Caching In The Snow!

[+zarah]

It is coming close to snowy season here in the NE. WOuldn't it be nice if people added something to the description of their cache that noted if the cache could be located if there was snow on the ground?

It could even be among the selector icons.....

snow friendly

 

what do you think?

[+Will+Bill]

Yeah, that would be cool. I went caching in the snow last year, but spent more time prying the cache out than actually finding it!

[+briansnat]

The Selector has a winter availability icon.

[+TotemLake]

Look at the topo, read the weather report, make your determinations. It's a fairly simple process.

[+zarah]

ok, geez. easier for some.

[+Night Stalker]

I recently did one that was on the continental divide just outside of Butte, Montana that stated it was winter friendly. I agree that this would be a nice addition to the cache descriptions.

 

[+Alan2]

On one of mine I stated that it would be accessible with the hint (the cache was in the roots of a large falllen tree). Often the hints would give you the only reasonable way of finding a cache in the snow.

Edited November 14, 2004 by Alan2

[+TotemLake]

ok, geez. easier for some.

Well if you want a quick and easy way to look at a Topo map and you don't own one, go here and zoom in. Then check the weather report for snow level reports.

 

Not all caches will be in the snow and now you want the cache owner to edit it for your weather reports? You should be paying attention to that anyway so you're properly prepared for your adventure. That's just being trail smart.

 

=-=-Keystone Approver made a good point about my tone. My apologies.-=-=

Edited November 14, 2004 by TotemLake

[Keystone]

TotemLake, I'm sorry, but you're coming on a bit too strong, so I will thank you in advance for toning it down a notch.

 

There is a difference between spending hours reading the weather report and studying maps, etc., and knowing whether the cache is winter-accessible. You could go out in a raging blizzard and still find a cache that is hidden inside a huge hollow tree, and the clue says "where do the Keebler elves live?" Or, you could go out on a crisp, sunshiney day with a temperature of 28°F and log a DNF on a cache that's underneath a log, but you cannot find it under all the ice-covered snow. I've done both.

 

The original poster should check out the discussion of "Cache Attributes" that is pinned at the top of the Geocaching.com Forum. When fully implemented, this long-planned site enhancement will permit searching for only those caches which have the "winter accessible" cache attribute.

[uperdooper]

as brian said there is a way to put the info on cache pages. getting a weather report isn't going to help if there is 4 feet of snow on the ground. it is not uncommon in upper michigan for a cache owner to put whether a cache is winter accessible. it's a reasonable request in areas that get a lot of snow.

[+zarah]

Wow I dop't think my witty little comment/question deserved all of that hostility.

Being rude isn't part of the geocaching game.

Gives the sport a bad name.

thanks for the apology

Edited November 14, 2004 by zarah

[+TotemLake]

Wow I dop't think my witty little comment/question deserved all of that hostility.

Being rude isn't part of the geocaching game.

Gives the sport a bad name.

thanks for the apology

Rude? It wasn't. Harsh? It was. And it was out of character for me.

 

Actually, the point I was trying to make, is if you're not doing some research into the area you're getting ready to hike into, having a symbol tell you there might be snow isn't going to be enough. I'm not talking hours of research here. I am talking about having a basic understanding of where you're going to make the proper decision. This doesn't require hours of research. It is however, a basic need before embarking on any trip.

 

Perfect example. If I were to give you an address in your local area, would you expect driver warnings about a hazardous intersection? How about the possibility of that roadside stream flooding out? No! You take on that responsibility for the what if factor. You have probably done ~some~ research of the area by looking at a map and understand you're about to embark on a trip that requires some decision process (on your own) whether or not you'll be able to make this trip.

 

The same applies to hunting for a cache. In some circumstances, not reaching an address as a destination is almost as inevitable as not finding a cache at the destination due to conditions that you must plan for whether or not the provider of that "address" gives you warning.

[uperdooper]

knowing what the snow conditions are is quite different than knowing whether a cache is on the ground under 4 feet of snow, or if it is hanging in the branches of a tree. one i would wait to do, the other i wouldn't. i have found caches under that much snow. bringing something to dig with helps. it's also helpful to know if only seasonal roads are used to get to the cache. i wouldn't go for a cache 4 miles down a road that isn't maintained in the winter unless i had a snowmobile. winter friendly notification is a reasonable request.

[+TotemLake]

knowing what the snow conditions are is quite different than knowing whether a cache is on the ground under 4 feet of snow, or if it is hanging in the branches of a tree.  one i would wait to do, the other i wouldn't.  i have found caches under that much snow.  bringing something to dig with helps.  it's also helpful to know if only seasonal roads are used to get to the cache.  i wouldn't go for a cache 4 miles down a road that isn't maintained in the winter unless i had a snowmobile.  winter friendly notification is a reasonable request.

You know... sometimes that's just part of the challenge even without the snow. If the clue doesn't give a good indication, knowing whether it is winter friendly or not by a symbol still doesn't tell you it's four feet off the ground.

Edited November 14, 2004 by TotemLake

[uperdooper]

knowing what the snow conditions are is quite different than knowing whether a cache is on the ground under 4 feet of snow, or if it is hanging in the branches of a tree.  one i would wait to do, the other i wouldn't.  i have found caches under that much snow.  bringing something to dig with helps.  it's also helpful to know if only seasonal roads are used to get to the cache.  i wouldn't go for a cache 4 miles down a road that isn't maintained in the winter unless i had a snowmobile.  winter friendly notification is a reasonable request.

You know... sometimes that's just part of the challenge.

there is a difference between a challange and wasting time and gas trying to get to a cache that is unaccessible 3 months or more of the year. i'll save those for summer. a 1 or 2 terrain cache ceases to be a 1 or 2 if the road it's on isn't plowed in the winter.

[uperdooper]

2 caches. one accessible, one not. kinda nice to know beforehand.

 

yes

 

no

[+TotemLake]

There is a difference in being inaccessible and having to hike in with snowshoes, or using the snowmobile and it also depends upon a person's skill level on whether it is accessible to them or not. I can point out many capable people who would consider it inaccessible and yet others would consider it just a variation of the adventure. Again, current weather conditions would have warranted having some kind of preparation or at the least, some kind of expectation.

 

The true purpose (in my perception) of a winter friendly symbol, is whether or not the area was officially closed off to all activities during the winter months for any number of reasons. Otherwise, the cache is accessible.

 

I haven't seen any examples here that the cache is not accessible just because you had to traverse by some other means than your roadster or dig a hole in the snow to get to the cache does not mean it is inaccessible

 

Now, one may argue that the difficulty and terrain levels should be changed or at the least, advised on the page based on the current conditions. So far, that's the thrust of the need that I see in the OP.

[+TotemLake]

2 caches. one accessible, one not. kinda nice to know beforehand.

 

no

 

Clearly, the D/T made that apparent. The symbol was merely extra.

[uperdooper]

here is another cache that is inaccessible in the winter. when the cache owner first posted the cache they didn't realize it was closed in the winter. luckily Hysteria and capt. bud got the find, but they might not have tried it in the winter if it had been disabled like it is now or marked inaccessible.

 

cache

 

log

 

another log

[+TotemLake]

when the cache owner first posted the cache they didn't realize it was closed in the winter.

The key phrase here is "closed in the winter". The need of a symbol in this case is warranted. The ignorance of the area's closure is unfortunate.

 

I think you and I are in some kind of agreement here.

Edited November 14, 2004 by TotemLake

[uperdooper]

let's just say i think it's nice to have the info and it won't kill anyone to add it to a cache page.

[+TotemLake]

let's just say i think it's nice to have the info and it won't kill anyone to add it to a cache page.

I can accept that. I merely saw reasons being used that watered down the intent of the symbol.

 

Just think of my unfortunate flame as that guy that flamed his office after eating the spicy food.

[+shunra]

ok, geez. easier for some.

Well if you want a quick and easy way to look at a Topo map and you don't own one, go here and zoom in. Then check the weather report for snow level reports.

 

Not all caches will be in the snow and now you want the cache owner to edit it for your weather reports? You should be paying attention to that anyway so you're properly prepared for your adventure. That's just being trail smart.

 

=-=-Keystone Approver made a good point about my tone. My apologies.-=-=

Geez, I saw nothing rude or harsh in TL's tone. It was a mere expression of common sense.

 

I do not think a cache owner can be expected to know at any time whether his cache is oovered by snow, and of so, under how much of it. Even less can he be expected to know it in advance, and write it on the cache page.

 

Information about road closures due to snow conditions are another matter, of course. A statement such as:

Lower Gate is closed from November through May. Parking at lower gate will add 6 miles to your round trip walking distance make perfect sense. Link to a forest service page, a tides table or a local weather station are helpful.

 

It's up to a cache owner to private any information he considers necessary. It remains the responsibility of the finder, however, to prepare himself.

[+TotemLake]

Thanks for sticking up for me Bugel, but that post did have a harsh line edited out. I guess I failed to make that clear.

[Keystone]

Point of order: Totem Lake edited out the sentence from his post that was a bit over the top. It took only the slightest nudge from a moderator. He is a class act, a valued forum contributor, and a fun hiking companion (especially if Snickers is along). Everyone has a bad day or a bad post, myself included.

 

Please continue a respectful discussion of caching in the snow. Thanks.

[+TotemLake]

Thanks KA. OT: Snickers is healing from an injury incurred on Cougar Mtn. I don't know if he'll be able to join me anymore. Only time will tell.

[+carleenp]

I could see the usefulness of a statement that a cache is snow friendly.

 

But something else to consider is that you can use snow caching to add some mystery and difficulty to your caching. I once found a typical micro stuck under a bench in the snow. But I had a hell of a time finding the bench because it had a four foot drift over it! Then I dug out the wrong end first! It turned a 1/1 cache into a big challenge and I got a kick out of it! Funny thing about that too is that I bet the owner would have listed that cache "snow friendly" if he or she had the option." But some might not have agreed that it was "snow friendly."

 

Anyway, I kind of get a kick out of going out and just seeing if I can find caches in the snow. It leads to more DNFs, but that is OK with me. I tend to save some of the easy urban caches for snow days to make them more challenging and fun.

Edited November 14, 2004 by carleenp

[+carleenp]

Thanks KA. OT: Snickers is healing from an injury incurred on Cougar Mtn. I don't know if he'll be able to join me anymore. Only time will tell.

I hope Snickers heals up OK!

[uperdooper]

i think the dialog that TL and i had proves that things can be discussed in the forums without flames or insults. i enjoyed it. angst is unnecessary.

 

i hope snickers is okay too. i wish i had a dog. oh well, maybe someday.

[+TotemLake]

Yep I agree with uperdooper.

 

I've had enough inquries I hope y'all will forgive another OT post here. Snickers and I went on a hike on a local mountain with a boardwalk going over a swamp area. I was in the rear of the pack, he was in front. He saw something that caught his interest and jumped off the boardwalk into muck that came up to his upper rear thighes. He twisted and tore some ligaments off his knee. I didn't realize the extent of the injury until much later, thinking his trouble with jumping into the Jeep at the end of the hike was due to him being just as tired as I was.

 

Anyway, arthritis is starting to kick in, so we're watching him closely. We have him on diet supplements and are trying to decide whether or not surgery will improve his quality of life or exacerbate it at his age.

 

Cheers all!

TL

[+Kealia]

TL - Man I'm sorry to hear that. I thought the worst thing that happened was that he got into that smelly mud - my thoughts are with you and Snickers. He's a great companion and I hope that continues for quite some time (in any capacity).

 

OT: I've only done one cache in snow and it was a real treat (since I'm in an area of CA that never sees snow locally). We had to wade thigh-deep to find it and it was definitely a fun change. The best part was adding all the "fake" trails around the cache area after we found it (a little something suggested by a few cachers who spend a fair amount of time in the snow).

[uperdooper]

caching in the snow can be great.

 

 

near checkpoint charlie.

 

 

snow depth.

[gpsdork]

I think this would be a good idea. I've pondered putting in a skiers-only cache in a local cross country ski area. Probably suspended off the ground.