WHY

[Guest sunsetnkc]

d to the others so that anyone can search from any of the geocaching sites and get all the postings on one? we are all in it for the sport and fun of it, aren't we? so is it impossible to 'get along' and make this possible?

 

at least that's one mans opinion....

[Guest jeremy]

It has and will always my opinion that there is only one registry for geocaching locations around the world. Keep in mind that these are physical caches hidden in real places, and it is important to make sure there is one location to find these coordinates. This is not some shareware application that can be disseminated with little consequence.

 

Others will explain this better than I can, but when you start disseminating information on the Internet, that information can become stagnant quickly. The geocaching.com database is incredibly organic and changes on a minute-by-minute basis, and even more so as the game gains popularity. Any other web sites that take data from this site and display it on theirs is irresponsible, *especially* in the minds of the park officials who we're attempting to accept this game as legitimate.

 

There are other reasons (privacy concerns of personal data, for one, being able to edit your information in one location for a cache is another), that others can explain to you.

 

Jeremy

[Guest Quinnow]

I hope I am not speaking out of place, and if you feel that I am then by all means please delete my post with no hard feelings on doing as such.

I think what Jeremy is saying is that "taking" information from this site and posting it on another in no way means that a cache owner can not himself post his/her caches on multi sites. At least thats what I hope he means and is not implying that others come in here and cut and past cache info to add said caches on other sites. any caches posted on my site are there at the owners posting and I would not allow it any other way.

As for parks officials, a cache is a cache is a cache, meaning that no matter what site a cache is submitted to it does not change the physical aspect of the container, so I can't see why a cache being posted here is more-so excepted in your eyes than it would be anywheres else. I myself can't speak for the 3rd site but I can assure you that I closely watch where and what type of caches are placed on my site to make certain that no damage is being done to the land it is placed on.

I have many caches submitted to this site which I spend a great deal of time placing, they are here because of the members and not for myself, if this was the case they would have been archived by me.

It is not good in my opinion to assume what other sites are doing and for what reasons, but better to ask and get facts for responses.

And please, like I mentioned above, I am not posting this to be a source of Ill-Feelings, but rather to add some light and clear the way for what I think could be misunderstood by comments made above.

You also by all means have my permission(not that you need it) to post on my forum your thoughts and feelings.

Thank you for your time and I hope all goes well here for you.

 

------------------

Quinn Stone

Rochester, NY.14616

www.Navicache.com

[Guest PC Medic]

quote:

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Any other web sites that take data from this site and display it on theirs is irresponsible, *especially* in the minds of the park officials who we're attempting to accept this game as legitimate.

 

There are other reasons (privacy concerns of personal data, for one, being able to edit your information in one location for a cache is another), that others can explain to you.

 

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Now that we know Navicache.com and Geocaching.com both use constantly changing static databases, I would like to go one step further if I may be so bold.

 

I for one would be quite interested in Jeremy's response here in confirming if he is in fact implying that Navicache.com (or ANY other specific site for that matter) is "taking data", whether by cut-n-paste, or any other method to display on their site?

I am hoping I am just reading something wrong here.

 

As for the park officials, I agree with Quinnow on this, "a cache is a cache, is a cache!". What site a cache is listed on hardly has any bearing on whether or not the sport would be accepted in a particular park or park system. Responsible caching is responsible caching, and that is what will determine whether the sport is widely accepted.

 

PC Medic

Team Navicache

[Guest Mopar]

quote:

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Originally posted by PC Medic:

As for the park officials, I agree with Quinnow on this, "a cache is a cache, is a cache!". What site a cache is listed on hardly has any bearing on whether or not the sport would be accepted in a particular park or park system. Responsible caching is responsible caching, and that is what will determine whether the sport is widely accepted.

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It's true a cache is a cache, no matter what or how many sites its listed on. That said, muliple listing sites means muliple contacts to keep track of, and multiple sites to monitor. Right now, 3-4 might not be too bad, but what about 15? While a parks official may allow coaching knowing he only has to check one website to keep tabs on it, and contact one person if he has a problem, his attitude may very well change if he has to contact 4, 8 or 12 people/websites if there is a problem.

 

Mirroring the information would be just as bad, since there is no way to force the mirrors to update. Besides, the database is so dynamic, most of your bandwidth and cpu cycles would be spent just trying to keep everyone current.

 

I do think regional sites, club sites etc. are a good idea. They can even include cache listings, but that information needs to be drawn off one central database. This way there is still just one contact if a problem arises. The problem there is the person maintaining the database is esentially paying for the bandwidth the other sites are using, without any chance of recouping those costs. I personally know that as a website maintainer myself, nothing gets me more fired up then to find another site "stealing" my bandwidth. I don't see an easy solution to that part.

[Guest pater47]

ttle brown bottle) there which I have never posted with Navicache nor given anyone else permission to do so. Incidentally, when I clicked on it, it took me back to geocaching.com.

[Guest Markwell]

Buxley pulls information for caches when they are new, and then posts them to his site with the appropriate links. His data is static and relies on visitors to let him know when a cache has been archived.

 

Mind you, I think that his maps are more user-friendly than Jeremy's (not that Jeremy's aren't good), but they are indeed static.

 

Some database definitions that seem to be confused from earlier posts...

 

An organic or dynamic database is one that is constantly being updated through deletions, additions and modifications. A static database takes a snapshot of a dynamic database and uses that for its information.

 

Speaking as a database author and administrator, I believe Jeremy's concern lies in the fact that if I post my cache here at Geocaching.com and at Navicache.com and its posted on Buxley's maps, etc., and then I archive it, will I as a responsible cacher archive it in all locations?

 

What about sites like Buxley's that takes the information from first posting only? If I didn't know about his site, the only way that my archived cache would be removed from his maps is if someone else contacted him.

 

It is always best to have the information in one dynamic location - but I understand the desires of Quinnow and others to provide additional features and service. It just requires a little more diligence on the cache placer and the site owners to remove archived caches.

[Guest PC Medic]

quote:

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Originally posted by pater47:

Is "Buxley's maps" considered Navicache, Geocaching, both, or what? I went to Navicache and looked at Buxley's maps and found my cache (little brown bottle) there which I have never posted with Navicache nor given anyone else permission to do so. Incidentally, when I clicked on it, it took me back to geocaching.com.

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Buxley's Maps is Buxley's Maps. Just as Navicache.com, Geocaching.com and others are their own independent sites. Some share databases, some don't. Navicache has chosen to share it's cache submissions database with Buxley's as this in effect results in one central search point for cache listings giving cache owners greater overalll exposure. It also allows the rest of the site to be styled to meet the needs and wants of the members.

[Guest Quinnow]

quote:

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Originally posted by pater47:

Is "Buxley's maps" considered Navicache, Geocaching, both, or what? I went to Navicache and looked at Buxley's maps and found my cache (little brown bottle) there which I have never posted with Navicache nor given anyone else permission to do so. Incidentally, when I clicked on it, it took me back to geocaching.com.

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Peter...your cache is not submitted to Navicache.com , if you see it on Buxleys maps and it links back to here that does not mean it's listed on my site. It simply means it's placed on Geocaching.com and was picked up as a cache and linked within Buxleys maps. For a better understanding Buxley is just a link on my site but also uses cache information submitted to it, same as here.

To also touch on another poster's words, When a cache is archived here, it is also archived on Buxleys maps and does not remain "Live" Not to mention if a cache is missing and or removed, it only takes a matter of a single post in the find reports to come to this conclussion even if a cache has been forgotten and left by it's owner. Thus this sends up a red flag for remving the information from the site / sites.

Cache containers should Aways have some sort of contact information inside them linking back to the cache owner if for some reason a parks official has a problem, I am not saying that it shouldn't also have the website address posted inside, but it is the main contact of who has placed it that is important. But sadly to say that any park official lately does not even open the container to see who owns it, they just call you know who to come down and turn it into smoke.

[Guest wapa2ee]

well i have bookmarked egroups yahoo clubs newsgroups and a few other sites all dealing with geocaching

and im a member at navicache

i also happen to like the interface of buxleys maps a little better

and i like navicache

but this site is at this time the largest

and contains the most data

even though i like buxleys

i use the map here because its here

it functions the same and i dont have to go to another url

 

i dont want to go to the meat store for meat

when i can get meat at the same store i get my milk

unless i need a special cut that the milk store doesnt have