Geocache Cheating?

[+Col. Flagg]

I really don't see the difference between looking up the answer on a web site and asking someone who already found the cache for answers...or what about people who log the find and didn't actually find it. You will always have some kind of cheating in this game.

I think this is going to be all up to individual cachers. If you are about your numbers, yes there is going to be a lot of cheating involved, but for those of us that are in it for the hunt, the excitement, the rush of finding something unknown, the final frontier, to go where no one else has gone before...oops I'm getting this confused with Star Trek now... Anyway the cachers in it for all the good reasons will rip all there hair out before they cheat, if it's looking on a web site or asking a friend.

 

I think the real people getting hit here are the hiders. They have put a lot of effort into thinking up and placing their caches. It is unfair to them that caches cheat...(although I think I would be tempted to cheat if anyone found IMM's Fairly Useless Cryptic Hints... )

 

Anyway we as individuals have a responsibility to the game to keep it clean.

 

In my opinion I think who ever is posting all the answers should get all his finds deleted...

 

Ok enough said.

[knowschad]

But everyone keeps throwing out "It cheapens the experiance for the ones whom did it before". Without thinking it through.

 

Ummm... please do not imply that any opinion different from yours is simply the result of not thinking it through. Thank you.

 

Im not on the side of the Site in question mind you. But everyone keeps throwing out "It cheapens the experiance for the ones whom did it before" as a blanket statement that all cachers would seem to be ticked off at the premise that they have somehow been cheated when the opposite may be true.

Fixed for me.

 

So stop impllying that as a cacher my feelings are gonig to be hurt. Please keep your opinions correctly labled (IE: In my opinion I would feel cheated)

 

Since you haven't found any puzzle caches yet, apparently I was not implying anything about you.

[+herrozerro]

But everyone keeps throwing out "It cheapens the experiance for the ones whom did it before". Without thinking it through.

 

Ummm... please do not imply that any opinion different from yours is simply the result of not thinking it through. Thank you.

 

Im not on the side of the Site in question mind you. But everyone keeps throwing out "It cheapens the experiance for the ones whom did it before" as a blanket statement that all cachers would seem to be ticked off at the premise that they have somehow been cheated when the opposite may be true.

Fixed for me.

 

So stop impllying that as a cacher my feelings are gonig to be hurt. Please keep your opinions correctly labled (IE: In my opinion I would feel cheated)

 

Since you haven't found any puzzle caches yet, apparently I was not implying anything about you.

 

Once again, unfair conclusions. I have not logged any puzzles.

 

GC1H1GX I have solved but have not made it out to the cache site yes as its a bit of a trip.

[knowschad]

 

Once again, unfair conclusions. I have not logged any puzzles.

 

GC1H1GX I have solved but have not made it out to the cache site yes as its a bit of a trip.

 

The majority of my puzzles are that way. I solve them and either verify my solution with the owner or with the coordinate checker, if there is one, but I rarely get around to actually grabbing them. Most of my caching is done with pocket queries for an area, and unless I happen to remember that there is a puzzle I've solved in that area, they go unfound.

[+sbell111]

... When a new puzzle is posted on my end of town, it could sit for a week or more without being found. Then amazingly, one guy cracks it and by the end of the new week, 5 people have logged the find presumably having done no work at all. With the FTF hounds in our area, there's NO WAY that 5 or 6 caches miraculously all solved the puzzle the same day (a week out from posting). ...

I'm not sure that this is evidence of anything.

 

Imagine this scenario: A difficult puzzle cache is placed. Many people really want to solve teh puzzle and find the cache. No one utilizes the FTF network or in any other way obtains help from anyone else.

 

It could take the first person a week to crack the puzzle and find the cache. It maight take five other people between one and two weeks to crack it. Most people could crack the puzzle in two to four weeks.

 

This would result in the cache going unfound for one week. By the end of that week, five other people find the cache. In the next two weeks, lots of people find the cache. No one 'cheated'. This is the natural way that difficult caches are logged.

Edited June 9, 2009 by sbell111

[+herrozerro]

... When a new puzzle is posted on my end of town, it could sit for a week or more without being found. Then amazingly, one guy cracks it and by the end of the new week, 5 people have logged the find presumably having done no work at all. With the FTF hounds in our area, there's NO WAY that 5 or 6 caches miraculously all solved the puzzle the same day (a week out from posting). ...

I'm not sure that this is evidence of anything.

 

Imagine this scenario: A difficult puzzle cache is placed. Many people really want to solve teh puzzle and find the cache. No one utilizes the FTF network or in any other way obtains help from anyone else.

 

It could take the first person a week to crack the puzzle and find the cache. It maight take five other people between one and two weeks to crack it. Most people could crack the puzzle in two to four weeks.

 

This would result in the cache going unfound for one week. By the end of that week, five other people find the cache. In the next two weeks, lots of people find the cache. No one 'cheated'. This is the natural way that difficult caches are logged.

 

That does bring up a good point. All that website seems to have done is make everyone paranoid now that all their puzzle solves are now cheats. In all honesty how are you gonig to to find out a cheat?

 

Are they going to log "Hey i cheated, but I did find the cache!"

 

No. In fact even if someone did cheat it wouldnt "Subtract from your experiance" because how are you going to know? (Forgive me if some of you geocachers suddenly feel the cries of a thousand cachers that were suddenly silanced everytime someone cheats.)

[+bflentje]

... When a new puzzle is posted on my end of town, it could sit for a week or more without being found. Then amazingly, one guy cracks it and by the end of the new week, 5 people have logged the find presumably having done no work at all. With the FTF hounds in our area, there's NO WAY that 5 or 6 caches miraculously all solved the puzzle the same day (a week out from posting). ...

I'm not sure that this is evidence of anything.

 

Imagine this scenario: A difficult puzzle cache is placed. Many people really want to solve teh puzzle and find the cache. No one utilizes the FTF network or in any other way obtains help from anyone else.

 

It could take the first person a week to crack the puzzle and find the cache. It maight take five other people between one and two weeks to crack it. Most people could crack the puzzle in two to four weeks.

 

This would result in the cache going unfound for one week. By the end of that week, five other people find the cache. In the next two weeks, lots of people find the cache. No one 'cheated'. This is the natural way that difficult caches are logged.

 

No, you don't understand. The limb you're going out on is way too thin. When it isn't MY puzzle, I particpate. I KNOW it happens. So stop trying to contradict my statement when YOU don't know.

[+herrozerro]

... When a new puzzle is posted on my end of town, it could sit for a week or more without being found. Then amazingly, one guy cracks it and by the end of the new week, 5 people have logged the find presumably having done no work at all. With the FTF hounds in our area, there's NO WAY that 5 or 6 caches miraculously all solved the puzzle the same day (a week out from posting). ...

I'm not sure that this is evidence of anything.

 

Imagine this scenario: A difficult puzzle cache is placed. Many people really want to solve teh puzzle and find the cache. No one utilizes the FTF network or in any other way obtains help from anyone else.

 

It could take the first person a week to crack the puzzle and find the cache. It maight take five other people between one and two weeks to crack it. Most people could crack the puzzle in two to four weeks.

 

This would result in the cache going unfound for one week. By the end of that week, five other people find the cache. In the next two weeks, lots of people find the cache. No one 'cheated'. This is the natural way that difficult caches are logged.

 

No, you don't understand. The limb you're going out on is way too thin. When it isn't MY puzzle, I particpate. I KNOW it happens. So stop trying to contradict my statement when YOU don't know.

 

You are goiung out on a pretty thin limb as well for taking your experiance and applying it to all suddenly found Geocache puzzles.

[knowschad]

... When a new puzzle is posted on my end of town, it could sit for a week or more without being found. Then amazingly, one guy cracks it and by the end of the new week, 5 people have logged the find presumably having done no work at all. With the FTF hounds in our area, there's NO WAY that 5 or 6 caches miraculously all solved the puzzle the same day (a week out from posting). ...

I'm not sure that this is evidence of anything.

 

Imagine this scenario: A difficult puzzle cache is placed. Many people really want to solve teh puzzle and find the cache. No one utilizes the FTF network or in any other way obtains help from anyone else.

 

It could take the first person a week to crack the puzzle and find the cache. It maight take five other people between one and two weeks to crack it. Most people could crack the puzzle in two to four weeks.

 

This would result in the cache going unfound for one week. By the end of that week, five other people find the cache. In the next two weeks, lots of people find the cache. No one 'cheated'. This is the natural way that difficult caches are logged.

 

Good point, but I do know what bflentje is referring to (we cache in the same area). I have been the recipient of an unsolicited "shhh.... mum's the word" puzzle solution myself. We do have a clandestine "puzzle network" around here. If you don't work a lot of puzzles, you will probably never know about it, but once you get known as a puzzle cacher, the help will come.

[+bflentje]

... When a new puzzle is posted on my end of town, it could sit for a week or more without being found. Then amazingly, one guy cracks it and by the end of the new week, 5 people have logged the find presumably having done no work at all. With the FTF hounds in our area, there's NO WAY that 5 or 6 caches miraculously all solved the puzzle the same day (a week out from posting). ...

I'm not sure that this is evidence of anything.

 

Imagine this scenario: A difficult puzzle cache is placed. Many people really want to solve teh puzzle and find the cache. No one utilizes the FTF network or in any other way obtains help from anyone else.

 

It could take the first person a week to crack the puzzle and find the cache. It maight take five other people between one and two weeks to crack it. Most people could crack the puzzle in two to four weeks.

 

This would result in the cache going unfound for one week. By the end of that week, five other people find the cache. In the next two weeks, lots of people find the cache. No one 'cheated'. This is the natural way that difficult caches are logged.

 

No, you don't understand. The limb you're going out on is way too thin. When it isn't MY puzzle, I particpate. I KNOW it happens. So stop trying to contradict my statement when YOU don't know.

 

You are goiung out on a pretty thin limb as well for taking your experiance and applying it to all suddenly found Geocache puzzles.

 

I tell you what, I'll let you look through my exact quote again.. when you're done, tell me where I've applied my experience to the game as a whole??

 

here it is..

 

... When a new puzzle is posted on my end of town, it could sit for a week or more without being found. Then amazingly, one guy cracks it and by the end of the new week, 5 people have logged the find presumably having done no work at all. With the FTF hounds in our area, there's NO WAY that 5 or 6 caches miraculously all solved the puzzle the same day (a week out from posting). ...

[+herrozerro]

I want to start by saying, I do not endorse this idea at all.. er, I guess I already said that. But I hate to break it to you, it's already happening. At least in our area. When a new puzzle is posted on my end of town, it could sit for a week or more without being found. Then amazingly, one guy cracks it and by the end of the new week, 5 people have logged the find presumably having done no work at all. With the FTF hounds in our area, there's NO WAY that 5 or 6 caches miraculously all solved the puzzle the same day (a week out from posting).

 

What am I saying here? The current system works just fine. Why make it public..

 

oh nevermind. I am not sure what my point was.

 

in reading the entire quote. I have found two parts, the first one is what i was looking for but you have a small disclaimer which is what i missed. I conceed the point.

[+tozainamboku]

Good point, but I do know what bflentje is referring to (we cache in the same area). I have been the recipient of an unsolicited "shhh.... mum's the word" puzzle solution myself. We do have a clandestine "puzzle network" around here. If you don't work a lot of puzzles, you will probably never know about it, but once you get known as a puzzle cacher, the help will come.

And that's the point. You can't stop what you call cheat sites any more than you could stop a group of friends who work puzzles and share the answers among themselves. People don't like to get stuck on a puzzle and have to abandon it because the owner won't give any hints. So they'll ask other people who have solved the puzzle for hints. And some people for whom even a big hint won't help solve a puzzle may even ask for the solution. When I put out a difficult puzzle, I assume that the people who get enjoyment from knowing that they worked a difficult puzzle on their own will not ask for hints or go to a "cheat" site for help. People who want the satisfaction of working the puzzle themselves but need a hint will ask for a hint. They may not ask me, because they know a hint from me will be cryptic and not give away too much. So they may ask someone who will give a better hint or even tell them detail instructions on how to solve the puzzle. And if they don't know anyone they may find the hint on a so-called cheat site. If there are some people who just want to find the cache and someone is willing to give them they answer or let them come along to find the cache, they may have cheated themselves out of the satisfaction of solving the puzzle or at least learning how to solve puzzle, but as far as I am concerned they found the cache. The people who solved the puzzle without a hint have the satisfaction of knowing they solved it without a hint. They can boast about in the log if they like. If they want to feel "cheated" because other people needed a hint or found the cache without solving the puzzle, there isn't much I can do about that.

[+bflentje]

I want to start by saying, I do not endorse this idea at all.. er, I guess I already said that. But I hate to break it to you, it's already happening. At least in our area. When a new puzzle is posted on my end of town, it could sit for a week or more without being found. Then amazingly, one guy cracks it and by the end of the new week, 5 people have logged the find presumably having done no work at all. With the FTF hounds in our area, there's NO WAY that 5 or 6 caches miraculously all solved the puzzle the same day (a week out from posting).

 

What am I saying here? The current system works just fine. Why make it public..

 

oh nevermind. I am not sure what my point was.

 

in reading the entire quote. I have found two parts, the first one is what i was looking for but you have a small disclaimer which is what i missed. I conceed the point.

 

Thank you, I accept your non-apology apology. And I retract my Iron Mountain comment in the other thread

[+The Powerpuff Girls]

Mii and my friends cheat all the time... Wii use a GPS device and tells us exactly where the geocache is...

[+shadowmib]

OK this thread was TLDR for me, but if I need a hint THAT BAD for a puzzle cache, I would either write the CO, or just skip it. Puzzle caches are difficult for a reason, for those who want the challenge.. if you dont want a challenge, do get all the LPCs out there.