Rockin Roddy

I agree...he WAS a leader!! You say nobody ran this great LEADER out of GC...well...you may not have held a gun to his head, but just as surely as if you had, your comments and bullying (and when I say "your" I mean that to everyone that participated in the bashings...not generalizing here) drove him from this sport. I think Tommy had stomached about all he could of the vile rantings, and then he and his wife decided that if no one appreciated what they were doing, WHY BOTHER???? What bothers me (and I was guilty of this myself here in my earlier post) is how everyone can just jump in and say whatever hurtful, mean things they want as if their words have no consequences. Another link says very much this same thing! If everyone had just said "hey, you are charging too much, I'm out" and left it at that, Tommy was more than happy to acknowledge those comments politely and move on. About half way through though, it got personal and mean...the same people just sat there and bashed instead of adding anything constructive. Is it so hard to say no and move on??? And yes, my comment was a bit strong up earlier...this is how problems get made! You see, I just had been told the day (or so) before that "if I don't like the view, move to another bench", I disagreed then, but turned around and said much the same thing to A&T. This was wrong, no matter how much I percieved A&T to be judgemental and rude....nice brings about nice. I am sorry A&T, being mad isn't an excuse to be mean, and I shouldn't have acted badly. In public forums, people shouldn't be condemned for such trivial things as charging too much for a coin...truly, it's a buyers market, you don't want it, don't buy it. And people shouldn't be harrassed for not knowing the procedures to posting (as it turns out another cacher said that Tommy came in like a distant relative at Christmas...) Posting is for everyone, everyone posts new coin releases, and there should be no "procedure" to asking for permission (as it looks the poster to another thread thinks there should be) before presenting a coin. If we get it wrong, how about some CONSTRUCTIVE criticism instead of continual harrassment...nice brings about nice!! AND...if you really don't think there was bashing going on, just read a few of the posts and see where the comments turn hurtful. They may not be too bad for some to accept, they may only make some of us mad...they turned TT from our sport and that's something that we ALL lost...THE LOSS OF A GREAT CONTRIBUTOR!!! My feeling here is that there were a group that had already made up their minds to harrass TT no matter what just because of the problems they had with him from another encounter (possibly a harsh worded response to someone not following one of TT's rules). If you don't like someone, why push it?? Why harrass someone just because he's there and vulnerable (reminds me of school and the local BULLY). I WILL get off my soapbox, I grow tired of trying to get everyone to see how this all came about. I too see your points, I just hope that you can come to the realization that by being abusive in your comments, you effectively drove a knife into Tommy's heart and killed a great contributor!! edit to add...also my last post...I have more constructive things to do!! Today, I'm hiding my 41st cache and then on to a TB trade!!

And with all honesty A&T, this topic IS about TT, if you don't want to read about him, there are other threads out there!

Tommy has let me in on a few of his "secrets" about his TBs...I will share a few tidbits for you to better understand the ENORMOUS efforts Tommy and Helen put forth into this great sport...and the HUGE loss because of those that just couldn't let well enough alone! Tommy has a "TB factory" in his basement...the 20'X40' room is filled with all the stuff needed to put out the TBs, replace the lost TBs, answer all the emails they receive DAILY from all those TBs being moved etc. Tommy and Helen spend more than $500 monthly JUST for the replacemnet of said TBs...thats's above and beyond the costs for the tags, the new TBs he's putting out on a regular basis, the costs of the materials and ink (we all know how much that cam be when printing up all those tags and info sheets etc), and any other costs which they incurred just to contribute to this great sport! Tommy and Helen spent 12 to 14 hours answering all those emails (not sure if that was weekly or daily, I can't recall)...yes, he answers EVERY email notice of movement etc! All that, plus Tommy was loosing 1000 coins into the wild for others to enjoy! His mistake was to offer his coins up for sale! He didn't intend to when he had them made, his intent was to release them for everyone to find and enjoy. Sooo many cachers asked to buy his coins, he decided to sell them...with rules that they NOT end up on the "e" place or be sold or traded...you want one, come to the source! His price and rules were merely to deter those that wanted nothing more than to profit fromTT's creation. I hope TT doesn't get upset with my sharing these little bits of info with everyone...he truly is a great person!! Yes, he had some problems, yes he sent out some tough messages for those that couldn't follow his rules about NOT placing his TBs into multi or event caches (the TBs have a higher rate of disappearance from those caches)...with all that money and time wrapped up into those TBs, you'd likely try any way possible to keep the losses at a minimum too!! The loss of a truly GREAT contributor!!! edit to add that my spelling is a bit off today...sorry!!

This happens often, I am sure that you can change the name and anything else that you want to to fit the item you are using to replace the lost TB. I agree with BD though...if the bug was dropped in the ocean or a stream or something that's likely the bug's demise, then re-release it, if it was just misplaced, you should wait for a while and see what comes of the bug!! Possibly it was dropped on the trail and another cacher may find it.

After reading a few of those comments again...I want to make some things clear. There aren't any real guidelines that I have seen that state anywhere about what these forums are for. The only difference from one thread to another is the topic titles. When I started posting, I had my coin put up for all to see and stated the price (actually, the minter posted the original thread because I didn't know anything about the topics and how they work). I see this done time and again, so and so is offering this coin, who would want this one etc... If a newbie were to bring up these forums, they'll see just that and assume (as did I and probably the person in question) that that's what these forums are for Announcing a coin, selling a coin or trading a coin! By some of your own comments, you make it out that this ISN'T what this forums is for, and that the OP was in the wrong for NOT knowing this! Yet, you say that the forums ARE open to all...I don't understand this at all!! Where was the wrong made??? Someone wanted more than what others thought the item was worth, so you shoot that person down in a ball of flames which causes the person to quit caching altogether??? I'm not sure that is much help to your cause then...if a newbie comes in and says the wrong thing, you shoo them away, do you really think they came away with a good feeling about the process?? Do you really think that you are helping the sales of future coins?? The only people that'll be left are the seasoned vets that want to keep things all nice and tidy! WOW...you won...but what is the prize??? A place to talk with all the other "heros"??? The best way to make friends would be to BE NICE!!! Yes CAN'T WE ALL GET ALONG??? You say this is a public place and if we don't like it move to another bench...I did and you followed me there. I said something about why someone would want an overpriced coin (making a comparisson to another iconic cacher) and now I'm being harrassed because I had the gall to bring up someone else??? There wasn't any bashing involved at all, but there was from the others toward me!! I don't get this...it does seem that there is a "member's only" section here...and you seasoned vets are the members with the say! Anyone that says anything you don't like, you all flock in and overtake the thread like we've done something wrong. If this were truly public you'd understand that we have things to say to...and if you don't agree with the comments maybe you should just do what I was doing...leave that thread alone and go to a thread that you have something constructive to add!! NOPE...you would rather jump in and spew your comments and then tell us to leave if we don't like it!!

Yep Saso...really makes you lose respect for those that just try to bend the conversaztions to meet their needs...the same has happened over on another thread. One thing is said that someone THINKS they don't like and they seize the whole thread and the next thing you know, YOU'RE the bad guy!! Forums are pretty useless if all that happens is the rest jump in and bash those that they don't want to hear from. Since the topic WAS about who can and cannot post to the forums, I see this ON topic. It may be in the wrong place, but then...I guess the rest found it ok!!

I don't know....YOU keep bringing her up...and yes...that's what I said!!

What is bashing about holding someone in high regards and then NOT??? I said nothing about this person, and I won't!! I don't bash people for the fun of it...and I have my reasons for not holding CC in the high regards I once did!! I never said that CC was a bad person or had done ANYTHING bad...I just don't see her in the same light as I did when I first tried to STRIVE to be like her!! I've met CC, she's a great person...I just don't put her up high like I once did. NOT ONE THING BASHING ABOUT THAT AT ALL...so get over it and back on topic!! AND btw...I aplogize ONLY for anything off topic...NOT for CC...I hope that's CLEAR too!! edit to take out some of the off topic comments!! and please Windrose...use the whole comment and not take something out of context...the rest said how I feel.

Great post...MY THOUGHT exactly!! Can't we all get along???

Nothing veiled there, I simply said that I once held CCCooper in high regards and do not any more....I once thought of her as THE top gun, and do not any more. Hey...I even offered CC a spot in my camp at the '06 Geobash. I didn't state ANY vile or bashing comments there at all, and I apologized for any comments that weren't ON topic!! Since this IS off topic, I will leave it at that. I think the reason to annonce the retirement AND the coin sale discount was to get rid of all the coins they have since they won't be caching any more. I'm in for one more Tommy...money order ok??? I want to give one to my God-Son KAboom!! edit to add...Tommy, IF you truly need someone to adopt any TBs, I'd be honored to adopt as many as you would allow.

Sorry if I put you in a bad light...I should have better stated that! What I meant was that one guy even stated that Tommy was disliked because he had "an air of superiority" about him...the gall of it all!! Believe me, if I was trying to make you out as the bad guy, I'd have stated your name!! I have sat back and watched as you guys (again generalizing here...I don't mean any one person in particular...but if you are feeling guilty here, you'll probably be one that I am talking about) BASH this man because he wants more for his coin than others (and you feel you MUST have the reason to justify this)...like nobody else charges MORE for their coins?? How do you people know that Tommy DOESN'T know Jeremy or what Jeremy's visions were for this sport?? You are right though, it IS hard to get across the true feelings that one is trying to convey, so maybe those reading the posts should take that into consideration before jumping to conclusions. Now, that said, I hope that by reading this, you don't think I come across as mad or anything...I'm simply trying to get across the fact that this IS hard...you see, by CAPITALIZING my words, I am merely trying to EMPHASIZE that word. I apologize if you feel I painted you in a bad light, that truly wasn't my meaning here.

I suppose the same could be said for all you that have brought this on! I may not have been caching long, but let me tell you a bit about my experience with Tommy, Helen and the TT crew. When I started, I knew nothing about TBs, I knew very little about caching at all!! One of my first TBs was a Tommy Trojan TB..when I found it, I read the description, which was a nice little story of how that particular TB was adventurous and would appreciate any adventure stories or pics. I made up a little story about how we (the TB and I) had some great fun and posted a few pics. Tommy writes me back THANKING me for helping his TB along!! I am now on the Top 50 TB mover's list, and I'll tell you this...Not another cacher out there has EVER thanked me for helping one of their TBs along, or have I found sooo many TBs from one cacher!! Not a single cacher has taken the time to write me and let me know that they appreciate ME for something I should be thanking them for!! Yes...Tommy sent out some tough messages for those who couldn't follow his "rules", if you had all those TBs running about, I'd think you'd want to minimize the losses too since Tommy replaced EVERY ONE that came up missing. And is it sooo hard to NOT place his TBs in an event or multi??? NOPE....you'd rather go out and muggle his caches (strange that the very people these are placed for muggled them...takes a lot of brains for that), or bash him in the forums for placing rules or asking a steep price for his coin. What really ticks me off the most is the way everyone BASHED this great cache team for GIVING so tirelessly and graciously to the cache community. Yes, he was selling his coin for MUCH more than most. The fact that hundreds were sold tells me that, even with the high price, cachers wanted them! WHY...about the same reason I wanted a CCCooper coin (until I wised up to her). This guy was placing 1000 coins out for everyone else to enjoy...you give to charity yet you wouldn't pay a bit more than normal for a good cause (one that helps EVERY cacher...more coins out, more for everyone to enjoy)??? Also...that's 600+ TBs LESS out there to find!! While some of you will see the loss of Tommy as a good thing, keep in mind his HUGE contributions!! I doubt that there are many out there that hide caches which cost $100+ EACH, I doubt there are many TB parents out there that CARE sooo much about their travelers. Yes, you cachers who have been wronged by this great guy got your wish...GREAT! I'm glad you feel so vindicated...I just hope you have enough brains to figure out what a HUGE loss this is!! I doubt it though...you'll just find someone else to bash!! What a grown up community we have here!!! Moderator, sorry if I may have overstepped the line here, but I have seen all those who overstepped while on the BASH ATTACK, so I just had to add my two cents!

His reasoning for having those "rules" was (and now I'm just speculating as I truly don't know) probably to keep them from disappearing. With sooo many TBs out, it's tough to keep up with them all, but Tommy replaced every one that went missing. The costs alone must have been staggering, not to mention all the time involved...and yes...Tommy wrote EVERYONE who moved one of his TBs thanking that cacher for helping the TB along. I know that Tommy may have rubbed many cachers the wrong way, I made a small mistake once too...but I have since modeled my caching around his actions and it's been a nice ride thus far!! I love to send out my thanks to others, it's a great way to make friends from near and far!! He's been a great player. FIGHT ON TOMMY...you will be missed!!

I hear you!! This cache team really made my caching experience a better one! I too am writing everyone that visits one of my caches or moves one of my coins/TBs (although I only have 1 TB out right now...11 coins though). I enjoyed having almost regular conversations with Tommy and Helen, almost like I knew them personally!! We have made quite the friendship here recently!! I really hope that those that pushed Tommy and crew to this end understand the HUGE loss we have all had with the loss of this ICONIC geocacher...he's a legend around here, and now he's gone!! Will miss you Tommy!!

Well, I suppose most of you have seen that the great Tommy Trojan is leaving our sport! I hope you all know what the cache world is losing!! Tommy, Helen and the TT crew gave generously to this sport...you hid caches that cost more than I could make in a day ($$$ wise), you sent out THOUSANDS of $$$$ worth of TBs for all to find and enjoy and you gave me something to look forward to when going to TB hunt!! All those great TT TBs will forever be missed. Why did this have to happen??? How did it come to this?? A great many of you Californians (and some out of state cachers as well...you guys undoubtedly know who you are) decided to BASH Tommy and Helen for their efforts! Caches would come up missing, TBs would be hoarded and hijacked! Instead of notes of thanks being sent to this great guy, you sent him hatred and vile! DISGUSTING!! How many of those who cut this man down will have given as much as Tommy and crew have??? You complained about a few simple rules placed on his TBs, hey...if you had that many TBs floating around, you'd be trying to minimize the losses too!! You JUMP all over this guy because he DARES to charge more for a coin than you want to spend...oh sure, you claim it's because he "hid the fact that he's making a profit". WHAT...nobody else has tried to profit from their sales????? GIVE ME A BREAK!!! Where were those "profits" going??? Right back into the cache community!! One guy over on the coin threads even has the gall to claim it's because you "have an air of superiority" about you...ARE YOU KIDDING ME???? What right do these people have to questions YOU about "KNOWING" some of those in this game??? What gives??? I could go on forever here, but my thread would soon turn vile and vicious (toward those TT bashers), I would hate to lower myself to that!! All I know is this: I started caching almost a year ago...one of my first TBs was a Tommy Trojan TB! I wrote a neat little story for it since it had such a great description. Now, my memory is HORRID (bad bicycle/car accident...I lost), but I do remember that TB and that little adventure story...AND I remember that Tommy, Helen and the crew WROTE ME a great message thanking me for moving their TB and for the story!! Since then, I have found a lot of the TT TBs, and this great cache team ALWAYS wrote me with gratitude for helping them on their way!! Tommy, it is I who should be thanking YOU for sending them out for all to enjoy!! I looked forward to finding another TT TB every time I went out!! I'm here for you Tommy, you have a friend in MI, give me a yell any time!! You will be missed my friend!!

First,,,this is a TB thread. Second...Tommy, Helen and the TT crew, I realize you have your mind made up in this decision. The cache world is losing one of the greats...and it's all because of a few jerks that can't leave well enough alone!! I'll bet that the very ones that cause the problems will LINE up to adopt your TBs too!! Help like that is needed like a hole in the head! All I can say to those "cachers" is Thanks for ruining such a good thing!! None of those guys will contribute near as much to the cache world as you have...and not many will have enough common sense to even realize it!! It's truly a sad day for caching, I had really hoped to make it out to CA and find one of those GREAT TT caches, and now I will have no TBs to look for when out hunting them...all the TT TBs will be gone! TRULY A SAD DAY!! If you need anything, you know where I am, drop me a line any time!! I will miss you and I wish you luck!! FIGHT ON!!!!!!

Went out yesterday to place some hides. The temp was around 15, the wind was blowing the snow about like a winter storm...GREAT weather for outdoor fun!! We placed 3 caches and marked another 7 locations for future hides. Our hike was a long 6 miles on some steep hills and in some deep growth (thickets and such). We didn't get cold until about an hour later, when we stopped for gas on the way home (took off the carharts by then). Dress warm, and take along the appropriate gear (hats, gloves warm boots and socks, a thick wind resistant coat and wear layers to keep warm)...no better time in the great outdoors than in the winter! You can always take off something if you get too warm...hard to cool off in the heat though.

I have to agree with TSD...that just doesn't seem like a good deal for the cacher! I won't go into detail, but I did get a much better deal than that! I would HOPE a cacher's name and idea would be worth more than a hundred or so bucks.

Yes...write to the last person to hold the coin asking that person to drop it in the cache you found it in. That way, the coin will get it's mileage for it's travels! If, after a few days to weeks (depending on how patient you are) you could either write a follow up note or you could grab it from the cacher, drop it into the cache you found it in, and then grab it back. That way, the TB still gets it's mileage and you have the TB!! Always be polite...and keep in mind that life may have prevented this person from following up on the coin!!

Hey...Thanks for the support guys!! I hope you enjoy your coins!!

MOST large battery dealerships BUY the batteries back from you paying a small amount!! (usually a few dollars at most, but still not bad if you have a bunch of them). Yes, batteries DO leak, and the acid inside IS dangerous to a person or interior of a car! Best to have a truck and gloves, but they are safe enough to load up and clean out!! I know this as I am co-owner of a golf course...we handle TONS of batteries out there. Just be careful not to touch metal to the posts of the batteries as there may be a bit of residual "charge" to any that are "newer" (or not have been there very long) batteries. UNLESS the battery in question looks VERY new, there is no real danger of it posing problems for you...old batteries shouldn't have a charge (that's why they were thrown out in the first place), so don't pose the chance of a discharge or "blowing up". edit to add...MOST batteries that have been out for long periods of time pose VERY little threat to anyone, your only concern would be the leaking of the casing...but, if there is a crack or holes in the battery (or if it's been out for say, a few years), chances are that there isn't much (if any) acid left inside to worry about. NO, I wouldn't sit in back and picnic on them after a day of collecting them, and I would wash my hands etc after cleaning them up from an area, but they are mostly nothing more than trash that has lead in them. Proper protective equipment in most cases would be old clothes (blue jeans etc) and gloves...maybe a pair of overalls!!

I had a great time at the '06 Bash...had fun helping with the TBs!! I would love to lend a hand ANYWHERE needed, but loved the experience last year!! Put me in, anywhere at all, I'll be happy to lend a hand. CONSIDER THIS MY WAY OF VOLUNTEERING!!!! SERIOUSLY...CONTACT ME IF YOU WOULD LIKE MY SERVICES!!! Depending on the schedule at our place of business, we MAY have an extra golf cart to lend too...MAYBE!! My only worry...last year, we signed up for an electric campsite. The only electric spots available seemed to be right in the middle of the pack!! While I'm not a recluse by any means, I didn't like the idea of "smelling what everyone else had for dinner that night" if you know what I mean. And, I don't think the tents offer much as sound barriers from those "all-nighter's" (not to mention against runaway golf carts ). We finally settled in a nice little spot in the parking lot (many of you probably saw us). Another problem was the lack of ability to have personal campfires...while this wasn't TOO much of a problem (we planned ahead), it would be nice to be able to have your own fire to enjoy...that's a HUGE part of camping (and since I don't drink, I'd rather NOT visit the host sites...not that you guys are BAD or anything...just not my idea of fun). I can't WAIT to get out there and enjoy all the great cache experiences, share our "tall-tales" and meet new cache friends!!

Definitely NOT!!! Dress warm, wear thick socks and water-resistant boots...there are TONS of caches out here for all to enjoy!! We started our caching last January 31st, by July, we had racked up 500+ caches...most of which were found during the winter months!! Winter offers a few bonuses as well as some problems: There are NO bugs, the weeds and such are down (no poison ivy the thickets aren't as bad, less bushwacking), the tree cover is thin, giving a better GPS reading and you don't ususally need to worry about getting overly hot and sweaty...while at the same time, you can dress WARMLY and have protective layers between you and those thickets that do happen to still be around (or the trail below you and your "bottom" as the trail may be slick at times). Some caches are only accessible by water...some of those will now be accessible by walking on water!! The trails will be a lot less active, giving you more freedom to search in peace and not be seen by muggle eyes...I could go on! Bad sides to winter caching...snow trails which make finding caches too easy at times (hey, that's not ALL bad), snow may cover some caches altogether (we have a few that will be moved for the winter, higher is sometimes better) and of course, the slippery roads and trails that may be encountered. Some of the parks will close during winter, or parking may be unavailable for some caches...most areas like this SHOULD describe these conditions in the listing though, and lastly....it gets dark early, making it tough to do soe of those "daytime only" caches (cemeteries etc...). All in all, winter is a great season for caching, get out and enjoy the land!!

repeat post as comp froze up!

Shameless bump...there are still plenty of these available in both the LE black nickel AND the RE gold!! I also have a few for trade for other personal coins!!