BurqueSahara

Now I know what Garmin thinks of version 2.70. I was so frustrated with my Vista HCx (purchased in February, and had many phone and email conversations about it with cust. serv since then) that I convinced the customer service guy to give me an RMA number to send it in for replacement. Garmin sent me a new Vista HCx with an OLDER serial number than the one I sent it. Funny thing is that the service report says "Unit passes all testing and is within operation limits." So, the first thing I did was check the software...and they sent it with 2.20/2.30 So, even Garmin doesn't trust newer software versions, I guess. I'm going to upgrade the software and do the hard reset and then go test it next week.

When I called them last month, I asked for a reference number so that I wouldn't have to repeat all of the symptoms and answer all of the same questions the next time I called. I was told that there was no such reference number and no way to track a problem from call to call. During the call, however, I heard them typing something in the background. (Maybe they're just playing a really fun computer game and can't be bothered by callers.) So, then I decided I would email Garmin so that all of the previous replies would be recorded in the text. This is fine, except that you have to wait 2-5 days before they reply to the email. And if they answer the wrong question, or even if they don't read the previous emails, you can get an answer that you've already tried. It is frustrating either way. I sure wish they would come join the forum. We'd all like to help them get the problem figured out. It is in our best interest and theirs. Too bad they can't see that.

Hiked this weekend with some friends so we had a 60CSx and 2 Vista HCx units running 2.60/2.60 One Vista had never had custom maps loaded and hadn't experienced the position bug yet. My Vista has had both (see earlier posts). We saw the position bug a bunch of times. My friend had his Vista set up to never use the backlight, whereas my backlight comes on with a button push. We noticed that my Vista was keeping better position than his, so I suggested he power cycle the unit. He didn't push the power button for long enough, so the backlight came on AND HIS ACCURACY IMPROVED! After that, anytime his accuracy began to degrade, he activated the backlight and the accuracy got better. It seemed like his accuracy didn't improve as much as when he power cycled, but there isn't a way to test that, so it is just a guess from comparing the numbers on the 3 units. This problem seems like an integrator error problem where error just continues to build up until something causes it to reset. I wish Garmin would take this seriously.

When I called Garmin, I was very frustrated that they didn't even have a way to track my call. If I call again, I have to explain the whole thing over again to a new service rep. I thought that I'd try the email service instead. It took them 5 days to respond. They said that I'd corrupted the software somehow and that I needed to do a hard reset of the unit and to download new software (though I'm running 2.6/2.6 - factory installed). It seems like they have either have no usable problem tracking system in place, or else, as the previous poster mentioned, they aren't going to admit it until they have a fix.

It is my understanding from other forum posters, that the firmware cannot be downgraded, only the software. So, it seems that you may get to join our misery. However, for whatever reason, not everybody has experienced it, so maybe you'll be fortunate. Can't say really since we don't know what is causing it all.

Yes, Garmin is trying to point the finger that way when you contact Customer support, but several of the previous posts have confirmed that they've seen the problem when using Topo2008, CityNav NA NT. So, while it seems like an easy target, I think the evidence points somewhere else.

In case any Garmin folks are trying to understand the problem following TopherAC's call to cust.serv., here's an updated summary of the variables. Potential causes of the problem...please update the list if you have information: low speed navigation - confirmed- low speed in all instances reported electronic compass interference - eliminated - occurs with electronic compass on or off backlight interference - maybe WAAS - eliminated - occurs with WAAS on or off challenging conditions - eliminated - users have experienced it in the open non-Garmin maps - eliminated - happens with Topo2008, CityNav NA 08/09, Garmin MG NA7, and custom specific to 2.6/2.6 - confirmed - both from webupdate and direct from factory Time/cumulative error - maybe - many have seen it happen after time on the trail SD card size - eliminated - 2GB down to 256MB card provided with unit Track Log on - maybe - Many have had the track log on, don't know about everybody Model - occuring on the Colorado and the Vista HCx expandable (x) - maybe (H)igh sensitivity - maybe Terrain - seems prettyvariable among those posting Any others?

My Info: Vista HCx purchased May, 2008 2.60/2.60 factory loaded WAAS enabled 256MB SD card (from factory) Electronic compass on Backlight on with button pushes Maps: Topo 2008 and custom Problem was seen on top of a ridge - mostly open hiking, but worst was under light tree cover on the side of a hill

Can somebody confirm that they have seen this problem while using a Garmin provided map (topo 2008, city navigator, or basemap)? Garmin tech support is quick to blame the problem on custom maps if you're running them. Seems like the map should have nothing to do with it, but they got hung up there. Has anybody seen the problem with the electronic compass turned off? Potential causes of the problem...please update the list if you have information: low speed navigation - confirmed electronic compass interference - maybe backlight interference - maybe WAAS - eliminated challenging conditions - maybe non-Garmin maps - maybe specific to 2.6/2.6 - confirmed others? Don't know about the rest of you, but my HCx is dangerously close to being returned to the store. I didn't buy a high accuracy GPSr with the intention of having to power cycle it to maintain my high accuracy.

On our hike, it may have been true that the error was worse when the conditions were more challenging. The worst point was hiking up a steep slope with some tree cover. But even at that time, my friend's 60CSx accuracy reading was still below 20ft. I agree that the indoor test that I proposed earlier isn't optimal. For me, the problem appeared t be cumulative, getting worse as the hike went on. I don't have the time to go on 7 hour hikes very often, so I was hoping to get the time element included by having it inside. However, your concerns about reflections etc. are quite valid and must be considered. I hope somebody can figure this problem out soon.

I just got a Vista HCx (preloaded with 2.6/2.6) and was hiking this weekend. The unit started out tracking exactly with our progress, but as we went further, the error of our position increased. This was especially noticeable at waypoints that were physical objects (switchbacks, trail intersections, etc.). We were comparing with my friend's 60CSx and his was right on using the same waypoints. The accuracy also changed from 12ft at the beginning to 250ft by mile 13 and the electronic compass was going berserk flipping back and forth(and yes, I was holding it horizontally and walking in a straight line). We had 10-11 satellites the whole time with most being WAAS (and WAAS was enabled). We were up high on a mountain ridge and the satellite strength stayed with full bars for at least 7 satellites the whole time. I talked to Garmin and they got hung up on my custom map and were no help. Since then, several of us have started some tests. I have left the unit recording tracks on my desk for each of the past 3 nights. With the electronic compass on and calibrated, the track wanders less than 30 feet over night. With the electronic compass on, but not calibrated, the track wanders over 300ft over night. Next tests will be run with the electronic compass turned off and then I hope to repeat the tests during 1 hour walks. Why would the electronic compass have any effect on the GPS's reported location and track? Isn't lat/long the same independent of any changes in some electronic compass?