segler999

OK, I think I figured out how to insert photos. It was buried deep in a FAQ. I followed all the directions there. Now, using the insert image icon above, I get: Strawberry Summit Looking SE No cairns visible. Might this blue-purple cement-stuff indicate a monument? Good GPS signal with 360 deg sky down to the horizon.

Everyone, this is a great discussion!! Thanks. I originally got the lat/lons off the ngs.noaa.gov website and used something like Geocalc to convert them to the decimal format. When we hiked up there 2 weeks ago, we looked around pretty hard (spent about 3 hours up there on the summit) and found no trace of disk benchmarks nor stems. All we saw was some kind of bluish-purplish cement-like material at three different locations. Besides those, the only other evidence of manmade structure is remnants of concrete foundation and several places where steel cable fragments go down into the rocks. Also, pieces of weathered wood scattered in the rocks, too. I have 3 photos I would like to insert here, but the icon above requires a url. Can somebody please guide me about how to do this? Simple copy and paste doesn't work.

NGS lists three horizontal benchmarks at the summit of Strawberry Mt in eastern Oregon: STRAWBERRY 44.312222 118.716667 STRAWBERRY MOUNTAIN 44.311944 118.716389 STRAWBERRY MOUNTAIN LOH 44.311944 118.716111 NGS lat/lons are converted to decimal dd.ddddddd since I use my gpsrs with decimal. Prior to use with airplanes, then later satellites, Strawberry used to have a USFS fire lookout house on the summit. It was a simple wooden building held in place with anchored cables. Since it was on the absolute summit, no tower was required. When you hike up there now, you can still see remnants of the steel cable, weathered wood, and concrete foundation. The elevation is 9038', which is the highest point in the central part of eastern Oregon, exceeded only by the Wallowas (9900') 100 miles to the northeast, and the Steens (9733') 100 miles to the south. The three benchmarks were established, we believe, to establish triangulation points visible from different directions. On 7/29 we hiked up there on vacation. With a 60Cx and 76Cx we tried to locate the benchmarks on the ground, in a kind of geocaching process. With the extremely severe winter weather that the exposed summit gets, we were not surprised to find no surviving metal benchmarks. However, we did observe locations that appeared to have manmade monumenting materials set in the bedrock.

OK, yes, we hiked up there, as intended, recorded lat/lon/alt for this vertical benchmark, and took a few pictures. We recorded lat/lons on two consecutive days (going in and coming out). The following is all the data (lat/lons are in the decimal ddd.ddddd format). Altitudes are gps-based. At that altitude and in the open we never got fewer than 8 satellites, and WAAS was solid. The markings on the benchmark show H88 USGS 1940 Vertical 8172' So, this confirms what DaveD wrote above in the USGS description. The description is very accurate. ***************************************** Lat/Lon/Alt 7/27/07 Sportrak Basic (averaging): 44.30908 118.68494 8247' Legend: 44.28454 118.67564 8181' 76Cx: 44.28455 118.67559 8180' 60Cx: 44.28453 118.67560 8187' ***************************************** Lat/Lon/Alt 7/28/07 Sportrak Basic (averaging): 44.28450 118.67559 8174' Legend: 44.28453 118.67561 8180' 76Cx: 44.28455 118.67561 8176' 60Cx: 44.28450 118.67559 8187' ***************************************** With the exception of the Sportrak on the first day, the results of all four instruments on the two consecutive days was within a latitude of 0.00005 degree, a longitude of 0.00005 degree, and a vertical of 13'. Amazing. I will send these results into the NGS, and will enter a couple of the better photos into the contest. The mapping geo-references in Delorme, MapSource, and Google Earth are about 50' off (maybe they are all sourced on Navteq). When you locate these lat/lons above on the digital maps, the points shown are clearly not what is on the ground. The ridge is very narrow, and its crest is very easy to pinpoint on the maps. When you locate the above lat/lons on the maps, they miss the ridge crest by about 50' consistently. I would hope that the mapping companies are getting on-ground reports for the horizontal markers and making geo-reference corrections accordingly.

Hey everyone, I keep reading about people having trouble with "saving" tracks, losing time-stamp data, truncating to 500 points, yada-yada. If you want to avoid this issue completely, first get a gpsr that has a microSD card capability, get a big card (1-2gb), turn on the "log track to card" in the firmware, and be happy forever. Never ever "save" your track and be disappointed with the results. Instead, just read the gpx files that is automatically logged to the card with ALL the data contained therein. I recently completed a 11-day vacation with my 60Cx, both in the car and on the trail. At the end of the trip I had a nice collection of gpx files on the card. Those files contained ALL the track data. No truncating, no stripping of data, nothing. It was ALL there. I used a usb card reader to move the files to the pc, but you can use the usb mass storage mode on the gpsr as well. I had track logging turned on the whole time. The internal log did hit the 10,000 point limit and did indeed wrap, like it is supposed to. However, it did not matter since ALL the individual track log point data were logged in the gpx files on the card. Make life easy: SAVE = NO LOG = YES

I'm glad that worked for you, but I'm puzzled. My 6.12.4. Mapsource has a comport dropdown that goes 1-8. So, why wouldn't it work with, say, com8 ?

The Delorme PN-20 comes packaged with topo maps. Not only is this included in the package, but it is the best topo mapping you can get on a gpsr. It does autoroute, but topo is the reason for getting the PN-20. The complete package is $299.95. Compare that with ~$450 for a 60CSx plus topo mapping.

Scuse me for asking, but, if you want to get a map, any map, have you tried first to get a satellite lock? Go outside, find a spot with a clear view of the sky down close to the ground, all 360 degrees around you. Turn on the Legend and let it sit out there in the open for, oh say, a full hour. Roof of your car is a good spot. A full hour will let you make sure that the almanac is loaded and sensed. Does the satellite page show that you are locking? If so, do you now have a map? Be sure to try to zoom out and in on the map page. Next week I will be backpacking in eastern Oregon. We will have (nerdness here) 4 gpsrs along because I plan to log and photograph a benchmark that is not in the NGS database. The day before, I plan to do the 1hour thing in order to make sure the gpsrs are locking in that general location before starting the hike. We will be using a 60Cx, 76Cx, Legend blue, and Sportrak Basic yellow.

I'm pretty sure you are not loading maps from Google to garmin/mapsource. However, Google and garmin/mapsource can, and do, exchange data via the gpx format. I use gpx from my garmin units to Google Earth (or maps, or myriad others) to archive and plot tracks.

I have the Legend (ole blue). So, in case I missed a point, yes, it does come with a basemap. Just to make double-sure, does your unit look like this: https://buy.garmin.com/shop/shop.do?cID=145&pID=173# And, yes, you can load maps into it. It does have only 8mb internal memory, so you can't load a lot, but you can load. If you click the Maps link on garmin.com and select the various Mapsource products, they all list the Legend as compatible. I have loaded Topo USA maps onto my Legend. I believe you can't wipe out the basemap by loading Mapsource maps. However, you can wipe out the marine POI database by loading maps. They provide a download to reload the marine POI database if you decide to erase the mapsource maps later. You might try running this marine POI download to see if it restores your functionality. Also, the latest firmware version 3.70. Be sure to install this, too.

I spent some time looking at Oregon with the online Map Viewer for both US Topo West and Topo 2008. Both products cover Oregon with the same ~158 segments. It appears that the segments are identical, at least in one area of eastern Oregon that I overlayed. So, no, Topo 2008 does not help with the 2025 segment limit issue. This segment issue is a limitation of the firmware in the X units and MapSource. I know this applies to the 60C(S)x and 76C(S)x units as well as the Legend Cx, Vista Cx, and Venture Cx. I don't know whether this limitation applies to the new HCx units, however, since they have not listed updated firmwares.

What I want is the ability to keep and display the maximum speed I hit during a track session. For example, I am kayaking. During the next 3 hours my speed varies from 1.2 to 6.2 mph. In addition to telling me what the instantaneous speed is, I want it to show me what my max speed was during that session. All my Garmins display this. I believe the later and better Magellans do, too. Has anybody figured out a way to get the Sportrak Basic to display this, too? Probably a firmware hack?

Does the Vista HCx have the same paltry 2025 segment limit that the 60/76 C(S)x units have?

Does anybody know of a way to calculate and display the max speed on a yellow/black Sportrak basic? I have tried firmware 1.06 and 1.10. Neither one seems to do max speed. Ideas? Hacks?

Just look on the website of the airline you plan to use. Buried deep in there are lists of permitted and forbidden devices that can be used on flights. Usually these is more extensive than what is listed in their inflight magazines. I was on a Delta flight last summer. After reaching cruise altitude, I told the attendant that I would like to use my gps. She said no. However, I was prepared. I whipped out a printout of their webpage that showed the gps as a permitted device. Seeing that, she relented, and let me use it. No problem. Some airlines do. Some don't. You have to look it up to find out. If there is ever a question, you can request that they ask the captain. I have never heard of a captain saying no unless it is a clear policy. This is not a TSA issue. It's up to the airlines.

OK, that lat/lon is in the mountains south of Ft. Smith, AR. I see on the USA-TOPO that Forest Service road 76 goes through Posey Hollow. Then, just NE of Brushy Knob a road branches south a few miles to connect to County Road 72 at Highland. Is this enough road detail for what you need? There are trails showing, too.

The TOPO I am using (USA-West) in my 60Cx shows all the Forest Service roads I ever need. SE of Seattle, the Corral Pass road shows. All the FS roads around Mt. St. Helens and Mt. Adams show. Can you say specifically which FS road you are looking for? Name it, or give us the lat/lon and we can check our TOPO.

I use a Legend (old blue) with serial cable to serial port with zero problems. I use Mapsource, Gartrip, Google Earth, GSAK, a few others. All communicate with the Legend just fine. Yes, make sure your serial port(s) on the computer are showing in Device Manager, and that they have the standard addresses and IRQs. Also, like just mentioned, make sure they are not already committed to some other device or process. Mapsource can find your Legend and port automatically, or you can direct it to a port. Gosh, the only downside to the serial port is relatively slow speed. My 60Cx downloads tracks through USB in a flash, whereas the Legend downloads my windsurfing tracks through COM1 over several seconds. No biggie.

The MTK chip is used in the Delorme PN-20. Several people have compared the sensitivity of the PN-20 with 60C(S)x and/or 76C(S)x, which use the Sirf III chips, and have found them comparable. They compared them indoors, inside vehicles under the dash, under tree cover, and in mountainous terrain. I think we can conclude that the MTK is on par with the Sirf III. This is good. Glad to see this. I use a 60Cx and like it (except for the 2025 segment limit). I would not hesitate to buy a unit with the MTK chip.

I have compared the tracks of my 60Cx and Legend (old blue) several times. These are for hikes in open ground. The Legend can have problems under dense tree cover, so if I want to make a comparison, I have to optimize the acquisition conditions for both units. The best way to set this up is to set both units for time at 1 second, not any of the auto settings. That way you don't have to rely on a mysterious algorithm to decide when to take the next point. Just take a new point every second regardless. Make sure NOT to save the tracks. Instead, use ONLY the active tracklog for one session, then download it into the computer. That way, you get ALL the points, not just the 500 that are kept when you do a save. When I compare the resultant tracks they are very close.

The issue of USB being built into ME, 2k, and XP has to do with mass storage devices, not USB itself. Mass storage includes thumb drives, external hard drives, external floppies, and external CD/DVDs. ME, 2k, and XP have USB mass storage built-in. Win98/SE does not, so it requires mass storage drivers, which are provided with the products. For most USB devices that are not mass storage, you still have to install USB drivers for all OSs, even for XP. These include such things as digital cameras, scanners, printers, gpsrs, others.

jotne, yes, I have contacted techsupport at Garmin numerous times about this. They keep replying about a future firmware fix. After 15 months of this, I am not holding my breath. rwwmith123, yes, I would be very interested in a process to re-group small segments into larger ones. For TOPO I would suggest simply grouping them by states. Yes, many segments overlap state lines, but that's OK. Nice, big state-sized TOPO segments will fit nicely onto the microSD cards, no prob. You could get the entire west half of the USA onto a big card with only 20 segments. Nice.

I have tried this. Doesn't matter whether you upload through the gpsr or through a card reader. It tops out at 2025 segments.

It's in their programming. 2025 is probably the result of 2^11=2048 minus a couple dozen bits for overhead. My contention is that they could change this by changing the 2048 parameter to something like 2^16=65536. If their software is well designed, just change the number in the parameter list and recompile. Recompile for the firmwares and for Mapsource. No biggie. I believe they are not fixing this due to market segmentation. The very small but numerous segments in TOPO makes it possible to load TOPO segments into older gpsrs with small internal memory, such as my old blue Legend. My 60Cx can't hold more than about 375mb worth of TOPO segments due to the 2025 segment count limit. So, if you use TOPO, a microSD card bigger than 512mb is a waste. (Unless you keep gobs of gpx tracks and waypoints on the card as well.) June is here tomorrow. I have threatened to sell my 60Cx if Garmin does not increase the count limit by June. I am tempted to follow through and sell, but the Delorme PN-20 is not quite good enough to catch my fancy, even though the PN-20 has vastly superior maps.

rwolf, I use an old Legend (blue, not C or Cx) inside an Aquapac on my upper arm for windsurfing. The Aquapac is a Pro Sports model with the velcro arm band. It has the clear window to read the gpsr. When I used to fasten the gps to the mast at the boom, I would get false max speed readings. The belief is that this comes from a reading taken during a sail flip--high speed for a split second. Wearing it on my arm has totally fixed this. This is the experience of other windsurfers as well. Also makes it easy to read the Trip page (large type) while on the water. I have the trip page set to Distance, Speed, Max Speed, and Time in Motion in large type. Works very well. What I particularly like is the ability to download tracks (always the active track, never the saved track) to a computer and save the session as a gpx file that can be plotted on various mapping products (Delorme TOPO and Google Earth are my favs). At default settings, I can record a whole day's worth of track data without running out of internal memory. I archive all my sessions as gpx files. Many windsurfers have good luck with one of the wristwatch-style gpsrs, too. But, I would think you still want a model that interfaces to a PC for track download. Since I race, I use the gpsr as a training buddy. With it I can tune and tweak my gear and stance to eke out higher max speeds. It is also great for analyzing upwind and downwind angles and speeds. No, I don't use the vmg feature, but one could. vmg requires too much manipulation, which is not practical on a windsurf board. All you really want is a continuously running display. The Legend in a bag (or any number of other small models as well as wristwatch-style) works very well for this.