City Navigator NT vs. non NT

[GeoBobC]

I've used City Navigator version 8, non NT, on a Garmin 60Cx for a few years with no complaints or problems.

 

I just purchased City Navigator 2009, NT and installed some maps on the 60Cx. The first surprise was that map size is actually larger in NT than non NT, at least comparing the 2009 NT version to the older non-NT version 8. I thought the map compression would result in smaller map sizes for equivalent coverage.

 

I also notice that map refresh appears to be slower. especially when turning. Is it my imagination, or has anyone else noticed this?

[+webscouter.]

Many people have noted this on the 60Cx series. The thought is that the processor in the GPS isn't fast enough and you notice a lag.

 

As far as size of the maps, City Navigator 2009 has a lot more POI's in it and in all likely hood is covering more area than your old non-NT as the map segment sizes are larger. For the whole of North America there is about a 47% reduction in map size according to my GPS.

[GeoBobC]

Hmmm..I might need to contact Garmin about an exchange for the non NT version, but it's probably a wasted hour.

[dualcore]

Hmmm..I might need to contact Garmin about an exchange for the non NT version, but it's probably a wasted hour.

 

FYI (I posted this info on Jul 16 on this board), 2009 CNNA (non-nt) has 344 segment (around 1.75G), so still works well on your device if you load all maps to the device

[+The_Wanderers]

I've used City Navigator version 8, non NT, on a Garmin 60Cx for a few years with no complaints or problems.

 

I just purchased City Navigator 2009, NT and installed some maps on the 60Cx. The first surprise was that map size is actually larger in NT than non NT, at least comparing the 2009 NT version to the older non-NT version 8. I thought the map compression would result in smaller map sizes for equivalent coverage.

 

I also notice that map refresh appears to be slower. especially when turning. Is it my imagination, or has anyone else noticed this?

 

Hmmm, I to am wondering what to purchase here. I have a 60CSx and it looks like alot of you think the NT version is slower than the non-NT. I was about to purchase this but am now not sure what version to get. How slow if slower? I assume the slowness is in the map navigation (Panning & Navigating). Is it significant? I talked to Garmin about this and the person I talked to says they have used the NT version on their 60CSx and it works fine.

 

Any more suggestions?

[dualcore]

 

Any more suggestions?

 

It is really hard to call, depending on the area "content density", how fast your moving.

 

If you use it for walking (if you hike, most people use topo map), does, not matter. If you use it for driving, the lagging is a bit irritating in dense street area. It is your call.

 

NON-NT POI searching is also a bit faster. But that is not so important.

 

Future non-NT upgrade is a bit more expensive (because it is only available via garmin), for $75, versus $45-69 for NT upgrade available via different retailers

Edited October 7, 2008 by dualcore

[GeoBobC]

"How slow if slower?"

 

Well, I started this post so I must think it's noticeable. Let's say I'm driving 30 mph, and turn a corner. The turn is 90 degrees and takes 10 seconds. The NT version may take 12 to 15 seconds before it shows that I'm now going 90 degrees in a different direction, whereas with the older non NT version 8 the change would be nearly instantaneous. I really haven't measured the lag so these numbers are just guesstimates, but it was noticeable several times.

 

As for Garmin saying they're the same: well, duh. "That's the first time I've ever heard of that problem....".

[roybassist]

Let's say I'm driving 30 mph, and turn a corner. The turn is 90 degrees and takes 10 seconds. The NT version may take 12 to 15 seconds before it shows that I'm now going 90 degrees in a different direction

I’ve used the NT version since April, 2007, and I normally don’t see anything like that. As I turn a corner, the cursor rotates on the map with every 1-second update, and the map likewise rotates. The cursor always keeps up with my direction of travel. In other words, as soon as I am around the corner, it shows me on the new street, pointing and moving in the correct direction. The map rotation doesn’t always keep up with the direction of travel, so sometimes it finishes rotating to the track up position a short time (like one or two seconds) after I finish rounding the corner; but I have always thought this was a design decision by Garmin to smooth out the movement of the map.

 

I live in Denver, so the area is urban. I usually keep the level of detail set to “normal.” Once in a while I set the level of detail to “most” for travel in rural areas, and sometimes I haven’t changed the setting back to normal immediately on returning to the city. On those occasions I have noticed that the map is slower to redraw; but setting the level of detail back to normal returns the redraw speed to the performance I described above.

 

What level of detail do you have your unit set to display, and is it possible you were using a lower level of detail with the non-NT Version 8?

[GeoBobC]

I have the level of detail set to "MORE" which has not changed. I need to do further testing; if others are not seeing a difference in refresh, then perhaps it is something other than a change of products.

[roybassist]

I have the level of detail set to "MORE" which has not changed. I need to do further testing; if others are not seeing a difference in refresh, then perhaps it is something other than a change of products.

It could be that there is a difference, but it is more noticeable at higher levels of detail and negligible when the detail is set to normal.

[GeoBobC]

I just called Garmin, and of course got the expected answer: "we've never heard of that problem before".

 

I did some additional testing this morning by panning the map. On average, the hourglass took 6 to 8 seconds to disappear after each pan. I don't have the older non NT version loaded to compare, but as I recall the refresh was nearly instantaneous.

[strumble]

I just called Garmin, and of course got the expected answer: "we've never heard of that problem before".

 

I did some additional testing this morning by panning the map. On average, the hourglass took 6 to 8 seconds to disappear after each pan. I don't have the older non NT version loaded to compare, but as I recall the refresh was nearly instantaneous.

 

Having been a member of several forums for several years and had different models of Garmin units [eMap, 60c, 60csx, iQue, Colorado and now Oregon] I can assure you that the problem you have is 'known'!!!

 

I have not as yet gone back to the NT version and use Non NT in my present four family units including the new Oregon.

[dualcore]

 

...

Having been a member of several forums for several years and had different models of Garmin units [eMap, 60c, 60csx, iQue, Colorado and now Oregon] I can assure you that the problem you have is 'known'!!!

 

...

 

Echo that, especially for old model. The Garmin "cross-over" model Quest2, that uses NT, is so much slower than the Quest 1 (that use non-NT), that many people complains and try to return this otherwise good product at the time. People compains 15-20 seconds delay on redraw. that until the next turn the map is not yet completely shown. Garmin know that well.

[+The_Wanderers]

Well, I took the plunge and got the non-NT version for my 60CSx and so far it work great. Very smooth. It's nice to have routable maps to navigate by as well as having a great unit to Cache with

[samandheidi]

Well, I took the plunge and got the non-NT version for my 60CSx and so far it work great. Very smooth. It's nice to have routable maps to navigate by as well as having a great unit to Cache with

 

So, are you happy with the non nt version ? Where did you purchase ?

[SiliconFiend]

I used to have a version MetroGuide (hacked to make it routable) on my Vista HCx. It uses the uncompressed, older style map format like the non-NT version of City Nav. It was pretty quick and responsive. Since then, I got City Nav 2009 NT and installed it and it feels much slower. Identifying items on the map with the cursor takes maybe 5-10 seconds where it used to take 1-2 seconds. Calculating (and recalculating) an active route is much slower (sometimes too slow and I miss the turn for the detour) and sometimes the route calculation fails, even over a distance of 10 miles or so. Bringing up the recent finds list has a several second delay as well. In general, it just seems slower. Now, as a caveat, I also have loaded a customized transparent topo overlay (using Topo 3.02), so I'm sure searching through 2 map sets doesn't help. Although, hiding the Topo map does not increase the speed at all.

 

However, the real advantage of the NT format is the space savings. Without the smaller size of the NT maps, I wouldn't be able to have Topo coverage of most of the continental US loaded in addition to my routable road maps all in a 2 GB MicroSD. So, I'm not happy with the slow speed, but I'll accept it to have my nice integrated topo + routable roads.

[+The_Wanderers]

Well, I took the plunge and got the non-NT version for my 60CSx and so far it work great. Very smooth. It's nice to have routable maps to navigate by as well as having a great unit to Cache with

 

So, are you happy with the non nt version ? Where did you purchase ?

 

Yes, I have used it several times navigating and the non-NT version seems to be very smooth. I'm very happy with it. I was not so concerned of having all the US on the card at one time. I ended up putting the whole west coast (south of about Idaho down) as well as Illinois and Iowa (because I travel there) and it only took up about 1/3 of a 2GB card. Not bad at all.

[+The_Wanderers]

Well, I took the plunge and got the non-NT version for my 60CSx and so far it work great. Very smooth. It's nice to have routable maps to navigate by as well as having a great unit to Cache with

 

So, are you happy with the non nt version ? Where did you purchase ?

 

Oops, sorry, I did not tell you where I got it. I purchased mine from REI. The regular price is more there but I'm a member and used the 20% off coupon they have going right now. For $79 the price was the same at Amazon.