garmin custom maps questions

[majormajor42]

I didn't want to hijack that other firmware thread with my questions:

 

first time hearing about the custom map option. looks really cool if it works. trying to read up on some words used in that other thread by searching on google.

 

Is "raster" any map loaded with this custom map option? I'll probably start with scanning a trail map.

 

The trails on that map will not be routable, right? I've been adding my tracks to openstreetmaps in the hopes of eventually getting routable trail maps in my area.

 

Are there some new databases/indexes popping up on the internet with lists of maps that people can use with this feature?

 

what is the best way to get some satellite imagery on my 400t?

 

so far I haven't needed the extra flash memory. will adding lots of maps require me to add a flash card?

[+Rifty]

Google earth is your friend, see here for a step by step : http://garmin.blogs.com/softwareupdates/trail-tech/

 

I used this method to overlay a map from 1856 and put it on the gps so I could see where the mine shaft from the old village pit is now. Works very well:-

 

 

I've also tried the satellite images from google earth but need a quick/easy way of getting more then one screen grab at a time to make satellite imagery on the gps practical. There's also the legality/copyright side of things to consider...

[+Redwoods Mtn Biker]

Is "raster" any map loaded with this custom map option? I'll probably start with scanning a trail map.

 

Raster maps are made from images -- .jpg, .tif, .pdf, etc. They are the opposite of vector maps which are constructed on the fly from datasets - lines, points and polygons. Raster imagery is much more resource and memory intensive than vector.

 

what is the best way to get some satellite imagery on my 400t?

 

My personal preference at this point is TopoFusion, but you'll have to buy the Pro package -- $75, I think.

[+Rockin Roddy]

I'm still a bit lost in all this as well and would like to ask a few questions...PLEASE, don't see this as hijacking or trying to start problems, these are valid questions.

 

Adding a "trail map"...wouldn't the map need to be fairly accurate to work? In the case of the 1856 map as described above, is that map very accurate?

 

How much (what size) can be added to any Garmin units? Is there still a limit?

[+Rockin Roddy]

Is "raster" any map loaded with this custom map option? I'll probably start with scanning a trail map.

 

Raster maps are made from images -- .jpg, .tif, .pdf, etc. They are the opposite of vector maps which are constructed on the fly from datasets - lines, points and polygons. Raster imagery is much more resource and memory intensive than vector.

 

what is the best way to get some satellite imagery on my 400t?

 

My personal preference at this point is TopoFusion, but you'll have to buy the Pro package -- $75, I think.

 

If you plan to use the rastor maps, you'll definitely need your "flash" storage.

[+splashy]

Custom maps is so cool, if you do it the right way you have a perfect map.

 

Capture the map with a screen capture program.

If needed, cut the map with a program like photoshop.

 

Lay this 'picture' over google earth as described by garmin.

This is the most critical part, be sure to georeference as good as possible.

Be aware, you can use any picture, as long as you can align.

You result map should be very accurate.

[+Rifty]

In the case of the 1856 map as described above, is that map very accurate?

 

How much (what size) can be added to any Garmin units? Is there still a limit?

 

Yes, it is accurate - if you follow that link, you overlay the image onto google earth and stretch it to fit the satellite imagery (you can make it transparent) so can be 100% confident about it's accuracy - surprising how close to scale the mapping is from back then tbh.

 

Limit - I still believe the limit to be 100 1024x1024 tiles, but I just read that on here, no experience of the limit or what happens when above it.

 

I'm keen to get satellite imagery for a decent region of the UK onto my oregon - if anyone has found a good way of going about this yet, please share your experiences/tips : screen grabs of google earth and overlaying them back into google earth manually is an awfully laborious process. Has to be a better way...

 

Cheers.

[+Rockin Roddy]

THANKS Splashy and Rifty for your responses...sounds like these maps are a great feature! Will keep watching, I am stll concerned as to size limits...

 

Good luck on the UK mapping!! I thought there were a few tips and tricks in the other thread, but could be mistaken.

[+Maingray]

A lot of mapping apps now come with a native export to the Colorado/OR/D specifically for this purpose, so really any map / aerial imagery from any source will now work and will likely be geo-referenced. LOve the use of the historical map up there!

 

Some tips on the original creation (of course, once youhave a map file, you can share with others, easy drag and drop onto the unit e.g. https://forums.garmin.com/forumdisplay.php?f=206 )

 

Some tips:

 

http://www.gpsfix.net/garmin-custom-maps-tips-random-stuff/

http://www.gpsfix.net/garmin-custom-maps-getting-started/

http://www.gpsfix.net/garmin-custom-maps-t...gps-visualizer/

http://gpstracklog.com/2009/10/garmin-custom-maps-day-2.html

http://gpstracklog.com/2009/10/garmin-custom-map-tools.html

 

Example from gpsfix

Edited November 20, 2009 by Maingray

[majormajor42]

thank you. those links, and the links in those links really showed me everything I needed to know. I'll try it soon.

 

That last link had some good advice in particular to my flash drive question. It advises putting these .kmz maps on the flash drive so that way, if you "brick it", all you have to do is pull the flash drive and restart.

 

At this point it seems quite clear that the trails on these raster/kmz maps are not routable unless you do additional tracing, custom mapping or something. I will continue to load my tracks to openstreetmap for the purpose of helping create that database of routable streets, bikepaths, and pedestrian/hiking ways.

 

After all that, I'm still a little confused by the copyright issue. Why should it be a problem for me to scan a map that I have paid for, and put it on my GPS for my own personal use. I certainly wouldn't share that map with anyone like with all the Park Service maps in Maingray's first link. Is there something in the process, like when putting the scanned map image on Google Earth, that exposes it to file sharing in some way?

[+zaphir]

A lot of mapping apps now come with a native export to the Colorado/OR/D specifically for this purpose, so really any map / aerial imagery from any source will now work and will likely be geo-referenced. LOve the use of the historical map up there!

 

Some tips on the original creation (of course, once youhave a map file, you can share with others, easy drag and drop onto the unit e.g. https://forums.garmin.com/forumdisplay.php?f=206 )

 

Some tips:

 

http://www.gpsfix.net/garmin-custom-maps-tips-random-stuff/

http://www.gpsfix.net/garmin-custom-maps-getting-started/

http://www.gpsfix.net/garmin-custom-maps-t...gps-visualizer/

http://gpstracklog.com/2009/10/garmin-custom-maps-day-2.html

http://gpstracklog.com/2009/10/garmin-custom-map-tools.html

 

Example from gpsfix

 

Maingray: I am the new owner of a Garmin 550 with base maps....no topo. I would love to have a picture like you showed on your Oregon. Can you point me in the right direction so I can make my 550 look like y our picture?

 

Thanks,

 

Zaph

AKA: 7.62

[+splashy]

See my last reply.( 4 5 MAILS UP)

[+Maingray]

t. Is there something in the process, like when putting the scanned map image on Google Earth, that exposes it to file sharing in some way?

 

Nope.

[+zaphir]

See my last reply.( 4 5 MAILS UP)

 

Splashy: Got it...between what you wrote and the links posted by Maingray, I think I can manage. It looks like it will take some time however. A few dedicated hours should take care of it.

 

Thank you...

 

Zaph

[+ras_oscar]

since you refuse to threadjack, I will. Has anhone ever thought about collaboration to create trail maps? there are a bunch of mountain bike trails in San Antonio, and Columbia MD has a whole network of paved bike paths. Not to mention the network of fire roads around most every large body of water on the east coast. Wonderful places to cache, and would be even more plesant with a map to tell you where the trails were in relationship to the caches. I have been recording track logs as I find the caches. With no place to save them they just get erased at the end of the trip. A true waste of data.

[+user13371]

ras_oscar, http://www.bikely.com has absolutely nothing to do with the original topic, so I won't help you hijack this thread.

[majormajor42]

since you refuse to threadjack, I will. Has anhone ever thought about collaboration to create trail maps? there are a bunch of mountain bike trails in San Antonio, and Columbia MD has a whole network of paved bike paths. Not to mention the network of fire roads around most every large body of water on the east coast. Wonderful places to cache, and would be even more plesant with a map to tell you where the trails were in relationship to the caches. I have been recording track logs as I find the caches. With no place to save them they just get erased at the end of the trip. A true waste of data.

 

I'll help you threadjack my own thread since my OP questions have basically been answered. I have been actively collaborating the last month with openstreetmap. I was able to load some of my old saved tracks from mapsource and now every time I get back from a hike I load those tracks as well. Like anything else, it might require a few minutes investment the first time you do it, but it is really easy after you get the hang of it. Here is a link to some of the trails in Harriman State Park, NY that I have been working on. Just make sure your map edits are based on your own experiences and other open domain information that is out there. While it will be great to have routable trails on my GPS, it is also very nice to have the trail map that I paid for from the local trail conference (that I support).

 

Once you upload the trails, edit the map, and then put it on your GPS, you should be able to see geocaches that you have also loaded amoung those trails.

 

A quick look at Columbia, MD shows that some of those trails, footpaths, and bikepaths may already be on openstreetmap. you might be able to add to this.

[+ras_oscar]

since you refuse to threadjack, I will. Has anhone ever thought about collaboration to create trail maps? there are a bunch of mountain bike trails in San Antonio, and Columbia MD has a whole network of paved bike paths. Not to mention the network of fire roads around most every large body of water on the east coast. Wonderful places to cache, and would be even more plesant with a map to tell you where the trails were in relationship to the caches. I have been recording track logs as I find the caches. With no place to save them they just get erased at the end of the trip. A true waste of data.

 

I'll help you threadjack my own thread since my OP questions have basically been answered. I have been actively collaborating the last month with openstreetmap. I was able to load some of my old saved tracks from mapsource and now every time I get back from a hike I load those tracks as well. Like anything else, it might require a few minutes investment the first time you do it, but it is really easy after you get the hang of it. Here is a link to some of the trails in Harriman State Park, NY that I have been working on. Just make sure your map edits are based on your own experiences and other open domain information that is out there. While it will be great to have routable trails on my GPS, it is also very nice to have the trail map that I paid for from the local trail conference (that I support).

 

Once you upload the trails, edit the map, and then put it on your GPS, you should be able to see geocaches that you have also loaded amoung those trails.

 

A quick look at Columbia, MD shows that some of those trails, footpaths, and bikepaths may already be on openstreetmap. you might be able to add to this.

what's the best place for me to score a practicum on adding my tracklogs to my openstreetmaps? Not interested in routable, jut would like to make my previous trips available to myself and others.

[+ras_oscar]

OK, now i'm confused. I looked at the link you gave me and indeed the trails I mentioned are in there. However I've recently Dlded those tiles from this link http://garmin.na1400.info/routable.php and none of the trails appeared. Are there more than one OpenStreetMap databases?

Edited November 21, 2009 by ras_oscar

[majormajor42]

the openstreetmap wiki is what I used to figure it all out.

 

BTW, I just read your recent messages to see what GPSr you have. I see you were having trouble with getting the .img files onto your GPSr. Did you ever work that out? I use this site for downloading to my Garmin. That way it puts all the regions I pick into just one .img file for me.

 

So, I loaded my tracks up two ways. My old tracks were saved on mapsource as the default type of file. I forget what they are called ( .mps???). The wiki says to use gpsbabel to convert to .gpx. I found it unnecessary to use GPSbabel since mapsource can do it too. Open the old track file and simply save as... .gpx in mapsource. Before saving, you can edit your tracks a little in mapsource if you want. since I am loading up to a public website, I removed the beginning or ends of my tracks that had me coming going to my house.

 

now that you have .gpx tracks, go to openstreetmap and hit the link at the top to upload tracks. you might need to register if you haven't already.

 

The other way to upload, with my 400t, but haven't tried this with my older Vista yet, is to just plug the GPSr in to the USB cable. Just upload the .gpx off the GPSr directly. No file conversion is necessary. This is what I do now when I return from a hike. I turn off the GPSr or the tracking well before I return home, for privacy again. Don't know why I am paranoid about this.

 

What I described above takes me a shorter time then the wait for my computer to start up now that I have done it a few times.

 

Now, at your convenience, once the track has loaded into the database, you'll get an email, you can edit the map. This will mean, left clicking the mouse a lot to create a "way" over your trace on the map. Then tagging the "way" appropriately: bikepath, footway, track... I'm still figuring out how to tag properly but as more experienced mappers told me, the important thing is getting the lines on the map.

 

after a day, the map should now have all the edits that you have made. It is not instantaneous like wikipedia. then download a new .img that includes your edits and have fun.

 

I kinda glossed over the editing part. let me know if you need help with that part. lots written on their wiki but mostly by Europeans and some stuff is lost in translation. Even the British have different terms for roads, hiking trails, dirt roads. Like I said, I'm still figuring out how to best tag my ways.

[+John Drake]

what's the best place for me to score a practicum on adding my tracklogs to my openstreetmaps? Not interested in routable, jut would like to make my previous trips available to myself and others.

Check out the Open Street Map wiki. Here's the Beginner's Guide:

 

http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Beginners%27_Guide

 

Since you mentioned mountain bike trails, take a look at Openmtbmap.org to get an idea of what is possible with Open Street Map data. Openmtbmap.org produces specialized routable mountain bike maps based on Open Street Map data:

 

http://openmtbmap.org/

 

Sadly, for the moment, Openmtbmap.org has maps for just about everywhere, except North America, so this will be of limited use for you. It does demonstrate one important concept of Open Street Map though: the data you upload from your tracks is saved in the database in a completely independent format. The data can be then converted into all kinds of other things, such as online maps, special hiking or biking maps, etc. The Garmin-compatible maps produced from this data are just side-projects. (This is perhaps why you could not find your hiking trails in the maps at http://garmin.na1400.info/routable.php. The maps there either do not include hiking trails, or they were updated before the hiking trails were added.)

 

At any rate, please do add your trails to the Open Street Map database. We can then all benefit from them. (Plus mapping is almost as addictive as Geocaching.)

[majormajor42]

OK, now i'm confused. I looked at the link you gave me and indeed the trails I mentioned are in there. However I've recently Dlded those tiles from this link http://garmin.na1400.info/routable.php and none of the trails appeared. Are there more than one OpenStreetMap databases?

 

sorry, I started my reply above without seeing your latest post. I had not yet tried the last step of getting the trails from openstreet onto my GPSr. I was going to experiment with it. Reading Gladstone's comments, it looks like it might not be that easy. I'll still be uploading my tracks and editing the map like he said. Will hope for a solution to the last step of getting those trails on the GPSr. One idea, to bring the thread full circle back to the new garmin custom maps is to use .kmz files but I don't think you can do it on a Vista.

[majormajor42]

It's working! I think... Of course, I'll have to try all this with the my Vista but the 400t is doing it. I loaded up the .img file of my area of NY that had the trails that I already added. They have indeed showed up on my GPSr. They are not nice little red dotted lines like on the opensteetmap. They show up as gray/white lines, something like dirt roads. but they are there and that is the cool part.

 

They seem to be routable as well. I'll have to play with the profile settings for routing. I'm still not entirely used to the settings on the Oregon. It was a Bday present a few months ago. Either the Vista is easier to use or I'm just used to it. Anyhow, as I speak, it is simulating a trip along one of my trails. My ETA is about a half hour moving at about 1.5 mph along the trail that I rendered. How cool is that?

 

Like I said, I'll try this again with my Vista and see if it works. Some of the trails that I edited a few days ago are not there so there are time delays involved. If it works with the vista then maybe I'll test it using the map portions from Columbia, MD.

[+mjcongleton]

Does anybody know it I can make a USGS quadrangle one of my custom maps? I have some historic quadrangles that I can convert to jpg, I'm just wondering if a quadrangle may be too big to download into the GPS.

[snowfleurys]

Does anybody know it I can make a USGS quadrangle one of my custom maps? I have some historic quadrangles that I can convert to jpg, I'm just wondering if a quadrangle may be too big to download into the GPS.

Depends on the size of the quadrangle and the resolution of the scanning. The one USGS DRG I looked at had a pixel size of 2.4 meters; at that resolution a .kmz file should hold about 15 by 15 miles.

[+DyverDown]

I have a JPEG of Short Hills trails that I am able to upload through Google Earth to my Oregon GPS and view there, but it turns out with a white background. I have left the draw number <50 and this helps, but is there any way of making the background transparent, but keeping the trails - I have Photoshop but cannot seem to accomplish it...

 

HELP

 

[majormajor42]

I have a JPEG of Short Hills trails that I am able to upload through Google Earth to my Oregon GPS and view there, but it turns out with a white background. I have left the draw number <50 and this helps, but is there any way of making the background transparent, but keeping the trails - I have Photoshop but cannot seem to accomplish it...

 

 

I would guess not. It, the GPSr, does not know the difference between the trails and the background. It is all on the surface of the same jpeg. looking at the example map image in the first reply above, it would be impossible to somehow automatically remove the white background parts and just leave the black trail/road parts. You would have to perform some intermediary step of tracing the trails or maybe cutting out the many polygons of the background between the trails.

 

I guess some sort of transparency would be nice in this case too, just as you can adjust the degree of transparency of the jpeg on google earth. All we got it the <50 or >50 adjustment. maybe later releases of firmware will have more options.

[majormajor42]

Success. I now have some scanned trail maps on my GPS. the map took about eight scans since it is large. I initially used photoshop to merge all the maps back together to make one big JPEG. That was a mistake. As maingrey's links point out, each jpeg must be less than a 1 to 3 MB but less than 1 works better. So as a test I used a smaller jpeg, like the Central Park pre-aligned kmz file as a test, and it worked, so I knew I had done something wrong. I went back and arranged each of the eight JPEGs individually and put them in one folder. There are some minor misalignments but all in all, it is a nice image on my 400t. I set it up so only one profile will display these trail maps.

 

the central park map, which makes a good test:

https://forums.garmin.com/showthread.php?t=2644

 

oh, one more thing. when I uploaded the software on my 400t, I had to create the folder /garmin/CustomMaps/ myself. I guess I thought it would appear automatically based on what I read.

Edited November 30, 2009 by majormajor42