Klemmer

My favorite recovered so far is San Juan Hill (California, not Puerto Rico). It's in southern California, almost exactly on the Orange / San Bernardino County line. See DX4280. It is actually a MONUMENT! It's a large concrete structure, with posts for tripod supports. It dates from 1886! And, I was first to log it in GC.com. How cool! I wish I had taken more / better pictures, and looked for the other Reference Marker, but we were still 2+ hours from the car, and it was 2+ hours to sunset. I remember hearing / seeing lots of coyotes the last mile back to the car (not worried about them). Fun trip! I think the hike was about 8 miles round trip., and probably 2000 ft elevation gain / loss one way. Don't think you can do the trip in much less than that, unless you have "ranger" access to the fire roads. From the later post by Worker II (he is a CA State Park maintenance worker), I also take it that the Station is still in active use, even with all the fancy GPS gear in use!

I've found (recovered) and logged (mostly on GC.com) about 30 Benchmarks (of various sorts), and probably looked for and NOT found about 30 more. Just to let you know I'm not exactly a newbie, nor an expert. Found / recovered Triangulation Station DX3785 recently (previously recovered most recently in 1975). In addition to the usual Station (Triangulation Mark), and (in this case) 2 Reference Markers, the original description (1939) describes the general location of an Azimuth Marker ("... 1/2 mile NE..."). I guess there is an actual marker there? From the descrption (quite loose), it will not be easy to find, and may not be public accessible. Question: What purpose did / does an Azimuth Station serve? I think I have seen a few references to several somewhere, but not quite as defintely spelled out as this one. Is it necesary for the proper use of the Triangulation Station? In other words, worth looking for? These days, with a survey grade GPS, is one needed? Reference made in the 1939 CGS monumenting entry to a "standard bronze disk set". Does that include a specially marked Azimuth disk? Haven't seen one yet.... Look forward to an informative answer (as always in this forum) .........

Thanks guys! Interesting. Didn't make it to those Benchmarks today. Too many caches. Next time.

Well, we had Loran ("A" type, or maybe an early "C", I think) installed in USAF aircraft Y flew in 1972 - 78. It was a C-9A Nightingale used for medical Air Evacuation. Mainly, we flew stateside, so didn't need it. All aircraft were wired for it, and we only installed & calibrated it when we flew overseas (e.g. Central America, Bermuda). We only had afew guys (ex-navigators) in the wing qualified on it, and I wasn't one of them. It was MANUAL, in that you had to look at a small scope, take measurements off it, do a bunch of Naviguesser magic pencil scribles. Never worked woth a darn. We pilots did better with DR (Dead reconning). We had no fancy stuff like Intertial Nav. GPS was still a dream. So I guess the USAF did have a stake in it, sort of.

About to go look for a couple benchmarks in Riverside CA area, and I noticed they are both listed as a "Gravity Station Disk". Anyone have any idea what that is, how it is used? Here they are: http://www.geocaching.com/mark/details.asp?PID=DX3592 http://www.geocaching.com/mark/details.asp?PID=DX3593

Rich - you are correct on LONG (I think - I didn't run the numbers). It sure does depend on your LAT. But what is really COOL is LAT. 1 minute LAT is ALWAYS EXACTLY 1 nautical mile = 6000 feet. Since we rarely deal with seconds on GC.com, decimal minutes are cool: 0.1 min LAT = 600 ft. 0.01 min LAT = 60 ft. 0.001 min Lat - 6 ft. Always. At the equator or the polls. That's what my navigation text tells me. BTW - a second of LAT = 6000 / 60 = 100 ft. So 6 seconds LAT - 600 ft always. Engineers design it to nanometer tolerances, measure it with a micrometer, mark it with chalk, and cut it with an axe.

Had the same problem on my Magellan MeriPlat. Looked at the waypoint names (in Easy GPS), and there were strange characters (non-alphanumeric). Some had used (I think) a "carot" - "^" in a couple cache names, and the NMEA data stream choked on it. Deleted the ^. Worked perfect. Klemmer

Yep, Jamie Z is right! Same thing I do with my Plat. Saw it here when Meri's were new. True then true now. Re-locks in 10 secs' or so. Works. Wish there was a buton "clear averaging buffer". Klemmer

Hi DrBC: I have been geocaching for a couple years, 200+ caches, and I'm real happy with the old Delorme TopoQuads. All USGS 7.5 min Topos ("Quads"), at the lowest 3 levels. (Don't confuse with Topo USA, which is not USGS). TopoQuads come by State (mostly), and if you stick to the right datum (it handles several), they are VERY accurate; input coords to a map feature (like a peak or road intersection) is right on. More so than the GPSr, in my opinion. Reasonably easy to use. Not sure it's still available.... Not free. Uh oh.. Is the "BC" for "British Columbia"... Don't think they do Canada. Klemmer Klemmer

Hi Kite & Hawkeye: You don't have to choose one kind of pole tip: you can have both rubber & sharp. Ours from REI are great (you probably have an REI in San Diego). They came with a cheapo shipping protector (tooos that), but as an accessory, you can buy nice snap on rubber tips. Right by the poles, or ask. Rubber tips good for sidewalks, roads, or solid bedrock (only used them once for that). No good on anything loose, and sure no good in a creek! Pointy in a creek the way to go. Look for carbide tips (very hard stuff, harder than steel). Love mine! Klemmer

My wife took a couple hikes to convince me, but boy, do I EVER like them! Two fancy aluminum REI types. Since starting hiking / Geocaching, have lost 25 lbs, and my back (and the rest of me) is in better shape than in the last 10+ years). Could NOT have done it without the sticks! Takes pressure off the lower back, spreads the load, better balance, etc.

one more word: Before you buy Topo USA, decide if you want USGS 7.5 minute (most detail) topographic maps. First, I bought Topo USA (whole US for the price). I found it somewhat limiting, having used paper USGS maps, before the digital days. It has roads & some topo data, but many details are lacking. I made the step up to 3D TopoQuads, and am glad I did. Problem is the price, which is for just one state (or half, if you're in CA). Just S. CA does it for me. LOTS more detail. Only downside is that you have to realize that most USGS Topo maps have not been updated in 10-15 years, or sometimes even more! If you are looking for newer (civilization) data, it's a problem. If you are wilderness hiking (like we mostly do), it's great, since it doesn't change much. Transfers work great. Geocaching (caches or BM)via EasyGPS (free) to GPS. GPS to Delorme TopoQuads. RIGHT ON everytime. Eyeballing to landmarks & topo lines, very good. Might be better than the actual GPS coords. Whew!

Appreciate the benchmark info on "my pages". Really do. But -- one minor (easily fixed?) thing, I almost hate to mention it ... one "glitch", at least on my PC - there is no space or separator between the benchmarks found and the next date, so they all run together. May I suggest a period, then a space? If it's just a hardware issue (hard to believe huh?), I'm using a fairly recent PC, 1024 X 768 video. Thanks.

Well, I bet wrong. I got a nice reply from them to an inquirey I send. ****** Quoting in part ********* ""... called the Corps' Vicksburg District and was told there is not a benchmark database accessible by the public. They are working on one that will be available in the future. You can call the Vicksburg District at {{removed by Klemmer}} and they can supply benchmark info over the phone. Hope this helps! {{name & email address removed by Klemmer}} US ERDC WES Research Library Vicksburg, MS"" ****** end quote ******** So, I guess no USACE Benchmark data for the moment. I "sanitized" the name, address & phone from above, since I don't think I would like many emails or phone calls per day. Personally, I'm not going to be making many calls to MS for Benchmark data.

Yup, I've got pics of three more Army Corps of Engineers marks also. Any ACE Dam will have a bunch, it seems. The hunt is on for the data base! I bet it is on-line somewhere!

Yup, I've got pics of three more Army Corps of Engineers marks also. Any ACE Dam will have a bunch, it seems. The hunt is on for the data base! I bet it is on-line somewhere!

Just having read a situation that is clearer (I'll post the link if I can find it again), here's my 2 cents worth: The way I read these is that they are talking about the height of the REFERENCE (in this case Turtle) above the benchmark in question. Probably done with classic surveying methods (transit sight & trig calculations).

Hey guys - if they scaled it on a topo map, you can bet it was done in NAD27. ALL USGS topo maps are NAD27! Did they convert to put it back in NAD83? Maybe not!

Yeah, I've been "recovering" PIDs & related markers for a while, just for fun, and have pics of some that are not in Elias' (USGS) data base. In particular, I have several that are US Army Corps of Engineers, that do not show up in the USGS data base. You'd think that one part of the Gov't would talk to another part -- naw - that's too much to hope for, I guess! -- Klemmer

"Recovered" just means they found it, and maybe improved the description, possibly the Lat/Long coords (?) if better equipment available. If you find it, you "Recover" it! On the US GS website (some months ago), they even solicited reports from ordinary civilians (boy, could they get a bunch this way!)

Meridian(s) advertized to float, also. Have been using Garmin Etrex Venture, and just ordered Magellan Meridian Platinum. If I remember & have time, I'll give you my opinion on them. I got the Magellan (daughter #2 gets the Garmin) because I wanted averaging when not moving, and the electronic compass. Both were lacking on the Garmin, and (I think) will be very useful in Geocaching & hiking. - Klemmer