Is this allowed?

[+wolfslady]

I know you can’t place a cache to advertize a business, but can you place one to warn people about a bad experience? Even if it’s just to call it “Don’t eat here” if the service at a restaurant was beyond bad. I’d like to leave the entire story on my cache page, but would settle for a name that gets my point across.

 

 

I don’t know how the food was because mine was over (Well) done and I sent it back and over 30 minutes later still did not have a replacement. (They quickly brought a second that was even more done than the first, and since it was prime rib I told them at that time that if they didn’t have some that was at least bright pink, to just bring me a menu and I would order something else.) Then I waited… and waited… and waited… I flagged down the waiter and he assured me they had it and it was coming. By that time my husband was finished eating and outside trying to keep our 2 yo entertained. When he finally returned 5-10 minutes later and told me they didn’t have any and asked if I wanted to order something else I was angry. I asked for the check. He said he’d send a manager over. I told him fine, but bring me the check. He came back 5 minutes later without the check and asked if the manager had come by yet. NO. Bring me the check so I can get out of hear and get something to eat. (Biting my tongue and now feeling like a hostage.) The manager finally showed up (without the check) just as I was ready to walk out without paying for Joe’s meal.) I explained the entire story including the fact that I’d been asking for the bill for at least 15 minutes and that all I wanted was to get out of there. By this time I truly thought they should just comp the entire thing and let me get out of there, post haste. She took off the food I hadn’t eaten acting like she was doing me a big favor and offered me dessert. HELLO ~ I HAVEN”T EATEN! I refused and once again asked for the bill so I could get out of there and get something to eat. It was 4-5 minutes later before they finally brought it. (I was timing it on my cell phone at that point.) I felt like I was in an April Fool’s Joke gone bad. If a person had held me prisoner like that and refused to let me leave I would have called the police and claimed false imprisonment. I am actually wondering if I can call an attorney and sue them for that because I still feel so angry and stressed over this. I wonder if it was a worse experience for me because it’s giving me flash backs over a time when I was actually held against my will by someone who was trying to kidnap me. If I’d had a micro with me I’d have planted it the second I walked out the door. I took a reading with my GPS in what I think is a very good place for a hide and was going to post it right away. But after I calmed down a bit I decided I’d better ask if it’s allowed before I submitted it with a rant.

 

 

I was going to post this the day it happened, but I was afraid people would think it was a joke. Why? Because the name of the place is Ransom’s Steakhouse and that’s what I felt like I was being held for. Snappy name suggestions anyone?

[+GrateBear]

And this has what to do with geocaching?

[BlackCloud1711]

If it is, it shouldn't be. This is not geocaching.

[Chumpo]

Just give them a lousy review.

[+Walts Hunting]

It clearly violates the No Agenda rule. I would wonder if that language was in the description when it was published. I can't see a reviewer publishing it. You might find out who published it (the first log after clicking View All) and drop him a note. Rather than a SBA log which is the only log that a reviewer sees.

[+nekom]

Gotta agree with Walts here, clear violation of the `no agenda' guideline. There are far more appropriate venues to air out your gripes than cache pages.

[Keystone]

Geocaching is supposed to be a light, fun activity -- not a platform for an agenda.

 

Sound familiar? If it doesn't, you shouldn't be hiding ANY caches. You haven't read and understood the listing guidelines yet.

 

EDIT to add: if you hid this cache at the restaurant, how in heck would you get permission to do so?

If you hid this cache someplace else, what the heck does the story have to do with the location? Cache pages are for describing locations and geocaching experiences.

Edited April 3, 2010 by Keystone

[+bittsen]

Yeah, it sounds like a bad experience for "you" but I bet others love the restaurant.

But, that's not the issue, is it? The issue is should you hide a cache with an obvious agenda? I think you knew the answer before you asked the question.

[+Chrysalides]

Post it on yelp instead if you haven't done so. You'll probably reach a wider audience looking for a place to eat.

[+wigglesworth]

Intrigued that you considered resorting to suing the restaurant - clearly not a place to hide a cache - and how would you get permission!!

 

Peter

[sdarken]

Since it's a cache at a a restaurant I wouldn't go out of my way to find it and if I did, I'd probably take one look at the long rant in the description and add a "tldr" to my "tftc".

[Mr.Yuck]

Intrigued that you considered resorting to suing the restaurant - clearly not a place to hide a cache - and how would you get permission!!

 

Peter

 

As if anyone, in any significant numbers, gets permission to hide a cache at a restaurant. Which is of course most likely why the OP figured they could hide one there.

[ad5smith]

ok it looks like (to me) that this tasteless cache has not been placed

[+Team Cotati]

yelp.com

[+DENelson83]

[+Bergie Bunch]

Geocaching is supposed to be a light, fun activity -- not a platform for an agenda.

 

Sound familiar? If it doesn't, you shouldn't be hiding ANY caches. You haven't read and understood the listing guidelines yet.

 

EDIT to add: if you hid this cache at the restaurant, how in heck would you get permission to do so?

If you hid this cache someplace else, what the heck does the story have to do with the location? Cache pages are for describing locations and geocaching experiences.

 

Boy, some mods take all the fun out of caching.....lol

 

On topic, Why waste your time over a bad experience? Send Mgt. a message and move on.

[+simpjkee]

I've found caches near restaurants with names that are suggestive to the restarant. I don't see why "Don't Eat Here" wouldn't be allowed if those are, but of course, there is no precendent yadda yadda yadda and no agenda yadda yadda yadda.

[+t4e]

name of the cache sounds fine, as long as you don't put that whole rant as the cache description, which actually belongs in a letter to management

 

however, if you want to "get your point across" there are better ways to reach the people out there, instead of using a game that is supposed to be fun as a venue to vent your anger

 

go stand at the door of the restaurant and tell everyone that went in that they shouldn't eat there, write to the local TV station, Newspaper etc....but please keep that stuff out of geocaching

[knowschad]

I've found caches near restaurants with names that are suggestive to the restarant. I don't see why "Don't Eat Here" wouldn't be allowed if those are, but of course, there is no precendent yadda yadda yadda and no agenda yadda yadda yadda.

You're kidding, right? This cache concept is the poster child of an agenda cache! If "this restaurant sucks" isn't an agenda, there is no such thing.

[+simpjkee]

I've found caches near restaurants with names that are suggestive to the restarant. I don't see why "Don't Eat Here" wouldn't be allowed if those are, but of course, there is no precendent yadda yadda yadda and no agenda yadda yadda yadda.

You're kidding, right? This cache concept is the poster child of an agenda cache! If "this restaurant sucks" isn't an agenda, there is no such thing.

 

It IS an agenda, but agenda caches supporting restarants are published often. If caches with the agenda of supporting restarants are allowed. Then I don't see why caches with the agenda of not supporting a restaurant shouldn't be allowed also. I doubt it would, because the guidelines like 'no precedent' and 'agenda caches' yadda yadda yadda would be pulled out in that case.

[+t4e]

 

It IS an agenda, but agenda caches supporting restarants are published often. If caches with the agenda of supporting restarants are allowed. Then I don't see why caches with the agenda of not supporting a restaurant shouldn't be allowed also. I doubt it would, because the guidelines like 'no precedent' and 'agenda caches' yadda yadda yadda would be pulled out in that case.

 

i would really like to see one such cache that supports restaurants

[+DENelson83]

i would really like to see one such cache that supports restaurants

But then wouldn't that be a cache that solicited?

[+t4e]

i would really like to see one such cache that supports restaurants

But then wouldn't that be a cache that solicited?

 

exactly, its why i asked for an example, because i have my doubts anything like that would be published

[+simpjkee]

 

It IS an agenda, but agenda caches supporting restarants are published often. If caches with the agenda of supporting restarants are allowed. Then I don't see why caches with the agenda of not supporting a restaurant shouldn't be allowed also. I doubt it would, because the guidelines like 'no precedent' and 'agenda caches' yadda yadda yadda would be pulled out in that case.

 

i would really like to see one such cache that supports restaurants

 

I figured someone would. I am not going to post them and have them get put under the microscope. I've already said that I've found them though. If you really want to see them, you can start looking through my profile.

[knowschad]

 

It IS an agenda, but agenda caches supporting restarants are published often. If caches with the agenda of supporting restarants are allowed. Then I don't see why caches with the agenda of not supporting a restaurant shouldn't be allowed also. I doubt it would, because the guidelines like 'no precedent' and 'agenda caches' yadda yadda yadda would be pulled out in that case.

i would really like to see one such cache that supports restaurants

Took the words right out of my mouth.

[knowschad]

 

It IS an agenda, but agenda caches supporting restarants are published often. If caches with the agenda of supporting restarants are allowed. Then I don't see why caches with the agenda of not supporting a restaurant shouldn't be allowed also. I doubt it would, because the guidelines like 'no precedent' and 'agenda caches' yadda yadda yadda would be pulled out in that case.

 

i would really like to see one such cache that supports restaurants

 

I figured someone would. I am not going to post them and have them get put under the microscope. I've already said that I've found them though. If you really want to see them, you can start looking through my profile.

How old are they? I seriously doubt that they are very recent cache hides.

[+simpjkee]

 

It IS an agenda, but agenda caches supporting restarants are published often. If caches with the agenda of supporting restarants are allowed. Then I don't see why caches with the agenda of not supporting a restaurant shouldn't be allowed also. I doubt it would, because the guidelines like 'no precedent' and 'agenda caches' yadda yadda yadda would be pulled out in that case.

 

i would really like to see one such cache that supports restaurants

 

I figured someone would. I am not going to post them and have them get put under the microscope. I've already said that I've found them though. If you really want to see them, you can start looking through my profile.

How old are they? I seriously doubt that they are very recent cache hides.

 

What would you call recent?

[+geodarts]

All I know is that I won't be eating there. So the post accomplished its purpose. As to any description in the proposed cache, I am sure the reviewer will properly handle it.

[+wolfslady]

No a cache hasn't been placed. Thank you to those who answered my question without jumping all over me for asking it. I’ve had a few rough nights and anyone who hasn’t been held prisoner in their car fighting someone who was attempting to kidnap and who than attempted to kill (Hit me on the head with a ratchet breaker bar) them when they managed to got out might not understand how traumatic it can be to feel trapped. Heck I don’t even understand it myself sometimes. I am less upset about the food than I am about not getting the check in a timely manner after I repeatedly requested it. If I’d left without paying I knew I was risking arrest, so in effect I was being held against my will when they refused to deliver it. I’ve never gotten over being claustrophobic after my attack either and I was never the least bit before it. I did get to where I can have someone standing behind me without feeling uncomfortable but that took awhile. Mostly because the guy laid on top of me with my face pressed into the seat and threatened to kill me if I didn’t stop fighting and then rapped me on the neck a few times to show he was serious. (Yes they caught him and he will most likely be in jail for the rest of his life.) I didn’t need to be reminded of an awful experience so vividly because I couldn’t get anyone to bring a darn check for my husbands food. So yes I wondered if I could sue. I want the right to walk out without paying in a situation like this. I want others to have it. Any other business you can put down what you’d planned to purchase and walk out if they are taking too long. But my husband had consumed his food so it’s likely that we couldn’t legally do that.

 

I felt this was a valid question; in my short caching history I’ve seen quite a few restraunt caches. I haven’t placed a cache yet because I haven’t finished reading all the info on placing one. So excuse me for asking a question. No agenda is kind of a relative term because lets face it when you place a cache you have an agenda, rather it’s to get someone to visit a certain spot or to get them to just find your hide. Anytime you name a cache with a business name you are promoting that business, even if that is not your intention. Why place one at or near a business that you don’t want to draw attention to? I actually did want to place a cache right next to the business on or next to a water tower. I had not looked to see if it could be done before going inside. As I was leaving I discovered that it looked like a perfect place for a hide. Which didn’t make me less angry but more, because I don’t want people to go there for my cache and decide to eat at the restraunt.

 

And no I would not have put that entire rant on my page. And yes I plan to write reviews. (thank you for the links) And yes I already wrote and sent an email but I haven’t gotten a response. Doubt I ever will since it is a local restraunt and not a chain.

 

Thank you for your support.

[+bittsen]

You can never be trapped in a restaurant. You were trapped there by your own politeness.

 

I would have stood up 2 minutes after asking for the check the first time, said really LOUDLY. I'm leaving now!!!

 

And then slowly walked past the front and out the doors. If they didn't stop me then I would assume they knew how bad the service was and just comp'd the meal.

[+Walts Hunting]

My mother always said that if you can't say something good about somebody (lets extend that to business's) then don't say anything.

 

Seems the might apply here.

[+wimseyguy]

Chowhound, yelp, and urbanspoon are all websites for listing restaurant reviews. This is a website for listing caches.

[+t4e]

My mother always said that if you can't say something good about somebody (lets extend that to business's) then don't say anything.

 

Seems the might apply here.

 

i agree with that in different circumstances but i won't extend it to any type of service

if you feel you were not treated properly you should definitely say so

you pay for a service and you should get adequate treatment

letting it go does nothing to warn other nor to , perhaps, improve the said business/service

 

but as i said before, GC is not the place to do that

[+narcissa]

I think this person KNOWS the cache is a ridiculous idea, and this whole post is just a platform for a rant about a bad restaurant experience. Why it hasn't been closed or moved to the off-topic forum, I don't know.

[+t4e]

 

I figured someone would. I am not going to post them and have them get put under the microscope. I've already said that I've found them though. If you really want to see them, you can start looking through my profile.

 

well i browsed through and all i can see its one for example that says "placed at my favorite restaurant", without any mention of name...that is not an agenda, nor is supporting the business in any way

 

there's plenty of caches out there placed near business

[+power69]

And this has what to do with geocaching?

a bad meal at a place he/she found a film cannister tossed behind the bushes.

[+wolfslady]

How about the "off your rocker" series. The main page it links to says "always a good place to" (stop or eat or something to that effect) after a long day of caching.

 

I know I've seen others. Doesn't really matter. I found out what I wanted and got a lot of not so nice answers I could have done without. From now on I'll just do my own research and not ask. If you want to continue to debate where my question should have been posted or if I have any business placing a cache have fun. I've already sent a note asking that it be closed. In the mean time I'm going to try and get some much needed sleep. Thank you for making me feel so good about myself.

 

I hope you have a Happy Easter.

[+simpjkee]

 

I figured someone would. I am not going to post them and have them get put under the microscope. I've already said that I've found them though. If you really want to see them, you can start looking through my profile.

 

well i browsed through and all i can see its one for example that says "placed at my favorite restaurant", without any mention of name...that is not an agenda, nor is supporting the business in any way

 

there's plenty of caches out there placed near business

 

There are some real shameless plugs you may have not seen, but anyway.

 

You're right that there are plenty of caches placed near businesses. Some even say stuff like "placed at my favorite restaurant" and that's not an agenda and apparently okay. So what's to stop the OP from placing a cache near a business and saying "placed at my least favorite resturant".

 

The OP never said anything about mentioning the name of the restarant. She suggested calling it "Don't Eat Here", but was open to other ideas. She even said she'd be fine with leaving out the rant.

 

Though I don't think I'd place a cache like this, I'd suggest the OP call it "Seared to Imperfection" or "Overcooked", with a description saying "Placed at my least favorite restaurant". That should be no big deal based on previous experience.

 

Oh, but wait, we'll pull out the light and fun guideline and the agenda guideline yadda yadda yadda to squash it.

[+simpjkee]

If you want to continue to debate where my question should have been posted or if I have any business placing a cache have fun. I've already sent a note asking that it be closed.

 

Oh man. It was gettin good.

[+t4e]

How about the "off your rocker" series. The main page it links to says "always a good place to" (stop or eat or something to that effect) after a long day of caching.

 

I know I've seen others. Doesn't really matter. I found out what I wanted and got a lot of not so nice answers I could have done without. From now on I'll just do my own research and not ask. If you want to continue to debate where my question should have been posted or if I have any business placing a cache have fun. I've already sent a note asking that it be closed. In the mean time I'm going to try and get some much needed sleep. Thank you for making me feel so good about myself.

 

I hope you have a Happy Easter.

 

well now, you have to realize that this forum has a diversity of people that have different opinions on how to play the game, what's right and what's wrong

 

you started a topic and asked a question, and you got answers, if they are good or bad in your eyes, well those are the opinions of the posters

 

take what you think is useful and filter out the ones you don't like, as simple as that

[knowschad]

How about the "off your rocker" series. The main page it links to says "always a good place to" (stop or eat or something to that effect) after a long day of caching.

 

I hope you have a Happy Easter.

The "Off Your Rocker" (Cracker Barrel) caches have not been approved for years now.

[+wimseyguy]

Nor did any of the ones I ever saw, nor the one I own link to the company's web site. I think she's OHR.

[+Scubasonic]

Chalk it up to a BAD EXPERIENCE, post on the necessary food review sites and move on not looking back.

 

Scubasonic

[+NYPaddleCacher]

My mother always said that if you can't say something good about somebody (lets extend that to business's) then don't say anything.

 

Seems the might apply here.

 

Nothing against your mother but I disagree with the advice. Youre not doing anyone else any favors but staying quiet about a bad experience. Speaking your mind not only tells the person/business that you're unhappy about how you were treated, it also tells others that are considering interacting with that person or going to a business that they might get the same treatment. If enough people speak their mind rather than keeping quiet maybe the person/business will change.

 

That said, cache pages and even this forum are not proper venues for complaints (or praises) about people or businesses unrelated to geocaching.

[+Team Noodles]

Uhm, I think you just need to relax a bit.

 

*edit - after letting this sink in a bit, I think you could do with some professional help, seriously

Edited April 4, 2010 by Ryuchan

[+Team Cotati]

How about the "off your rocker" series. The main page it links to says "always a good place to" (stop or eat or something to that effect) after a long day of caching.

 

I hope you have a Happy Easter.

The "Off Your Rocker" (Cracker Barrel) caches have not been approved for years now.

 

Yeah, I heard that they went out of bidness shortly after the banning the hiding of geocaches on their property.

 

That ought to teach other 'difficult' business owners a lesson or two.

[+chachi44089]

Seems to me she has blown this whole bad eating experience way out of proportion.Feeling kidnapped,held hostage,thinking of sueing and flashbacks?A little over the top for me.All of us have had a bad day at a restaurant a time or ten.Most just chaulk it up to experience.Maybe they were shorthanded,the chef was ill or something.She might be an overly picky customer.My wife waites tables at a local establishment two nights a week and has said some people just cant be pleased,others arent happy until they have sent their dish back once or twice.

In this situation there seems to be a much bigger underlying issue than simply bad sevice and overcooked prime rib.Some counseling or other help may be needed.And I say this with all due respect to the original poster.In no way am I attempting to be condescending or otherwise.

[+GrateBear]

After making the same mistake a couple of times, I learned a long time ago not to totally believe a recitation of events when only one side of the story has been heard. I am NOT making any judgement about the OP, just saying it would be interesting to hear the restaurant's input. Reality is usually somewhere between the two extremes.

[+bittsen]

Seems to me she has blown this whole bad eating experience way out of proportion.Feeling kidnapped,held hostage,thinking of sueing and flashbacks?A little over the top for me.All of us have had a bad day at a restaurant a time or ten.Most just chaulk it up to experience.Maybe they were shorthanded,the chef was ill or something.She might be an overly picky customer.My wife waites tables at a local establishment two nights a week and has said some people just cant be pleased,others arent happy until they have sent their dish back once or twice.

In this situation there seems to be a much bigger underlying issue than simply bad sevice and overcooked prime rib.Some counseling or other help may be needed.And I say this with all due respect to the original poster.In no way am I attempting to be condescending or otherwise.

 

Perhaps posting to help make the case for the trauma that was suffered?

Edited April 4, 2010 by bittsen

[+chachi44089]

Seems to me she has blown this whole bad eating experience way out of proportion.Feeling kidnapped,held hostage,thinking of sueing and flashbacks?A little over the top for me.All of us have had a bad day at a restaurant a time or ten.Most just chaulk it up to experience.Maybe they were shorthanded,the chef was ill or something.She might be an overly picky customer.My wife waites tables at a local establishment two nights a week and has said some people just cant be pleased,others arent happy until they have sent their dish back once or twice.

In this situation there seems to be a much bigger underlying issue than simply bad sevice and overcooked prime rib.Some counseling or other help may be needed.And I say this with all due respect to the original poster.In no way am I attempting to be condescending or otherwise.

 

Perhaps posting to help make the case for the trauma that was suffered?

Could be..Sometimes I think people just like to feel they are not alone in their anguish.Having others to agree,or side with them makes the anger feel more justified.I can sometimes understand that feeling,but anger can put thoughts out of perspective.I honestly hope she feels a little better after putting it into words.We all need to vent,but dont always know where to do it,or who will understand.