Bubba Cache

AGAIN, the point of this thread is not to hear how everyone hates virtuals or loves them. It was to address inconsistencies in approvers when it came to caches LIKE virtuals. Some allow, some don't. Even tho both follow the same guidelines. quote: "We're glad that cache types are listed since we avoid the virtuals as if they were the Plague." from mckee. That is why they are listed like that. You choose not to find them, I do sometimes. Is it fair that your opinion and others means I get no choic ein the matter? mckee, you opinion is very important. Even tho we seem to be on different sides of the fence, we can agree to disagree,. (Boy, does the world need to learn that lesson) I have never been to a virtual that I can get the answer to prove the find from 200 feet away. I have NEVER seen a virtual on this site that was "a view". canadazuuk, I am sure that if the approver's got overloaded, then Jeremy could ask others to act as such. I also don't see a problem with "virtuals" or any type cache become "more numerous", as you put it. Isn't that the nature of this sport, TO GROW? And as long as it doesn't cause you harm (you don't look for virtuals) why is it a big deal for virtuals to be allowed for others. Are those who hate virtuals saying that their opinion is the right one and should become the standard? I appreciate you clarifying what the rules say. But again, that is a mundane point considering that is NOT the focus of this thread. I have never found, nor do I hope to find a virtual that is a "view" or just a "trail". The last point you quoted is the sticking point: A virtual cache must be novel, of interest to other players, and have a special historic, community or geocaching quality that sets it apart from everyday subjects. Some, including myself, feel there is inconsistecy in this department. Thats all. Depending on what approver you get, will determine if your virtual gets placed or not. BOTTOM LINE: we could go on and on in the debate over virtuals and their validity to geocaching. Even if virtuals were abolished, I would keep on caching and chatting with you guys. Would I be upset, a little because a compromise was not achieved. But either they are allowed and the rules used by ALL approvers consistently, do away with them, or make them seperate. God bless you and your family, Team Bubba Cache

Boy, did I open a can of worms. I am happy that the thread has continued in a "mostly" tactful tone. I feel it is good for those who disagree with the appearant policy of "virtual caches" being frowned upon to voice your opinion. Several of you, who have e-mailed me, have stated that you stray away from posting because of a "backlash" from other geocachers. However, voices must be heard. This post was concerning the CONSISTENCY of the approval process, virtuals or traditional. My BIGGEST argument is, and I AM NOT ALONE ON THIS, is the following: Re-write the guidelines to fit your policy. In no place does it say "ask before you place a virtual cache". In no place does it state that virtual caches aren't as good as a "McToy filled tubberware box". If you wish to focus on traditional caches only, then let the guidelines reflect that. There are guidelines for placing a "virtual cache" on your site yet I have now learned that in some cases the "approvers" will not allow one. Then why have these guidelines. Either allow them fully or don't allow them at ALL. Don't ride the fence with these issues. All I am asking is be consistent ACROSS THE BOARD. Not left up to each approver. This would even take some pressure off of them. Please also remember, we are all different, we like different things in life, and different stuff makes us happy. Some of us do like virtual caches. I teach history and so I really like finding a cool historical spot. It is NOT fair that someone who has been caching longer than I, who doesn't care for the historic marker, take it away from me and others who share my opinion. There is an obvious rift on this issue. I stand as the first one to post here, but NOT the lone voice saying, "We want consistancy!" There have even been suggestions as to how to fix the problem. 1. Make virtuals like benchmarks. 2. Do away with virtuals all together. 3. Make the guidelines for virtuals state the real policy. 4. Fix the guidelines to allow virtuals, but make the form more detailed for the approver's benefit. Let's all be thankful that this site allows different opinions, even bad ones (Unlike the Magellan site from what I have heard). Be grateful to Jeremy and others who keep Geocaching.com up and running, and improving it from time to time. Where else would we go. God bless you and your family, Team Bubba Cache

Actually, this thread's topic isn't virtuals - it's about consistency in approving all caches. And, if I can figure out how to make this artist's statue a multi-cache I will, which I already said. However, this is in the middle of the highest traffic part of a college campus and there are no benches or the like to put something under. As for liking or disliking virtuals, to each his own. Some of us like them though. Also, think of this - many caches aren't handicapped accessible so virtuals might be the only caches a handicapped cacher can get to. I'm just saying there are many ways to look at it. Plus, if virtual caches are part of the whole "geocaching" sport - then it really doesn't matter who likes them and who doesn't. Sooooo... Like I said before, let's move past the statue topic and back to the main topic which is the consistency in approval issue. God bless you and your family, Team Bubba Cache

OK, MINE was a statue, butthat is really missing the point. I was just wondering why depending on what approver you get, the same cache may be approved, may not. Let's get off the "statue thing". I have gotten 5 e-mails in the last hour from people who do back me Mtn-Man, so I am not alone. Don't ask me why they don't post. Just because we disagree with each other doesn't mean we don't respect each other. God bless you and your family, Team Bubba Cache

And solohiker, don't beat Mtn-Man into submission, no one would be there to approve man!!! God bless you and your family, Team Bubba Cache

Mtn-man, your reading my mind!!! Unless I told you before. Working on a multi with that statue in mind. If I am thinking about a virtual, do I run it by you first? And hey, a 20 foot hand in the middle of the cowboy town of Montevalle is unique, LOL. "so it appears that it might not be that interesting afterall." Man does that sound like a POO POO God bless you and your family, Team Bubba Cache

To be honest with you too, I LOVE traditional ones better. Hey, I can always use the Mctoy for my 18 month old caching buddy. This cahce of mine that was to be virtual, was on a college campus, a well-groomed college campus. and a tubberware dish would prob. be a NO-NO. Lets say I had an idea for a virtual one (gong to try to stick to traditionals but, you never know) who do I run the idea by first? God bless you and your family, Team Bubba Cache

Solohiker, LOVEd the beating into submission, but if I did that, I would nevre get one apporved. Jeremy, thanks for the advice man, will do next time, LOL. The cache I am refering to is:The Good Fight GCA491 I am not saying can this one, don't get me wrong. I am going by the info that the "grandfathering" were caches before Sept. 2002??? God bless you and your family, Team Bubba Cache

This was posted on the General Board: "Hello. I am in my 7th month of caching and still LOVE IT!!!!. I want to do things the right way in what ever I do, even when I have problems. I have been reading Hawk Eyes post in the "Southern Board" concerning his caches being archived. I had a similar problem last month with a virtual on a college campus. I will speak for myself only, NOT Hawk Eye. There needs to be some consistency to the criteria by which the "approvers" approve caches. I really don't think I am alone in this opinion. I have talked with several other cachers and read post on this site that suggest the same. I understand that the "approvers" volunteer and commend them for this. But the fact remains that some of them allow certain types of caches while others do not. Cache A may be archived because of one reason and a cacher can find another cache, almost identical, that was allowed (NOT grandfathered in). Myself, I get sooooo pumped when I get a new cache idea and place one (virtual, or traditional). I spend time thinking about it, making sure it is appropriate. I can accept my cache being archived for legitimate reasons, hey no one but Christ was perfect. My cache was archived because the approver didn't find it "interesting", had never heard of the artist, and that there were lots of artwork around town. Isn't this the opinion of the approver? Is he the only one that will find this cache? What I think is interesting, could others not feel the same? I feel as Hawk Eye does, there needs to be some type of check sheet for caches. If it meets all the requirements, then it is approved. Opinions should NOT enter the decision making process because everyone has a different one. I am,by no means, leaving geocaching because of a few. I love it too much. I just want fairness in an unfair world. The rules should be as close to "black and white" as possible. To me finding caches is half the fun, the other half is hiding some so others may find. If artwork is not a good virtual cache then so be it, but be that way across the board. We found a cache 3 days before we tried to have this one approved (same 100 mile area) that was 4 words on a marble wall with water running over it?????? How is that more interesting than mine. INCONSISTENCY. Please let me know how I can help with this issue in anyway. I was always told "Don't whine about a problem unless you have a way to fix it!" It wasn't my idea but Hawk Eye's, create a more detailed form that addresses all the rules for those who wish to "place" a cache. If it meets all those requirments, it gets approved. I would say 90% of the cachers put lots of thought into a cache before they try to place it. Bursting one's bubble only takes the wind out of our sails. You can't blame people for getting discouraged. Thanks a TON" Hang in there Hawk Eye. I understand your point. But stay with it and work to find a solution. I liked your idea about a more detailed form for potential caches. God bless you and your family, Team Bubba Cache

Hello. I am in my 7th month of caching and still LOVE IT!!!!. I want to do things the right way in what ever I do, even when I have problems. I have been reading Hawk Eyes post in the "Southern Board" concerning his caches being archived. I had a similar problem last month with a virtual on a college campus. I will speak for myself only, NOT Hawk Eye. There needs to be some consistency to the criteria by which the "approvers" approve caches. I really don't think I am alone in this opinion. I have talked with several other cachers and read post on this site that suggest the same. I understand that the "approvers" volunteer and commend them for this. But the fact remains that some of them allow certain types of caches while others do not. Cache A may be archived because of one reason and a cacher can find another cache, almost identical, that was allowed (NOT grandfathered in). Myself, I get sooooo pumped when I get a new cache idea and place one (virtual, or traditional). I spend time thinking about it, making sure it is appropriate. I can accept my cache being archived for legitimate reasons, hey no one but Christ was perfect. My cache was archived because the approver didn't find it "interesting", had never heard of the artist, and that there were lots of artwork around town. Isn't this the opinion of the approver? Is he the only one that will find this cache? What I think is interesting, could others not feel the same? I feel as Hawk Eye does, there needs to be some type of check sheet for caches. If it meets all the requirements, then it is approved. Opinions should NOT enter the decision making process because everyone has a different one. I am,by no means, leaving geocaching because of a few. I love it too much. I just want fairness in an unfair world. The rules should be as close to "black and white" as possible. To me finding caches is half the fun, the other half is hiding some so others may find. If artwork is not a good virtual cache then so be it, but be that way across the board. We found a cache 3 days before we tried to have this one approved (same 100 mile area) that was 4 words on a marble wall with water running over it?????? How is that more interesting than mine. INCONSISTENCY. Please let me know how I can help with this issue in anyway. I was always told "Don't whine about a problem unless you have a way to fix it!" It wasn't my idea but Hawk Eye's, create a more detailed form that addresses all the rules for those who wish to "place" a cache. If it meets all those requirments, it gets approved. I would say 90% of the cachers put lots of thought into a cache before they try to place it. Bursting one's bubble only takes the wind out of our sails. You can't blame people for getting discouraged. Thanks a TON God bless you and your family, Team Bubba Cache [This message was edited by Bubba Cache on August 13, 2003 at 08:44 AM.]

Greetings everyone. I haven't forgotten about the "get together". Joe frog and I talked about it back in June. It was really Jeff35080's idea, we just wanted to volunteer our services to him to help get this gathering going. I figure we all are just waiting to cooler temps and less TICKS. I have noticed that the amount of caching has dwindled during the summer. Since this is my first year to be involved with the sport, I just figured this was natural and that fall and spring are peak caching seasons. Jeff mentioned he wanted to wait after little league season and that he was going to plan a schedule. Let me know what I can do to help. Feel free to e-mail me. God bless you and your family, Team Bubba Cache

I am truly sorry. I have thought all along that I have e-mailed you. Mrs LC Cache even asked me if I had and I said yes, but as I have gone back to look at "sent items" in Outlook, I see no such e-mail. SORRY . She tells me some times that I have a "paw paw" mind, no offense (I have a paw paw). Heads up to mtn-man: The cache will be set out here, we will adopt it but we will put it as ridgesoarer's cache. Look for it in the next few weeks. God bless you and your family, Team Bubba Cache

I would say that Geocaching has a few rewards: 1. My wife and 17 month old spend quality time together if we all go or just me and my wife, we get to have "no kids time" (those parents understand) 2. We see things that we would have otherwise never known they were there. Exploring, like when you were a kid. 3. You do find some caches that have really cool stuff in them. 4. Finding TRAVEL BUGS, which i LOVE!!!!! Hang in there, it's a worthy sport. God bless you and your family, Team Bubba Cache

This one is on the campus of Montevallo. I am just afraid that it would be discovered. Believe me, I prefer caches that are traditional, then micros, then virtual. There is ALOT of foot traffic by this one. I may go back and look this weekend or next to see ifthere is any way I can disguise a micro. I recently got alot of ideas on disguising caches from a previous post. Thanks again. God bless you and your family, Team Bubba Cache

Sorry, I believe time expired on me. So to continue.... Quoted from this website - "A virtual cache must be novel, of interest to other players, and have a special historic, community or geocaching quality that sets it apart from everyday subjects. Items that would be in a coffee table book are good examples." My cache is novel or unique, I am sure it will interest some, the community it is in does take pride in this site and it is special to them. Please tell me where I am wrong. If I am, I will admit it. God bless you and your family, Team Bubba Cache

Please note that this is by NO MEANS a slap to mtn-man. I just happen to disagree with him. I appreciate all those who volunteer their time to proof the caches befor ethey go public. It is just that I feel I have followed the rules and therefore the cache should be approved. Here's the whole story including the cache description This is the cache description: "This place holds a ton of my best memories. Make sure you look around before leaving. This "cache" is brand new. It is very symbolic to its location. Not something you see everyday. To confirm your visit, e-mail me what is etched into the statue, at the very bottom. NOT on the pedestal, but on the statue itself. A great place to "plan your future". Considered by some to be extremely haunted, has a cemetary on it (you'll understand why this is odd when you get there), was all-female at one point, oldest homecoming tradition in the US, BEAUTIFUL esp during the fall." My question is what rule did I break. Mtn-man says virtuals must be unique. Has he ever been to mine? How does he know it's not unique? I asked him in an e-mail what I could add to help it pass. He just said there were hundreds of statues in Atlanta and everyone of them couldn't have a cache. I live in Birmingham, there aren't hundreds of them here, I guess we are art backwards, LOL. My points are: Should an "approver's" ( i guess that is the title, not sure)opinion influence their decision? If I have followed all rules, shouldn't my cache be approved. I feel this statue is unique, heck its a pair of 18 foot hands. I have only put out 2 other caches so it's not like I place a thousand dumb ones out. I don't want to whine, I just don't want to have to have someone else shut my cache down because our taste are different. Rules are posted, I follow them when I put out a cache. Qouted from this website but is it fair to let others decide what is God bless you and your family, Team Bubba Cache

If a cache you put out has been archived, and you feel it was unfair, is there anyway to appeal it? God bless you and your family, Team Bubba Cache

Where is the View by state map??????? I REALLY used that esp. when we went on trips to search along routes. God bless you and your family, Team Bubba Cache

Me - High school history and law teacher 9-12 Wife - Coordinates research of new drugs against HIV/AIDS and Anthrax. Joshua - 16 month old critic for the Wiggles, Stanley, PB&J Otter, and a gost of other childrens shows. God bless you and your family, Team Bubba Cache

We seem to have got off tangent, but ahh, who cares. I have read that those with high IQ's can't spell worth a crap. Seeing as how I spelled everything right, I guess I am dumb, LOL. God bless you and your family, Team Bubba Cache

I have hit a few multis inthe past few weeks and most were just the coords to the next one, one was MATH rpoblems to figure out the final coords (ARRRGGGHHHH, I teach history because I HATE math). I want to place one out in the area I live in. What do cachers like most: math, hints or just gimme the coords to the next stop? Also, What are some cool multi ones you have come across, as afr as the clues to get to the final one? God bless you and your family, Team Bubba Cache

quote: I have a good friend who is a charter member of the Georgia Geocaching Society. He keeps encouraging me to get one rolling over here.What do you guys think about it? I actually thought about that today when I read a forum thread on caching clubs that had websites. My brother-in-law works on networks for Southtrust and knows computers fowards and backwards. I am sure he has acess to webspace and I speak for both of us (we were discussing this 3 weeks ago as well) we would love to help create a group here in central Alabama. God bless you and your family, Team Bubba Cache

I believe Northern Lights meant the items in your cache would be pre-made microo caches. The finders would get on eof these micros and THEY would place them out. At least thats how I percieved it. God bless you and your family, Team Bubba Cache

You are a man after my own heart. We both like the Travel Bug game. Come and get it. I kinda owe you one anyway, LOL. Haven't heard from jeff, so I don't have any new info on the get together. Let me know if you do. If he is too busy, maybe we (you. me, theviolas)can. See ya on the trails. God bless you and your family, Team Bubba Cache

I think most of us who hide caches, want to go that "step above" in the way we hide caches. What are some of the cool ways you have seen caches hidden. I myself have seen caches that had magnets glued to them and under benches or the one that was tied to a rope and slung over a limb. God bless you and your family, Team Bubba Cache