Quality Of Logs At The Ngs

[2oldfarts (the rockhounders)]

We located this benchmark near Searchlight, NV. It is in good condition and the description is adequate enough to get you to it.

 

The following is direct from the benchmark's NGS description.....

 

"Documented History (by the NGS)

1/1/1934 by CGS (MONUMENTED)

 

1/1/1949 by NGS (GOOD)

DESCRIBED BY NATIONAL GEODETIC SURVEY 1949 1.4 MI SE FROM SEARCHLIGHT. 1.4 MILES SOUTHEAST ALONG A GRADED DIRT ROAD (OLD U.S. HIGHWAY 95) FROM THE POST OFFICE AT SEARCHLIGHT, 0.2 MILE SOUTH OF THE JUNCTION OF A DIRT ROAD LEADING WEST, 51 FEET WEST OF THE CENTER LINE OF THE ROAD, ABOUT 1 FOOT HIGHER THAN THE ROAD, AND SET IN THE TOP OF A CONCRETE POST PROJECTING 0.6 FOOT ABOVE GROUND. NOTE-- IT MAY HAVE BEEN DESTROYED DURING THE CONSTUCTION OF AN AIR STRIP. MILEAGE FROM TWO DIRECTIONS CHECKS AT THE NORTH END OF THE AIR STRIP.

1/1/1957 by NGS (MARK NOT FOUND)

RECOVERY NOTE BY NATIONAL GEODETIC SURVEY 1957 MARK NOT FOUND. "

 

 

So the question becomes if the benchmark may have been destroyed during the construction of the airstrip How can it be logged as "GOOD"?

 

Anyone care to notify the NGS and get a clarification on this?

 

John

[evenfall]

Hi John,

 

This part of the datasheet ---> 1/1/1949 by NGS (GOOD) is a computer generated part. It is a data entry error. There are approximately 1.5 million stations, both active and inactive in the NGS database. Data entry errors happen. These datasheets at one time looked like this example from elcamano. (thanks Mike!) This status item likely was overlooked when all these were typed into the database. If you like, you could easily get this corrected by emailing cheryl.malone@noaa.gov stating that you feel that this PID's entry should be listed as a (NOT FOUND) under the 1949 entry.

 

After you email Cheryl with the correction, you can also choose if you like, to improve the database by submitting your recovery to the NGS so they and other users of the database will know that the station is in fact still there. You can do this by writing your own recovery including the coordinates you took while there to improve the scaled position, in a similar manner to the way you are used to reading them off the datasheets and submitting them on the Mark Recovery Entry page at the NGS. It will be processed not too long after and the latest data, your recovery, will be reflected on the sheet that is found.

 

Also if you like, you can submit the pictures you took of your find to the NGS. They would love to have 2 pictures of it for their database if they could. One close up of the station, and an area photo with the station included in the photo. If you choose to do this, they would appreciate it if you could label the photos as such; If it is and close up, it could be labeled as an example: FS0619_20041116_C.jpg which is PID_DATE_ and either A or C for area or closeup. It would be best if the photo were reduced to 4x6 size and resolution should be 72-100 dpi. This will cause the file size to be under 100k and that is preferred. Photo editing software can be used to emboss the data onto the photo as well. Once the photos have been prepared as such, they can be emailed to deb.brown@noaa.gov and she will add them to the database as her workload permits.

 

An example of what this looks like on a datasheet is found on the NGS PIDS FORM by looking up the datasheet for PID GA2360. Scroll down the page a bit until you come to this line: GA2360.Photographs are available for this station. The word Photographs should be an underlined link. There you will see the photos that were submitted during the latest recovery of the station. At some future point all photo submissions to the NGS will be treated this way, and they are working on a webpage for photo submissions of this nature.

 

Anyone can take this on as a volunteer effort if they like. Of course all this NGS recovery work is strictly an elective process. The basic premise of benchmark hunting at geocaching is a game based on NGS survey markers and their data. No one is under any obligation to perform any of this work to correct the NGS data, yet all geocachers are certainly welcome to volunteer their energies to correcting the errors and reporting the status they find if they like. If we should choose to, the NAD 83 Datum and ddd.mm.sss modes on the GPSr will be most helpful for working with NGS data. The ultimate premise of all this is about having fun. By all means, if anyone needs further clarification from the NGS, they are a friendly agency and they appreciate geocachers. Please feel free to write them directly with any questions you may like further clarification of, or not, that is up to the finder, or questioner.

 

I hope that helps clarify what likely happened in this case for you. Thanks John.

 

Rob

[+GEO*Trailblazer 1]

NOTE-- IT MAY HAVE BEEN DESTROYED DURING THE CONSTUCTION OF AN AIR STRIP. MILEAGE FROM TWO DIRECTIONS CHECKS AT THE NORTH END OF THE AIR STRIP.

 

To me that would mean they did not look real good for it thus the "NOTE".

My0.02

[+PFF]

Also if you like, you can submit the pictures you took of your find to the NGS. They would love to have 2 pictures of it for their database if they could. One close up of the station, and an area photo with the station included in the photo.

 

Rob:

 

Thanks for the reminder. I have been collecting photos of each disk and the immediate vicinity, but I have never submitted any of them. I figured this project was on the back burner due to funding. However, when you mentioned a data sheet with "pictures available for station", it was encouraging.

 

-Paul-

 

P.S. Ten-four on the Dodge fire truck in the "destroyed water tower" thread. I believe you are correct.

[2oldfarts (the rockhounders)]

NOTE-- IT MAY HAVE BEEN DESTROYED DURING THE CONSTUCTION OF AN AIR STRIP. MILEAGE FROM TWO DIRECTIONS CHECKS AT THE NORTH END OF THE AIR STRIP.

 

To me that would mean they did not look real good for it thus the "NOTE".

My0.02

 

That's what we thought.....glad to have someone else see the reason we posted this thread.

 

Thank you Geo.

 

Shirley~

[+GEO*Trailblazer 1]

To me a note also means a maybe it might be there.

 

I was told yesterday by Cardinal,from Fayetteville Arkansas,the one who broke his back,and compound fractured his leg from a fall looking for a rivet ON A BRIDGE at the first of the year,

He told everyone at the TRI STATES meeting I was the crazy one because He goes for the ones on bridges no one goes for,the one's with ? beside them and generally the very hard to find ones.And he said you have found almost all of them too.

 

I just said I always make shure that someone is there,and has the phone,I got the GPS.

Thank goodness for technology .

 

I bring this up also because as we get older we do not heal as we did when young,we are traversing very dangerous places sometimes(most times) and I want to keep everyone aware at all times this is a dangerous hobby or can be when not following safe measures.

 

BE ALWAYS A LERT

AMERICA NEEDS MORE OF THEM

LERT'S THAT IS

 

Please stay safe and have a happy Holiday this Year.

 

By the Way Cardinal is healing well,his back has completly healed and the leg,up untill yesterday was going to have to be operated on again,but the DR. told him that Calcium has finally started depositing in the bone at the second major fracture and that NO surgery was necessary.

 

He will be back out there Hunting Benchmarks before spring,He made it to our meeting and has been slowly getting easy caches practiceing up for the BIG BM search day.

[+Spoo]

AMEN to GEO above............

 

About 6 weeks ago, I did a string of Benchmarks that ended with one last mark on a RR bridge. When I arrived at the location and scoped things out, I found I was going to have to walk down an active RR bridge about 200 feet, 80 feet above a river, then climb 10 feet down onto a rock piling to its second tier.

 

NO WAY!

 

Others have since asked me what my problem was.

 

Hmmmm.......1) active RR line 2) 80 feet in the air over a river 3) climb up and down vertical rocks at that height.

 

OK, so I am a wimp.

[Bill93]

Spoo, with an attitude like that you might even become an OLD wimp some day. Way to go. Like I've heard aviators (of whom I think you are one) say, there are bold pilots and old pilots but no old, bold pilots.

 

The questions left in my mind are how somebody set and measured that mark in the first place, and why they didn't use the abutment instead of a piling. To make this relevant to the initial topic, did the description give you any clues about that?

[2oldfarts (the rockhounders)]

To make this relevant to the initial topic, did the description give you any clues about that?

 

The initial topic was "If the benchmark is logged as good, then why does it have a note stating it may have been destroyed".

 

Is this the initial topic to which you are refering?

 

John

[+Spoo]

Bill93.....just to answer your question. (Sorry 2oldfarts if I am now off the thread here) The description here is awful and one wonders why the NGS has ever kept it on the books given a 'POOR' condition for at least 60 years.

 

The description makes it sound easy. PF0155:

 

Unknown by USGS (MONUMENTED)

 

1/1/1942 by NGS (POOR)

DESCRIBED BY NATIONAL GEODETIC SURVEY 1942 0.4 MI W FROM GILEAD. 0.4 MILE WEST ALONG THE GRAND TRUNK RAILWAY FROM THE STATION AT GILEAD, OXFORD COUNTY, 0.4 MILE WEST OF MILEPOST 80, 600 FEET NORTH OF U.S. HIGHWAY 2, AT RAILROAD BRIDGE 80-5 OVER WILD RIVER, IN THE NORTH OF THE EAST GARNITE ABUTMENT, IN THE SECOND COURSE OF STONE FROM THE TOP, 13.3 FEET NORTH OF THE NORTH RAIL OF THE TRACK, AND ABOUT 2 FEET LOWER THAN THE RAIL.

1/1/1978 by NGS (POOR)

RECOVERY NOTE BY NATIONAL GEODETIC SURVEY 1978 DISK MUTILATED AND A SMALL PIECE OF THE DISK CHIPPED AWAY.

 

Only when you see it do you realize you have to get up over the RR retaining wall on the bridge then back down to the mark. One wonders how such an out of the way disc ever got mutilated.

 

Yes. I know it says ABUTMENT in the description.......but nothing is there. Standing on a granite slab I could see the disc on the PILING about 200 feet out in the river using binoculars. (OK, so maybe it is only 100 feet out.)

Edited November 21, 2004 by Spoo

[+Colorado Papa]

Also if you like, you can submit the pictures you took of your find to the NGS.  They would love to have 2 pictures of it for their database if they could.  One close up of the station, and an area photo with the station included in the photo.  If you choose to do this, they would appreciate it if you could label the photos as such; If it is and close up, it could be labeled as an example:  FS0619_20041116_C.jpg which is PID_DATE_ and either A or C for area or closeup. 

Rob,

 

I was looking for a quote as a reply to another string when I came across your entry. I didn't think about it when I read it originally, but I have a slightly different format.

 

I have been submitting my photos to Deb as GM059120040925C.jpg, no "_" for separation. I've asked her before if this was proper and she replied it was OK.

So I guess it can be sent either way.

 

Ted

[evenfall]

Hi Ted,

 

Yes that will work fine. The underscore is an optional unix file naming convention. I just use the underscore because it aids this particular human user in reading the filename better and faster when I am looking through my files. In other words, it wont matter to them, but it is a helpful aid for me and my eyes. Helps me find what I want with less squint and think. I can parse what "I" am looking for easier that way. After a few hours of dealing with data the eyes and mind tend to like the little things like that.

 

Feel free to use either method as it applies to your way of dealing with your data, as long as it works for both you and Deb at NGS.

 

Rob