stevensj2

I totally agree, and I think that's the route most people would understandably take, But likewise, I don't believe honest, law-abiding citizens should fear invoking their rights. If more people stood their ground and utilized their rights, they wouldn't be so quick to slip away and LEO's wouldn't take it as some sort of a challenge. Enforcing your rights should never be a threat to any officer. If its the law they're trying to uphold, they should be delighted when a fellow citizen is familiar with it; if they're not delighted, then I'd question their motives and what it is they are really upholding. (Not to derail the thread, but I just wanted to emphasize that acknowledging your Constitutional rights should never be seen as a challenge to an officer. If they make unlawful demands, he/she is challenging you, and your rights are all you have.)

Under US law, you are not required to present ID unless you are in a building which requires it, or operating a vehicle/machine and are requested to show your license to to do so. If a LEO asks you who you are, what you're doing, etc just give them your name and tell them you are participating in a treasure hunting hobby. No more information, verbal or through ID, is required of you. The officer can get as huffy as they like, and make all the threats in the book, but the constitution entitles you to be free of this harassment when obeying the law. If you are on public land, you have no need to do any further. Creating some sort of GC-ID card only furthers the problem, and continues to perpetuate the myth that you most don an ID wherever you go.

Or a full-throttle mixture of cyan, magenta, and yellow

If you like the pn-40, you might want to keep your eyes open on the PN-30 that will be coming out soon. It's essentially a pn-40 without the tri-axis compass and altimeter, and it's green instead of orange. Estimated retail is $299, which means online stores (Amazon, etc) will likely have them for around $200-220 (my guess). (DeLorme's price for the pn-40 is $399, but they are much cheaper elsewhere - as low as $310ish, for reference as to why you can expect the pn-30 to be lower than the $299 mark) Depending on how soon you want to have the unit, it might be worth the wait

I'd wait and see, Debbzilla. The difference between the pn-20 and pn-40 is pretty significant, and the substantial speed increase is noticeable. I see a lot of pn-20's with extras going for about $300. A new, warrantied pn-30 will be less than that (store retail and online markets will always be less than DeLorme's MSRP).

The idea makes me speculate it with doubt, but two things make it seem legit to me: - The fact that there are reviews, not just ads or "talk" - The latest firmware update mentioned a PN-30. Most likely a typo...however, this indicates that maybe it was not. If it is using the same internals, a fimware for both would make sense. Do the pn-20 and pn-40 typically share the same firmware update? (Not too big a fan of the green though! A more olive-drab green would be much nicer, in my opinion. Let's hope the PN-50 or PN-60 isn't bright blue or red!. Too "Fisher-Price" for me.)

I'm sure you will be very happy with the pn-40. I doubted it too, with all the negativity and opinions I've heard here. But I decided to see for myself. After 2 days with it, I returned my Garmin. Topo 7 takes some getting used to, but anyone who is able to download and manage their geocaches will be able to handle it just fine. Let us know your impressions when it arrives!

There's also one for the PN-20! There was even one for the PN-30 at first release

I was previously using a Garmin Colorado, but tried out the DeLorme pn-40 and decided it fit my needs much better, so I returned the Garmin.

I'm from the Ann Arbor/Chelsea area (butt I work and go to school in Lansing). Just started caching, and hope to make a couple in my local area soon

If a cache is placed such that local land owners are likely to be encroached upon and the cache owner fails to address this, then I see no problem with a finder bringing it up in the log. Sure - an email would probably suffice. But if the cache owner hasn't mentioned it yet, why might they in the future? At least by mentioning it the log, future cachers will have a headsup. If the cache owner has anything to gripe about, its that Not The Mama! did part of their work for them. Sometimes caches can be placed in a way that all paths to it might seem to impose upon locals. If no alternative is obvious and the cache owner does not assist in addressing the correct way to get to the cache, then the locals are just going to get fed up. That will eventually lead to a destroyed/missing cache. Should we ignore the real issue (cache owner not mentioning land ownership), not let others know in our logs, and risk that happening just to appear "diplomatic?"

I was going to write up a detailed comparison between the pn-40 and Colorado, but no one should really care _that_ much about what I think Plus, with a lot of work this weekend, I didn't have the time to take comparative photos and all (I was also going to through in some comparisons with a eTrex Vista, since I have one sitting around lately). To make a long story short, I had both of them and needed to return one of them. So I spent some time using both at the same time, looking at their functions, ease of use, and lastly, their waypoints and track logs. I exported each of the GPX files for the track logs and overlaid it on a USGS topo in ArcMap. On one end, I was impressed; with another, I was disappointed. Long story short: I returned one of my units today. With the other, I found my first three caches (not logged yet...waiting to upgrade to prem. for easier tracking). I'm not going to say which one I preferred and kept, but I will say that if I ever drop it in the woods, it won't be that hard to find. From what I hear, its also pretty good at toting around a single Tic-Tac (Just kidding, of course. The pn-40 rocks, and I'm extremely happy with it. Topo 7 and I still have our bouts, but I usually get it to submit. Sure does go down swinging, though.) Once I get my website finished, I'll likely post a review from the newbs perspective (maybe).

It is perfectly adequate for storing a single Tic-Tac

I would recommend narrowing it down to the 60csx and pn-40. Both are really, really good. It might be neat to try out a different brand, and you and your son will be able to carry with you the Garmin maps and the DeLorme maps. On the other side, owning both Garmins, the maps you download from other sites would work for both units. None of us here can tell you what to get, but I think randomly choosing between the pn-40 and 60csx, you will be quite happy either way. The 60csx will be easier to use and get up to speed, but if you're good with computers and don't mind learning the manual, the pn-40 won't be a problem.

It (visually looking at both of them now on my desk) is about 2/3 the size of the Colorado's screen. It is smaller, but its also more visible with less backlight. I'll probably try to get some comparisons and lots of pics up this weekend, comparing the pn-40 to the Colorado.

If you're free any day (or all weekend) of the weekend of May 15th-17th, come on out to Lazy Hayes Days III and you can truly put that tool through some testing!!! I'll be a busy man, but not too busy to maybe find a cache or two (or even a night cache on Saturday night), and would be happy to meet you!! That sounds fun, I'll have to remember those days. I can't wait for the summer to begin.

Thanks for the updates, Chip! I just received my pn-40 yesterday, and installed the 2.5b firmware. Haven't had much chance to use it yet, but I've got my maps loaded and I'm looking forward to trying out the geocache features tomorrow evening

GPSFileDepot has some free topo maps. They may or may not have ones that cover your area or level of detail, but that is probably the #1 source for free maps for Gamin units. Enjoy!

I have the Colorado, and I really like it. For a first time geocacher, it is perfect. I was also curious about the pn-40, and even though I'm not sure it will be what I'm looking for, I ordered one to try it out. 30-day return period was worth trying out, I thought. This weekend I'll be able to use both the Colorado and the pn-40 side by side. There are a lot of reviews for either unit, but if you're looking for a side-by-side comparison of just those two, sit tight! I plan on writing something up for others who were in this very position.

I'm from the Stockbridge area, and have so far downloaded just a few cache locations around there. Had a DNF the other day, so I will try again with the pn-40 soon

In my opinion, it is hard to say whether or not most buy additional maps. I'd assume they do, because it is likely someone without much knowledge would ask the salesmen and he'd have them buying everything under the sun. That being said, whether many or a few take advantage of it, free maps for Garmin units do exist and can be made without too much effort. That's a huge plus. I saw the argument made against the free maps on the point the DeLorme has XMap. This isn't a strong comparison, as XMap is certainly not free, and even a one time fee of $100 (at discount) is infinitely more expensive than free. As far as maps go, you're going to spend money with either unit - most of us have purchased maps and/or software from either (or both) companies. From a sideline perspective, Garmin has the advantage here because no matter how common it is, it is at least possible to buy only the unit and add free maps as you wish, or create your own. DeLorme could make this a moot point buy opening up their units to user-made maps (without needing proprietary software, ie XMap), but that isn't how it currently stands. For me, its a tough decision to call, so I'll have to try both units to see which I prefer, and I can't wait to make some comparisons. Functionality and repeatable accuracy are more important to me than maps (cartographers can make their own, after all ). Edit: Rockin Roddy - I notice a lot of your finds are near where I'm from. We're almost neighbors!

What about a soap that could be broken off, or shaved off...something that doesn't get wet and stay slimey, etc. I don't know how to be more help or describe a product that solves that problem, but thats one of the things I currently dislike about typical bar soap. It gets wet, stays wet, and has to be carried inside a container which it will turn into a giant mess. Liquid soaps, such as body gels and the like, are nice but the use per unit ratio is not very high, and it doesn't last very long. Probably not very helpful, but seeing your post, that was my first thought. Good luck. (And because your soliciting advise rather than shoving links down our throats, I don't see it as spam. If anything, you are asking for us to spam you lol)

Just ordered a pn-40 Hopefully it arrives in time for me to do a lot of side-by-sides with the Garmin Colorado, but in any case, I plan to put the DeLorme through the paces. Its one thing to say it won't fit my needs, finding out for sure is another. And I look forward to all the good things I've read and seen demonstrated. I'll post some feedback once I've had it in the field for several days.

I could - and it is the GPSr I currently use (Colorado), but in a thread about the DeLorme, I didn't want to make it about any other units. My purpose of asking questions was not to deter others from the pn-40, but to bring up considerations that I think one should think about before purchasing (with any unit). Since it was asked of me, I trust it won't later be used as a "gotcha" to say that I had been steering the thread to other units. Without knowing about the battery-brick thing, I doubt most people would ever think of it and look into it. But, that being said, for anyone in similar shoes as me, the Colorado is not the answer to all the questions, either. I've had some issues with it that first made me consider the pn-40, and to a degree, I am still doing so. I'm considering challenging myself by buying the pn-40 and seeing how it stacks up to my needs. To be honest, as much as I debate things with myself (lol) it may be the only real way to see. All in all, at this point, I can only ask questions about the pn-40, rather than answer them

I don't think any unit can be more accurate (without post-processing) than another, inherently. The only thing affecting the unit itself will be its handling of WAAS and overall ability to get and hold a lock, which does differ from unit to unit. The satellites are sending out deliberately "inaccurate" signals, and no unit can be more accurate than the signals it is receiving. We are limited by the satellites, not the units. (Its similar to the megapixel myth in digital cameras, where the companies advertise more megapixels as producing better images for the internet. Image quality is limited by the DPI of the medium, not the MP of the camera. No one will ever push the limits of even a 6mp camera until printing 26" photos at 300dpi or larger.)