Logscaler and Red
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Posts posted by Logscaler and Red
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Whats the difference between a cache in a wilderness and a high point - Summit log book?
Size? Not really as I have seen ammo cans used for summit markers as well.
Logscaler
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You could use a hole saw and just take a core out.
Then cut the core off and screw / glue it to the bottom of a cache.
If you use two different sizes of hole saw bits, you can make a plug that will fit real tight.
A 2 inch for the plug and a 1 7/8" for the core should work fine.
Use two different chunks of wood, one for the cache and one for the plug.
The 1/8 " difference accounts for the curf of the bit for a tight fit.
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Did you kill a tortoise for that?
You are kidding, right?
The thing I found wrong with those Turtle shells is they have a tendency to fall apart over time.
The Antler one would end up getting packed off and sold or given to a dog as a chew toy.
Keep the ideas coming, I have seen several I would like to have the time to replicate.
Logscaler.
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Remember, geocaching is never about numbers.
Ahh, but it is all about the numbers.
Maybe not "those" numbers but about 15 others that you do need to play this game.
Maybe you have "doubled up" on a cache and the owner deleted one "find"?
Maybe you cut Jeremy or your local cache approver off in traffic and he/they are going to make you pay for it slowly?
Other then that,
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Are these gaskets made especially for plumbing, or purchased somewhere else in a hardware store?
Yes, do tell. I would very much like to make a fake log type cache, whose internal component would be PVC pipe. Because every single PVC pipe cache I've found, (about 20 or so), had moisture in it, (we have monstrously high humidity here), I kinda put the idea on a back burner. If I could come up with a better seal than those provided by the plastic threads of a screw in cap, my idea might come back to life. I am to plumbing what Rosie O'Donnell is to common sense, so I have no knowledge of my own to draw from.
If you go to any hardware store or auto parts store that has Jerry cans, they sell a replacement gasket for the spout - I would use the proper term for this opening but who knows where THAT would go - and or cap that should work well for the 2.5 or 3 inch pvc pipe.
Be sure to scrape the burrs off and clean the cut ends before applying glue and then give the joined ends a quarter twist after slipping them together but be fast as the stuff bonds real fast. That will give you the best seal.
One thing people should think about with these containers. If you place it with the cap down, then it will not fill with water if it leaks.
I don't have photos of it but I do have a cache hidden in a pumice rock. Basket ball size. Bored the hole out with a wire wheel on a drill. Worked real slick. Made another one along the same line to hide the water valve pipe for our house. Need to make one to hide a key in also.
logscaler.
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It seems as I also need to clarify my statement I guess.
We will not replace a cache we have not found, only those we find that have a problem with the container. Dropping another cache because "yours is missing" is not the right thing to do. As my list of DNF's suggest, you don't find them all.
Everyone needs to be willing to help out other cachers by restocking swag, replacing logbooks and leaving a scribble stick when needed.
Logscaler.
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Just how many people do you think actually sit down and read all those flipping nitpicking PITA rules/guidelines anyway? Did you?
I think many read them, but not all. Since i have placed caches i did read them. If you dont then you pretty much are lying when you check that box.
My thoughts on this is - buy your ticket and take your ride. Or get out of line and let someone else in who is a little more adventuresome. THEY understand what COULD happen and are willing to risk it. Their lookout, not yours.
True. But if LEO or media happened to pick up on why they were there or what they were doing then it would reflect badly on all of us. Maybe people would think we all don't follow the laws? Honestly i would hate to be associated with a group of people known to violate laws and make their own rules.
Considering stuff i have read on the forums from reviewers, under no circumstances should a cache be buried. So yeah- that is a blanket statement.
Pray tell, how do you know it the cacher has permission or not? Need a contact number for the Park Ranger engraved on the cache? At this rate, a EA would be needed for any cache placement to make sure the cache is not killing off some stupid moss or lichen or ant or frog or grub or or or, well you get the idea. Let alone the hike into the cache.How would i know about a cache placement? If it seemed to be a placement that i felt in some way could endanger the activity- i would probably ask them about it.
I would like to think that all people have common sense and read/follow guidelines but you made it sound like some don't. I'm pretty sure some don't. Its just too easy to check the box and forget it. Guidelines are in place for a reason. Some may not agree. But i understand why they are there. Whether you agree or disagree with them how we all conduct ourselves- reflects on everyone- just not usually on a large scale.
Thanks for the well thought out answers and they all make sense.
Playing "Devils advocate" at times makes for some interesting responses.
Yes, I have and do read the guideline's. As I remember it, the no burying things was decided on by cachers before that rule was put into the guidelines. I agree with it as well for several reasons.
I know some people don't read and or follow the guidelines. It shows.
Yes, Even I have reported caches I know that violate the guidelines and will in the future.
I also try and put the best effort into PR for the group as a whole even if it goes against the grain of a few cachers but there is a limit to how many restrictions I will agree to. (And it is getting closer to that limit all the time.)
Geocaching and cachers reputation's will/have start(ed) proceeding them through media coverage and word of mouth and it behooves all of us to use our best manners if we want access to a lot of grounds. Public and private lands.
I still think that this game is getting too PC and restricted in its actions and response's to minor incidents. Kinda like killing a fly with a 12 gauge. It is getting the job done but at what cost?
Logscaler.
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Since not everyone has common sense if a cache violates guidelines and in some way could cause harm to the sport, then i think it is all cachers responsibility to say something. If you dont want to, thats cool too.
Just how many people do you think actually sit down and read all those flipping nitpicking PITA rules/guidelines anyway? Did you?
It reminds me of a cache i saw that had clearly marked no trespassing signs. Dozens and dozens visited and even wrote about the signs in their logs. If someone was ticketed (which the sign said was possible as it was city property) then that would reflect bad on geocaching. (At least in that city.)My thoughts on this is - buy your ticket and take your ride. Or get out of line and let someone else in who is a little more adventuresome. THEY understand what COULD happen and are willing to risk it. Their lookout, not yours.
If a cache is buried in a park, I think someone should say something.Now that is a blanket answer to cover every park. I happen to know of several parks where it would have been ok to bury something but we as a group have decided against it on the basic principle that there is a known error in this game of around 30 feet, give or take the time of day, satellite coverage, reception, etc. Can you think of the horror of trying to find a buried cache in a 30 foot radius if everything was perfect, let alone the with the error factors possible? Plant a crop in the spring and get your winter supply of greens.
If i cache is embedded in a hole drilled in a dead tree and the placer had permission- who am i to say something about it? If its not hurting anything, let it be i guess.Pray tell, how do you know it the cacher has permission or not? Need a contact number for the Park Ranger engraved on the cache? At this rate, a EA would be needed for any cache placement to make sure the cache is not killing off some stupid moss or lichen or ant or frog or grub or or or, well you get the idea. Let alone the hike into the cache.
If a cache container is made/crafted by drilling i am sure it is fine. I do think when that drilling/digging whatever goes on site that is a different matter.Another blanket tossed out on a general principal. That CCC thread has given me some great ideas to steal. Now, with that blanket thrown over the parks and by extension, any BLM, USFS, State Forest lands, etc, those ideas are out the window.
Let's throw the ball back at you and play another what if game. It will be a soft nerf ball type as I understand that Dodge Ball is too harsh and causes bruises on the ego as well as the skin.
What if I find a micro cache under oh I don't know, maybe a street light skirt, heaven forbid seeing as they are ALL either on public property or Private property, should I request it to be archived seeing as I don't find a permission slip from the property owner or manger attached to the cache page or in the cache itself? Because I would bet that technically, when you go onto WalMarts parking lot and have no intention to shop, your guilty of trespassing. (I should state that I am no lawyer but I did play one one time in a nightmare that I had.) And when you find one on a public street light - If you would I should say - could that not be construed as damaging public property? When you moved it, you scuffed the paint didn't you? Now your going to have to pay to have all the street lights repainted. We can't have just one with new paint, know can we? It would stick out and be an eyesore but if their all painted the same.......
Know don't go an be getting all upset and get your knickers in a knot and think I am picking you out to harass. Far from it but this topic and several others have pushed a few buttons and I have to vent when I think people are trying to blow smoke up my backside. I have habit of popping off once and a while (Side bar Judge - Hi Jon, sorry about the rant but it happens once and a while. You know me and "Devils club".) and it has been known to get me into trouble with TPTB.
I am not one to be PC and will say what I think, when I think it needs to be said. If some people have a problem with that, well you can just about guess what I think about that problem. Yours, not mine.
On a parting shot, Get over it people. You can not control everyone all the time no matter what "rules / guidelines" you want to impose on them. Anyone so arrogant who thinks that with enough "understanding - compassion - love - money - etc" that ALL the worlds troubles can be solved needs to check into a rubber room and get off MY planet.
Logscaler.
(Do people still get put into a time out on this site????)
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Rant forthcoming, be prepared to get your dander up.
Will wonders never cease.
When I have witnessed, and helped, the BLM, USFS, State department of forestry in girdling trees one year and then coming back the next year and boring 2 and 3 inch holes for the critters to start their nest in. Where they have went through and blown the tops out of trees with explosives to make more snags. Where part of a timber sale contract is that the logger has to make snags. These type of events happens all the time out here. Yes, there are already plenty of natural snags and holes but the eco freaks want "more."
Now I have to worry about a film can sized hole in a dead tree? BS.
As I see it, common sense has taken a big hit in this game. Period.
So when I take a chain saw and bore a hole for an ammo box in a snag, that would be a bad thing? How about using a single jack to make a hole in a rock? How about driving concrete nails into rock to hang a tag with? What about using a piece of wire to attach a tag to a tree limb? Plastic box in the puckerbrush?
Now that your all up in arms, lets take another look at things.
The idiots have broken free from their pen and are running rampant over the world. PO.(personal opinion.) Anyone who can not tell a dead tree from a live one needs caught and put back into a padded cell somewhere. PO.
I have a location picked out in an old cold deck for placing the cache in a bored out hole. Old bridge logs in fact and there are already plenty of holes - bolts - notches in them but none the size I want.
90 percent of you don't even know what a single jack is or what they where used for so that is a mute statement / question. The location I will be using is in an old rock pit where there are plenty of oversized rock that where going to be used as riprap but never hauled out. If I can find a bore hole, okay but I will make one if not. The same goes for the nails into the rock. Old rock pit so no harm done to anything "pristine" to get people up in arms over the vandalism of a rock with placing a 1/4 inch hole in it.
The wire on a tree limb can grow into the limb causing a possible wound so if you know of any, you had better report it to GC.com and have the cache archived.
How many of you have seen where critters have chewed plastic cache containers? Did you ever think maybe they swallowed some of it, got a intestinal obstruction and died from it?
Ravens love shiny things so those firetacks you use could attract them. They could possible maybe sorta kinda pluck one out and swallow it and get a hole in a gut somewhere and give them an infection, it could kinda sorta maybe rust and cause an infection or even - heaven forbid - get stuck as they are trying to pass it.
Better report any firetacks you see as well.Lets see now, where can we go from here.
I know, your driving. You could hurt me on your way to a cache as you get distracted looking at the gpsr, cache sheet, looking for a road sign, etc, and forget your primary job of driving so please stop driving and save me the pain. And the buzz phrase this year seems to be "carbon footprint" so as your driving around realize your leaving one and are personally responsible for global warming. For shame, for shame. Go plant a tree and get that warm fuzzy feeling of being environmentally aware.
I am tired of this playing the "What about if...." game so lets put an end to it.
IF IT DOES NOT SEEM RIGHT AND YOU HAVE TO ASK SOMEONE IF IT WOULD BE OK, DON'T DO IT!!!
Get your head out of your backside and use some common sense people.
On the flip side of the coin I will say that no matter what is said in here, it is still going to happen out there so the best YOU can do is look out after yourself and yours. Let the others thin out the gene pool.
logscaler.
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To us, it all depends on the cache location and not the cache itself.
If the area deserves a cache and the one we are looking for is in trouble, we will do what it takes to keep an active cache there.
We will restock if needed and we have replaced those cheap containers with ammo cans where we can.
We have done it before and will in the future.
But if the cache is in a poor location, we have no problem requesting it to be archived.
IF the cache owner has a problem with us upgrading their cheap deli tub - chip tube - Gladware box - baggie under a rock, etc, etc, then THEY need to look at what they are bringing to this game and what THEY want others to think of them. Not my problem.
Logscaler.
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Red keeps letting me go out and cache even when She can't go along.
She was there for the first find and was just as hooked as I was.
She tried to get out of a Bridal Shower so she could go with me today but was not able to pull it off.
One thing I have noticed is that I find caching a lot more entertaining when I have someone to share it with and to help me see past the obvious. Two minds are better then one when it comes to some of those little micros.
Logscaler
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I just checked ours and we are on page 454 of 456 with 8 caches in the oldest 45 still active.
Not bad me thinks.
Looks like another challenge is to try and clear out all the oldest caches I have not found in Oregon.
Interesting road trip for a weekend.
ID # 8424
Logscaler
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No.
To ambiguous.
Logscaler.
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Yeah, it is private property, I know...
But I'd place a magnetic micro about halfway up the Green Monster at Fenway Park.
Paul
Oh, I just read the link. It isn't metal. It sure sounds metal when the ball hits it. I guess I'd have to be clever about attaching then.
How about twenty feet of rope covered in fake Ivy tied off to the top of the wall somewhere?
I always wanted to cut a maze out of a large field - 40 acres or more - of Blackberries. Have a few 6 foot culverts to make Rabbit runs.
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$$$$$$ or $$$$$$$$$$$
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But I disagree.
Caching is about the numbers.
Otherwise it would be letter boxing now wouldn't it?
Logscaler
Letterboxers have a PFX count (Planted, Found, Exchanges, i.e. met) and many sign their their names with this
PFX count and merit badges are awarded for reaching certain levels of finds and plants. So it could be argued that numbers are more a part of letter boxing than they are in geocaching.
Anyway, geocaching is only about the numbers for those who make it about the numbers.
BrianSnat P199 F567 X287
In my own smart a** way, I was meaning that in geocaching, we use Lat/long numbers to locate our prize unlike letterboxing which uses descriptions, therefore it is about the numbers.
I understand the count thing for letter boxing and it was not an issue.
Logscaler.
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I see logscaler knows what's up.Too bad he dosen't comment in more threads.We could use more posters like him.Short and to the point.
Thanks for the compliment.
I used to post a lot but the response started getting way to personal - even e-mails off the forums with subtle threats of destruction to all my caches, of which some "walked" - that I decided it was not worth the effort to call a "spade a spade", so to speak.
I will pop in and read things but very seldom post anymore. These last few days have been an aberration from the norm for me.
Signing off now.
Good night. And good luck.
Logscaler.
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Really? I never thought that I had to hide caches because that is one of the stats...I thought that if I hid caches, then there would be a stat showing how many I had hidden.
I don't have to find caches because there are numbers next to my user name either--but if I do, the numbers change so I can see how many I found.
... geocaching isn't about the numbers.
But I disagree.
Caching is about the numbers.
Otherwise it would be letter boxing now wouldn't it?
Just what is the problem with having the numbers there?
I use the numbers for DNF problems. I like seeing how others are doing.
Competing with them? For some friends, yes, but for the most part, No, just a reference point.
No one has given me a good reason to NOT have the numbers.
Unless it is like Red says, it is NUMBER ENVY.
Now, what ever happened to the original topic anyway?
Seems like this thread has run its course and needs to be locked down.
Logscaler.
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I was thinking about some of the caches that are around now that were not around when I started and I thought of an interesting question for you all.
Imagine that you are at home doing some chores or yardwork. The phone rings and some guy that you don't know asks you to drive 5 miles into town. He tells you to drive behind a Taco Bell and check out a smelly garbage dumpster. There is no cache there. He just tells you that he thinks it's really fun, and that you should go check it out! Be honest. What would you do?
Bingo. "Old School" v New caches.
Heck of a generalization but pretty much seems to be the direction caching has leaned towards in the last few years. In my opinion anyway.
Yes, the first few micros where interesting in a unique way but how many breath mint strip - film can - magnets can you find under a lamp skirt - in a guard rail - under a park bench until you cry uncle?
UNLESS there is something of interest to go with it? Historical plaques are all over the place but a lot of them have limited hiding spots. Or you have to make a multi stage cache out of it.
But we have also found our share of "Why Here?" caches using ammo cans, buckets, Tupperware, etc, etc.
Now to keep in line with the topic: Newbie advice. Place the cache where you would like to send your friends from out of town to see.
Logscaler.
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The really smart solution would be to quit logging altogether.
Anyhow, my point in saying that was if they had this feature I would use it. Is that OK with you? 
For the first part, I know of cachers who have never logged a "found it" in the 6 years they have been caching. A choice they made for personal reasons.
For the second part, Fine by me.
The option of showing or not showing your log count is a valid one I would vote for.
Maybe that is one thing Jeremy could or will implement in V2 to come out next year. Get your request in now before the rush.
My main point in all my comments to this thread is I have not read anything "New" here that had not been hashed through before in one form or another.
They all came to naught as I fear this thread will. Yes, the ideas are worth merit and need discussed but unless the PTB want to change, it matters not what goes on in these threads.
I still suggest that any ideas for improvement to the GC site that have any merit worth opening a thread for should be worth the effort of first starting with Jeremy.
Or one of his lackeys.
To be "On Topic", a comment to newbies is that as an "Old School" cacher, I have taken my own advise before and sent Jeremy an e-mail when ever I had a question, idea or request. He is not beyond answering e-mails. But you have to be willing to sent them.
Logscaler.
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I agree with you. I would make my numbers private in a heartbeat.
As I understand it you don't want any numbers.
That is real easy to do now if you think about it.
IF your not interested in a find count, then just log the cache using a "Note".
Use a program like GSAK where you can filter the PQ's to edit the files so as to not load anything that you have already found.
Problem solved.
And this makes 1000 replies in 6 years.
Now to go back to lurking and shaking my head at some of the drivel on these pages.
Don't take that wrong.
There is a lot of good information posted but I get tired of subjects that the PO seems to have an answer in mind already yet ask an "innocent" question or starts an "innocent" thread and tries to get people to come around to his/her line of thinking.
The simple answer that I see is to send your "new and improved" idea to Jeremy and see what his reply is.
I guess that is one more bit of advise that I would pass along to newbies.
When reading these forums.
Learn to sort the Wheat from the Chaff.
TTFRN.
Logscaler.
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...We have a stray cat in the neighborhood. It's a scrawny gray thing that gets stuff thrown at it whenever it shows up.
In the chain of command, I'm right below the cat.
What's the cat throw at you when you show up?
On topic.
Ratings are for sissies. If you need ratings you ain't worthy of old school.
Agreed
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Basically.
See what happened is I was catching up on my thread,and as usual two users (One who seems to be involved everytime)get into an argument over silly baloney and derail the thread,thus solving nothing.
I wanted this thread to be for newbies learning from the old schoolers since they are always telling us we are ruining caching.So what better way to get it back to where it mythically was then for them to air grievences and tell us suggestions.From what I've been seeing so far from all of the old schoolers is that caching wasn't that great in the early days.Most of them say it's better now.
Kinda growly ain't yea?
I didn't see where I was arguing with anyone but it is subjective I guess.
As for suggestions to newbies.
First off, What percentage of newbies do you think come to these threads?
"They" may be newbies to this game but my bets are that most of them are over the age of 30. Most of them have read books of adventure. Most of them have kids.
My advice to newbies would be to make their hides something that they would like to find, be that at whatever level they are comfortable with. Expand on what you enjoyed as a kid.
Then as they evolve into the game and see what others have hidden, they just might be able to expand a type or style of hide they have found.
One of the best things that newbies can do is to attend events. That is one of the best places to exchange ideas and to hookup with other people looking for partners of their level of caching or people needing a partner to go out with.
You suggested a rating system. Been hashed and rehashed to death but lets do it again I guess.
Too subjective no matter how you try break it down or whatever guide lines you put out to steer people along. Different skill levels, physical conditioning IQ's, etc.
And at one time, the cache numbers where dropped from your stats. Didn't work then either.
I would suggest that IF a rating system is implemented, there should be one vote when you log your find and no deleting of a log by the finder but still allow the cache owner to either delete or modify the log with approver permission, yet still retain the vote cast for that cache. Clear as mud?
To what level do you want to go? Are you wanting micro details? General? Rough?
As for the cache's themselves, We have found over time that we did enjoy the older caches better then the newer ones.
Then it was go find it and now there seems to be a lot of mystery, puzzles, online research videos to watch or seeing how small and hidden you can go.
Now I even see a couple caches out there that brag about how many DNF's they can get.
But, this is how things evolve, Like it or not. YOU have to decide what you want out of this game.
Sure, some of us want things to stay the way they where. I can have that with PQ's, GSAK and using selective cache page reading.
Now, was that what you wanted to hear?
Logscaler
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I think perceptions about caches have changed more than the actual caches have. A while back someone (Team GPSaxaphone maybe?) started a thread asking whether finding hundreds or thousands of caches had caused some cachers to be less than enthused by average caches. In other words, had some cachers become jaded, bored, or burned out on the game, causing them to be less than impressed with caches that may have satisfied them earlier in their caching career?. I think he may have hit the nail on the head with that postulation.
I don't know about this for myself.
I think someone placing a crappy cache in '01 or '02 or even '03 got a lot more flak then they do know. PC?
I have ALWAYS expected something to be worthwhile to be there when I found a cache. Be it history or location.
As for the post about insulting to have "Easy find' in a log. What if it is?
Wow, two post on one thread in one day. Wonders will never end.
Logscaler.
Better report any firetacks you see as well.
Oregon Forest Fire Lookout Challenge
in Northwest
Posted
I have placed two more caches at lookouts this past week but waiting for approval.
Both caches are in South Central Oregon in section 4.
One on Slide Mountain. No lookout but there is an outhouse still. As well as a great view North across Summer Lake.
One on Bald Butte. The lookout is still active and in use.
Both can be found within a couple hours of each other, depending on your risk level.
Both are around 7700 feet elevation so I am guessing mid to late June for access. Or now.
More in the works.