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Everything posted by Papa-Bear-NYC

  1. Alas, a great loss to all of us. I "followed his footsteps" to many an out-of-the-way place in Maine and even Canada back in the oughts (see, for example this). I always wanted to meet up with him on my yearly trips to DC but never managed it. Richard G, aka Papa Bear
  2. This article on the New Yorker web page appeared yesterday: Unearthing the City Grid That Would Have Been in Central Park by Marguerite Holloway. Marguerite Holloway, who wrote the book I mentioned in the previous post, together with the surveyor Lemuel Morrison, was with me from day one when we recognized and got the ball rolling on validating and protecting the first in situ Randel marble monument found in the city. A well written article and she gives me a nice plug. The project team subsequently found 3 more monuments and one more bolt. I myself know the location of just the first one, not those subsequently found, and the information on that location is embargoed until the park decides how to protect the monument. So no, I can't show it to you. Sorry.
  3. Extra long screwdriver: Home Depot, $7.67 I use an earlier version made by husky. Strong, light, won't bend or break. I tried to make something like it from raw materials. No way could I come close.
  4. I have no idea what the little holes around the circumference are. In 1844, I don't know how such bolts were manufactured or why. Possibly for some 19th century industrial or manufacturing use. And I would presume the cross is from 1844 and not from the 1930s since lots of such old bolts have them.
  5. Here's a "AND STATE" disk from Foxboro Mass. It was on the side of a RR cut. It was used a a reference marker for the 1944 MY3577 MASSACHUSETTS NORTH BASE. As for "Used to be a lot more great pictures with neat notes on this forum", here's my 2008 forum post on this mark and a bunch of others: The Eastern Oblique Arc cross Massachusetts
  6. So I did. Here it is (full resolution): That was almost 10 years ago. I'm pretty sure I did not notice the station type on the disk. I would note a few things: It's a Tidal Bench mark, not a Hydrographic Station, so it's also a reused disk. So it must have been a leftover in the surveyors kit. The disk says "Superintendent" not "Director", so by the reasoning for the other one up in Garrison, it was made in 1921. It's stamped "2" and "1930" It may well have been the same party as the one set up in Garrison since the crew may have been working up along the river at that time That's an EXTREMELY DANGEROUS LOCATION. Sometimes I wonder what I was doing there in my carefree youth This has to be much more dangerous than the one in Garrison, not least because unlike that one you have to cross the tracks. As for Central Park, send me an email and I would be happy to meet up sometime. No trains there.
  7. I've not been active for quite a while, but here's something from a 2007 forum post: An Unusual Tidal Bench Mark Disk Here's the log: LX1097 GC log It's about a 1921 Hydrographic station disk reused as a Tidal Benchmark. Pb
  8. Yes, I remember that show. As you may have guessed, it was staged. I know those guys (although I didn't know them then). The true story is in an excellent book which came out a couple of years ago: The Measure of Manhattan by Marguerite Holloway. Just give me some notice and it will be nice to see you again.
  9. To elaborate: if you plan to be in NYC some time and are serious about the protection of these artifacts and have a half day available for some exploring, including fairly rugged territory, feel free to contact me.
  10. Did I hear my name mentioned? Yes, I'm still alive and well and I check in here from time to time. I've mentioned a couple of the bolt's on my web site, one of which is known to the cognoscenti, the other not. Check this page I wrote in 2010: The City and the Park which shows them. I do not publish the location of the second one for obvious reason (vandalism, souvenir hunting, etc.). And far as I know I am the only one who has ever found it, and it has not been seen by anyone but folks I have brought there. I'm not trying to be snarky, but these things are possibly among the rarist of relics in the city full of relics. Feel free to contact me off line.
  11. I caught this on another forum and I thought there would be interest here: Article from GPS World Rg
  12. I caught this on another forum and I thought there would be interest here: Article from GPS World Maybe someone could post it to the appropriate Geocaching forum about which I am totally clueless. Rg
  13. Interesting topic. I did spend some time in the most northerly part of the boundary. I think this one is the coolest (#91): You will note that it says the boundary is 1 foot from the disk. Guess what is one foot away: It's the edge of the rock. This rock marks the northernmost point of the boundary - it's IN the river on the west side. It's at the very point in the little triangle of Vermont that sticks eastward into New Hampshire. The rock is down the hill about 100 yards from that marker (#90) shown above which is on the side of the road.
  14. Here are the pictures of what we were doing while I was not running the marathon: https://picasaweb.google.com/112264703949200509077/20110930StGeorgeUtahSnowCanyonCoronadoInn https://picasaweb.google.com/112264703949200509077/2011100304ZionNationalPark https://picasaweb.google.com/112264703949200509077/2011100456GrandCanyonNorthRim And as for benchmarks, I was on vacation and did not look for one. I found one anyway (on the front step of the Kaibab Lodge near the north rim of the Grand canyon where we stayed for two nights) but I ignored it! I figured I paid my dues by running the race. The rest of the time I was off duty.
  15. YES! Boston 2013, YES! Yesterday on a hot, mostly downhill course (quads are wrecked fo a week) I broke my qualifying time by almost 9 minutes with a 4:16:09 and was 15th in the 65-69 age group (out of 65 runners in the group), which I am now in. I will run Boston on April 15th 2013 when I will be 70. This was my first marathon in nearly 8 years. I guess I am now un-retired from marathoning! YES!
  16. This goes back 10 years ... You may have noticed that I have not been Benchmark hunting much this year. For those who know I'm also interested in hiking and mountain climbing , I haven't been doing much of that either. No, I'm not injured or terminally ill - just the opposite. I'm as fit or fitter than ever. I've been running. And running and running. Saturday is the culmination of all that running when I do the St. George Marathon (Utah). Then I can stop running -- but only for a while. What's with the 10 years? Easy, that's when I retired, and my first project was to train for a marathon and qualify for the Boston Marathon as a 60 year old. Well, I did. The qualifier was the Dublin Marathon (Ireland) in October 2001, and Boston was in April of 2003. In between, through most of the summer of 2002, I hiked about half the Appalachian Trail (the good half). After Boston 2003, I said "That's my last Boston" (it was my 4th) "I'm retiring from marathons, they're getting too dadgum hard". So I did. And a few years after that I began Benchmark hunting and joined this group. This year, like certain baseball players, I decided to un-retire and try just one more time to qualify for the Boston Marathon (that would be the 2013 Boston -- the lead time is quite long due to the registration process). This time it would be as a 70 year old. Yikes!. I've gotten slower (surprise!) but the age specific qualification times have also gotten slower so I have a good shot at it. So think of me on Saturday and wish me luck. Next summer you may see me Benchmark hunting again (and of course hiking and mountain climbing and running), and then the following April 15th I'll be in Boston (I hope). Then I think I'll retire from marathons, they're getting too dadgum hard. No, really.
  17. All, An interesting thread here on the Minn Arrowhead shore of Lake Superior. It would be very nice if a recovery with a 'FIELD CHECKED DESCRIPTION' makes into the DATASHEET. West of here along the Medicine Line a good number of the small diameter U.S. & C. B. SURVEY disks and the short stake RM's do have a PID. <cut> TC0447 And this disk is a Triangulation Station. <cut> CHILD Would like to gather up a few more of them, but I think that my return to Montana in a week or so will be along a southern South Dakota route. kayakbird Don't need to go to Montana. Maine, NH, and VT have tons of them. I've been working the area for several years. See this map for example: NH IBC stations The red line is the border and the red icons are the monuments. The grey icons are triangulations stations (most or which are in the NGS database) connected by blue lines which shows the 1915 triangulation. The green icons are reference marks along both sides of Hall's Stream, most of which are not in the NGS database. For those I could find in the old docs. I have also included the original description in the info-window. See Hereford, QH0620, (far left of screen) which is one of my prized finds. Click on an icon and you'll see what is what.
  18. It would be great to see a picture of the mark - which is the granite post about 5 ft. high. That way we could all see how the mark has faired since it was placed in 1845! Shirley~ ------------------------------ There is a photo by JCLBA (who visited the site with PatrickValerie) labeled IMG 0413[1] It shows the bottom of the post in a concrete base inscribed "No. 658 / RENEWED / 1902" (hold your head upside down). What this means is the original post, which was just stuck in the ground, was set in a concrete base while holding it's position constant. The process is described in the old IBC publications from the early 20th century. It would be the equivalent of doing a Reset on a triangulation station. There is also a disk pictured. This is a Bench Mark disk which was set in the base for each monument when the resurvey was done in 1915 - 1920. These disks are not in the NGS database but were used by the IBC to control the elevation of the surveys. These books are actually purchasable from the IBC (part of the US State Dept.) and I bought one for about $10 (it weighs about 10 lb). They are listed on this web page IBC publications. I just sent an email to someone listed and got back instructions for ordering the book. It's got huge amounts of very cool information.
  19. Yep - I can't get that link to work using Internet Explorer or Chrome. Does it work for you? Thanks, Works fine for me with both Firefox 4 and IE 8.Rg
  20. A couple of years back, I was privileged to be present at the dedication of "Meridian Park" in Calais Maine. The longitudinal observatory at this site served as the last link or the "Golden Spike" of the telegraphic determinations from Europe to the US from 1855 to 1866. Here's a report I put on this forum (part of a longer thread): The Curious and Wonderful Tale of the Calais Observatory.
  21. Couple of things 1) The USGS (at least for this time frame) used the same disk blank for both Triangulation Stations and Bench Marks. The all say "Bench Mark" and they all have a triangle in the middle. The fact that there is an accurate elevation stamped on the disk tells me it's a bench mark, not a triangulation station. Furthermore, if it's on the front step of some structure, you can be absolutely certain it's not a triangulation station. 2) For any USGS triangulation station I've encountered (very few), I have NOT seen reference marks nor azimuth marks. The fact that they were set to make maps which, when done, were no longer needed, is probably the reason. 3) I have occasionally seen the USC&GS come along and use an existing USGS tri station disk for their own purposes, but they would generally resurvey it, and add their own Reference marks and maybe an azimuth mark. Bottom line: without the backup information you can't tell what to expect and you shouldn't expect the USGS markers to follow the USC&GS rules.
  22. Nice ... but that's not how they used to do it. Observe the following illustration from an early CGS publication: Notice the wedge in the end of the split shaft. The whole thing was driven into a pre-drilled hole. When the wedge hit the bottom, it got driven up into the shaft, spreading the two sides and forming a very tight fit. Obviously this would work in rock and in hardened concrete which would allow the hole to be drilled the right width and depth (and at the right location). Not so wet concrete. But wet concrete would also not provide a carefully predetermined location. So you couldn't use it for example if you were resetting a surface mark from the underground mark or from the reference marks. Always nice to see how things were done in the "good old days". The picture is from Special Publication 76 (1922).
  23. A bunch in Maine, NY and Vermont are like that. They're all IBC marks or marks set by GSC which were used by the IBC. They're placed in the nearest US county, which woks fine for someone like me who understands what is going on, but for someone unfamiliar with the situation it could be confusing. I think the best was this one Hereford, QH0620 A beautiful stamped copper bolt (a first order station) set in 1909 by the GSC and used by the IBC in it's triangulation of the border in 1915. It's one of several points used to tie the border triangulation with the triangulations of the US and Canada, and thus tied those two national triangulations together. Here it is: Although only a 3/4" bolt, they managed to stamp "GSC" and "1909" on it, together with a circle and a tiny cross at the datum point.
  24. Maybe wishful thinking, but I think that I can see the tail of the Quebec, maybe added to an Oscar with the corner of a chisel, in the closeup of the pipe cap. Maybe another shot will be posted?? kayakbird You may also find confusion between the number "1" and the letter "I". Two points to remember: 1) the permanent part of the disk is engraved, not stamped so comparisons of fonts, serifs, etc. will not be helpful. 2) it helps to compare the questionable stamped character with another on the disk or on another disk set at the same time and place (such as reference marks). I also find a curious confusion of the number "3" with the number "5" when they used a highly serifed font popular at one point. I'll look for some examples and post them here when I find them. Here's one: Tell me, does that say 1938 or 1958? Answer Here There are worse ones out there using that stamping set with the flat topped 3 with the down serif.
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