Ontario Town Search?????

[+team kweb cakes]

A couple months ago I posted here trying to figure out the best way to located caches will visiting the in-laws in Ontario. I was turned onto the very cool Town search through the Ontario Geocaching site. It's clearly been down for some time, but I was wondering if there was any way besides just searching postal codes to find caches. Geocaching.com maps works great in the US but sucks for Canada.....like if i'm driving along a road I can pan to see what caches are close.....how do you do that up there?

[+chris-mouse]

There's a couple of ways I have to pick out caches along a route. One easy, the other harder.

The easy way requires a premium membership. Request a couple of Pocket Queries for the area along your route, then use GSAK or GPSBabel to sort through the list and pick out only the caches close to your route.

 

For non members, it's a bit more work. Pick a cache near the starting point for your route and do a search for all nearby caches. Select all the caches in the search list, then download the resulting .loc file.

Once that's done, pick a cache that's a little further along your route, and do a search centred around that cache, and download another set of waypoints. Repeat this for the entire length of your route. (I said it was more work, didn't I)

Once you have the collection of downloaded waypoint lists, use GSAK or GPSBabel to combine the lists and eliminate the duplicate entries.

 

Either way, Once I have the list of waypoints, I dump a copy of them into my GPS, and then use Plucker to put a copy of the cache pages onto my PDA.

I find the PQ method to be a lot easier though. By picking the starting points of your PQ searches carefully, you can grab 90% or more of the cache waypoints in Ontario with only a dozen or so PQs.

[+Old Sailor]

What area you looking for?

[+team kweb cakes]

well my wife's sister and fam. live near Beamsville/Grimsby area.....and we're staying the night there, but then on Saturday we're headed up toward the Ingersoll/Norwich area. We have some time to play with on Saturday before we have to meet up with other family, so I thought I could get some caching in. Thanks for the help so far, and the help that's coming!

[+Old Sailor]

I just did a postal code search for Ingersoll ( N5C 2Y2 ) and came up with over1800 caches, if you now what postal code you need..... you will find plenty.....Old Sailor

[+logger&trail]

You can also use the buddy cache search engine on the OGA site. You can search by postal code or by physical coordinates. Enter your caching name (spelling counts) and either the postal code or physical coordinates and you will be emailed a list of caches within a 20 mile radius that you have not done. If you enter multiple cacher names it will find caches that none of you have done.

[+Keith Watson]

Until the OGA can get the towns search working again you can use the one at http://www.ghcaching.com/towns.php

Edited April 27, 2005 by Keith Watson

[+northernpenguin]

Thanks Keith. That's pretty slick.

[+The Blue Quasar]

looks a lot like the one that White Owl created for the Ontario Geocaching Association.

 

Must be a coincidence, since I know how the owner of GHCaching feels about "intellectual property"

 

The Blue Quasar

[+team kweb cakes]

THANK YOU THANK YOU THANK YOU!!!!! That's exactly what I was looking for. That helps a bunch.

 

team kweb cakes

[+Keith Watson]

I put the page up on the site because someone expressed and interest in it and I thought that maybe I would help people out since the OGA used to have a similar page and no longer provide that service. A good example of no good deed goes un-punished. But since you are now hinting that I have done something inappropriate, a feel a response is in order.

 

First of all I would like to acknowledge White Owl’s hard work in collecting all the data and making it available. White Owl went though the effort of collecting latitudes and longitudes of all the towns in Ontario. The data was then sent to me in Excel format. The data was moved from the Excel files into a Microsoft Access database by me. I then wrote the application using an Active Server Page to present the information with no consideration from the OGA.

 

According to the Copyright Act, factual information can not be copyrighted. The copy right can only be applied to the Excel files themselves. White Owl's contribution to the project ended with the Excel files. I must say that he did do a wonderful job collecting the information. Since I created the database and the Active Server Page with no consideration from the OGA one could argue the database and page belong to me. It would appear the Blue Quasar’s opinion differs.

 

For those of you that may not know, I created and managed the original OGA site. After a lengthy deliberation, I resigned my services as I believed my concerns about copyright and privacy legislation were not being addressed. This is not an accusation that the OGA was doing anything inappropriate. After consulting with a colleague in the industry I decided that it was in my best interest to distance myself from the project.

 

If anyone wishes to question my practices in regards to the Golden Horseshoe Geocachers web site then talk to me directly instead of making accusations and/or false assumptions in the forums. When I created the Golden Horseshoe Geocachers web site, my intent was to create a place where local geocachers could come and exchange information and provide tools that could help. I have made efforts to comply with copyright and privacy acts to the best of my ability. I give credit where credit is due, and even invite the owners of the sites I gather content/information from to visit and let me know if there is a problem. I state on the site “If someone has posted copyrighted material or otherwise illegal material, please notify us so that it may be removed”. Every effort has been made to protect the data on ghcaching.com, and comply with Federal legislation - including PIPEDA. The only information that is collected is what is actually needed to provide the services offered. Information that is required by such legislation is provided.

 

I make no revenue from advertising, or charge for the use of any part of the site. Why should anyone have a problem with the displaying of factual information that the OGA no longer provides?

 

Now that I have said my piece, I have a question for Blue Quasar. On the subject of “Intellectual Property”: Has the OGA secured permission from Groundspeak for the re-distribution of GPX files. These files look as if they contain the same information in the same format that can be obtained from the geocaching.com website via a paid service?

[+The Blue Quasar]

You are absolutely correct on much of what you said Keith.

 

You did a fantastic job of presenting the "Towns" page on both the OGA site when you were maintaining it, and now on the GHCachers page.

 

I am also happy to see that the info is again available to cachers, and you did meet a request from a fellow cacher. I don't have any issue with you using it, I was surprised to see that you did since you were often very concerned about copyright issues and ensuring that people's property was credited.

 

First of all I would like to acknowledge White Owl’s hard work in collecting all the data and making it available. White Owl went though the effort of collecting latitudes and longitudes of all the towns in Ontario. The data was then sent to me in Excel format. The data was moved from the Excel files into a Microsoft Access database by me. I then wrote the application using an Active Server Page to present the information with no consideration from the OGA.

 

Yup, true. You were able to utilize the data to present an easy to use search. You did transfer the Excel files into other programs, but that Excel file was created by White Owl for OGA. It was sent to you for inclusion on the OGA site, and that is what you did.

 

The copy right can only be applied to the Excel files themselves. White Owl's contribution to the project ended with the Excel files. I must say that he did do a wonderful job collecting the information.

 

This quote confirms that the Excel file is protected by copyright. Also, when White Owl's contribution ended with the Excel File. When you left OGA, your claim to OGA files ended as well. Anything that was created for OGA remains the property of OGA. Naturally the sections that you created after the Excel file are yours, and I would be more than happy to say that for all the work you did for OGA that you can have a copy of the Excel file so you can use it on your GHCachers page.

 

So that said, please continue to use the Excel file that White Owl made. I don't want either group to feel negatively towards each other. I would rather consider us brothers in this hobby (and brothers sometimes have spats... but we still love each other and make up)

 

Now on to the other topic you raised.

 

You brought up the OGA's feature of "Cache Buddy". Which for those that do not know, is an application to plan joint caching adventures with your friends.

 

I have a question for Blue Quasar. On the subject of “Intellectual Property”: Has the OGA secured permission from Groundspeak for the re-distribution of GPX files. These files look as if they contain the same information in the same format that can be obtained from the geocaching.com website via a paid service?

 

This also was true months ago. During the initial test period, the "Cache Buddy" application was sent as a beta test to some of the Premium Members of Geocaching.com to help us find some bugs and get feedback.

 

One of the first things that I noticed, and some others did too, was that there was a GPX option. I informed the programmer that we could not provide GPX files from Geocaching.com as it violated their "Terms and Conditions", just like you said. The option was removed and now only .LOC and a Browser version are available.

 

However, GPX files are not a propriatary file to Geocaching.com as there are several programs that allow you to create GPX files. GPX files are an open source and GSAK and EasyGPS both allow users to enter co-ordinates and save them as GPX for easy uploading to various devices or other software applications.

 

Should OGA in the future decide to create GPX files of it's own authoring, there is nothing preventing us from doing so. Provided OGA observes and respects the "Terms and Conditions" of Geocaching.com, we can make, distribute and edit any such files.

 

I trust that this is just another fun hiccup in our once-in-a-while bantering. As I have said before, you and are very much alike in the way we do things and feel about things. That is probably why we have these occational moments where one says something that wasn't worded well, the other gets annoyed and says more... and eventually we both look at it and wonder why were are arguing anyways.

 

I remember that in the Wednesday night chat the other night I said "Remember when someone would hide a cache, post coordinates, people would find it and have fun", and your reply was "I'm still having fun"

 

I am sorry if, even momentarily, I have reduced that feeling. Enjoy life as best you can, and don't let petty things annoy you. I am talking to myself as much as you there.

 

The Blue Quasar