GPS on a plane

[+Bad_CRC]

Anyone try to do this? I searched the web, and apparently some commercial carriers allow it, some do not. Has anyone tried it? does it work at all?

 

I would imagine it would be pretty fun to watch your actual position and speed on a boring flight if it worked.

 

[+Wacka]

Wednesday 9/6, I flew from Charlotte, NC to SF on USAir. Took out my Garmin Venture when we got above 10K feet . It fit between the shade and the window, so when I got tired of holding it at the window, I put it behind the shade. No questions at all from the flight attendants. On some other airlines, they are not allowed. You have to have a window seat. I got 3-4 satellites and the EPE was from 15-75 feet. When I plotted the track with Mapsource, it put me about 10 miles south of where we actually were.

The speed was between 485-515 mph and the altitude was 33-35 K for most of the flight.

Edited September 9, 2006 by Wacka

[+Timpat]

I use my Garmin Legend, Map60C and 60Cx any time I fly. Once a United crew asked if they could borrow my 60Cx to play with it in the cockpit after the flight attendant noticed I had it. When she returned it to me she had a comment from the crew; "If we lose our nav system bring him and his Garmin up front".

 

Check here for a list of airlines that allow (or do not allow) GPSrs in flight.

[+blindleader]

"If we lose our nav system bring him and his Garmin up front".

 

 

Nice of them to compliment the power and versatility of the hand held unit (tongue in cheek I'm sure), but the flight would really have to be in the deep end of the sheep dip pool to fall back on a hand-held unit. With lost Nav, an airliner is still in radar coverage pretty much all the time over North America, so they would just have ATC give them vectors for an emergency landing. If they lost Com as well, then it gets really deep. Now they're trying to find and enter coordinates (by hand at 450 mph) for the nearest safe visual landing. The flight would probably never be in any serious danger, but it would probably be the most exciting event any of the crew will ever experience.

[+BigLarry]

I used a 60CSx as copilot/navigator on a Cessna 206 going from San Jose to Oregon a couple weeks ago. I pre-programmed in waypoints for airports and sight seeing spots like Crater Lake and Mt. Shasta. We used it quite nicely, and it plotted our tracks correctly.

 

The only thing missing is an aviation map. I just flipped between Topo and City Navigator, but Topo worked better. The biggest problem is that we couldn't easily tell if we were in the TCA or other restricted air zones, which are virtual boundaries and would very nice to have on a GPS map. We had to refer to the aviation maps and my GPS for names of the feature near by. It was sometimes easier to just look for landmarks out the window and compare it to the aviation maps. I don't think they sell the aviation maps for the 60CSx, but you'd want a more dedicated unit for air navigatin anyway.

 

Garmin's Aviation units like the GPSMAP 496 are amazing. For a mere $3K, you can see aviation map data, have airspace alerts highlighted, get weather and radar displayed from XM satellite, have all of City Navigator streets for the US along with POI in memory (when on ground), 650 airport taxi ways included, with info for another 5300 airports, display of nearby air traffic information from a transponder,....

[Garmin8888]

If I was a Pilot I would carry a Garmin Map 60 CSx too for back up!

[+Alan2]

I used a 60CSx as copilot/navigator on a Cessna 206 going from San Jose to Oregon a couple weeks ago. I pre-programmed in waypoints for airports and sight seeing spots like Crater Lake and Mt. Shasta. We used it quite nicely, and it plotted our tracks correctly.

 

The only thing missing is an aviation map. I just flipped between Topo and City Navigator, but Topo worked better. The biggest problem is that we couldn't easily tell if we were in the TCA or other restricted air zones, which are virtual boundaries and would very nice to have on a GPS map. We had to refer to the aviation maps and my GPS for names of the feature near by. It was sometimes easier to just look for landmarks out the window and compare it to the aviation maps. I don't think they sell the aviation maps for the 60CSx, but you'd want a more dedicated unit for air navigatin anyway.

 

Garmin's Aviation units like the GPSMAP 496 are amazing. For a mere $3K, you can see aviation map data, have airspace alerts highlighted, get weather and radar displayed from XM satellite, have all of City Navigator streets for the US along with POI in memory (when on ground), 650 airport taxi ways included, with info for another 5300 airports, display of nearby air traffic information from a transponder,....

 

Why not use a Pocket PC with GPS attached. Then you have aviation programs avaiable like this

[+JanniCash]

Why not use a Pocket PC with GPS attached. Then you have aviation programs avaiable like this

 

I'm not a real world pilot, but the GPSr's modelled in MS Flight Simulator are Garmins, and they all have runway data including (where available) GPS approach vectors, ILS frequencies and headings, hold patterns, airspace and restricted area info &c. A handheld unit designed for hiking and road navigation wouldn't be a match for that.

 

Jan

[+Fhantazm]

Dunno bout GPS' but I hear snakes are allowed on a plane.

[beautyisgod]

I use my Garmin Legend, Map60C and 60Cx any time I fly. Once a United crew asked if they could borrow my 60Cx to play with it in the cockpit after the flight attendant noticed I had it. When she returned it to me she had a comment from the crew; "If we lose our nav system bring him and his Garmin up front".

 

Check here for a list of airlines that allow (or do not allow) GPSrs in flight.

 

can anyone tell us why some airliner don't allow GPSr on board? what is the reason for this policy? and if some airliner dont allow GPSr on the plane...can we hide it in our bag and take it out once we up?

[+Wacka]

You can take it on any plane. Some lines don't allow you to use it though.

I wouldn't use it if they say not to though, unless you want to spend some time in the graybar hotel.

[+Aloha! & Wahine Eye Spy]

This very topic is being discussed at: http://forums.Groundspeak.com/GC/index.php?showtopic=142793. A wee bit heated at times too.

[Neo_Geo]

Once a United crew asked if they could borrow my 60Cx to play with it in the cockpit after the flight attendant noticed I had it. When she returned it to me she had a comment from the crew; "If we lose our nav system bring him and his Garmin up front".

Did you, by any chance, have my aviation custom POIs loaded at the time?

 

can anyone tell us why some airliner don't allow GPSr on board? what is the reason for this policy?

It has to do with the remote possibility of the electronic circuitry causing interference with the plane's sensitive electronic navigation system. Even though it's just a receiver, all electronics emit a small amount of radio waves which normally do not interfere with other devices, but under certain circumstances (a short circuit perhaps) there's an open-ended possibility that they could cause problems. So, there's a federal regulation which basically leaves it up to the carrier to determine whether or not to allow certain electronic devices to be used while in flight:

Sec. 91.21 - Portable electronic devices.

 

(a) Except as provided in paragraph ( of this section, no person may operate, nor may any operator or pilot in command of an aircraft allow the operation of, any portable electronic device on any of the following U.S.-registered civil aircraft:

 

(1) Aircraft operated by a holder of an air carrier operating certificate or an operating certificate; or

(2) Any other aircraft while it is operated under IFR.

 

( Paragraph (a) of this section does not apply to --

(1) Portable voice recorders;

(2) Hearing aids;

(3) Heart pacemakers;

(4) Electric shavers; or

(5) Any other portable electronic device that the operator of the aircraft has determined will not cause interference with the navigation or communication system of the aircraft on which it is to be used.

 

(c ) In the case of an aircraft operated by a holder of an air carrier operating certificate or an operating certificate, the determination required by paragraph ((5) of this section shall be made by that operator of the aircraft on which the particular device is to be used. In the case of other aircraft, the determination may be made by the pilot in command or other operator of the aircraft.

So some airlines may not be entirely clear as to the meaning of this regulation. Others may be afraid of it as it would possibly open up the door to lawsuits if something happened to a plane, and the NTSB later determined that the use of portable electronic devices was found to be a contributing factor in an accident.

 

The list of airlines that approve is much longer than the list that do not approve. It used to be about half and half, but now about three quarters of the airlines allow them. Ultimately, it's up to the PILOT IN COMMAND as to whether or not to allow their use.

 

Case in point, American Eagle has a strict NO USE OF GPS policy!

 

In the last paragraph, you can find the following:

During flight, never use cellphones (to make or receive calls), two-way pagers, radios, TV sets, remote controls (example: DVD, CD, game, or toy remote controls), a cordless computer mouse, commercial TV cameras, or Global Positioning Systems.

I was on a Delta code-sharing flight which put me on an American Eagle flight, and prior to takeoff I asked the flight attendant to ask the captain if I could use my 60Cx. She didn't even bother to ask the captain - she simply said that I could use it after we reached 10,000 feet like all other electronic devices. Maybe she used to work for another airline and was new to American, or maybe she knew the captain would allow it.

 

...and if some airliner dont allow GPSr on the plane...can we hide it in our bag and take it out once we up?

You could turn it on and use it and claim ignorance if you're busted, and most likely they would simply tell you to turn it off and put it away - in which case you'd best do just that! But if they announce "the operation of electronic devices is not allowed on this flight," then you'd best just leave it in your bag - period!

Edited September 10, 2006 by Neo_Geo