Can You Solve My Puzzle Cache ?

[+SeaTrout]

For those that like Puzzle caches,can you solve my puzzle cache ?

http://www.geocaching.com/seek/cache_details.aspx?ID=107783

If you can solve for the longitude(without using the zip file)please e-mail me with a description of how you obtained the longitude and how long it took to solve it.

Please do not post spoilers here.

If you like the idea feel free to use it in your area.

Seatrout

Edited January 7, 2004 by SeaTrout

[+nittany dave]

Neat puzzle, I just sent you an email. Gives me some ideas...

[+BeachBuddies]

Got it in about 30 minutes, but I had to use the clue.

[+ironman114]

took about 15 min. started to get a headache but backed off a bit and it came in a flash.

[ghOzt]

I solved it in about 20 or 30 minutes and thought it was great. I emailed the solution.

[+nieterpj]

Got it in about 10 minutes!

[+carleenp]

Took around 15 minutes for me. Like someone else, the answer came in a flash!

 

Well done, I like it! I PM'd the answer to you.

[Poppa Duck]

Poppa took up the challenge during lunch today. Solved it in about 20 minutes - emailed answer. Sneaky but I like it.

 

-PD

[+Don&Betty]

Too deep for me!

 

If you like puzzles, here's one of my puzzle caches that no-one has "solved" in 151 days and after 250 hits to the site. I wouldn't have thought it would be too difficult to find the errors in an "algebraic proof" that ANY female is equal to ANY male! Have a look.

 

http://www.geocaching.com/seek/cache_details.aspx?ID=77948.

[+carleenp]

If you like puzzles, here's one of my puzzle caches that no-one has "solved" in 151 days and after 250 hits to the site. I wouldn't have thought it would be too difficult to find the errors in an "algebraic proof" that ANY female is equal to ANY male! Have a look.

 

I can't do that one. I'm afraid of math!

[+coast2coast2coast]

I found them both...But I cheated on the Long...How did you link to the zip file?...I like the idea that people know they got the right answer with out haveing to email you and ask...was it tough to set up the file and link...You can email me if the answer is too long to post here

 

Thanx

[ju66l3r]

D&B, I used to use a much shortened version of similar screwy math in my e-mail signature file without the backstory.

 

Drove my fellow scientists nuts.

 

EDIT: don't want to accidentally give anything away...even slyly

 

I'm not close enough to MI or I'd find your cache.

Edited January 8, 2004 by ju66l3r

[+SeaTrout]

I received a lot of replies about the puzzle.

Thanks to everyone who solved,or tried to solve the puzzle.

Most people solved it in about 30 minutes.

Many people used the Longitude zip file(not the purpose of my post),but thanks

anyway.

I may restore the puzzle to its original configuration (remove the longitude zip file solution).

Coast2Coast2Coast you have E-mail

Thanks again

Seatrout

[+coast2coast2coast]

Thanx Seatrout...let me mess around with it for a bit...if I have probs I'll let you know

 

Coast

[+Mr. 0]

It took me roughly 5 min to get it. But I've got puzzles on the brain due to a local cacher here in Columbus, Oh having placed a couple of puzzle caches recently.

 

Here are the links to those puzzles.

 

The Hex

 

Regz Fan III

[+SeaTrout]

Just a note to inform that I have just restored the puzzle to its original configuration.

I have removed the Longitude Zip file solution.There are still 2 ways to solve for the

Longitude

Seatrout

[+Don&Betty]

screwy math

There's absolutely no "screwy math" in the "Equality of the Sexes" puzzle cache. That's all straight, out of the book algebra. It's a good puzzle though. You don't have to live in Michigan to try to solve it. There is a "checksum" you compute to check that you've solved it correctly. So, take a whack at it and see if you can solve it and get that correct checksum.

Edited January 8, 2004 by Don&Betty

[ju66l3r]

There's absolutely no "screwy math" in the "Equality of the Sexes" puzzle cache. That's all straight, out of the book algebra. It's a good puzzle though. You don't have to live in Michigan to try to solve it. There is a "checksum" you compute to check that you've solved it correctly. So, take a whack at it and see if you can solve it and get that correct checksum.

Call it whatever you like. When you don't keep things absolutely straight in how you handle your variables, then you have screwed up the math and it is screwy math. The same way you can't do this (from my old email sig):

 

a=1

b=1

a=b

a*a=a*b

a*a - b*b = a*b - b*b

(a-(a+ = b(a-

a+b=b

2=1

 

Screwy math.

 

As for your "checksum", I have to agree with one of your cache's logs....your syntax is atrocious for trying to determine what line numbers to use in calculating the coordinates. "Untrue"...."imprudent"?

 

Is line 30 "untrue" or "imprudent"? It's not even a complete sentence but when taken with line 31, it's certainly not "untrue", since it will remove the exponent by using the sqrt....but if it's "imprudent" since it doesn't complete what is necessary in describing the results of sqrt on variables...then is it line 30 (the FIRST line of the complete sentence....) that you are looking for in part C or line 31 (the FIRST line where you actually say something potentially imprudent about the sqrt function)?

 

There's a reason that if you look in any algebra book, the equations are the only things numbered and referenced to by their number. The equation may be incorrect because it is based on invalid assumptions or incorrect calculation. The text is just fluff. In your case, I have a feeling you've included the text lines when you speak of "untrue" and "imprudent", because algebra by itself is not "imprudent" and in your case, the text is so broken up, it's hard to deside what the first "imprudent" thought is and if any of the text should be considered "untrue".

 

To add on top of all that, you have instructions like "ignore the decimal point...multiply against a whole number....round to the nearest tenth"... huh? Am I supposed to ignore it and then...not ignore it...or am I supposed to get a tenth digit from multiplying two whole numbers?

 

Also you say "multiply to 11 sigfigs.....the sum of these 10 digits"? Huh?

 

Caches like "The Hex" are very complicated in their math and encryption but are still doable by those who want to put the effort in. Your puzzle needs some work in my opinion to improve its readability, because I am well aware of the fundamental math flaw, but determining the coordinates from that is practically impossible.

Edited January 9, 2004 by ju66l3r

[+Don&Betty]

"(a-(a+ = b(a-"

 

 

That's not so. Algebraically, (a-(a+ = aa + ab - ba - bb = a*a - b*b.

Edited January 12, 2004 by Don&Betty

[ju66l3r]

"(a-(a+ = b(a-"

 

 

That's not so. Algebraically, (a-(a+ = aa + ab - ba - bb = a*a - b*b.

 

a*a=a*b

 

Subtract b*b from both sides and get:

 

a*a - b*b = a*b - b*b

 

Factor both sides and get:

 

(a-(a+ = b(a-

 

There is no problem with that step.

Edited January 12, 2004 by ju66l3r

[+Don&Betty]

OK, I see now how you got from one step to the next. I suppose it all falls apart because most of those terms, a-b, a*a, etc. are zero.

 

There are no such "zero" or undefined "divide-by-zero" factors in the "Equality of the Sexes" puzzle.

 

Just what is it that's hard to understand about: "...you must find all of the numbered lines that are untrue...?"

 

Just look at each numbered line, one at a time. Sometimes they're not complete sentences. Sometimes you must infer a reference to the previous or following line. Usually, in such cases, the line just doesn't make any "statement of fact" so is not untrue.

 

And what's to not understand about: "...you must find the first, numbered line that, though not untrue itself, ...introduces the likelihood of making those other mistakes...?"

 

Decimal points? It just means to perform the multiplications etc. out to that many significant digits, probably by hand, unless your calculator will handle perhaps 12 or more decimal places.

 

If you're in doubt about just one line or two, try it both ways and check the checksum. It's feasible to "dry-lab" the whole thing, trying every combination of line numbers with a computer program while not even reading the proof. That would take some heavy number crunching though, probably too much for a spreadsheet.

 

Once you get the coordinates, you can locate them on a high-resolution aerial photograph (check out: www.lostoutdoors.com/newmap.html) or topo map to probably verify that you found the trailhead.

 

It's really a good puzzle. Good luck. You really ought to like the proof, if not the puzzle.

 

By the way, I see the site has had another 70 hits since these postings. Nobody's solved it yet. I'm really surprised that it is that tough. It would probably help to discuss each line with somebody else, like your wife or girlfriend or algebra teacher as you solve it.

 

Best regards.