Moving a Cache

[+burgessfour]

Hi Everyone,

I am sure that there are threads about this already, but I did a search and I must not be wording it right or something because nothing that really applies is coming up for me.

We are having a problem with a cacher coming and raiding one of our caches. She doesn't log the find, but takes TB's (and coins too I suspect as they keep going missing) and "retrieves" them out of the cache. The nicer coins will probably never be heard from again, although one diabetes coin might have moved. No one has discovered it yet, but it is showing up in a different cache. It's kind of a long story how we discovered what she was doing....

Anyway, she is not a premium member and I was thinking of making the cache PM only and moving it a bit away and changing the coords but I'm not sure how far I can move it without having to archive it and make a new one.

Any feedback would be great or a link to an existing thread, and again, I'm sorry if this has already been an issue hashed over.

Thank you,

Shari of burgessfour

 

Editing to add that I just today discovered her previous visit to the cache when I examined her coin inventory and saw that she had been there on 9/22 as well as on 9/27 where she ran into another cacher (a whole other bizarre story).

Edited October 1, 2008 by burgessfour

[+hydnsek]

You can move an existing cache so long as it's under 528 feet (the proximity distance) using the Update Coordinates log. Only reviewers can update the coords for larger moves, and they usually request you archive the cache and submit a new listing, as the caching experience will be different from that of previous finders (something to consider even for smaller moves).

[+NeverSummer]

I've been asked to archive and resubmit when I tried to move 300ft. I'm guessing it really has to do with proximity and possibly the reviewer's discretion. I'm thinking of moving one of my caches 200ft down the road, but I may just archive and get a brand new cache out there to start fresh...but it's part of a series, so I'm still debating.

[+burgessfour]

Thanks! So it sounds from the two of you like it varies from reviewer to reviewer and case to case. Maybe I should email one of the reviewers and ask; I thought that there was a definite distance.

[+NeverSummer]

Thanks! So it sounds from the two of you like it varies from reviewer to reviewer and case to case. Maybe I should email one of the reviewers and ask; I thought that there was a definite distance.

I'm positive it will impact it more if it is more than the 528 feet. With our active reviewers, I'm sure email correspondence will suffice. As long as it doesn't get too close to another cache, they may ok to move and not archive. I'd check in with the reviewer that approved your cache...but our PDX reviewers are all very helpful!

 

Edit to add: Hydnsek would have a better grasp than I would, so I'd go with what they said...but you can try to contact reviewers to not archive it if that is what you want.

Edited October 1, 2008 by NeverSummer

[+burgessfour]

Thanks! So it sounds from the two of you like it varies from reviewer to reviewer and case to case. Maybe I should email one of the reviewers and ask; I thought that there was a definite distance.

I'm positive it will impact it more if it is more than the 528 feet. With our active reviewers, I'm sure an email will suffice. As long as it doesn't get too close to another cache, they may ok to move and not archive. I'd check in with the reviewer that approved your cache...but our PDX reviewers are all very helpful!

Yes, Thundereggs is awesome and has been a lot of help with some of my past questions-I will shoot her an email. And NeverSummer, since you live in this same area shoot me an email if you would like her geocaching name which I finally found out through another local cacher who is having problems with her. It could impact some of your caches too.

 

Mods-I think I just need to email my reviewer so you can close this thread.

 

Thanks!

[+NeverSummer]

email sent!

[+wimseyguy]

You are really asking two separate questions.

1. How far can I move my cache? hydensek has already given you this answer, 528' without reviewer assistance, beyond that they need to make the edit for you.

 

2. You can call your cache whatever you want; it isn't covered in the guidelines. I've seen the same name used on two different caches, I've seen cachers archive one, place another 50' away and call it version two, I've seen caches that are miles apart called version two.

 

But the real question is at what distance does it become a distinctly different caching experience? That's when you want to think about a new name and location.

[+burgessfour]

This is the response I received from one of our great reviewers:

 

"You can change the coordinates by yourself for up to 528 feet. More

than that would take the cache away from the place you've originally

intended to bring people to, and in that case we would encourage you

to archive the existing cache and create a new one, because it would

be a new caching experience.

 

However, also be aware that the way to change coordinates, even if we

did it for you, is to post a coordinate change log on the cache page.

That log will be sent to anyone who is watching your cache, even if

you change it to a member's only cache and the watcher isn't a member.

If the person you are trying to avoid has a watch on the cache page,

then they will know where the cache is, even if they cannot see the

cache page anymore. There is no way to know who is watching your

cache.

 

The only way to do what you want to do without the watch list email

going out is to archive the cache page and create a new one member's

only from the start. I would recommend that you do not mention your

suspicions on the cache page.

 

ThunderEggs 1"

 

I had not thought about the watchlist issue, and wouldn't have had she not been so helpful as to bring it up. So given that, my only option is to archive, move it, and post it again as a PM only cache. I'm thinking on what the best course of action (or lack of) would be. Perhaps I should just state on the cache page to please not drop TB's or coins in the cache, but not mention why so as not to cast blame or anger anyone?

Just thinking out loud....

Thanks for everyone's input,

Shari

[+J-Way]

Something I'm not clear on... is a geocacher simply retrieving TB's and coins from your cache and logging the retrieval here at Geocaching.com, or is someone stealing TB's and coins without logging them?

 

If the person (people?) are logging the retrievals, then nothing wrong is occuring. There are several people around here who "collect" coins and travel bugs. They go to various caches (even ones they've already visited) and grab all the TB's they can find. But they do log the retrieval here so the TB is shown in their possession. Typically, they carry them around from event to event, then eventually start a new "TB Hotel/Prison". I don't agree with this practice, but they technically aren't doing anything wrong.

 

If the coins disappear but are still listed as residing in your cache, then you have a thief in the area. This thief may or may not be a geocacher. Your best bet is to archive the cache and create a new one (PM Only) in a different location. Move it far enough and hide it well enough that a muggle thief will have lots of trouble finding it. If you hide it too well then provide a better hint to help legitimate seekers.

[+briansnat]

But the real question is at what distance does it become a distinctly different caching experience? That's when you want to think about a new name and location.

 

Agreed. Once it's moved enough to become a different caching experience it should be archived and a new cache submitted. The distance of the move can vary a great deal. Sometimes a move of 20 feet can entirely change the nature of the hunt. Sometimes a quarter mile move will have little essential affect on the hunt.

[+burgessfour]

Something I'm not clear on... is a geocacher simply retrieving TB's and coins from your cache and logging the retrieval here at Geocaching.com, or is someone stealing TB's and coins without logging them?

 

If the person (people?) are logging the retrievals, then nothing wrong is occuring. There are several people around here who "collect" coins and travel bugs. They go to various caches (even ones they've already visited) and grab all the TB's they can find. But they do log the retrieval here so the TB is shown in their possession. Typically, they carry them around from event to event, then eventually start a new "TB Hotel/Prison". I don't agree with this practice, but they technically aren't doing anything wrong.

 

If the coins disappear but are still listed as residing in your cache, then you have a thief in the area. This thief may or may not be a geocacher. Your best bet is to archive the cache and create a new one (PM Only) in a different location. Move it far enough and hide it well enough that a muggle thief will have lots of trouble finding it. If you hide it too well then provide a better hint to help legitimate seekers.

 

Hi J-Way,

The cache in question is GC1G0G4 and there are no coins there. The person is also taking TB's without ever logging a "find" on the cache despite the fact that they have been there at least twice; once "caught" by a cacher so they signed the log but only with part of their caching name and the other time I found by going through their trackables list and seeing that they "retrieved" a coin out of my cache. but again, never logged the find online. I hope they are releasing them, but their actions are suspicious and I don't want my cache to be a TB and coin grave

[+yukionna]

With regards to your comment below (which I have hilighted in blue):

 

"and the other time I found by going through their trackables list and seeing that they "retrieved" a coin out of my cache. but again, never logged the find online."

 

...if you can SEE that a trackable was retrieved from a cache -- in other words, if you see that the trackable is in their trackable list -- then, technically that cacher has in fact logged the find online. You may not see an official log online because some people delete their log entries. So the cacher is not breaking any rules. You can easily see if the cacher is "releasing" them by putting a watch on the trackable. By doing that, you will receive an email notification when/if that cacher places the trackable into another cache.

 

Also, if you haven't done so already, you may want to give that cacher a chance to "drop" the trackable. Sometimes it can take upwards of a month for someone to get around to moving along a trackable.

 

I hope this helps.

Edited October 2, 2008 by yukionna

[+burgessfour]

With regards to your comment below (which I have hilighted in blue):

 

"and the other time I found by going through their trackables list and seeing that they "retrieved" a coin out of my cache. but again, never logged the find online."

 

...if you can SEE that a trackable was retrieved from a cache -- in other words, if you see that the trackable is in their trackable list -- then, technically that cacher has in fact logged the find online. When a trackable is retreived online, then Groundspeak automatically creates an online log entry. So the cacher is not breaking any rules. You can easily see if the cacher is "releasing" them by putting a watch on the trackable. By doing that, you will receive an email notification when/if that cacher places the trackable into another cache.

 

Also, if you haven't done so already, you may want to give that cacher a chance to "drop" the trackable. Sometimes it can take upwards of a month for someone to get around to moving along a trackable.

 

I hope this helps.

Thank you for your input,

What is odd about it though, is that in going through the logs for the cache, their name never shows up. In other words, they frequent the cache and take trackables, but have never once logged it is a find. If you look at the log, on Sept. 27th you can see there is no log for the second cacher at the site (the one Fakari Mama runs into). This person actually found the cache on Sept. 22nd as well, but no log just a trackable retrieval (which shows up on the trackables log, but not on the cache page). I find that really strange, but I could just be a bit paranoid. I love trackables and hate to think one of my caches is eating them....

 

I just reread your post-I would have been emailed a notification if they had logged a find on my cache whether they went back and deleted it or not.....

Edited October 2, 2008 by burgessfour

[+yukionna]

...

I just reread your post-I would have been emailed a notification if they had logged a find on my cache whether they went back and deleted it or not.....

 

Right. What I was referring to was that a cacher can take the trackable number and create a log entry for a trackable which would then show that the trackable was in their possession. They can do all this thru the trackable's page without posting anything to your cache listing. That explains why you aren't getting an email.

 

Over time, a small percentage of trackables go missing -- it is inevitable. The loss is due to many things -- pilferage, misplacement, forgetting where it was dropped so it isn't logged, etc. I wouldn't stress too much over it myself. You will drive yourself crazy, otherwise.