GPS help

[Washco]

Well, I have an old Megellan 315 and want to upgrade. I want to use it for hiking/car travel/geocaching. I want color and have basically narrowed it down to the Vista CX or the 60csx. I like the smallness of the vista but the sirf on the 60 seems like its way better reception wise. From what I can gather, what ever you get you will need to buy mapping software which is around $100 ballpark. So, it seems I can get a Vista and buy the software for about the price of the 60csx without the software. What do you guys think? Is the only thing Im losing to the 60csx the sirf antenna? Man there sure are a lot of choices. Thanks in advance.

[+DoubleBogie6]

Well, I have an old Megellan 315 and want to upgrade. I want to use it for hiking/car travel/geocaching. I want color and have basically narrowed it down to the Vista CX or the 60csx. I like the smallness of the vista but the sirf on the 60 seems like its way better reception wise. From what I can gather, what ever you get you will need to buy mapping software which is around $100 ballpark. So, it seems I can get a Vista and buy the software for about the price of the 60csx without the software. What do you guys think? Is the only thing Im losing to the 60csx the sirf antenna? Man there sure are a lot of choices. Thanks in advance.

 

Have owned 4 different models of Garmins and 3 Magellans used mostly for geocaching and street/trail negotiations. In my opinion the best GPSr on the market right now is the Delorme PN-20. The unit compares with the Garmin 60/76 CXS models as a receiver. The big plus, however, is the Delorme mapping software which is light years beyond Garmin and Magellan maps. King of the hill is Delorme topo 6. Been there done that!

[+media601]

I use both an etrex VentureCX (same as Vista wthout electronic compass and barometric altimeter) and a 60CSx. I find that for geocaching there is no real difference in accuracy. We don't have as much tree cover in winter and I haven't tried to boot the VentureCX in the middle of an urban canyon, which apparently is where the sirf chipset shines, so maybe I haven't given them a fair test yet.

 

I prefer the size and weight of the etrex, as well as the placement of the lanyard connection. I can hang it around my neck and just check it once in a while as I walk. There is no doubt the 60Csx does acquire faster and with more satellites, though there is little difference when it comes to zeroing in on the cache.

 

For my money and the way I like to use the GPSr, the VentureCX is the best value around. I don't miss the compass at all. You can't really go wrong with the 60CSx or CX either. I would vote for the CX.

 

I have no experience with the new Delorme but it does sound interesting. I have heard mixed reports about whether it auto routes addresses and auto recalcs after missed turns. Can anyone clarify this? Also I haven't heard much about Delorme customer service, but I can say Garmin has gone "above and beyond" for me.

[+Paulsan]

Well, I have an old Megellan 315 and want to upgrade. I want to use it for hiking/car travel/geocaching. I want color and have basically narrowed it down to the Vista CX or the 60csx. I like the smallness of the vista but the sirf on the 60 seems like its way better reception wise. From what I can gather, what ever you get you will need to buy mapping software which is around $100 ballpark. So, it seems I can get a Vista and buy the software for about the price of the 60csx without the software. What do you guys think? Is the only thing Im losing to the 60csx the sirf antenna? Man there sure are a lot of choices. Thanks in advance.

 

Have owned 4 different models of Garmins and 3 Magellans used mostly for geocaching and street/trail negotiations. In my opinion the best GPSr on the market right now is the Delorme PN-20. The unit compares with the Garmin 60/76 CXS models as a receiver. The big plus, however, is the Delorme mapping software which is light years beyond Garmin and Magellan maps. King of the hill is Delorme topo 6. Been there done that!

 

I didn't think the DeLorme had the Sirf III chipset. Wouldn't that make it a closer match to a Vista from a hardware perspective?

[MtnHermit]

I didn't think the DeLorme had the Sirf III chipset. Wouldn't that make it a closer match to a Vista from a hardware perspective?

The DeLorme has the exact same display as the Venture/Vista and I believe it has the same antenna/chipset. DeLorme clouds the receiver issue with their own trade-name.

 

From past experience, DeLorme's upgrade practices are horrific, that and the poor battery life were major reason to go Garmin vs DeLorme. In the month that I've owned the Venture Cx I've been very impressed.

 

Hermit

[+Paulsan]

I didn't think the DeLorme had the Sirf III chipset. Wouldn't that make it a closer match to a Vista from a hardware perspective?

The DeLorme has the exact same display as the Venture/Vista and I believe it has the same antenna/chipset. DeLorme clouds the receiver issue with their own trade-name.

 

From past experience, DeLorme's upgrade practices are horrific, that and the poor battery life were major reason to go Garmin vs DeLorme. In the month that I've owned the Venture Cx I've been very impressed.

 

Hermit

 

I didn't realize that DeLorme had such bad upgrade practices. How are they at customer support in general?

[WolfinSTL]

Garmin's customer service is ok but I have had issues with them in the past over their MapSource product.

 

I found this thread as I have had enough of crappy maps on my Garmin Rino 130 and am looking to upgrade. The Delorme PN-20 seems like a great replacement at first glance but i'm distressed to hear Delorme has upgrade issues. If you have more information please let us know

Edited February 28, 2007 by WolfinSTL

[+Red90]

Does the Delorme auto-route? The OP requested car use and auto-routing is a must for that application.

[+embra]

Let me see if I can cover the PN-20 issues...let me know if I miss something.

 

Customer service: Super. The thing I like the best about my PN-20 experience so far is that several DeLorme staff are active on the PN-20 forum DeLorme maintains. The image they have put forth is that of a company excited about a new product and willing to do whatever it takes to make it work right. A glaring firmware bug emerged early after release (the compass pointed the wrong way for a GOTO). While you have to scratch your head wondering how that made it out the door, they had a fix available within 5 days of the report. I was one of several people who discovered that their Li-ion battery was a dud. A call to customer support had a new travel pack in my hands within two days (and they emailed a prepaid label to send the bad battery back for examination). The only black mark so far in my book (and it's only gray right now, but darkening day by day) is a glaring silence in response to Robert Lipe's request for their communication specifications for him to include support for the PN-20 in GPSBabel. I'm guessing they're debating the issue.

 

Autorouting: The PN-20 does autoroute (to address blocks, not specific addresses) but at present does not auto recalc without your pressing a button to give it the go-ahead. I expect that we will see automatic recalc in a firmware upgrade soon. DeLorme acknowledges that the PN-20 is more of a recreational (hiking/biking) unit than an in-vehicle unit. I find that it's not bad if you can select a waypoint to which you want to route, but searches for addresses take a rather long time. Also, the search feature is dumb: you have to spell the entire street/city whatever--the unit doesn't try to guess or narrow down possibilities like my Quest does. The autorouting is a notch above Magellan's DirectRoute because you can insert via points, but otherwise is comparable (i.e, not as good as Garmin). The route quality is average; it leaves something to be desired sometimes. Currently, POIs like gas stations and restaurants are not available, but DeLorme has said they will be available in the future.

 

Oh, another neat feature (that doesn't quite work right at present--a fix promised) is that you can route on trails. TopoUSA6 has the most complete trail data that I have seen in a commercial map package--although that still is lacking in many places. You can add a track as a trail to maps you upload to the GPS.

 

Chipset: I don't know this. My PN-20 seems better than my Explorist 500 for satellite lock and position error estimate; Robert found the Explorist 600 to fare only a little worse than a 60csx.

 

Upgrade issues: I'm not sure what Hermit specifically was referring to. I'm guessing that he's talking about the fact that you don't save very much upgrading from one version to the next, rather than just buying a new version retail. Let's see if I can find a flyer in my drawer for a concrete example...ah, here: Street Atlas 2007 offered to me as a registered Street Atlas owner for $32 and free shipping. The flyer lists full retail at $39, and a Froogle search indicates the lowest online price to be $33 plus shipping. Not a good upgrade path, but on the other hand, these programs don't cost all that much, either.

 

My impression at this point--and I haven't put this through its paces in the field yet--are that the maps are great, and the PN-20 should be a pretty good GPS after the firmware gets some polish. It's a little ragged right now. The biggest problem at the moment is that there is no averaging or dampening of apparent position movement...whatever changes in position occur (even the random wandering while you are stopped) are added to tracks, odometers, speed averages, etc. It makes distance measures inflated to a point of not being very useful.

 

Happily, I am much more optimistic that needed changes will be implemented in a timely manner than I ever was with my Explorist.

[+Paulsan]

I would like to see how Gunpowder Falls State Park/Prettyboy Reservoir in Baltimore County MD looks on the Delorme. Do the trails show up?

Edited February 28, 2007 by Paulsan

[+embra]

I would like to see how Gunpowder Falls State Park/Prettyboy Reservoir in Baltimore County MD looks on the Delorme. Do the trails show up?

I took a look, and for both of those locations TopoUSA6 shows no trails.

 

I'll post screenshots if you're interested in seeing what the program (or the GPS) shows for the areas, but it sounds like you just wanted to know what they have for trails.

[+Paulsan]

Thanks embra. It's a shame that there is no trail data but I'll bet the map is amazing. Garmins Topo is simply adequate.

 

If you haven't gone down to Prettyboy, you really should. It's beautiful down there.

[WolfinSTL]

Let me see if I can cover the PN-20 issues...let me know if I miss something.

 

Thanks Embra, great review! I talked with Delorme today and asked about their street atlas software. The guy I talked with said that it would port directly to the PN-20 but thought I would be able to add the data sets to the Topo software and port it over that way. Have you had any experience with adding data sets that way? Does it work?

 

Thanks!

[+embra]

I think he's wrong--although I think I recall that the original promotional materials cited SA compatibility (the web site appears corrected now--I couldn't easily find any reference to SA in the PN-20 materials).

 

I think the more accurate status is reflected in this reply from a DeLorme staffer to some speculation that DeLorme was working on SA POI porting to the PN-20 in the next firmware upgrade:

There are many, many complex issues with the different products, when their map datasets were created and how POIs display on each release. Plus how routing can be compromised by having multiple products with unique data layers and route connectivity mechanisms all trying to play on the same GPS.

 

Having said that, we are working on how best to get the SAUSA POIs onto the PN-20, but they may not come from the next SAUSA. Instead, they could possibly be a Web download or come from the next version of Topo USA.

 

My point here is to let you know we want to make this happen and are working on the best solution, as well as the many other good suggestions we have had for our various products and how they could work on the PN-20. More later.

 

On another note, I saw this specification on the chipset in looking for SA references (I don't really know what it means, but it doesn't sound like it's SiRF III):

STMicroelectronics chip technology with SiGE front-end and DeLorme firmware for faster acquisition times and outstanding signal retention

 

One other thing I thought I'd mention that's nice about the PN-20 is that they got the power right: it will run off a Li-Ion that can be recharged in the GPS, but it will also work off a pair of AA's...with decent (not exceptional) run times.

 

Edit: I just re-read your post and realized you were talking about running the POIs into TopoUSA. I think something prevents that from happening, as alluded to in the post I quoted. But I'll look into it further.

Edited March 2, 2007 by embra