TheLoneGrangers
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Posts posted by TheLoneGrangers
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that's great, but you realize that a very small precentage of geocachers actually use these forums? I am giving realistic idea of what would happen, based off what I would do...it's not a fact, just my opinion, based off statistics if one person feels that way, there is sure to be many more...and based off the trail that is made, its safe to bet that is what is happening. Like I said if you do not know about the forums, and you do a search on off-road use of BLM lands, thier rules say "use existing trails, or washes". It doesn't say "use existing trails that are listed on our maps or numerically designated" I spent about an hour on thier website yesterday, looking on thier maps, it's not user friendly by any means.
So I am standing by what I said, by driving to the location, and you see a trail, you do not know that the trail goes from cache to cache, you won't realize that until you started. You know that BLM rules say to use existing trails, based off thier website. It looks like a existing trail when you get there, so you drive on it.
I do realize that not every cacher is on the forums, and that most, if not all, would look at that trail and say that it's "established." But for you to sit here and say that you would still drive the trail, even after you've learned the rules... Well, there's not much more I can really say about a total disregard for the landowner's wishes...
You qouted me out of context.
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Thanks for the thread, I found two perfect gifts for my wife, the awesome T-shirt and ornament! My wife is a huge fan of Survivor and geocaching, perfect!
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the trail looks like a existing trail to me, so I would drive on it.
Yes, to YOU it does. But to the rest of us, who have read every post since the thread started, know that, according to the BLM, it is NOT an existing trail.
It's pretty obvious that some people here have skimmed right over this clutch post by Clan Riffster. Here ya go, go ahead and give it another read.
HINT: The bold portion is very important.
Another update: I spoke to Lisa today, (Recreation Specialist for the Caliente Field Office of the Bureau of Land Management), and got some clarification from her. The area I asked about was the chunk of land about 6 miles northwest of Rachel Nevada, northwest of the intersection of Hwy-375 and Smith Well Rd. I asked her what the OHV (Off Highway Vehicle) classification was for that property, and she said driving off of "established" trails is strictly forbidden, and violators would be subject to "serious fines". (Her words, not mine) When I asked her why they would enforce such a thing in that area, she told me that driving off trail "damages the ecosystem". (Again, her words, not mine) The phone number listed above is the main office. You can call her direct at 775-726-8116 if you wish to verify what she told me.
The one thing I really wanted to nail her down on was what the particular classification was for this property. What she described would fall under their definition of "Limited", as you can only travel on "established" trails, but I couldn't get her to specify which classification it had, by name. Just by definition. When I asked what would qualify as an "established" trail, according to their rules, she said any trail that is listed on their maps, by name or numeric designation.
Sadly, I neglected to ask if there was an online resource available to us mortals, where we could see for ourselves what a particular property's OHV classification was.
I did not mention anything about the alien head, or the folks driving it, as I would rather not poke that sleeping dragon. My approach was a fib, in that I claimed I wanted to do some driving around that area when I came over for my next vacation. (Not precisely a lie, but...)
I think it's safe to put to bed the notion that they, (The BLM), wouldn't care.
So, as you other people can (hopefully) see, this trail, though it exists insofar as we can physically see it, does not exist as far as the BLM is concerned. Therefore, driving on this trail would be regarded as driving off of an existing or established trail.
that's great, but you realize that a very small precentage of geocachers actually use these forums? I am giving realistic idea of what would happen, based off what I would do...it's not a fact, just my opinion, based off statistics if one person feels that way, there is sure to be many more...and based off the trail that is made, its safe to bet that is what is happening. Like I said if you do not know about the forums, and you do a search on off-road use of BLM lands, thier rules say "use existing trails, or washes". It doesn't say "use existing trails that are listed on our maps or numerically designated" I spent about an hour on thier website yesterday, looking on thier maps, it's not user friendly by any means.
So I am standing by what I said, by driving to the location, and you see a trail, you do not know that the trail goes from cache to cache, you won't realize that until you started. You know that BLM rules say to use existing trails, based off thier website. It looks like a existing trail when you get there, so you drive on it.
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NEWHERE, I took a look at the map where you made your finds, and briefly looking over the area, if I were to go there, one area that looks interesting is the davidson-arabia mountain national perserve. looks like about 6-7 caches there, one i looked at had 7 favorites and a 3 star terrain. Also Stone Mountain east of Scottdale has alot of caches, and is actually a place we plan on visiting in the future. Sweetwater creek state park also looks promising.
It took me about 5 minutes to look at your area. Not bragging by any means...but I am sure you would enjoy finding those caches. I would be pleased to know if you go to one of these places on your next day off and post your experiance
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..(trim).. If it looked real enough to call the police I would say you did the right thing. Better safe than sorry and whatnot.
Just like the dead body found in the link below looked real enough?? For crying out loud.
WOW! It amazes me the lack of common sense people lack, look at the dang eyes on the thing, you can tell just from the picture it is fake
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a simple smell check would have solved the issue at hand. (pun intended lol)
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The only clear evidence that the trail was not preexisting, and the result of geocaching activity is this thread.
That and the BLM charts. Those, I imagine, are pretty clear as well.
I'm all for romping in the desert. Legally. I've broken more than a few truck parts in the sand, so I'm not an anti-4WD person.
Does the BLM provide this information? Because I can't find it anywhere. (I have to admit I didn't look very hard) Bottom line, I did more then probably alot of people who wheel (just assuming) and the trail looks like a existing trail to me, so I would drive on it. The BLM website says you can drive on existing washes too, maybe this whole area is a wash?? Doubtful I am sure. So my main question is, how does the BLM let the public know which trails are acceptable to drive on? Are they clearly marked?
The serious people here put in a hard and concerted effort to find out where they go off road in the various vehicles. The less than serious ones, and the ones who cause the most problems for the off roading community here, see a trail and drive on it after casually flitting through a website which then affects the community as a whole as land managers aren't keen on that sort of thing.
All it took was for one person here to get information from talking a person. I imagine the serious people not only casually flit through a website but if really conscientious about how their actions may affect a community as a whole will pick up the phone if they do not get clear enough information. I would bet if you ask for a map from the BLM they will gladly give you one.
I can assure you I am a serious driver. I should have included why I didn't search to hard for a map. My trip was cancelled and I didn't feel the need to keep researching since I wasn't going.
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The only clear evidence that the trail was not preexisting, and the result of geocaching activity is this thread.
That and the BLM charts. Those, I imagine, are pretty clear as well.
I'm all for romping in the desert. Legally. I've broken more than a few truck parts in the sand, so I'm not an anti-4WD person.
Does the BLM provide this information? Because I can't find it anywhere. (I have to admit I didn't look very hard) Bottom line, I did more then probably alot of people who wheel (just assuming) and the trail looks like a existing trail to me, so I would drive on it. The BLM website says you can drive on existing washes too, maybe this whole area is a wash?? Doubtful I am sure. So my main question is, how does the BLM let the public know which trails are acceptable to drive on? Are they clearly marked?
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two things: First, I can't believe you actually called the police. You could have very easily determined yourself if it was fake or not....sense of smell maybe? poke it with a stick?
Second, to be 21 years old and claim you know everything about children is laughable, why? You have a degree? My wife is a elementary school teacher who is nationally board certified and has her masters degree. She has been teaching for 10 years, does she know everything about children? She would be the first to say no. Please get a grip with reality
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If I did not know about this thread...and I were to visit Nevada, and rent a 4wd, since my jeep is in SC, and its not practical to drive it to NV lol. (which BTW was my plan last month, I was going to Nellis AFB for a week of training, and I intended to rent a jeep and find geocaches in the desert. I looked up BLM policy on jeeping on thier lands. The website says use existing trails. If I were to drive out there and see a trail I would drive on it. Starting out I would not know that it goes from cache to cache, I see a existing trail and I am going to drive my 4wd on it because BLM says I can. The CO telling me not to drive on BLM land is a irrevelant request, because the BLM website says you can drive on existing trails, and thats why I bought a Jeep! and in this case rented one.
Thought I should add
I believe in tread lightly and take out what you take in for sure, I would not go off trail if the caches become off trail I would just have driven as far as I could possibly drive, because it is the fun part of caching for me.
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Briansnat has the best advice. A multicache that requires you to go in the tunnel to figure out the coords to the final stage.
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thanks for the train wreak picture because that is exactly what happened here lol
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Again I agree with Snoogans, but really both sides of this arguement are not going to agree with the other, so can this topic just die already?! LOL
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what a cool thread, will have to find some and snap some pics
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I like that reasoning DanOCan
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I'd be interested to know what is going on "behind the scenes" as well
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people log multiple DNFs on single caches
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Little late on posting, but i am still fairly new to riding. I started with a mtb a 400.00 diamondback I ordered online. Well it takes me 40 minutes to ride on any trails around here so i started riding the mtb on the road. It was rough! and I didn't understand why it was so hard, 10 miles was really hard, I could go 10 miles on the trails, why is 10 miles on the road so hard??? So I went and bought a Giant for 800 bucks at my local bike shop. I literally doubled my distance with same time in a matter of 2 days. Crazy big differance! and i love it! Im really happy with my road bike
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I just purchased my first handgun a taurus PT 740 slim this week. Can't wait to fire it at the range this weekend. looking forward to getting my CCL in the future, once I get proficient with it.
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The ability for premium members to search for trackables in the same way as geocaches. Showing, what cache ti is in, distance, last placed, last moved, last logged. etc. With this feature, you could remove trackable inventory from the cache page. You would log it like a cache, with a found it, DNF etc. and a automated email would be sent to the TO...no smileys awared of course.
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I agree with you, great idea.
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I don't think there should be a trackable inventory at all on the cache page.
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Long term goal: Find every cache in the state I am living in, South Carolina...boy there is alot lol. But at least it's not California.
Short term goals: Find a great trail with caches to backpack. and take my jeep to uwharrie state forest in North Carolina to cache
We can finally see Alien Head from space!
in General geocaching topics
Posted
Nope you didn't, you got me, I forgot that post =P. Honestly I am torn on what I would do, half of me says to act as if this thread doesn't exist and drive. The other half says, ok, I'm not allowed to drive on this trail, so I will hike it...and truthfully I probably couldn't answer this until I actually got out there.
Of course this is all hypothetical, if I ever get a chance to go to Nellis AFB again, I won't be going after the alien head or the ET trail. I will go after caches that I can legally drive my jeep too, and there are plenty, and look more fun