+dino_hunters Posted September 17, 2004 Share Posted September 17, 2004 I'm considering between the Gamin 60CS and the Vista C. From what I understand, the differences are as folows: Different Antena types External antena connector on 60 CS More memory in 60 CS Size/buttons etc... Are there any other differences between the 2? has anyone compared reception capabilities between these gps's? One other concern I have with the 60CS, is that the optimum orientation for the antennal is vertical, but for the compass is horizontal. If I'm holding it horizontal for the compass, will I see a big drop in reception because of antena orientation? are there any differences NOT listed above, that would be a deal breaker for you? I'm leaning to the Vista C, because I like the size, Price, memory is not a big deal, and neither is an exteral antena. what do you think thanks Quote Link to comment
+tirediron Posted September 17, 2004 Share Posted September 17, 2004 I think you've covered the main differences between them. I have to admit that while I love my new 76CS, I don't like having to carry it vertially. I always find that after a little while it starts to drop back down to a more horizontal position... To answer your question, depending on terrain and your oreintation to the satellites, you can see a significant drop in reception holding either unit in the "wrong" way. It certainly sounds like the Vista is the unit for you, and there's nothing wrong with it. Quote Link to comment
tubemonkey Posted September 17, 2004 Share Posted September 17, 2004 (edited) Go to this link and you can do a side by side comparison of the two units: Garmin Comparison tm Edited September 17, 2004 by tubemonkey Quote Link to comment
+TheOfficeMaven Posted September 17, 2004 Share Posted September 17, 2004 If you search these forums for Legend C or Vista C, you'll see that my user name pops up quite a bit in the discussions. I'm a HUGE fan of the Vista C. I currently own both a 60CS and a Vista C and I prefer the Vista C over the 60CS hands down. In fact, I prefer it so much more, that I've decided to sell my 60CS. I've been on quite a few caching runs with the two units side-by-side and I can't tell any difference between them as far as the antenna goes. If you're caching in heavy tree cover, then the 60CS will marginally out perform the Vista C, but everywhere else, I can't tell a difference. What really sold me on the vista C is its super small size and the unit's click stick. The Vista C is much smaller than the 60CS and yet it's screen size is very close to being the same size (especially when you consider that the 60CS has that silly toolbar/status bar running across the top of the screen that can't be turned off and the Vista C doesn't). In my opinion, the Vista C's click stick is sooo much easier to use (and faster too) than the rocker button on the 60CS. Other than the smaller amount of memory (which doesn't bother me either as it's still enough to load all the maps I need for geocaching), and the other items you've already noted, the Vista C is identical to the 60CS and the 76CS (i.e. they all use nearly the exact same firmware and so they offer all of the same features/functions). As you can tell, my vote goes to the Vista C... Quote Link to comment
Neo_Geo Posted September 17, 2004 Share Posted September 17, 2004 (edited) Computer interface connections: The 60CS has both Serial (RS-232) AND USB The Vista C only has USB THE BAD NEWS: This has been a major pain for some people in getting some different applications to recognize their GPSrs. Since the 60CS has a serial connector, you can buy a separate serial cable, hook it up to the computer and fool the application into thinking the 60CS is a Rino or some other supported model. The Vista C only has a USB connection. This simply means that the Vista C is "S.O.L." when it comes to connectivity with some applications! THE GOOD NEWS: Garmin has released their Communication Protocol Interface Specifications, which means application developers can get their programs to recognize the new USB models. THE BAD NEWS: It takes time for application developers to get their programs to recognize the new USB models. THE GOOD NEWS: Some developers have already gotten their applications to work with the USB models. THE BAD NEWS: Many haven't. Of course Garmin's MapSource program works with the USB models. Programs that work with MapSource (such as EasyMPS) work too. I use EasyMPS with MapSource to upload my caches via USB. Edited September 17, 2004 by Neo_Geo Quote Link to comment
+dino_hunters Posted September 17, 2004 Author Share Posted September 17, 2004 Another quick question about the Vista C. Does it only hold 500 Waypoints? Quote Link to comment
moonpup Posted September 17, 2004 Share Posted September 17, 2004 Another quick question about the Vista C. Does it only hold 500 Waypoints? Currently yes, only 500 waypoints. It is possible that Garmin will update the firmware to take 1000 as they did to the orginal Legend/Vista. As for which one I would buy, I have to agree with OfficeMaven on the Vista C. I too was battling the same dilemma as you and went with the Vista C. I preferred the lightweight unit, it's small size and click stick. It would have been nice to have the extra 32 meg of ram, but 24 is more than adequate for my topo map needs. Currently i'm only using 11 meg. Also, the display size is not an issue either as the screen resolution is a bit higher than the 60C/CS. It comes down to what features you need. If size, weight and money are not a problem for you, grab the 60CS. Quote Link to comment
scottf Posted September 20, 2004 Share Posted September 20, 2004 Personally I think the 60C is the way to go specifically for someone who is after an all-in-one GPSr and needs the most memory possible (i.e for autorouting). Each to their own. Quote Link to comment
tubemonkey Posted September 20, 2004 Share Posted September 20, 2004 Expensive GPSr + expensive auto-routing maps + expensive yearly map updates = 56mb? Come now! Until Garmin adds an SD slot for unlimited memory, I don't want one. These units are worthless for long distance road trips; unless you tote along a laptop (which defeats the purpose of a stand alone unit). It's time for Magellan to ante up. If they can add an SD slot to the 60CS, I'm getting it. tm Quote Link to comment
+HHHarrier Posted September 22, 2004 Share Posted September 22, 2004 Expensive GPSr + expensive auto-routing maps + expensive yearly map updates = 56mb? Come now! Until Garmin adds an SD slot for unlimited memory, I don't want one. These units are worthless for long distance road trips; unless you tote along a laptop (which defeats the purpose of a stand alone unit). I have a Legend C (same as the Vista C, but without the magnetic compass and altimeter) with CitySelect. The limitations of the 24mb memory depend on the length of your journey, and how densely populated the area traveling through happens to be. Earlier this month we were able to load enough CitySelect maps to allow us to auto-route from Northern New Jersey to Kingston, NY to Ithaca, NY, and back to NJ via PA (over 500 miles). Locally, I use my Legend C for auto-routing all the time (mostly just because it’s so fun to use). Quote Link to comment
tubemonkey Posted September 22, 2004 Share Posted September 22, 2004 The limitations of the 24mb memory depend on the length of your journey, and how densely populated the area traveling through happens to be. How about Seattle to Orlando? or Seattle to Portland to San Francisco to LA to San Diego to Las Vegas to Salt Lake to Yellowstone? If I stayed local, 24mb or 56mb would suffice. But it's worthless for trips covering thousands of miles. I want the ability to carry a complete set of topo and auto-routing city maps of the entire western US. For my needs, it's a serious design flaw. As is, I'll just wait a bit to see how Magellan responds to the 60C/CS; Legend/Vista C. tm Quote Link to comment
+TheOfficeMaven Posted September 22, 2004 Share Posted September 22, 2004 tubemonkey, If that's what you want your GPSr to do (i.e. auto-route over long distances) then I think that your seriously barking up the wrong tree with the Legend C, Vista C, or the 60C(S)/76C(S) as that's NOT what they were built for (i.e. that's not what they were designed to do). If you're looking for a GPSr that can auto-route over long distances, then you'd be much better off considering the Quest or the SteetPilot 2610. Quote Link to comment
tubemonkey Posted September 22, 2004 Share Posted September 22, 2004 If that's what you want your GPSr to do (i.e. auto-route over long distances) then I think that your seriously barking up the wrong tree with the Legend C, Vista C, or the 60C(S)/76C(S) as that's NOT what they were built for (i.e. that's not what they were designed to do). I know, that's why I said -- for my needs, it's a serious design flaw. I'm fully aware that they weren't designed for this. If all I wanted a GPS to do was to geocache, I certainly wouldn't spend $350+ for one. A Legend or ST Map is more than adequate. I can navigate the roads in my own neck of the woods (western Washington) just fine without a GPS. It's after I leave the car when it comes into play; and for that, I don't need color or auto-routing. As to the Quest and the StreetPilots, that's even worse. I will never spend $600, $1000, and up on a GPS, no matter what it does; especially on a strictly car unit. I still know how to read AAA maps and ask directions at gas stations. I don't mind spending $400 for this capability on a multiple purpose unit, but not on a single purpose unit. Why Garmin still refuses to add SD technology to their very expensive handhelds is beyond me. A simple addition of SD would turn them into long distance auto nav units. What's stopping them? Like I said, I'm waiting to see what Magellan will respond with. tm Quote Link to comment
+TheOfficeMaven Posted September 22, 2004 Share Posted September 22, 2004 Why Garmin still refuses to add SD technology to their very expensive handhelds is beyond me. A simple addition of SD would turn them into long distance auto nav units. What's stopping them? I completely agree. Like I said, I'm waiting to see what Magellan will respond with. Here's part of the answer to this. Magellan has just announced their new RoadMate 300 line (which has 115 MB internal memory and an SD slot). Here's a couple of links to it: Magellan RoadMate 300 Magellan News & Events This unit more matches the Garmin Quest, but I believe that Magellan is also going to announce a hand-held line to compeat with the 60C(S)/76C(S) as well. It's totally beyond me why Garmin can't/won't give us SD technology??? Quote Link to comment
Dukie 'n' Dad Posted September 22, 2004 Share Posted September 22, 2004 Vista C owner. We took a trip from Massachusetts to Virginia recently and used the Auto-Routing. Basically, I found that if you load the detailed maps in the areas you want to have the detail and then are careful with setting waypoints, the unit does fine. For example, I didn't have the New York maps (way too much data for just a highway passing) and just set a waypoint on the Tappen-Zee bridge. So long as you generally know the highways you need to take, you don't need the details. That said, don't expect the Vista to remind you properly for the exits when traveling through the non-detail areas. Once you get local and have the detail, the mapping works great. I know much of the Boston area, but have found some nice short cuts when i consulted the Vista C for directions. As for caching, I spend most of my time on the 'compass' page with just "Distance' and 'Bearing' as the only numerical fields on the page. It's really all you need. I do wish that it was easier to swap between Topo and Street maps. Right now, I need to go to the map manager and uncheck all of whatever type is in the way. Anyone know a better way? Quote Link to comment
Neo_Geo Posted September 22, 2004 Share Posted September 22, 2004 60C owner Sometimes you just get a craving for a certain food (like Taco Bell or KFC) while you're on the road. Unless you have the detailed maps along your route, you won't be able to search for the nearest such POIs. Also, sometimes you are forced to make an unplanned emergency exit from the highway (baby with a soiled diaper). Sometimes, when you exit the highway, the entrance is NOT the same way you got off! (this is all from real-world eperience). When you go back the way you came and there ain't no entrance back onto the highway, it sure is nice to have those detailed maps to help you find your way back on again! ...Just my 2¢ Quote Link to comment
+TheOfficeMaven Posted September 22, 2004 Share Posted September 22, 2004 Neo_Geo, Yes, but on a long trip, you're just as stuck with the 60C(S) as you are with the Legend C/Vista C (i.e. 56 MB of maps vs. 24 MB of maps isn't going to make that big of a difference in our long trip example). Thus, it all still goes back to what the units were designed for, and in my eyes, they were only designed for auto-routing around small areas (such as around your home town) and so the 24 MB vs 56 MB of memory isn't that big of a deal. Just my $0.02... Quote Link to comment
+TheOfficeMaven Posted September 22, 2004 Share Posted September 22, 2004 I do wish that it was easier to swap between Topo and Street maps. Right now, I need to go to the map manager and uncheck all of whatever type is in the way. Anyone know a better way? Yes, there is a bit easier way. While you are in the map manager, hit the menu button and a popup menu will appear allowing you to hide or show whole maps (i.e. Show/Hide City Select North America, Show/Hide Topo United States, etc.) instead of having to hide all of the sub-maps one at a time form the map manager. I hope this helps some... Quote Link to comment
Dukie 'n' Dad Posted September 22, 2004 Share Posted September 22, 2004 The only problem is the amount of data some of the maps have. Might be different out west, but a journey from Boston to Washington DC using MapSource 6.0 requires 130+mb of data. NONE of the handheld devices from Garmin would suffice. That is roughly only a 7 to 8 hour trip. I'm sure that with some careful clicking, you can bring that memory requirement down to the level of a 76CS, but never a 60 or VistaC. All because you HAVE to load all the NYC, Boston, Hartford, etc. city details that you never need. Besides, most of the exits around here have signs telling you what is off each exit for food lodging, gas etc. Even so, on our trip, I set some waypoints for our favorite places and there was always something pretty close. Then again, we don't like to use the big chains and prefer to try little mom and pop locations. Try to find the Port Clinton Hotel in Port Clinton PA in your MapSource. Less than 2 miles from the Cabella's in Hamburg, PA and some of the best food for the $$ I've ever had. I agree that sometimes turns and exits are good to have, but what I really wish I could do is define a route and only have the details along the route say 2 miles of the highway load. Or, forget the food, gas, etc and just load the road data. I guess my point is that I love the Vista for what it CAN do. And I don't really see all that much value in the 60 series as most times I need more map memory, even the 60 doesn't have enough. Pretty tough to beat the Vista C for local routing and the color screen is very nice to look at. Lets not forget that it is also nice and small and easy to pack along. Quote Link to comment
Dukie 'n' Dad Posted September 22, 2004 Share Posted September 22, 2004 Office Maven, Cool. Never realized there was yet another pop-up menu there. Thanks Quote Link to comment
+Garmin Guy Posted September 22, 2004 Share Posted September 22, 2004 I live in Europe and lets face it if you plan first where you are going then the memory of a 60c or cs is enough....we all know where we are roughly going to travel.... I use the 60cs because it is an allround GPS...car...bike ....walking...what more do you need.....? Quote Link to comment
Neo_Geo Posted September 22, 2004 Share Posted September 22, 2004 (edited) Neo_Geo, Yes, but on a long trip, you're just as stuck with the 60C(S) as you are with the Legend C/Vista C (i.e. 56 MB of maps vs. 24 MB of maps isn't going to make that big of a difference in our long trip example). Thus, it all still goes back to what the units were designed for, and in my eyes, they were only designed for auto-routing around small areas (such as around your home town) and so the 24 MB vs 56 MB of memory isn't that big of a deal. Just my $0.02... 56 minus 24 = 32. That is considerably MORE THAN DOUBLE the memory. To demonstrate the difference, I used METROGUIDE 5 maps and started with ALL of Manhattan and worked my way down I-95 south. When I got to 24MB, the selected maps stopped just short of Wilmington, Delaware! (232 miles) Wanna guess how far 56MB got me? Almost to Savannah, Georgia. And that includes ALL of Baltimore, Maryland Washington, DC, and Richmond, Virginia! See if you can hold off peeing for 496 miles the next time you go on a road trip. That's how far away Savannah, Georgia is from Wilmington, Delaware. And if that's not enough memory for you, then buy a 76C/S which has double the memory of the 60 series. Granted, I was using MetroGuide maps and not City Select, but it still accurately reflects the DIFFERENCE in how much data can be stored between the two units. BTW - it's 728 driving miles from Manhattan to Savannah. I'd call that a long road trip! Anything further than that, and I'm flying. Edited September 22, 2004 by Neo_Geo Quote Link to comment
+TheOfficeMaven Posted September 22, 2004 Share Posted September 22, 2004 Garmin Guy, Exactly! And the same exact thing can go for the Legend C/Vista C as well. And that's my whole point... i.e. The units are near identical in every manner so it just boils down to personal preference is all. I prefer the Legend C/Vista C over the 60C(S) due to its much smaller size and the ease of use of the click stick. I'm not saying that it's any better than the 60C(S), but only that I prefer it more. Since the two units are so similar, I don't see how anyone else can argue differently (i.e. you may prefer the 60C(S) over the Legend C/Vista C, and that's fine, but that doesn't make it any better). Personally, I'd prefer to save the extra $80 - $100 on the price of the unit and put it towards the price of the City Select maps for auto-routing instead. If someone feels that the difference in memory between the two units (i.e. 56 MB vs. 24 MB) is that big of a deal, then they'd be much better off getting the 76C(S) instead (which has something like 115 MB). Again though, even the 76C(S) is functionally equivalent to the Legend C/Vista C just like the 60C(S) is. So, it all boils down to personal preference and the small differences in memory (and some would also argue about the antenna, but I can't tell any difference between them at all so that's a mute point as far as I'm concerned). Again, just my $0.02... Quote Link to comment
+TheOfficeMaven Posted September 22, 2004 Share Posted September 22, 2004 Neo_Geo, This just reinforces my point all the more... Neither the 60C(S) nor the Legend C/Vista C were designed for long distance auto-routing. If you want to do that, you'd be much better off getting a Quest. And if 32 MB makes that big of a difference to someone, then they would indeed be much better off getting a 76C(S) instead. I live in Southern California, and the 24 MBs available in the Vista C can hold all of the City Select maps and the TOPO maps I need for a long weekend of caching, hiking, etc. Thus, I don't need anything else (and the extra 32 MB in the 60C(S) won't make any real difference for me - sure, it would be nice, but it's not at all necessary). Thus, it makes no sense for me to have one since I prefer the Vista C over the 60CS any way. We can bicker back and forth about this all day long, but my point is simply that someone looking for a good color GPSr for use in geocaching, hiking, lite auto-routing, etc. shouldn't rule out the Legend C/Vista C models. Everyone here seems quick to rule them out simply because they only have 24 MB of memory. I say go take a look at the two and decide for yourself which one is better for you. Enough said... Quote Link to comment
Neo_Geo Posted September 22, 2004 Share Posted September 22, 2004 Sorry if I misinterpreted your point. I guess it sounded to me, when you said "56 MB of maps vs. 24 MB of maps isn't going to make that big of a difference...", like 56 vs 24 doesn't make much of a difference! I don't know how I got the wrong idea. I think my example demonstrates that it makes a HUGE difference! Someone who wants to autoroute from New York to Washington would want the 60 series. Someone who wants Boston to Miami should opt for the 76. Someone who wants to go from the Bronx to Philadelphia would do fine with the eTrex C series. MY POINT is that New York to South Carolina is hardly considered "auto-routing around small areas (such as around your home town)". I've never felt "stuck with the 60C(S)". IF all you want is something for "auto-routing around small areas (such as around your home town)", then sure - the eTrex C is a fine choice. But the 56MB of the 60 series is a fairly robust amount of memory which more than satisfies the needs of a majority of users. 'nuff said. Quote Link to comment
+julgeo Posted September 22, 2004 Share Posted September 22, 2004 I am painstakingly trying to deicde between the 76CS and 60CS and while I agree, I wish they would just add a SD port and be done with it. How much better is the basemap between the 76 and 60? According to the Garmin website the 76 has a better basemap. Recreational Routable Basemap Vs. America's Autoroute. Does anyone know how big of a difference it would be on long trips? I really like the look of the 60CS but like the extra memory and better basemap of the 76CS. Has anyone used a 76? How is the feel, it looks odd with the buttons on the top. I can't find a store anywhere that has one to "get a feel" for it. HELP ME. I'm dying to buy but want to make sure I get the right one. Thanks Quote Link to comment
+wickedsprint Posted September 22, 2004 Share Posted September 22, 2004 Open up a rand mcnally atlas, now look at the large pages, the 76 series basemap is identical to that..at least for 5 random cities I checked...it is very impressive. Quote Link to comment
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