Ground Zero caches question

[+And Sister]

There's a Ground Zero puzzle cache in my area that's been driving me nuts for over a year, for various reasons. By looking at previous logs and doing some crosschecking, I have now determined the general area that cache is located in, but the closest I can get my coordinates to that area is down the street a couple of tenths of a mile away. Last night I did a little research on other Ground Zero caches in other states, and I noticed that all three of the ones I found have updated information (from November/December 2011) saying that once the users have determined how to get the ground zero coordinates for the location, "due to a recent change on the Geocaching.com website, you need to offset the numbers you got [as follows]". But the numbers all three of those pages use to offset both the north and west coordinates differ. (i.e. one says to add 0.816 to the North coords and another says to add 0.239 to North, etc.) My questions:

 

1) How are these offsets determined?

2) Do they differ depending on the location (state) of the cache?

3) If they don't differ, why do all three of the cache pages I'm looking at for reference purposes use different offsets?

4) How can I find out what offsets to use for the cache I'm looking at?

 

The cache page I'm looking at does not have a cache owner note about changes to the website affecting the calculations of the location, and the cache owner has been unresponsive in the past when I've contacted him about this and other caches he is responsible for, so asking him seems to be a useless endeavor.

[+kantear]

i'm confused, could you post links?

 

to the cache(s) you're referring to, and the link to where this is - "due to a recent change on the Geocaching.com website, you need to offset the numbers you got [as follows]"

[+The A-Team]

i'm confused, could you post links?

 

to the cache(s) you're referring to, and the link to where this is - "due to a recent change on the Geocaching.com website, you need to offset the numbers you got [as follows]"

I think they're talking about caches like this one. The "recent change" would have been to something in the background of the site, so I doubt there was any kind of official notice anywhere.

I thought I had figured out a quick to solve these, but after trying the Geochecker on a couple of them, I guess that method doesn't work. I can think of how I might go about it, though.

I guess if your particular cache doesn't mention offsets, then they're not required. The owner may have changed the cache sufficiently to accomodate the website change. I won't spell it all out for you, because doing so would be a massive hint, but I can see why the offsets would be different for different locations. Really, if the owner isn't responding, and it's been "driving you nuts", I'd just contact a previous finder and ask for a hint.

 

ETA: Hmm, I just tried a couple more things, but didn't get the right result. I think another more recent change may have changed one method of solving these. I'm pretty sure my method should have worked. Maybe you should ask a previous finder if their method still works.

Edited January 23, 2012 by The A-Team

[+And Sister]

i'm confused, could you post links?

 

to the cache(s) you're referring to, and the link to where this is - "due to a recent change on the Geocaching.com website, you need to offset the numbers you got [as follows]"

 

Well, I'm reluctant to link to all of the caches because they are puzzle caches and a couple of the pages give instructions that give a lot away. But this cache does a good job of hinting at what needs to be done without being too explicit and also gives an example of "you must offset the location you get in this manner": http://coord.info/GCM2PD. If you need more information or want to see the cache I'm actually working on, I will give you that information by private message if you like.

[+And Sister]

i'm confused, could you post links?

 

to the cache(s) you're referring to, and the link to where this is - "due to a recent change on the Geocaching.com website, you need to offset the numbers you got [as follows]"

I think they're talking about caches like this one. The "recent change" would have been to something in the background of the site, so I doubt there was any kind of official notice anywhere.

I thought I had figured out a quick to solve these, but after trying the Geochecker on a couple of them, I guess that method doesn't work. I can think of how I might go about it, though.

I guess if your particular cache doesn't mention offsets, then they're not required. The owner may have changed the cache sufficiently to accomodate the website change. I won't spell it all out for you, because doing so would be a massive hint, but I can see why the offsets would be different for different locations. Really, if the owner isn't responding, and it's been "driving you nuts", I'd just contact a previous finder and ask for a hint.

 

Yup. That's the kind of cache I'm talking about. However, my guess is that the particular cache I'm talking about doesn't mention them because the CO is either not aware of the change or isn't motivated to do anything about it. The cache has only been found by a few people. I have only met one of them, and I did send a message asking about it. But he found it a couple of years ago, so I'm not hopeful he'll be very helpful in determining any needed offsets, though I'm hoping he can confirm my guess as to the general area I expect it to be found. The last find on it was over a year ago, so even that finder may not know anything about needed offsets.

[+The A-Team]

i'm confused, could you post links?

 

to the cache(s) you're referring to, and the link to where this is - "due to a recent change on the Geocaching.com website, you need to offset the numbers you got [as follows]"

I think they're talking about caches like this one. The "recent change" would have been to something in the background of the site, so I doubt there was any kind of official notice anywhere.

I thought I had figured out a quick to solve these, but after trying the Geochecker on a couple of them, I guess that method doesn't work. I can think of how I might go about it, though.

I guess if your particular cache doesn't mention offsets, then they're not required. The owner may have changed the cache sufficiently to accomodate the website change. I won't spell it all out for you, because doing so would be a massive hint, but I can see why the offsets would be different for different locations. Really, if the owner isn't responding, and it's been "driving you nuts", I'd just contact a previous finder and ask for a hint.

 

Yup. That's the kind of cache I'm talking about. However, my guess is that the particular cache I'm talking about doesn't mention them because the CO is either not aware of the change or isn't motivated to do anything about it. The cache has only been found by a few people. I have only met one of them, and I did send a message asking about it. But he found it a couple of years ago, so I'm not hopeful he'll be very helpful in determining any needed offsets, though I'm hoping he can confirm my guess as to the general area I expect it to be found. The last find on it was over a year ago, so even that finder may not know anything about needed offsets.

Yeah, it kind of sounds like it's unsolveable. I bet there are many that have tried to solve it in the past year, but have failed and just passed it over without ever posting anything on the cache page. The CO probably hasn't even realized that no one is finding it or that the puzzle has changed. You might want to post a note saying you're having problems solving it. That might get some of those failed-solvers to pipe up and say that they ran into problems too.

[+And Sister]

Yeah, it kind of sounds like it's unsolveable. I bet there are many that have tried to solve it in the past year, but have failed and just passed it over without ever posting anything on the cache page. The CO probably hasn't even realized that no one is finding it or that the puzzle has changed. You might want to post a note saying you're having problems solving it. That might get some of those failed-solvers to pipe up and say that they ran into problems too.

 

Well, I can give it a try. If other would-be solvers chime in, maybe I'll get a response. I won't hold my breath, though.

[+Ambient_Skater]

Well, I'm reluctant to link to all of the caches because they are puzzle caches and a couple of the pages give instructions that give a lot away.

The cache descriptions themselves give a lot away? I don't understand...

[+And Sister]

Well, I'm reluctant to link to all of the caches because they are puzzle caches and a couple of the pages give instructions that give a lot away.

The cache descriptions themselves give a lot away? I don't understand...

 

Some of the Ground Zero puzzles I've found do give instructions about how to solve them, but other GZ cache owners want these kept as true puzzle caches and require the solvers to figure out how to go about doing that. Putting the links to all the puzzles I found would reveal more than the latter COs want revealed.

 

I believe The A Team has answered my original query, for which I thank him.

[+kantear]

ok ... i had 2 other "ground zero's" in mind ... neither one was this. now i understand.

 

sorry though, i can't offer anything more than what's been said.

[Skippermark]

All the Ground Zero caches use the same method to get the "Ground Zero" coordinates. After that, some owners will add unique twists to the puzzle to solve for the actual cache location. I've only seen one Ground Zero cache use a different method, but no one could figure it out since it didn't use the "standard" method. I think it got archived without ever being found.

 

For the cache in question, it has a puzzle checker, and I was able to get a successful result.

 

That said, the GZ puzzles aren't something someone will likely figure out on their own, and everyone I know had to get a lot of hints or be told how to solve their first one.