GEO WALKER

A quick scan of the Mid-Atlantic Forum (where this information actually belongs) would have revealed that we are quite aware: What's going on with PA DCNR?, A fee to Geocache in PA State Parks True... but are any of us who create and find EC's also aware of this? Keep in mind there are a number of EC's in PA State Parks. I was originally informed of this issue through the PAGA website by a member of NWPA, Erie Geocachcers. Therefore, as a common courtesy I feel a post here would help inform the EC Bunch…

I have sent, by email, my "letter of discontent" to PA DCNR’s Director of Office of Education, Communication, and Partnership to Gretchen Leslie and my State Senator. I have also posted this as a topic on the Earthcache Form. Many EC's are in State Parks.

Just a FYI here... I'm not sure if any of you are aware of or are affected/effected by a recent but quite insertion to the PA STATE PARK Geocaching Guidelines which now include a $25 administration fee. http://www.dcnr.state.pa.us/geocaching.aspx Caches placed in State Park lands require an administrative fee of $25.00. This fee is used to cover the costs associated with approving the cache site, including the PNDI review and processing the necessary paperwork. I sent my "letter of discontent" to: PA DCNR Director of Education, Communications and Partnerships: Gretchen Leslie gleslie@state.pa.us http://www.dcnr.state.pa.us/info/ataglance/index.aspx and my local State Senator http://www.legis.state.pa.us/cfdocs/legis/home/find.cfm

Great idea on the challeneg - perhaps this could be the new level then - 5 or 10 EC's in a single state/country? That sounds very resonable to me...

My guess would be the element of Cartography is far stronger in geology than say archeology. As an older Geologist, I remember doing ALL mapping by hand. With the introduction of Geographical Information Systems a.k.a. GIS, cartography and be done and edited in a matter of days, minutes and seconds rather than months & weeks. GPS is a fantastic means of folding in field data, and changes to that data, into a GIS. The USGS has converted a good bit of their data to an electronic format and GSA being a professional organization with many of its members using this type of informational format it just seems a natural fit. My interest in Geocaching as well as Earthcaching is a direct result due to being a professional w/a background in GIS. Of course this is what I’m seeing… but then again I may be wrong????

I have a BS in Geology (79) and an MS in Earth Science (06) from California University, a small university in SW PA, locally referred to as "Harvard on the Mon". I also have 28+ years experience w/the PA Dept. of Environmental Protection. Hey what can I say... I like field trips!

I concure, Been There, Done That, and Had Fun... I'm also looking at an Esker out my way.

Congrats and best of luck on reaching 100...

"EarthCaches should highlight a unique feature. EarthCaches that duplicate existing EarthCache information about the site or related sites may be rejected. EarthCaches should be developed to provide a unique experience to the visitor to the region. Multiple EarthCaches on the same feature should be avoided and content rather than proximity will be the guiding principle. What this means is that some Earth science features have been covered so many times that new EarthCache submissions on the same content may be rejected. Examples of content which falls into this are (and not limited to) : River gauging stations - in the US there already is a considerable number of these. Glacial erratics Waterfalls - where the content is about classification It is up to the EarthCache developer to look at the other EarthCaches in the wider area before starting development. I would also suggest a friendly email to the EC reviewers checking if you are unsure would work as well." Is there a general rule of thumb, for the geograpical zone/distance concerning EC saturation? Some folks will and others will not travel distances for any cache...

I agree... But if you can I also agree w/offseting the micro to prevent the icon stacking on the map. Sometimes one is seen the other not... If not you could mention the other cache in both cache pages.

I'd rather help than giggle... Here are a couple of useful links from the PA Geological Survey: http://www.dcnr.state.pa.us/topogeo/field/index.aspx http://www.dcnr.state.pa.us/topogeo/pub/pa...geolonline.aspx http://www.dcnr.state.pa.us/topogeo/pub/pgspub.aspx I would imagine that other States here in the USA would have something similar. So check the Geologic Surveys w/in the State. They are usually associated w/ Departments of Natural Recourses or sometimes Environmental Resources. Hope this helps???

The main reason I figure is that "public lands" although public are "managed" by some other entity. The permission ensures that the care and consideration given to the area [plant life wildlife particularlly endanged etc.] is taken into consideration upon approval. I also can see a certain "professionalism" via GSA being applied to this approach. All in all it is a sound environmental approach...

I sent you an email w/the link...

Just for the record, I received Platinum Earthcache Master back in September 2007. Thanks to everyone’s interest and participation, I am still enjoying them.

Based on my experience as well as many others, you’ll find the “coexistence” of physical caches and earthcaches will be welcomed.

The educational aspect of an Earthcache separates it form traditional caches. It’s one thing to “show” someone an interesting place it’s another to “educate” them on what they see. As a result, I see no need to place a distance requirement among caches that by their very nature are distinctly different. This all seems very “petty” to me. What is the real reason for the unwillingness to share space?

I see your point, but the submission guidelines on Earthcache.org do indicate that, rightly or wrongly, their definition of Earth Science doesn't really include Biology. While general definitions of "Earth Science" often embrace Biology, Earthcache.org's big partner is the Geological Society of America - hence the focus on geology. If you really feel strongly about using geocaching to teach people about ecology, then start something like "ecocaching." Or just put out Multi-caches that require cachers to learn about ecology in order to find the final cache location. Or just buck up and add the requisite information about the island formation to your Earthcache, whether or not you think it's interesting. "Rightly or Wrongly" While I had this "go around" a couple of years ago w/GSA. I wonder why the "Teacher's Guideline" EarthCaching — An Educator's Guide doesn't correct the over use of term "Earth Science" and the "restricted application" of only "Geology" to Earthcaches. In essence just what are we teaching furture generations?

You might want to look into coastal geomorphological features?

Here's an interesting EC w/a twist, Black as Coal, Orange as Water? GC1PQRC. Perhaps this approach may be what you're looking for. You may also want to check w/a local watershed group and see if they might be monitoring something that could be tested w/a pool kit. I personally like the idea of the "picture requirement"... Now that is sight specific... Hope this helps...

Boy this is a tough one… Is there any chance that there may be mineralization? Here in SW PA, coal mining has provided the dominant a orange or milky white color to stream and springs. Perhaps there may be a local historical reference to enjoying “healthy waters” or a Spa? If so, ask the cacher for their interpretation of the importance/non-importance of the health benefits and why is there a historical significance? This may be purely subjective but it does get the cacher thinking and involved.

Your approcah may frustrate some cachers. If you’re looking to vary the usual approach you may want to offer a multiple choice answers. I know a number of people who pick a particular type of cache and use that as a center point to cache in an area. Your suggested approach may not yeild that type of oppurtunity for those cachers. Remember the level of your audience and the fact that not everyone is thrilled by Puzzle Caches. Simplicity will yield more visits and better results from an educational standpoint. Personally if I was looking for variation I would provide the multiple choice questions..

I Agree… I see absolutely no sense in limiting the educational base thru a PM Status. To me it defeats the purpose of an EC and it sounds, or can be viewed, as being somewhat “elitist”. So let’s not take that path…

There are a few Archeological/Historical ECs that deal w/the Hopewell and Adena Cultures aka Mound builders in Ohio. Their references are of a lunar and astrological nature, which allow them to fall into the EC category. Any chance of that in this case?

I like the “signature character” idea. Most of my “self portraits” include me w/facial hair, sometimes a handle bar muzzy, sunglasses and a baseball cap so you don’t get see much anyway. Maybe I should find a Yosemite Sam Figure???

I Agree! This seems to defeat the purpose of EC’s, by limiting the educational audience. And it sounds [or could be viewed as] a bit too “elitist” for me...