Gauge Station Ref Mark - does it have a PID?

[vulture1957]

I found this USGS Gaging Station Reference Mark on an old bridge. I don't see a PID for it. it's at 35° 32' 45" N , 97° 58' 10" W  but it doesn't show on the USGS map (National Geodetic Survey Data Explorer (noaa.gov). Am I searching for the wrong thing, or in the wrong place?

Edited March 30, 2021 by vulture1957

[Bill93]

Don't confuse USGS (US Geological Survey) who made the maps versus the NGS (National Geodetic Survey, formerly called US Coast and Geodetic Survey).

NGS maintains the master control network of lat/lon and elevation references. USGS worked off of those and set many additional disks or other marks as needed for mapping and water monitoring.

If NGS happened to find a USGS point convenient they may have measured it to their standards and added it to their data base, but that is a minority of USGS marks.

USGS never computerized their data sheets, and most are only available from filing cabinets.

[Z15]

Note  

USGS is an agency in the Dept of the Interior

NGS is an agnecy in the Dept of Commerce, Nat'l Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration (NOAA)

 

They have/had different mandate/missions. USGS does NOT publish a lot of their work unless requested.  I knew of the USGS guys at a local water level branch as they had a field office in our DOT bldg. They monitored water levels and did stream surveys on those tributary to Lake Michigan and Superior. Their info was office specific and a lot of the data collection has been automated now. 

Edited April 13, 2021 by Z15

[wister6813]

I am curious about the location of this disk.  However, the coordinates provided don't appear to be the location of an old bridge, or where a gaging station would be located.  These coordinates plot to a location in a field.  

[kayakbird]

A reference mark could be some distance from the primary location.  Wonder if there might be a series of monitoring wells having to do with that railroad yard 600 yards to the northeast.  MEL

[Bill93]

I would think a reference mark would be within easy taping distance of the station mark, and a gaging station would be adjacent to a stream or body of water.

 

Could there be a typo in the coordinates?

[DaveD]

USGS stream gage reference marks are not like reference marks for a triangulation station.  There is no station mark only the stream gage.  They don't typically measure the distance from the RM to the gage but rather perform leveling to determine the height difference.  Like Wister6813 and Bill93, I think the coordinates are a typo.  USGS has set thousands of these marks across the country and only a very tiny fraction have ever been accurately connected to the National Spatial Reference System maintained by NGS.  In some cases the gage has long since been removed but the RM remains.

[kayakbird]

Stumbled upon this tidbit of history on the word 'gage'.  MEL 

https://www.usgs.gov/faqs/why-does-usgs-use-spelling-gage-instead-gauge?qt-news_science_products=0#qt-news_science_products

[+outdoorsoccer]

5 hours ago, kayakbird said:

Stumbled upon this tidbit of history on the word 'gage'.  MEL 

https://www.usgs.gov/faqs/why-does-usgs-use-spelling-gage-instead-gauge?qt-news_science_products=0#qt-news_science_products

A pretty cool article.  Thanks for sharing it.

 

ODS