Travel Bugs Ok To Leave As Trade Items

February 23, 2006

I have a travel bug with me today and plan on leaving it in a cache that I'm near. I don't have anything with me to trade and my shopping options are very limited at the moment. In the cache's I have found so far, I've never taken or left anything.

If there was something of interest in the cache I hope to find today, is it ok to exchange the bug for an item?

Lyf

February 23, 2006

Since I mentioned I haven't removed anything from any cache I found, I guess I should have noted that the bug that I have was given to me by another geocacher for transport.

Lyf

February 23, 2006

Typically no, they are "Hitch-hikers", just a long for the ride, and not considered a trade item.

22k · February 23, 2006

Correct. Travel bugs are not trade items.

However, cash is acceptable for trade.

Edited February 23, 2006 by BlueDeuce

38.2k · February 23, 2006

Typically no, they are "Hitch-hikers", just a long for the ride, and not considered a trade item.

Yep. Which is also why its OK to take a TB and not leave anything in return.

Edited February 23, 2006 by briansnat

2.6k · February 23, 2006

But it's also okay not to trade.

10.2k · February 23, 2006

Typically no, they are "Hitch-hikers", just a long for the ride, and not considered a trade item.

Yep. Which is also why its OK to take a TB and not leave anything in return.

A no brainer here. But the number of people who take trade items in exchange for a Travel Bug, which belongs to someone else still never ceases to amaze me

11.3k · February 23, 2006

I have a travel bug with me today and plan on leaving it in a cache that I'm near. I don't have anything with me to trade and my shopping options are very limited at the moment. In the cache's I have found so far, I've never taken or left anything.

If there was something of interest in the cache I hope to find today, is it ok to exchange the bug for an item?

Lyf

Since Travel Bugs are not trade items, here is a quick scenario of what can happen if people take something when they drop off a Travel Bug.

A new cache is placed with eight items in it. Someone comes along, drops a TB and takes an item in "trade," but leaves nothing else. Now there are seven items in the cache.

Later another cacher comes to the cache and takes the TB to move it along. Still later another cacher comes along and drops off a TB, takes something in "trade," and leaves nothing. Now there are only six items in the cache. :laughing:

After this happens a few more times, the well-stocked cache has nothing in it except a dirty golf ball and the log book. :laughing:

February 23, 2006

A no brainer here. But the number of people who take trade items in exchange for a Travel Bug, which belongs to someone else still never ceases to amaze me

Well if it was a no brainer, no one would ever have to ask.

I didn't really see anything wrong with taking an item and leaving a travel bug as long as whoever took the travel bug put something in when they took it. The number of items in the cache would effectively never change. There would be one less item to trade as long as the travel bug was in there of course.

Hey, I've only found like 5 caches and it never hurts to ask. :laughing:

Lyf

9.5k · February 23, 2006

A no brainer here. But the number of people who take trade items in exchange for a Travel Bug, which belongs to someone else still never ceases to amaze me

Well if it was a no brainer, no one would ever have to ask.

I didn't really see anything wrong with taking an item and leaving a travel bug as long as whoever took the travel bug put something in when they took it. The number of items in the cache would effectively never change. There would be one less item to trade as long as the travel bug was in there of course.

Hey, I've only found like 5 caches and it never hurts to ask.

Lyf

That would be like changing the rules to driving on the road. Not everybody will do it and the ones that do will cause problems.

February 23, 2006

Lyfisin, it's a long-standing agreement (and it's even written somewhere in the geocaching code of conduct) that travel bugs are not to be considered or counted as trade items.

First, trade items are essentially abandoned or donated property. Travel bugs remain the property of their owner forever. You can't trade someone else's property, but you can help in achieving the owner's goals for that TB.

Second, TBs are trackable items (like geocoins) and as such are in a whole different category than trade items.

Third, the entire rest of the geocaching community has agreed to handle TBs this way.

You can take a TB or not. You can leave a TB or not. You can trade other items or not, but you cannot intermingle the two without essentially "stealing" one or the other.

1.4k · February 23, 2006

I didn't really see anything wrong with taking an item and leaving a travel bug as long as whoever took the travel bug put something in when they took it. The number of items in the cache would effectively never change. There would be one less item to trade as long as the travel bug was in there of course.

Hey, I've only found like 5 caches and it never hurts to ask.

Lyf

I'm glad you asked, that's what the forums are for. :blink:

Unless you can guarantee the next visitor to exchange the TB for a trade item, what you did can be considered wrong. I treat TB "transactions" separate from swag/trade item "transactions" - maybe that's an easier analogy to understand.

2.1k · February 24, 2006

I have a travel bug with me today and plan on leaving it in a cache that I'm near. I don't have anything with me to trade and my shopping options are very limited at the moment. In the cache's I have found so far, I've never taken or left anything.

If there was something of interest in the cache I hope to find today, is it ok to exchange the bug for an item?

Lyf

As has been previously stated, most people don't consider bugs to be trade items. After all, you aren't allowed to keep them, so the net balance between all the caches in the world is equal.

That being said, I can think of one, situation where it *might* be acceptable to 'trade' something out for a bug.

If you were to arrive at a cache where you intended to leave the bug, and there wasn't quite enough room, it might be acceptable to remove something from the cache in order to make room for the bug, as long as you returned said item to another cache without taking anything in trade. Some people will disagree with this though, but I think it makes sense (although only to a degree. Don't remove a really valuable item from a cache, and leave a bug in it's place, also don't take one of very few items out of a cache just to make room, try to think what the cache will be like after the bug has been removed). Another option is to return the 'traded' item to the cache once some room is freed up. (some people will doubtless argue here that you should just find another cache for the bug)

10.2k · February 24, 2006

A no brainer here. But the number of people who take trade items in exchange for a Travel Bug, which belongs to someone else still never ceases to amaze me

Well if it was a no brainer, no one would ever have to ask.

I didn't really see anything wrong with taking an item and leaving a travel bug as long as whoever took the travel bug put something in when they took it. The number of items in the cache would effectively never change. There would be one less item to trade as long as the travel bug was in there of course.

Hey, I've only found like 5 caches and it never hurts to ask.

Lyf

To be totally honest, I forgot which forum I was in! I've never posted here. Hope that didn't sound to smart-alecky And don't worry about asking, at least you thought enough to ask. Heck, I've seen someone with 2,000 finds trade a Travel Bug for a trade item, in a cache with a "no-junk, trade fairly or trade up" policy to boot!! To me, at least, not trading someone else's TB for a trade item has always been a "no-brainer"

February 24, 2006

it seems like here in southwest ohio treating travelbugs as trade items is pretty status-quo. i've never actually talked to anyone about it, but it just seems like thats how its always been. i almost always leave something when i take a travelbug and take something when i leave one.

i hope i do not regret saying that here...

anyway, i've actually always viewed travelbugs as a higher end trade item. most of the time i'm happier finding a travelbug rather than something i'd normally keep for myself. as the sheets say "this is no ordinary trade item!"

ben

10.2k · February 25, 2006

it seems like here in southwest ohio treating travelbugs as trade items is pretty status-quo. i've never actually talked to anyone about it, but it just seems like thats how its always been. i almost always leave something when i take a travelbug and take something when i leave one.

i hope i do not regret saying that here...

anyway, i've actually always viewed travelbugs as a higher end trade item. most of the time i'm happier finding a travelbug rather than something i'd normally keep for myself. as the sheets say "this is no ordinary trade item!"

ben

Naw, you won't regret saying it, this thread is almost dead. But a higher end trade item? Sure, maybe for the person who paid $5.95 + Shipping and handling for it, but it's not yours!! So if taking something from the cache in exchange for a Travel Bug, you are removing an item with monetary value, and replacing it with a temporary item that adds zero monetary value to the contents of that cache. And when the TB, a temporary item, is removed and long gone, the cache is -1 trade item, which was essentially traded for nothing. That makes sense, I hope

February 27, 2006

sorry to bring back the dead thread...

i get it, but wouldn't that be offset by me leaving the good items in the cache and only taking a travelbug in return? not the same cache, but the reciprocity seems logical to me.

ben

1.4k · February 27, 2006

sorry to bring back the dead thread...

i get it, but wouldn't that be offset by me leaving the good items in the cache and only taking a travelbug in return? not the same cache, but the reciprocity seems logical to me.

ben

If there was a "Karma Depository" then sure, you'll never be in debt. Still, listing owners and cachers may still get upset. Since I don't expect them to check on your activity like a nagging spouse, it's probably safe to follow the majority advice here, treat regular trade items and TBs as separate transactions.

March 2, 2006

I've found several caches and didn't know this "rule" either. I assumed that if you take something, you leave something--no matter if it's a TB or not.

Guess I was wrong.

A no brainer here. But the number of people who take trade items in exchange for a Travel Bug, which belongs to someone else still never ceases to amaze me

Well if it was a no brainer, no one would ever have to ask.

I didn't really see anything wrong with taking an item and leaving a travel bug as long as whoever took the travel bug put something in when they took it. The number of items in the cache would effectively never change. There would be one less item to trade as long as the travel bug was in there of course.

Hey, I've only found like 5 caches and it never hurts to ask.

Lyf

March 4, 2006

I have to admit, we messed up. Our first find had a travel bug and we grabbed it. we didn't know what it was at first. BUT we left something in the cache. So I guess the cache now has too many items.

When we got home, we read about the TB we grabbed. Seems it's wants to travel near water so we will help it along it's journey.

I assume since we left something in return, it's okay but should not be done in the future.

Now what about trading items? Is there any rules as far as what you should or shouln't trade? I mean I know not to leave food, weapons etc, but should you try and trade similar type items or similar priced items? Some of the caches we have found (and we are still new to this) have some nice stuff in them. And of course some don't.

Also, When we grab an item, should be trade it in the next cache? Or do we keep it and trade something of our own? What if the caches are close to each other, say only a mile or so, should we NOT trade the item we found in the previous cache?

One last thing, are TB and coins the only things that can be tracked? If we wanted to tract an item, we would have to buy a TB and attache it, right?

Thanks, and please don't bash a new member still learning. I want to make we do things correctly and would rather ask up front.

22k · March 4, 2006

Take something to keep, leave something to keep.

Leave something to travel, hope that it travels.

Edited March 4, 2006 by BlueDeuce

March 4, 2006

Not to worry, you haven't done a thing wrong.

1) It is always OK to leave something in a cache, even you you don't take something out (unless, of course, that would make the cache too full to close again). It is fine to leave something if you take a TB, just not required. I like to leave something if taking the TB makes the cache look too empty, just to make it nice for the next finder.

2) I didn't look to see--but I hope that you remembered to log the TB out of the cache when you picked it up. When you leave it in the next cache, be sure to log it in again. Ask if you need any help with logging TBs that the TB page links don't cover.

3) I try to trade items with a similar price range, if possible. I carry items with me that cost between 50 cents/1 dollar (lots) and about 10 dollars (1 item). I have traded two or three lesser price items for one higher price item in the past (both by taking the more expensive item and by leaving the more expensive item), but I like it best when I can leave at least as many items in the cache as when I found it.

4) You may trade items out of one cache into another, or an item of your own. I usually don't trade items around in nearby caches, just in case someone who collects some particular item sees it mentioned on a cache page and goes there to look for it. There is nothing wrong with doing that, however, --You might find something that you really want at cache two, and the only thing with you that is worth trading for it is the thing that you just picked up at cache one.

Plus see #5

5) Remember that you do not have to trade items at all. It is perfectly acceptable to just sign the log without trading anything. It is also OK to sign the log and leave a signature item or a trade item without taking anything.

5a) A signature item is something selected by a cacher to "represent" their visit, that they buy or make in multiples, so they can leave one at nearly every cache they visit. These are also not usually considered trade items, although that is a bit more complicated. Pricey, rare, or unusually exquisite items are coveted and collected in some areas by some cachers. Most These folks will usually trade for that kind of sig item (Examples: hand blown art-quality marbles, hand-made wood toys, etc). Some cachers who leave these sig items consider them a gift to the first person who wants them, others see them as trade items, and once in a great while someone will intend them to go to the cache owner. If I want the cache owner to get the item, I leave it in a bag marked "For Cache Owner, Please" and drop them a note when I log the cache page. Simpel sig items, such as laminated business cards are considered fair game for just picking up to add to a collection in my area (your area may vary--I suggest reading the old logs or emailing some folks with lots of caches in your area to see if you can figure out what is the norm where you usually cache)

6) TBs and coins are the only trackables that I know of. If you want to track an item, attach a TB travel tag to the item. Just understand that TBs often go missing, so don't use an item that you would be devastated to have disappear.

I usually just follow the idea of leaving the cache at least as nice as I find it.

March 4, 2006

Thanks for the information. This will make our "hunting" a lot more fun. As I said, we found some pretty nice items in a few of the caches. I knew up front that if we took something we need to leave something. So we "stocked" up with several items as we didn't know exactly what we would find and of course didn't know what kind of items people traded. We now know that people trade all kinds of items.

It's really a shame that the travel bugs get "lost". I had an idea for one but did some searching and found someone else had the exact same idea for a TB. I started to track it but it hasn't been seen in only 4 drop offs, but it did make it from Oregon or an eastern state all in one jump. It was on it's way to New York but didn't make it. I even sent the owner a message asking if they had heard anything about it. Kind of a bummer when a TB comes up missing.

Thanks again for all the info. I really appreciate it.

March 4, 2006

It's really a shame that the travel bugs get "lost". I had an idea for one but did some searching and found someone else had the exact same idea for a TB. ...

Thanks again for all the info. I really appreciate it.

You are certainly welcome!

By the way, if you really liked that travel bug idea, why not try it yourself? Travel bugs don't have to be unique and usually travel bugs do very well. There are travel bugs out there that have lots of miles and have been out for ages and ages.

Travel Bugs Ok To Leave As Trade Items

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