puts on the cache listing, the themed items are not going to remain. Many have tried it and few have succeeded. I've done several themed caches. Only 1 actually succeeded in keeping with the theme.

I'm actually a bit surprised that one succeeded. I wish that was the rule and not the exception.

[+Ecylram]

 

First, saying that someone stole something is the same as calling that person a thief. Let's not mince words here.

 

Second, the OP TRADED for the items. Trading is kind of common in caches ya know.

 

Third, with the new revision of the cache listing, it is clear that the cache is meant to be a themed cache. The intent of the CO is not for people to not take the items at all. It is for items that relate to the theme of the cache to be traded in and out.

 

 

Anything I'd say in response would just be a

. I'll just say I respectfully disagree.

 

One thing I haven't said yet: I agree with the statements that the Cache Owner should have worded the description differently. However, I don't believe it absolves the OP from the responsibility of returning the items taken in error.

 

//insert wildly optimistic & unrealistic comment//

 

I believe this sport/hobby is better off if all cachers would make their best effort to respect the wishes of the cache owners.

 

//end wildly optimistic & unrealistic comment//

[+thedeadpirate]

One thing I haven't said yet: I agree with the statements that the Cache Owner should have worded the description differently. However, I don't believe it absolves the OP from the responsibility of returning the items taken in error.

 

//insert wildly optimistic & unrealistic comment//

 

I believe this sport/hobby is better off if all cachers would make their best effort to respect the wishes of the cache owners.

 

//end wildly optimistic & unrealistic comment//

I've never disagreed with this, from a moral/ethical point of view.

[+sbell111]

Years ago, I owned a book-themed cache. If someone traded out a book for some non-book item, I wouldn't have called them a thief, nor would I have expected them to come back and 'undo' their trade.

[+Lil Devil]

The OP asked for peoples opinions. Several people, including myself, stated that keeping something that doesn't belong to you is stealing and recommend that she return the items. That's not an "insane" response, that's a valid response to the OP's question.

First, saying that someone stole something is the same as calling that person a thief. Let's not mince words here.

 

Second, the OP TRADED for the items. Trading is kind of common in caches ya know.

Interesting. My interpretation of the original post is that they did not trade. They just took.

 

Received notice of this one and immediately took off to find the cache. With a shock and surprise we were FTF!! Our very first time being FTF. The kids (aged 6 and 8) loved everything in the cache. They even fought over what they were going to be rewarded with. Then we get home, my jaw dropped when I saw that we can't take anything from the cache, it's only for show?

Can someone please tell me if this is right, or am I crazy to think that I should have the placer of the cache tell my kids they have to give back what they so rightfully fought over....????? HELP!!!!

If there was further clarification elsewhere that they did in fact trade, then I missed it.

[+thedeadpirate]

If there was further clarification elsewhere that they did in fact trade, then I missed it.

 

There was. But since the OP decided to delete all her posts, I'm not sure I feel like going back to look it up.

 

I'm not really sure why I'm still defending her.

[+Lil Devil]

just a side note, as i have the feeling that this isn't quite clear yet: being FTF doesn't automatically entitle you to take something without leaving anything in return. most caches don't offer any FTF prizes, and those that do will specifically say so.

I never said that I was expecting a huge prize, it's the excitement of my very first FTF.[/u] Then the come down from having to give back my milestone. It's not something that it's important monetarily, it's the memory of the find that I'm entitled too. And I did leave something in return, most likely worth more than the hassle.

It will be going back to the owner of the cache.{Can I take what I left back then too}?

Found it. Thanks. Saving it before it gets deleted too.

 

Not that it really matters now.

[+thedeadpirate]

In fact, since the OP has deleted the post where she stated that she did trade and I told her in a response to an email she sent me that this opened her up to anyone saying anything they want about her now, I will no longer speak in her defense.

 

I requested that the thread be closed the other day, based on the fact that without the OP's posts, the thread is pretty much useless.

 

But I'm guessing it can only be closed at the OP's request and it doesn't appear she has made that request.

 

This one is messing with my OCD badly. But from this point on, I am going to try my best not to respond.

 

[+wolfslady]

Wow I can’t believe some of the responses on this one. Saying someone stole something is not the same as calling them a thief. Talk about a poor grasp of the English language. I agree with sbell 1 1 1 right down to final statement – ”it is shameful how some of you chose to behave.“ It’s also a shame that the OP choose to delete her posts, but frankly the way she was treated I can’t see why anyone thinks she shouldn’t have. She was doing her best to figure out the way this game is played when someone tossed in unusual rules.

 

Some of us don’t have the luxury of using a game to teach our children the lessons we’d like to wait until the time is right for them to learn. They are learning them in everyday life. It’s so nice that all of you have perfect lives and are perfect parents. I’m glad you weren’t mine or my son’s. It’s easy for some people to sit in their well planned boxes and look down on others who often work twice as hard to give their children a decent quality of life. We don’t drag our children along as accessories or after thoughts. We don’t care to steal treasured memories from our little ones over teaching them lessons that don’t need to be taught. We take them caching so that we can have family time and enjoy the experience together.

 

Some of us don’t have a lot and that small toy they trade for may be the biggest way they get a new treasure. They may be the most inexpensive way that we can find to spend time doing something our child enjoys and if the treasure at the end of the hunt makes that experience more rewarding then by God we are not too lazy to make sure that we carry a few trade items instead of saying “oh well they should have planned better.” It’s one thing to do that to a teen who needs to learn responsibility, but an awful thing to do to a toddler or preschooler.

 

Not that people who live in their own narrow world will ever care, but there are people who geocache who realize that the lessons some of you find so important mean nothing in the scheme of things. People who treasure every second they have with their family making “happy” memories, because they know that the clock is ticking faster for them or maybe even that child. They don’t take the time spent together for granted.

 

There are also people who don’t take every word someone writes in the worst light. “Fighting” among siblings doesn’t always mean they were having a spat. It can be very good natured and be done in a loving way. It’s just a phrase. And in my opinion when a child takes a long car ride and makes a hike and searches for a geocache being extra good because they enjoy the “reward” at the end of the trip as much as they enjoy the trip, they have earned it. They have worked for it. But no let’s teach them that they need to learn that it’s all about the smiley and their feelings don’t matter as long as mama or daddy get one. Frankly anyone who ever logs a find online. Who ever rushes out to be FTF. Who has ever even once taken any kind of item from a geocache, is being a hypocrite to try and teach their child any lesson about geocaching that involves denying their child the pleasure that they take from it.

 

I would like to say more but I’ll leave it at this.

 

Here are a few to the lessons I’m teaching my son while geocaching.

 

1. Watch where you’re going so you don’t destroy fragile things along the way. (plants, animals or PEOPLE)

2. Take care of the planet and leave it better than you found it. (Same thing for the geocache if possible.)

3. Empathy - Leave something so the next person won’t be disappointed, even if there is nothing for you to take.

4. There are many different kinds of treasure in life, some are in the in journey; others are in what you find at the end of it and those don’t have to be mutually exclusive. `

5. Perseverance. Don’t stop trying just because you didn’t succeed quickly.

6. Just because others don’t play nice doesn’t mean we shouldn’t.

7. You can trust your parents to try and keep their promises, but they aren’t always perfect.

8. Try to find something good to say even if it’s only TFTC.

9. Defend those who are unable to defend themselves, no matter what their reason is. (so applies to this thread)

10. If you “want” something you “need” to trade even or trade up. Up is always best. See numbers 2 and 3.

11. Some of the magic in life is worth holding on to.

12. Your parents aren’t too old or self-centered to remember what’s important to kids.

13. Your feelings are worthy of respect. We can’t always let you have your way but we aren’t going to say no out of some narcissistic need to rule your world

14. Your parents care about you and are tying to make sure you enjoy the time we spend together.

 

Sometimes the best thing you can say to your children is “let’s figure out if we can accomplish (fix, do, find a way) it together.”

[+thedeadpirate]

Saying someone stole something is not the same as calling them a thief. Talk about a poor grasp of the English language.

I have a fairly good grasp of the English language.

 

thief

   /θif/ Show Spelled[theef] Show IPA

–noun,pluralthieves.

a person who steals, esp. secretly or without open force; one guilty of theft or larceny.

[+wolfslady]

I see I needed the sarcastic smiley and a question mark might have helped too. This was refering back to post 115 when Eclryam (I think) claimed that no one had called her a thief. As you have pointed out so well accusing someone of stealing something is the same as calling them a thief.

[+thedeadpirate]

I see I needed the sarcastic smiley and a question mark might have helped too. This was refering back to post 115 when Eclryam (I think) claimed that no one had called her a thief. As you have pointed out so well accusing someone of stealing something is the same as calling them a thief.

 

I gotta admit I was having a hard time reconciling that statement along with the next one agreeing with sbell.

[+thedeadpirate]

This one is messing with my OCD badly. But from this point on, I am going to try my best not to respond.

 

 

FAIL! I'm going to bed. Maybe this madness will be gone by tomorrow.

[+brslk]

I see I needed the sarcastic smiley and a question mark might have helped too. This was refering back to post 115 when Eclryam (I think) claimed that no one had called her a thief. As you have pointed out so well accusing someone of stealing something is the same as calling them a thief.

 

I gotta admit I was having a hard time reconciling that statement along with the next one agreeing with sbell.

 

That is the best looking pic of you I have ever seen!

 

(must note that the pic I am seeing is a large yellow smiley face. Because the creepy man changes his pics hourly)

 

^That was for future forum reference. Pretty sure I will do something to be banned for life at one point and wont be here to explain my post.

[dementedtribe]

We found a cache that was listed as a travel bug hotel. It was a rather large lock and lock (2ft x 2ft) with little trees and things glued to the bottom and sides to resemble a hotel courtyard with a pool. It was obvious that certain things were not for trade in there. As for this cache, don't think putting in items that were not to be taken out was a good idea! As others have said, loose things in a cache are fair game to many people. I think bringing the items back is a good idea, and then having the CO remove them would be a better idea.

[+sbell111]

We found a cache that was listed as a travel bug hotel. It was a rather large lock and lock (2ft x 2ft) with little trees and things glued to the bottom and sides to resemble a hotel courtyard with a pool. It was obvious that certain things were not for trade in there. As for this cache, don't think putting in items that were not to be taken out was a good idea! As others have said, loose things in a cache are fair game to many people. I think bringing the items back is a good idea, and then having the CO remove them would be a better idea.

The earlier verbiage on the cache page seemed to state that these items weren't tradeables, but in fact they are. As now clarified on the cache page, the CO merely wanted these items to be only traded for other civil war era junk.

[+Printess Caroline]

Wow I can’t believe some of the responses on this one. Saying someone stole something is not the same as calling them a thief. Talk about a poor grasp of the English language. I agree with sbell 1 1 1 right down to final statement – ”it is shameful how some of you chose to behave.“ It’s also a shame that the OP choose to delete her posts, but frankly the way she was treated I can’t see why anyone thinks she shouldn’t have. She was doing her best to figure out the way this game is played when someone tossed in unusual rules.

 

Some of us don’t have the luxury of using a game to teach our children the lessons we’d like to wait until the time is right for them to learn. They are learning them in everyday life. It’s so nice that all of you have perfect lives and are perfect parents. I’m glad you weren’t mine or my son’s. It’s easy for some people to sit in their well planned boxes and look down on others who often work twice as hard to give their children a decent quality of life. We don’t drag our children along as accessories or after thoughts. We don’t care to steal treasured memories from our little ones over teaching them lessons that don’t need to be taught. We take them caching so that we can have family time and enjoy the experience together.

 

Some of us don’t have a lot and that small toy they trade for may be the biggest way they get a new treasure. They may be the most inexpensive way that we can find to spend time doing something our child enjoys and if the treasure at the end of the hunt makes that experience more rewarding then by God we are not too lazy to make sure that we carry a few trade items instead of saying “oh well they should have planned better.” It’s one thing to do that to a teen who needs to learn responsibility, but an awful thing to do to a toddler or preschooler.

 

Not that people who live in their own narrow world will ever care, but there are people who geocache who realize that the lessons some of you find so important mean nothing in the scheme of things. People who treasure every second they have with their family making “happy” memories, because they know that the clock is ticking faster for them or maybe even that child. They don’t take the time spent together for granted.

 

There are also people who don’t take every word someone writes in the worst light. “Fighting” among siblings doesn’t always mean they were having a spat. It can be very good natured and be done in a loving way. It’s just a phrase. And in my opinion when a child takes a long car ride and makes a hike and searches for a geocache being extra good because they enjoy the “reward” at the end of the trip as much as they enjoy the trip, they have earned it. They have worked for it. But no let’s teach them that they need to learn that it’s all about the smiley and their feelings don’t matter as long as mama or daddy get one. Frankly anyone who ever logs a find online. Who ever rushes out to be FTF. Who has ever even once taken any kind of item from a geocache, is being a hypocrite to try and teach their child any lesson about geocaching that involves denying their child the pleasure that they take from it.

 

I would like to say more but I’ll leave it at this.

 

Here are a few to the lessons I’m teaching my son while geocaching.

 

1. Watch where you’re going so you don’t destroy fragile things along the way. (plants, animals or PEOPLE)

2. Take care of the planet and leave it better than you found it. (Same thing for the geocache if possible.)

3. Empathy - Leave something so the next person won’t be disappointed, even if there is nothing for you to take.

4. There are many different kinds of treasure in life, some are in the in journey; others are in what you find at the end of it and those don’t have to be mutually exclusive. `

5. Perseverance. Don’t stop trying just because you didn’t succeed quickly.

6. Just because others don’t play nice doesn’t mean we shouldn’t.

7. You can trust your parents to try and keep their promises, but they aren’t always perfect.

8. Try to find something good to say even if it’s only TFTC.

9. Defend those who are unable to defend themselves, no matter what their reason is. (so applies to this thread)

10. If you “want” something you “need” to trade even or trade up. Up is always best. See numbers 2 and 3.

11. Some of the magic in life is worth holding on to.

12. Your parents aren’t too old or self-centered to remember what’s important to kids.

13. Your feelings are worthy of respect. We can’t always let you have your way but we aren’t going to say no out of some narcissistic need to rule your world

14. Your parents care about you and are tying to make sure you enjoy the time we spend together.

 

Sometimes the best thing you can say to your children is “let’s figure out if we can accomplish (fix, do, find a way) it together.”

 

Oh dear. Please take a deep breath. I fear that you're getting a bit too worked up over this. I'm sure you're a fine mother.

[+terrkan78]

Wow I can’t believe some of the responses on this one. Saying someone stole something is not the same as calling them a thief. Talk about a poor grasp of the English language. I agree with sbell 1 1 1 right down to final statement – ”it is shameful how some of you chose to behave.“ It’s also a shame that the OP choose to delete her posts, but frankly the way she was treated I can’t see why anyone thinks she shouldn’t have. She was doing her best to figure out the way this game is played when someone tossed in unusual rules.

 

Some of us don’t have the luxury of using a game to teach our children the lessons we’d like to wait until the time is right for them to learn. They are learning them in everyday life. It’s so nice that all of you have perfect lives and are perfect parents. I’m glad you weren’t mine or my son’s. It’s easy for some people to sit in their well planned boxes and look down on others who often work twice as hard to give their children a decent quality of life. We don’t drag our children along as accessories or after thoughts. We don’t care to steal treasured memories from our little ones over teaching them lessons that don’t need to be taught. We take them caching so that we can have family time and enjoy the experience together.

 

Some of us don’t have a lot and that small toy they trade for may be the biggest way they get a new treasure. They may be the most inexpensive way that we can find to spend time doing something our child enjoys and if the treasure at the end of the hunt makes that experience more rewarding then by God we are not too lazy to make sure that we carry a few trade items instead of saying “oh well they should have planned better.” It’s one thing to do that to a teen who needs to learn responsibility, but an awful thing to do to a toddler or preschooler.

 

Not that people who live in their own narrow world will ever care, but there are people who geocache who realize that the lessons some of you find so important mean nothing in the scheme of things. People who treasure every second they have with their family making “happy” memories, because they know that the clock is ticking faster for them or maybe even that child. They don’t take the time spent together for granted.

 

There are also people who don’t take every word someone writes in the worst light. “Fighting” among siblings doesn’t always mean they were having a spat. It can be very good natured and be done in a loving way. It’s just a phrase. And in my opinion when a child takes a long car ride and makes a hike and searches for a geocache being extra good because they enjoy the “reward” at the end of the trip as much as they enjoy the trip, they have earned it. They have worked for it. But no let’s teach them that they need to learn that it’s all about the smiley and their feelings don’t matter as long as mama or daddy get one. Frankly anyone who ever logs a find online. Who ever rushes out to be FTF. Who has ever even once taken any kind of item from a geocache, is being a hypocrite to try and teach their child any lesson about geocaching that involves denying their child the pleasure that they take from it.

 

I would like to say more but I’ll leave it at this.

 

Here are a few to the lessons I’m teaching my son while geocaching.

 

1. Watch where you’re going so you don’t destroy fragile things along the way. (plants, animals or PEOPLE)

2. Take care of the planet and leave it better than you found it. (Same thing for the geocache if possible.)

3. Empathy - Leave something so the next person won’t be disappointed, even if there is nothing for you to take.

4. There are many different kinds of treasure in life, some are in the in journey; others are in what you find at the end of it and those don’t have to be mutually exclusive. `

5. Perseverance. Don’t stop trying just because you didn’t succeed quickly.

6. Just because others don’t play nice doesn’t mean we shouldn’t.

7. You can trust your parents to try and keep their promises, but they aren’t always perfect.

8. Try to find something good to say even if it’s only TFTC.

9. Defend those who are unable to defend themselves, no matter what their reason is. (so applies to this thread)

10. If you “want” something you “need” to trade even or trade up. Up is always best. See numbers 2 and 3.

11. Some of the magic in life is worth holding on to.

12. Your parents aren’t too old or self-centered to remember what’s important to kids.

13. Your feelings are worthy of respect. We can’t always let you have your way but we aren’t going to say no out of some narcissistic need to rule your world

14. Your parents care about you and are tying to make sure you enjoy the time we spend together.

 

Sometimes the best thing you can say to your children is “let’s figure out if we can accomplish (fix, do, find a way) it together.”

 

I appreciated your post. Well said.