XMap <> Topo USA 4 tips and tricks.

[+Dan_Edwards]

On the surface the Topo USA PDA exchage window looks straight forward enough, except for the fact that a lot of the time it does not do what you expect.

 

Topo map export works well and as expected for me, but dealing with draw layers and waypoints has me confused as to what it is doing. Sometimes I get it to export, and then other times I end up with several copies of the same waypoint.

 

I think when I import waypoint from the PDA it creates multiple copies on the desktop too. And then when I export it is creating multiple copies on the Palm, each time I go back and forth more and more appear.

 

I would have expected to the software to work like other PDA conduits and it would SYNC and only change new or update waypoints.

 

Anyway I thought I would create this topic so that we could work as a team to sort out what it is that software does now, and so that we can write to Delorme as a group and tell them how it should work.

 

The main trick I have found is to make sure you export the draw layer and then create waypoints you want exported as draw objects on the desktop. Map tags don't get exported I think.

 

Dan

 

A = A

[dboggny]

i will try and figure out layers, i haven't used them yet myself... usually, i download the waypoints as a draw file and just export the map nd they r there, no problems. if your talking about importing from one program to anoher, i can get xmap to import its routes into topo but thats about it so far

[CacheAndCarry]

Waypoints that are going to be exchanged are in text file in a folder C:Program FilesDelorme XMap DocsMobile MapsWpts Transfer. This location may vary based on what you select at install. Don't get confused, Topo4 hands waypoints, routes and tracks off to XMap for the actual exchange.

 

There should be 2 files in this folder:

XMapHHWptsRcv.txt - waypoints newly created on palm.

XMapHHWptsSend.txt - waypoints to be sent to palm.

 

The format for each is the same.

 

BEGIN SYMBOL

43.5639184713,-73.6121053696,14MI

43.8689500093,-74.4320030212,ADMUSM

43.5886377096,-73.5696084499,BLKM11

END

 

Check these files before actually doing a hotsync, sometimes Topo4 will create duplicates if you click the Prepare for Sync button more than once without actually performing a sync with the palm. Feel free to edit the file before sync just maintain the structure.

 

CacheAndCarry

 

Tennessee Tuxedo will not fail.

[CacheAndCarry]

Layers are cool! Make lots for different things, waypoints, tracks etc. Then you can turn different layers on and off by selecting their checkbox.

 

When you setup layers in Topo4 there is a predefined layer called "WaypointLayer", use this draw layer when exchanging waypoints. When you cut a map by selecting quads, be aware what layers are visible. What you see when you cut the map is what will be on the map on the handheld.

 

Be careful not the have the layer that contains your waypoints visible. If you do the waypoints will show up on the palm map, but as images on the map, not routable objects. Instead, exchange waypoints separately by using the exchange wizard and select "Send to Device" with object type select "User Map Data - Waypoints". This way the waypoints will show up in the routable waypoints list.

 

I wouldn't recommend putting more than 100 or so waypoints as performance viewing and selecting waypoints will suffer.

 

CacheAndCarry

 

Tennessee Tuxedo will not fail.

[+Dan_Edwards]

quote:

---

Originally posted by CacheAndCarry:

Waypoints that are going to be exchanged are in text file in a folder C:Program FilesDelorme XMap DocsMobile MapsWpts Transfer. This location may vary based on what you select at install. Don't get confused, Topo4 hands waypoints, routes and tracks off to XMap for the actual exchange.

 

There should be 2 files in this folder:

XMapHHWptsRcv.txt - waypoints newly created on palm.

XMapHHWptsSend.txt - waypoints to be sent to palm.

 

The format for each is the same.

 

BEGIN SYMBOL

43.5639184713,-73.6121053696,14MI

43.8689500093,-74.4320030212,ADMUSM

43.5886377096,-73.5696084499,BLKM11

END

 

Check these files before actually doing a hotsync, sometimes Topo4 will create duplicates if you click the Prepare for Sync button more than once without actually performing a sync with the palm. Feel free to edit the file before sync just maintain the structure.

 

CacheAndCarry

 

Tennessee Tuxedo will not fail.

---

 

I stumbled across these files this weekend when I was working with dboggny on transfering .loc files around. He had figured out that if you upload the waypoints to a standalone GPS, then you could download them to TopoUSA.

 

Since the format of the .loc file is very close to the format of the it should be pretty simple edit .loc into the import file on TopoUSA. Then just import them into a new layer and POW you can have layers for each Geocaching Query you do! SWEET!

 

Dan

 

A = A

[+Dan_Edwards]

quote:

---

Originally posted by CacheAndCarry:

Layers are cool! Make lots for different things, waypoints, tracks etc. Then you can turn different layers on and off by selecting their checkbox.

---

 

I was playing with this a little this weekend. I also noticed there is anouther section where you can make draw layers "active", this was different then the section with the checkboxes. This one was radio buttons. If I had to guess this would do something like locking a layer in Photoshop. You can still see it, but can't affect the stuff on it.

 

quote:

---

When you setup layers in Topo4 there is a predefined layer called "WaypointLayer", use this draw layer when exchanging waypoints. When you cut a map by selecting quads, be aware what layers are visible. What you see when you cut the map is what will be on the map on the handheld.

 

Be careful not the have the layer that contains your waypoints visible. If you do the waypoints will show up on the palm map, but as images on the map, not routable objects. Instead, exchange waypoints separately by using the exchange wizard and select "Send to Device" with object type select "User Map Data - Waypoints". This way the waypoints will show up in the routable waypoints list.

---

 

Thanks, that does help clear up what is happening a bit. So I am little confused. If I want both the object to appear on the map AND I want a waypoint so it can be routeable, how do I do that?

 

quote:

---

I wouldn't recommend putting more than 100 or so waypoints as performance viewing and selecting waypoints will suffer.

---

 

Yea after I downloaded a entire search of all level two or higher terrian rated Geocaches within 100 miles of me, I found that out the hard way. Glad I got the Visor Pro, I don't think I could have waited for my Deluxe to do it!

 

A = A

[+Dan_Edwards]

I have found a way to get Geocaching.com .loc files to import into TopoUSA 4 and XMap.

 

There are two files that Topo USA 4 uses when sending waypoints back and forth to XMap. If you look inside the "Mobile Maps/WptsTransfer directory you will find two files, one called "XMAPHHWptsRcv" and "XMAPHHWptsSend". These files are your basic standard CSV file with just the words "BEGIN SYMBOL" and "END" tacked onto the start and end of the file.

 

Today I found a program called GPSBabel on sourceforge that translates a lot of formats. So I had it translate the .loc file from my Geocaching query to a CSV file. I then used Notepad to add "BEGIN SYMBOL" at the start and "END" to the end of the data. I then replaced the "XMAPHHWptsRcv" with the new file. I loaded Topo USA and went to the exchange wizard and told it to import the waypoints from the Palm into a new layer and I was done. Not the most user friendly method, but it works.

 

Took me a little while to find the FAQ for GPS Babel so I thought I would show a example command line.

 

gpsbabel -s -i geo -f 10322.loc -o csv -F overgrade2.csv

 

-s tells it to use the long name rather then the "GCxxxx" name from the geocaching .loc file. If you like the GCxxxx name, leave that off.

 

-i geo tells it your inputing a geocaching.com .loc file.

 

-f 10322.loc is the name of the input file name.

 

-o csv tells it that the output format will be csv

 

-F overgrade2.csv tells it to output the data to the file overgrade2.csv.

 

A = A

[dboggny]

quote:

---

Originally posted by Dan Edwards:

I have found a way to get Geocaching.com .loc files to import into TopoUSA 4 and XMap.

 

There are two files that Topo USA 4 uses when sending waypoints back and forth to XMap. If you look inside the "Mobile Maps/WptsTransfer directory you will find two files, one called "XMAPHHWptsRcv" and "XMAPHHWptsSend". These files are your basic standard CSV file with just the words "BEGIN SYMBOL" and "END" tacked onto the start and end of the file.

 

Today I found a program called http://sourceforge.net/projects/gpsbabel/ on sourceforge that translates a lot of formats. So I had it translate the .loc file from my Geocaching query to a CSV file. I then used Notepad to add "BEGIN SYMBOL" at the start and "END" to the end of the data. I then replaced the "XMAPHHWptsRcv" with the new file. I loaded Topo USA and went to the exchange wizard and told it to import the waypoints from the Palm into a new layer and I was done. Not the most user friendly method, but it works.

 

Took me a little while to find the FAQ for GPS Babel so I thought I would show a example command line.

 

gpsbabel -s -i geo -f 10322.loc -o csv -F overgrade2.csv

 

-s tells it to use the long name rather then the "GCxxxx" name from the geocaching .loc file. If you like the GCxxxx name, leave that off.

 

-i geo tells it your inputing a geocaching.com .loc file.

 

-f 10322.loc is the name of the input file name.

 

-o csv tells it that the output format will be csv

 

-F overgrade2.csv tells it to output the data to the file overgrade2.csv.

 

A = A

---

 

i was gonna suggest trying this, in fact i did try it about a month ago but i didnt have the knowledge to figure out how to get gps babel to work

 

SR and dboggny. my mother in law rides a broom!

[+Dan_Edwards]

I left out the most useful command for GPSBabel. GPSBabel -?

That will show a list of available formats it can convert.

 

A = A

[robertlipe]

quote:

---

Originally posted by Dan Edwards:

 

I These files are your basic standard CSV file with just the words "BEGIN SYMBOL" and "END" tacked onto the start and end of the file.

...

Today I found a program called http://sourceforge.net/projects/gpsbabel/ on sourceforge that translates a lot of formats. So I had it translate the .loc file from my Geocaching query to a CSV file. I then used Notepad to add "BEGIN SYMBOL" at the start and "END" to the end of the data.

---

 

I just posted a trivial patch to GPSBabel 1.0.0 that adds that as 'tusa4' format on the mailing list for that program at http://gpsbabel.sourceforge.net If you could verify that it works, I'll commit it for the next version. (If you want a windows binary with that added, mail me privately.)

 

quote:

---

I then replaced the "XMAPHHWptsRcv" with the new file. I loaded Topo

---

 

Use -F /path/to/XMAPHHWptsRcv and it'll write it directly to that file if you like.

[dboggny]

quote:

---

Originally posted by robertlipe:

quote:

---

Originally posted by Dan Edwards:

 

I These files are your basic standard CSV file with just the words "BEGIN SYMBOL" and "END" tacked onto the start and end of the file.

...

Today I found a program called http://sourceforge.net/projects/gpsbabel/ on sourceforge that translates a lot of formats. So I had it translate the .loc file from my Geocaching query to a CSV file. I then used Notepad to add "BEGIN SYMBOL" at the start and "END" to the end of the data.

---

 

I just posted a trivial patch to GPSBabel 1.0.0 that adds that as 'tusa4' format on the mailing list for that program at http://gpsbabel.sourceforge.net If you could verify that it works, I'll commit it for the next version. (If you want a windows binary with that added, mail me privately.)

 

quote:

---

I then replaced the "XMAPHHWptsRcv" with the new file. I loaded Topo

---

 

Use -F /path/to/XMAPHHWptsRcv and it'll write it directly to that file if you like.

---

 

Dear Rob:

 

How about a version of gpsbabel for those of us who are computer idiots? when i said i coulnt get it to work, i mean that i could not get the progem to work at all... it requires dos commands and stuff. what are those things anyway??

 

SR and dboggny. my mother in law rides a broom!

[robertlipe]

quote:

---

Originally posted by SR & dboggny:

 

Dear Rob:

---

"Robert", please.

quote:

---

How about a version of gpsbabel for those of us who are computer idiots? when i said i coulnt get it to work, i mean that i could not get the progem to work at all... it requires dos commands and stuff. what are those things anyway??

---

 

Do you really mean the program failed to execute or do you mean that the thought of typing a command just isn't your bag? There are eight examples given in the doc.

 

I don't distribute a DOS program, though it can be built for DOS. I do offer a version bilt for Windows. It is a command line program since a tool like this is often needed in an automatable context.

 

A GUI wrapper for it wouldn't be that hard to do.

I'd bet that a cgi jockey could put a php or other web front end on it in an afternoon easily.

I've just not been motivated to do one yet and nobody has contributed one.

 

If you do some task frequently, it's trivial to wrap the (admittedly potentially lengthy) command line invocation in a batch file or a desktop icon. If you do it infrequently, the six seconds it takes to type it isn't a big deal.

 

So, yes, I'd like to make it more accessible to those that think only GUIs are "real programs" but it's not at the top of the list for my midnight hacking projects.

[dboggny]

quote:

---

Originally posted by robertlipe:

quote:

---

Originally posted by SR & dboggny:

 

Dear Rob:

---

"Robert", please.

quote:

---

How about a version of gpsbabel for those of us who are computer idiots? when i said i coulnt get it to work, i mean that i could not get the progem to work at all... it requires dos commands and stuff. what are those things anyway??

---

 

Do you really mean the program failed to execute or do you mean that the thought of typing a command just isn't your bag? There are eight examples given in the doc.

 

.

---

 

i tried to follow the examples in the doc... but not understanding root directories and things i could not get the program to execute.... it was due to my lack of knowledge. i tried typing in different combinations as best i could from the examples but if you just dont have the knowledge, its kinda hard... i think the program is great, its just for me, i couldnt get it.

 

SR and dboggny. my mother in law rides a broom!

[+Dan_Edwards]

quote:

---

Originally posted by SR & dboggny:

 

i tried to follow the examples in the doc... but not understanding root directories and things i could not get the program to execute.... it was due to my lack of knowledge. i tried typing in different combinations as best i could from the examples but if you just dont have the knowledge, its kinda hard... i think the program is great, its just for me, i couldnt get it.

 

SR and dboggny. my mother in law rides a broom!

---

 

Get ahold of me sometime on Yahoo IM and I will talk you thru how to use command line and directories and stuff.

 

A = A

[+Dan_Edwards]

Just a FYI...

 

Robert has been helping me and he created a version of GPSBabel that will create the files that work with the XMap - Topo USA conduit directly saving me from having to manually edit the CSV output. He also stamped a small bug that would sometime mess up the long cache names with the "-s" option.

 

Made my weekend!

 

A = A

[+Dan_Edwards]

Just a FYI...

 

Robert has been helping me and he created a version of GPSBabel that will create the files that work with the XMap - Topo USA conduit directly saving me from having to manually edit the CSV output. He also stamped a small bug that would sometime mess up the long cache names with the "-s" option.

 

Made my weekend!

 

A = A

[+Dan_Edwards]

One thing that me and dboggny found out is that now that we can easily get hundreds of waypoints into XMap, there is no easy way to get rid of them. First dboggny tried to delete the XMapWptsDB from the Hotsync directory thinking that would cause the database to delete on the handheld. Uh, no it just crashed the Palm on Sync.

So then he deleted the database on the handheld. That worked. The only trick is that you need a program that will list all databases on the Palm. TealMover and PiMover can see the database and delete it, but I am sure there are others that will work.

 

A = A

[dboggny]

i have finally figured out gpsbabel. i dont know how but i did. if anyone is in the same boat as me (has no computer sense) and is trying to get gpsbabel to run on xp, and is having a problem, drop me a line and i will tell you word for word how to set it up so it is simple.

 

SR and dboggny.

[+parkrrrr]

quote:

---

Originally posted by Dan Edwards:

So then he deleted the database on the handheld. That worked. The only trick is that you need a program that will list all databases on the Palm. TealMover and PiMover can see the database and delete it, but I am sure there are others that will work.

---

 

Another trick that should work would be to "install" an empty database with the same name, creator, and TypeID as the database you're trying to remove. This works because things you install get synced before conduits are run, so you'd effectively clear out the database and then sync the new data into it. The advantage to this method is that you run zero risk of accidentally deleting the wrong database with TealMover, and you can do it all from your desktop machine.

 

I haven't been able to test this, as I don't have the XMap conduit installed here, but there's a blank database with the appropriate name, creator, and typeid at http://216.202.195.127/BlankXMap.zip that you can try it with.

 

[dboggny]

for those who care, there is now a graphical interface created by mr snazz for gpsbabel i think it can be downlaoded from the same place gpsbabel is downloaded from.

 

SR and dboggny.

[dboggny]

i am bringing this thread back from the dead. i was fooling around with this a bit the other day because my gps was dead and i had no money for batteries. i was gonna take my palm out with me. however, i could not get the waypoints to show up on the palm. does anyone remember how to do this, i just can't figure it out; its been so long since i used this method. thanks danny

 

SR and dboggny.