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I, too have heard that story and told it more than once. I remember as a kid in the 60's seeing the TV commercials for the "Space Pen" that would write upside down or in weightlessness!! Wow!! But, this, from Wikipedia's entry on "Writing in Space": <Quote> "A common misconception states that, faced with the fact that ball-point pens would not write in zero-gravity, the Fisher Space Pen was devised as the result of millions of dollars of unnecessary spending on NASA's part when the Soviet Union took the simpler and cheaper route of just using pencils. In reality, the space pen was independently developed by Paul C. Fisher, founder of the Fisher Pen Company, with $1 million of his own funds.[1][2][3][4] NASA tested and approved the pen for space use, then purchased 400 pens at $6 per pen.[5] The Soviet Union subsequently also purchased the space pen for its Soyuz spaceflights." </Quote>

SURVEY MARK QUIZ CHALLENGE Below are questions for a fun quiz I have prepared. There are 40 questions, concerning U.S. Coast & Geodetic Survey, National Ocean Service, and National Geodetic Survey survey marks. Some questions should be easy, some hopefully informative, and some have best answers that may not be one’s first guess. Read all questions carefully. Rules: This is an open book quiz. The first three sets of answers received with 100% grades, win prizes. If there are less than three perfect papers by December 15th, then the three highest grades win, but all winners must have at least 70%. Submit all entries to George.leigh@noaa.gov , subject line “Quiz”. The winners, the correct answers, and the overall average score will be announced, individual scores will not be published. First prize will be a newly designed USC&GS T-shirt with a brass-colored Bench Mark on the front ( ) and the un-official USC&GS logo of an Eagle with a sextant on the back ( ). Second and third place prizes will be USC&GS 200th Anniversary lapel pins ( ). 1. In which time frame were the first survey disks set in the U.S. by any agency? A. 1810-1819, B, 1850-1859, C. 1870-1879, D. 1900-1909. 2. What is the definition of a bench mark? A. Any point in the Geocaching or National Geodetic Survey databases, B. Any survey disk, C. A mark with a known elevation above or below a certain datum, D. A brand of booze. 3. The Bilby Tower was first used in the year: A. 1870, B. 1900, C. 1917, D. 1927. 4. A “Base Line” is: A. A line between two survey points that is carefully measured for use on controlling the scale of triangulation, B. A line between two survey points that is carefully measured and used to calibrate electronic distance measuring instruments, C. Both of the above, D. Neither of the above. 5. Which if the following is not a standard height for a Bilby Tower: A. 37, B. 50, C. 63, D. 103. 6. Which of the following were used as survey marks by the USC&GS: A. Bottles, B. Wooden stakes, C. Nails, D. All of the above. 7. Which of the following types of USC&GS survey disks had arrows on them? A. Reference marks, B. Azimuth marks, C. Gravity reference marks, D. All of the above. 8. Which of the following were used to measure distances by the USC&GS/NGS? A. A chain, B. A rod in an ice bath, C. A laser, D. All of the above. 9. The first survey disks used by the USC&GS were: A. Flat on top, B. “Cup” shaped, C. Convex on top, D. None of the above. 10. A tower such as a church spire, radio mast, or water tank which has been surveyed is called a: A. Bench mark, B. Survey mark, C. Intersection station, D. None of the above. 11. Most USC&GS survey disks were set between the years: A. 1807 – Present B. 1880 – 1970 C. 1900 – 1970 D. 1910 – present. 12. National Ocean Survey (later National Ocean Service) disks were set to mark: A. Tidal bench marks, B. Third-order horizontal points for hydrographic surveys, C. Airport surveys, D. All of the above. 13. Reference marks are generally within ______ meters of the triangulation station. A. 10, B. 20, C. 30, D. 40. 14. USC&GS or NGS survey disks have been made of: A. Brass/bronze, B. Iron/steel, C. Aluminum, D. All of the above. 15. A USC&GS disk with a circle in the center could mark a: A. Topographic Station, B. Hydrographic Station, C. Bench Mark, D. All of the above. 16. The rarest USC&GS disk is probably the: A. Hexangle shaped Gravity disk, B. “Cup” shaped triangulation station disk, C. Magnetic station disk with 6-pointed star, D. Hexangle shaped Gravity reference mark disk. 17. Which of these is usually the only one with a horizontal position? A. MAGNETIC STATION, B. GRAVITY STATION, C. BENCH MARK, D. TOPOGRAPHIC STATION. 18. Which of these types of disks may have an underground mark beneath it? A. TRIANGULATION STATION, B. REFENCE MARK, C. AZIMUTH MARK, D. All of the above. 19. Survey disks are set: A. Above ground level, B. Below ground level, C. Flush with the ground, D. All of the above. 20. Which of the following types of disks do not have a blank spot for stamping the elevation? A. BENCH MARK with 3 crossed slashes, B. TRAVERSE STATION, C. USC&GS AND STATE SURVEY, D. GRAVITY STATION. 21. Which of the following symbols used in the center of a disk were not used on a BENCH MARK disk? A. Slash, B . Circle, C. Three crossed slashes, D. Triangle. 22. Which of these USC&GS disks did the NGS HORIZONTAL CONTROL MARK not replace? A. TOPOGRAPHIC STATION, B. HYDROGRAPHIC STATION, C. GRAVITY STATION, D. TRAVERSE STATION. 23. Which of these following disk symbols were used to mark horizontal control points? A. Triangle, B. Circle, C. Cross, D. All of the above. 24. When searching for a survey mark on a hill top, look for: A. Highest point, B. Point with best visibility around the horizon, C. Place where you would have set the mark, D. All of the above. 25. When looking for a bench mark (vertical point), consider: A. Mark spacing along the level line, B. Exposed bedrock, C. Clues in the Description, D. All of the above. 26. Which of the following is not true about Reference Marks? A. Disks have arrows pointing to the Triangulation Station, B. Marks usually less than 100 feet from the Station, C. Always higher than the Station, D. Station Description contains the distance and direction from the Station to the RMs. 27. Which of the following usually do not have an accurate horizontal position? A. GRAVITY STATION, B. MAGNETIC STATION, C. BENCH MARK, D. All of the above. 28. The most important factor in a close-up photograph of a survey mark: A., No debris covering mark, B. All stamping is clear and legible, C. Even lighting, D. Disk fills most of photo. 29. Which of the following is not needed when recovering a survey mark? A. Station Description, B. Hammer, C. Tape measure, D. Magnetic compass. 30. Which of the following is not a parameter for setting a concrete mark: A. Four feet deep, B. Twelve inches in diameter, C. Rebar placed in concrete, D. Collar or form used around top portion of mark. 31. Survey towers were made of: A. Steel, B. Wood, C. Aluminum, D. All of the above. 32. Which of the following can be used to measure horizontal angles: A. Transit, B. Sextant, C. Theodolite, D. All of the above. 33. Tools used to dig a hole for a concrete mark include: A. Auger, B. Post hole digger, C. Sharp-shooter shovel, D. All of the above. 34. The back of a survey disk might contain: A. A Stem for setting in a drill hole in bedrock or a large structure, B. A Tube for mounting on a buried rod, C. A Collar for mounting on a pipe, D. All of the above. 35. Which type of disk came in two shapes? A. MAGNETIC STATION, B. GRAVITY STATION, C. HYDROGRAPHIC STATION, D. None of the above. 36. During the 1950’s and 1960’s, the number of disks set at a Triangulation Station was usually: A. 3, B. 4, C. 5, D. 6. 37. For many years, the specified distance range from the Triangulation Station to the Azimuth Mark was: A. 30 meters to 3 miles, B. 100 meters to 3 miles, C. 1/4 mile to 2 miles, D. None of the above. 38. USC&GS disks were phased out of usage when NOAA was formed in: A. 1970, B. 1971, C. 1972, D. None of the above. 39. The NGS disk that did not replace a USC&GS disk: A. HORIZONTAL CONTROL MARK, B. VERTICAL CONTROL MARK, C. GRAVITY MARK, D. CALIBRATION BASE LINE. 40. The following types of aluminum logo caps were made (collar and lid to protect stainless steel rod marks): A. Vertical Control Mark, B. Geodetic control mark, C. Tidal Bench Mark, D. All of the above. Good Luck, GeorgeL NGS

About to go look for a couple benchmarks in Riverside CA area, and I noticed they are both listed as a "Gravity Station Disk". Anyone have any idea what that is, how it is used? Here they are: http://www.geocaching.com/mark/details.asp?PID=DX3592 http://www.geocaching.com/mark/details.asp?PID=DX3593

Thanks. A 'complete' datasheet for the second example is: The NGS Data Sheet See file dsdata.txt for more information about the datasheet. DATABASE = ,PROGRAM = datasheet, VERSION = 8.00 1 National Geodetic Survey, Retrieval Date = January 1, 2012 UA0024 *********************************************************************** UA0024 FBN - This is a Federal Base Network Control Station. UA0024 DESIGNATION - JEFFERSON PIER UA0024 PID - UA0024 UA0024 STATE/COUNTY- DC/DISTRICT OF COLUMBIA UA0024 COUNTRY - USA UA0024 USGS QUAD - WASHINGTON WEST (1983) UA0024 UA0024 *CURRENT SURVEY CONTROL UA0024 UA0024* NAD 83(2007) POSITION- 38 53 23.29463(N) 077 02 11.56258(W) ADJUSTED UA0024* NAD 83(2007) ELLIP HT- -25.045 (meters) (02/10/07) ADJUSTED UA0024* NAD 83(2007) EPOCH - 2002.00 (01/01/02) UA0024* NAVD 88 ORTHO HEIGHT - 7.020 (meters) 23.03 (feet) ADJUSTED UA0024* NAVD 88 EPOCH - 2006.81 UA0024 UA0024 NOTE: NAVD 88 ortho height was determined from prior model GEOID03. UA0024 NAD 83(2007) X - 1,115,141.472 (meters) COMP UA0024 NAD 83(2007) Y - -4,844,303.306 (meters) COMP UA0024 NAD 83(2007) Z - 3,982,786.811 (meters) COMP UA0024 LAPLACE CORR - -2.52 (seconds) DEFLEC09 UA0024 CURRENT GEOID HT- -32.06 (meters) GEOID09 UA0024 DYNAMIC HEIGHT - 7.016 (meters) 23.02 (feet) COMP UA0024 MODELED GRAVITY - 980,097.6 (mgal) NAVD 88 UA0024 UA0024 VERT ORDER - FIRST CLASS II UA0024 UA0024 FGDC Geospatial Positioning Accuracy Standards (95% confidence, cm) UA0024 Type Horiz Ellip Dist(km) UA0024 ----------------------------------------------------------------------- UA0024 NETWORK ACCURACY 0.31 0.25 UA0024 MEDIAN LOCAL ACCURACY AND DIST ( 44 points) 0.62 1.20 29.84 UA0024 ----------------------------------------------------------------------- UA0024 NOTE: Individual local accuracy values and other accuracy information UA0024 are available here. UA0024 UA0024.The horizontal coordinates were established by GPS observations UA0024.and adjusted by the National Geodetic Survey in February 2007. UA0024 UA0024.The datum tag of NAD 83(2007) is equivalent to NAD 83(NSRS2007). UA0024.See National Readjustment for more information. UA0024.The horizontal coordinates are valid at the epoch date displayed above. UA0024.The epoch date for horizontal control is a decimal equivalence UA0024.of Year/Month/Day. UA0024 UA0024.The orthometric height was determined by differential leveling and UA0024.adjusted in April 2010. UA0024 UA0024.Photographs are available for this station. UA0024 UA0024.The X, Y, and Z were computed from the position and the ellipsoidal ht. UA0024 UA0024.The Laplace correction was computed from DEFLEC09 derived deflections. UA0024 UA0024.The ellipsoidal height was determined by GPS observations UA0024.and is referenced to NAD 83. UA0024 UA0024.The current geoid height was determined by GEOID09. (remove sentence) UA0024 UA0024.The modeled gravity was interpolated from observed gravity values. UA0024 UA0024.The dynamic height is computed by dividing the NAVD 88 UA0024.geopotential number by the normal gravity value computed on the UA0024.Geodetic Reference System of 1980 (GRS 80) ellipsoid at 45 UA0024.degrees latitude (g = 980.6199 gals.). UA0024 UA0024.The modeled gravity was interpolated from observed gravity values. UA0024 UA0024.The following values were computed from [current datum/realization, e.g. NAD 83(2007)]. UA0024 UA0024; North East Units Scale Factor Converg. UA0024;SPC MD - 135,774.106 396,829.478 MT 0.99994988 -0 01 22.6 UA0024;SPC MD - 445,452.21 1,301,931.38 sFT 0.99994988 -0 01 22.6 UA0024;SPC VA N - 2,136,780.288 3,626,959.736 MT 0.99995965 +0 54 48.1 UA0024;SPC VA N - 7,010,419.99 11,899,450.40 sFT 0.99995965 +0 54 48.1 UA0024;UTM 18 - 4,306,519.398 323,370.814 MT 0.99998418 -1 16 44.1 UA0024 UA0024! - Elev Factor x Scale Factor = Combined Factor UA0024!SPC MD - 1.00000393 x 0.99994988 = 0.99995381 UA0024!SPC VA N - 1.00000393 x 0.99995965 = 0.99996358 UA0024!UTM 18 - 1.00000393 x 0.99998418 = 0.99998811 UA0024 UA0024|---------------------------------------------------------------------| UA0024| PID Reference Object Distance Geod. Az | UA0024| dddmmss.s | UA0024| HV4442 WASHINGTON MONUMENT 1913 119.205 METERS 10816 | UA0024|---------------------------------------------------------------------| UA0024 UA0024 SUPERSEDED SURVEY CONTROL UA0024 UA0024 ELLIP H (02/12/02) -25.021 (m) GP( ) 4 1 UA0024 NAD 83(1993)- 38 53 23.29439(N) 077 02 11.56216(W) AD( ) B UA0024 ELLIP H (06/29/94) -25.094 (m) GP( ) 4 1 UA0024 NAD 83(1993)- 38 53 23.29440(N) 077 02 11.56215(W) AD( ) B UA0024 ELLIP H (04/04/94) -25.094 (m) GP( ) 4 1 UA0024 NAD 27 - 38 53 22.89700(N) 077 02 12.64600(W) AD( ) 3 UA0024 USSD - 38 53 23.23000(N) 077 02 12.48000(W) AD( ) 3 UA0024 NAVD 88 (08/03/00) 7.02 (m) 23.0 (f) LEVELING 3 UA0024 NAVD 88 (05/07/99) 7.021 (m) 23.03 (f) UNKNOWN 1 2 UA0024 UA0024.Superseded values are not recommended for survey control. UA0024.NGS no longer adjusts projects to the NAD 27 or NGVD 29 datums. UA0024.See file dsdata.txt to determine how the superseded data were derived. UA0024 UA0024_U.S. NATIONAL GRID SPATIAL ADDRESS: 18SUJ2337006519(NAD 83) UA0024_MARKER: Z = SEE DESCRIPTION UA0024_SETTING: 7 = SET IN TOP OF CONCRETE MONUMENT UA0024_MARK LOGO: CGS UA0024_PROJECTION: PROJECTING 91 CENTIMETERS UA0024_MAGNETIC: N = NO MAGNETIC MATERIAL UA0024_STABILITY: C = MAY HOLD, BUT OF TYPE COMMONLY SUBJECT TO UA0024+STABILITY: SURFACE MOTION UA0024_SATELLITE: THE SITE LOCATION WAS REPORTED AS SUITABLE FOR UA0024+SATELLITE: SATELLITE OBSERVATIONS - May 21, 2010 UA0024 UA0024 HISTORY - Date Condition Report By UA0024 HISTORY - 1907 MONUMENTED CGS UA0024 HISTORY - 1907 GOOD CGS UA0024 HISTORY - 1940 GOOD CGS UA0024 HISTORY - 19930909 GOOD NGS UA0024 HISTORY - 19960718 GOOD DMW UA0024 HISTORY - 19980928 GOOD NGS UA0024 HISTORY - 19991122 GOOD NGS UA0024 HISTORY - 20000224 GOOD NGS UA0024 HISTORY - 20000330 GOOD NGS UA0024 HISTORY - 20000510 GOOD NGS UA0024 HISTORY - 20030515 GOOD DMW UA0024 HISTORY - 20051216 GOOD GEOCAC UA0024 HISTORY - 20061111 GOOD USPSQD UA0024 HISTORY - 20081222 GOOD NGS UA0024 HISTORY - 20090319 GOOD GEOCAC UA0024 HISTORY - 20100521 GOOD GEOCAC UA0024 UA0024 STATION DESCRIPTION UA0024 UA0024'DESCRIBED BY COAST AND GEODETIC SURVEY 1907 (OBF) UA0024'JEFFERSON PIER IS A CONCRETE POST ABOUT NW OF THE WASHINGTON UA0024'MONUMENT, VERY NEARLY IN THE LATITUDE OF THE CAPITOL DOME AND THE UA0024'LONGTITUDE OF THE WHITE HOUSE. UA0024 UA0024 STATION RECOVERY (1907) UA0024 UA0024'RECOVERY NOTE BY COAST AND GEODETIC SURVEY 1907 UA0024'RECOVERED IN GOOD CONDITION. UA0024 UA0024 STATION RECOVERY (1940) UA0024 UA0024'RECOVERY NOTE BY COAST AND GEODETIC SURVEY 1940 (TMP) UA0024'THIS STATION WAS RECOVERED. THIS STATION IS LOCATED ON THE W UA0024'SLOPE OF THE MOUND OF THE WASHINGTON MONUMENT, AND IS IN LINE UA0024'WITH 16TH STREET EXTENDED, AND IN APPROXIMATE RANGE WITH THE UA0024'N SIDE OF THE LINCOLN MEMORIAL. IT IS IN A DEPRESSION ABOUT 8 UA0024'INCHES BELOW THE LINCOLN MEMORIAL. IT IS IN A DEPRESSION ABOUT UA0024'8 INCHES BELOW THE GENERAL GROUND SURFACE AND ABOUT 15 FEET IN UA0024'DIAMETER. THE MARK IS ABOUT 2 FEET SQUARE AT BASE AND ABOUT 6 UA0024'INCHES SQUARE AT TOP AND EXTENDS ABOUT 2 FEET ABOVE GROUND. UA0024' UA0024'THIS MARK IS SAID TO HAVE BEEN RAISED FROM TIME TO TIME AS WORK UA0024'WAS DONE ON THE MONUMENT GROUNDS, BUT THE POSITION OF THE UA0024'STATION IS SUPPOSED TO HAVE BEEN HELD EACH TIME. UA0024 UA0024 STATION RECOVERY (1993) UA0024 UA0024'RECOVERY NOTE BY NATIONAL GEODETIC SURVEY 1993 UA0024'THE STATION IS LOCATED IN WASHINGTON, D.C., ON THE WASHINGTON MONUMENT UA0024'GROUNDS AT THE JEFFERSON PIER STONE WHICH LIES ON A LINE EXTENDING UA0024'BETWEEN THE WHITE HOUSE AND THE JEFFERSON MEMORIAL. OWNERSHIP--UNITED UA0024'STATES DEPARTMENT OF THE INTERIOR, NATIONAL PARK SERVICE. CONTACT UA0024'THE NATIONAL PARK SERVICE, TELEPHONE NUMBER (202) 485-9880. UA0024'THE STATION IS A BRASS PLUG WITH A PUNCH MARK, SET IN THE CENTER OF A UA0024'RECESSED CROSS IN THE TOP OF A 2 BY 2-FOOT GRANITE MONUMENT WHICH IS UA0024'INSCRIBED POSITION OF JEFFERSON PIER ERECTED DECEMBER 18, 1804, UA0024'RECOVERED AND RE-ERECTED DECEMBER 2, 1889, DISTRICT OF COLUMBIA AND UA0024'PROJECTS 26 INCHES ABOVE THE GROUND. UA0024'LOCATED 110 M (360.9 FT) WEST-NORTHWEST OF THE WASHINGTON MONUMENT AND UA0024'13.0 M (42.7 FT) SOUTH OF THE SOUTH EDGE OF A 15-FOOT WIDE CONCRETE UA0024'WALKWAY. UA0024'NOTE--PERMISSION MUST BE OBTAINED FROM THE NATIONAL PARK SERVICE TO UA0024'OCCUPY THIS STATION. UA0024 UA0024 STATION RECOVERY (1996) UA0024 UA0024'RECOVERY NOTE BY DAFT MCCUNE WALKER INCORPORATED 1996 (JMS) UA0024'RECOVERED AS DESCRIBED. UA0024 UA0024 STATION RECOVERY (1998) UA0024 UA0024'RECOVERY NOTE BY NATIONAL GEODETIC SURVEY 1998 (RLA) UA0024'RECOVERED AS DESCRIBED. UA0024 UA0024 STATION RECOVERY (1999) UA0024 UA0024'RECOVERY NOTE BY NATIONAL GEODETIC SURVEY 1999 (RWA) UA0024'RECOVERED AS DESCRIBED. UA0024 UA0024 STATION RECOVERY (2000) UA0024 UA0024'RECOVERY NOTE BY NATIONAL GEODETIC SURVEY 2000 (MLM) UA0024'RECOVERED BY NATIONAL GEODETIC SURVEY, RECOVERED AS PREVIOUSLY UA0024'DESCRIBED. UA0024 UA0024 STATION RECOVERY (2000) UA0024 UA0024'RECOVERY NOTE BY NATIONAL GEODETIC SURVEY 2000 (RWA) UA0024'RECOVERED AS DESCRIBED. UA0024 UA0024 STATION RECOVERY (2000) UA0024 UA0024'RECOVERY NOTE BY NATIONAL GEODETIC SURVEY 2000 (RWA) UA0024'RECOVERED AS DESCRIBED. UA0024 UA0024 STATION RECOVERY (2003) UA0024 UA0024'RECOVERY NOTE BY DAFT MCCUNE WALKER INCORPORATED 2003 (JMS) UA0024'RECOVERED IN GOOD CONDITION. UA0024 UA0024 STATION RECOVERY (2005) UA0024 UA0024'RECOVERY NOTE BY GEOCACHING 2005 (WD) UA0024'THE PIER NOW LIES INSIDE A NEW PAVED PATH AND RETAINING WALL THAT UA0024'CIRCLES THE WASHINGTON MONUMENT, ABOUT 60 FEET SOUTHEAST OF THE UA0024'INTERSECTION OF THREE PAVED ACCESS PATHS AND THE CIRCULAR PATH, AND UA0024'ABOUT THREE FEET HIGHER THAN THE CIRCULAR PATH. UA0024 UA0024 STATION RECOVERY (2006) UA0024 UA0024'RECOVERY NOTE BY US POWER SQUADRON 2006 (DEB) UA0024'RECOVERED IN GOOD CONDITION. UA0024 UA0024 STATION RECOVERY (2008) UA0024 UA0024'RECOVERY NOTE BY NATIONAL GEODETIC SURVEY 2008 (DBC) UA0024'RECOVERED AS DESCRIBED. UA0024 UA0024 STATION RECOVERY (2009) UA0024 UA0024'RECOVERY NOTE BY GEOCACHING 2009 (SMC) UA0024'RECOVERED IN GOOD CONDITION. UA0024 UA0024 STATION RECOVERY (2010) UA0024 UA0024'RECOVERY NOTE BY GEOCACHING 2010 (MTT) UA0024'RECOVERED IN GOOD CONDITION. Again, I haven't test this on my program yet, as my code for it is at home. I believe that v2.0 didn't use RegEx for some of the strings, instead using absolute positioning. I think that will mess up the code that grabs the coordinates from the sheet. (And, obviously, it will ignore the 'Country' designation.)

False "Found" online logs really does take the fun from the game and defying to purpose of the game by getting outdoors. My logs are embarrassing for the time I joined in '15 till now, with only 106 finds. I am not one to falsify logs just to collect smileys. I always record my DNF for the reason that might tell the co that the cache might have been moved by the last finder or the cache might be stolen. Or I may just be to stupid to find it. As for logs, I do check against my online logs compared to written logs. There were a couple I had suspicions on. Found some did actually sign the log. Found one that hit all four of my caches, plus both of my geo partner's caches in one day including another cache over 100 miles away. He logs on the computer but never signed any of the physical paper logs. I also found where finders signed the paper log but haven't logged it on computer. However, Some finds, signs the paper log, then record it on computer a week or two later. I notice 2 finders did that just this morning.

Could be this one except that the stamping is supposed to be 'ASTRONOMICAL STATION' - it is destroyed, however.. TT1521 *********************************************************************** TT1521 DESIGNATION - ASTRONOMICAL STATION TT1521 PID - TT1521 TT1521 STATE/COUNTY- AK/VALDEZ-CORDOVA CENSUS TT1521 COUNTRY - US TT1521 USGS QUAD - VALDEZ D-4 TT1521 TT1521 *CURRENT SURVEY CONTROL TT1521 ______________________________________________________________________ TT1521* NAD 83(1986) POSITION- 61 57 16.08712(N) 145 18 13.67771(W) ADJUSTED TT1521* NAVD 88 ORTHO HEIGHT - 314.413 (meters) 1031.54 (feet) ADJUSTED TT1521 ______________________________________________________________________ TT1521 LAPLACE CORR - -0.49 (seconds) DEFLEC12A TT1521 GEOID HEIGHT - 13.95 (meters) GEOID12A TT1521 DYNAMIC HEIGHT - 314.837 (meters) 1032.93 (feet) COMP TT1521 MODELED GRAVITY - 981,929.2 (mgal) NAVD 88 TT1521 TT1521 HORZ ORDER - SECOND TT1521 VERT ORDER - FIRST CLASS II TT1521 TT1521.The horizontal coordinates were established by classical geodetic methods TT1521.and adjusted by the National Geodetic Survey in July 1986. TT1521. TT1521.The orthometric height was determined by differential leveling and TT1521.adjusted by the NATIONAL GEODETIC SURVEY TT1521.in June 1991. TT1521 TT1521.The Laplace correction was computed from DEFLEC12A derived deflections. TT1521 TT1521.The dynamic height is computed by dividing the NAVD 88 TT1521.geopotential number by the normal gravity value computed on the TT1521.Geodetic Reference System of 1980 (GRS 80) ellipsoid at 45 TT1521.degrees latitude (g = 980.6199 gals.). TT1521 TT1521.The modeled gravity was interpolated from observed gravity values. TT1521 TT1521. The following values were computed from the NAD 83(1986) position. TT1521 TT1521; North East Units Scale Factor Converg. TT1521;SPC AK 3 - 886,047.927 536,529.966 MT 0.99991634 +0 36 52.0 TT1521;UTM 06 - 6,870,270.322 588,967.693 MT 0.99969696 +1 29 49.6 TT1521 TT1521! - Elev Factor x Scale Factor = Combined Factor TT1521!SPC AK 3 - 0.99994862 x 0.99991634 = 0.99986496 TT1521!UTM 06 - 0.99994862 x 0.99969696 = 0.99964559 TT1521 TT1521: Primary Azimuth Mark Grid Az TT1521:SPC AK 3 - KLUTINA 182 08 47.5 TT1521:UTM 06 - KLUTINA 181 15 49.9 TT1521 TT1521|---------------------------------------------------------------------| TT1521| PID Reference Object Distance Geod. Az | TT1521| dddmmss.s | TT1521| TT1523 KLUTINA APPROX. 0.7 KM 1824539.5 | TT1521|---------------------------------------------------------------------| TT1521 TT1521 SUPERSEDED SURVEY CONTROL TT1521 TT1521 NAD 27 - 61 57 17.80100(N) 145 18 05.97600(W) AD( ) 2 TT1521 NGVD 29 (??/??/92) 312.40 (m) 1024.9 (f) COMPUTED 1 2 TT1521 TT1521.Superseded values are not recommended for survey control. TT1521 TT1521.NGS no longer adjusts projects to the NAD 27 or NGVD 29 datums. TT1521.See file dsdata.txt to determine how the superseded data were derived. TT1521 TT1521_U.S. NATIONAL GRID SPATIAL ADDRESS: 6VWP8896770270(NAD 83) TT1521 TT1521_MARKER: DS = TRIANGULATION STATION DISK TT1521_SETTING: 36 = SET IN A MASSIVE STRUCTURE TT1521_SP_SET: PIER TT1521_STAMPING: ASTRONOMICAL STATION TT1521_STABILITY: B = PROBABLY HOLD POSITION/ELEVATION WELL TT1521 TT1521 HISTORY - Date Condition Report By TT1521 HISTORY - 1911 MONUMENTED CGS TT1521 HISTORY - 1941 GOOD CGS TT1521 HISTORY - 1949 GOOD USGS TT1521 HISTORY - 1949 GOOD USAF TT1521 HISTORY - 1952 GOOD CGS TT1521 HISTORY - 1964 GOOD CGS TT1521 HISTORY - 1964 GOOD CGS TT1521 HISTORY - 1966 DESTROYED CGS TT1521 TT1521 STATION DESCRIPTION TT1521 TT1521'DESCRIBED BY COAST AND GEODETIC SURVEY 1911 (ES) TT1521'THE STATION IS ABOUT 18 METERS W OF THE TRAIL GOING N AND ABOUT 100 TT1521'METERS N OF THE KLUTINA RIVER. TT1521' TT1521'STATION IS MARKED WITH A CONCRETE PIER 14 BY 26 INCHES ON TOP AND TT1521'PROJECTING 34 INCHES ABOVE GROUND. THE BASE IS 2 FEET IN THE GROUND TT1521'AND SOMEWHAT LARGER THAN THAT PART OF THE PIER THAT PROJECTS ABOVE TT1521'THE GROUND. A COPPER DISK TRIANGULATION STATION MARK WITH THE WORDS TT1521'ASTRONOMICAL STATION STAMPED ABOUT THE TRIANGLE IS SET IN THE TT1521'TOP OF THE PIER. TT1521 TT1521 STATION RECOVERY (1941) TT1521 TT1521'RECOVERY NOTE BY COAST AND GEODETIC SURVEY 1941 (ANS) TT1521'STATION RECOVERED, MARK FOUND TO BE IN GOOD CONDITION. THE ORIGINAL TT1521'DESCRIPTION IS NOT ADEQUATE AT PRESENT, THE FOLLOWING IS TO BE USED. TT1521'THE STATION IS IN THE THIRD JUDICIAL DISTRICT, ABOUT 1/4 MILE W OF TT1521'THE COPPER CENTER ROAD HOUSE, 65 FEET W OF THE CENTER LINE OF THE TT1521'RICHARDSON HIGHWAY, ABOUT 75 YARDS N OF A TIN WAREHOUSE OF THE TT1521'ALASKA ROAD COMMISSION, AND ABOUT 130 YARDS N OF THE KLUTINA RIVER. TT1521'(THE KLUTINA RIVER HAS CHANGED ITS COURSE SINCE THE ORIGINAL TT1521'DESCRIPTION WAS WRITTEN.) THE MARK IS AN OLD TYPE TRIANGULATION TT1521'DISK, INSCRIBED ASTRONOMICAL STATION, SET IN THE TOP OF A CONCRETE TT1521'POST 14 INCHES WIDE, 26 INCHES LONG AND 34 INCHES HIGH. TT1521' TT1521'TO REACH THE STATION FROM THE COPPER CENTER ROAD HOUSE GO W ON GRADED TT1521'ROAD FOR 1/4 MILE TO THE TIN WAREHOUSE OF THE ALASKA ROAD COMMISSION TT1521'AND THE STATION. TT1521' TT1521'THE ELEVATION OF THE STATION IS ABOUT 1026 FEET. TT1521' TT1521'NO OTHER MARKS WERE ESTABLISHED. TT1521' TT1521'THIS STATION WAS TIED TO THE TRIANGULATION ARC IN 1941. TT1521 TT1521 STATION RECOVERY (1949) TT1521 TT1521'RECOVERY NOTE BY US GEOLOGICAL SURVEY 1949 (RB) TT1521'STATION FOUND AS DESCRIBED. TT1521' TT1521'STATION MARK--A STANDARD NGS DISK SET IN A CONCRETE PIER PROJECTING TT1521'3.0 FT. TT1521 TT1521 STATION RECOVERY (1949) TT1521 TT1521'RECOVERY NOTE BY US AIR FORCE 1949 TT1521'STATION AND REFERENCE MARKS WERE RECOVERED AS DESCRIBED AND IN GOOD TT1521'CONDITION. TT1521 TT1521 STATION RECOVERY (1952) TT1521 TT1521'RECOVERY NOTE BY COAST AND GEODETIC SURVEY 1952 (TCC) TT1521'THE STATION WAS RECOVERED IN GOOD CONDITION. IT IS LOCATED AT COPPER TT1521'CENTER, ALONG THE RICHARDSON HIGHWAY, 0.6 MI. S OF STEWARTS STORE, TT1521'1/4 MI. W OF COPPER CENTER ROAD HOUSE, 0.15 MI. NE OF A STEEL GIRDER TT1521'BRIDGE OVER KLUTINA RIVER, 271 FT. E OF THE E CORNER OF A TIN TT1521'WAREHOUSE OF THE ALASKA ROAD COMMISSION, 137.5 FT. N OF AND TT1521'ACROSS THE HIGHWAY FROM THE N CORNER OF THE HYKE TRANSFER SERVICE TT1521'GARAGE, 63 FT. NW OF THE CENTERLINE OF THE HIGHWAY, AND ABOUT 2 FT. TT1521'HIGHER THAN THE HIGHWAY. IT IS MARKED BY A TRIANGULATION-STATION TT1521'DISK, STAMPED ASTRONOMICAL STATION AND SET IN THE TOP OF A 14- TT1521'BY 26-IN. CONCRETE PIER PROJECTING 3.0 FT. ABOVE THE GROUND. TT1521 TT1521 STATION RECOVERY (1964) TT1521 TT1521'RECOVERY NOTE BY COAST AND GEODETIC SURVEY 1964 (GCR) TT1521'THE STATION WAS RECOVERED AS DESCRIBED AND FOUND TO BE IN GOOD TT1521'CONDTION. IT IS 59.0 FEET WEST OF THE CENTER LINE OF THE RICHARDSON TT1521'HIGHWAY. 55.0 FEET EAST OF THE NORTHEAST CORNER OF THE STANDARD OIL TT1521'COMPANY BUILDINGS. TT1521 TT1521 STATION RECOVERY (1964) TT1521 TT1521'RECOVERY NOTE BY COAST AND GEODETIC SURVEY 1964 TT1521'0.6 MI S FROM COPPER CENTER. TT1521'0.6 MILE SOUTH ALONG STATE HIGHWAY 4 FROM THE POST OFFICE AT COPPER TT1521'CENTER, ABOUT 0.15 MILE NORTHEAST OF A STEEL AND CONCRETE BRIDGE OVER TT1521'THE KLUTINA RIVER, 157 FEET NORTHEAST OF THE SOUTHEAST CORNER OF THE TT1521'STANDARD OIL COMPANY WAREHOUSE, 137 1/2 FEET NORTH AND ACROSS THE TT1521'HIGHWAY FROM THE COPPER CENTER GARAGE, 60 FEET NORTHWEST OF THE TT1521'CENTERLINE OF THE HIGHWAY, AND ABOUT 2 1/2 FEET HIGHER THAN THE TT1521'HIGHWAY. A DISK SET IN THE TOP OF A 14 BY 26-INCH CONCRETE PIER TT1521'PROJECTING 2.5 FEET. TT1521 TT1521 STATION RECOVERY (1966) TT1521 TT1521'RECOVERY NOTE BY COAST AND GEODETIC SURVEY 1966 (EWR) TT1521'THIS MARK WAS FOUND BROKEN OFF, AND LYING ON THE GROUND. THE DISK TT1521'WAS RECLAIMED FROM THE BLOCK OF CEMENT. THERE WAS NO SUBSURFACE, OR TT1521'REFERENCE MARKS SET FOR THIS STATION. PRESENT CONDITION TT1521'DESTROYED

The one I placed had a horizontal post hole. If I were to drill my own, it might have a slight angle down, so gravity assists it staying in place. But I won't make anything for Geocaching that leaves a trace when I later remove the cache (makes some cache ideas tougher, sure), and I definitely won't ask to drill a hole, and I won't drill a hole in other people's property, for a host of reasons. I'll leave the hole drilling to the experts.

That will be a ding for Hellfire And if anyone’s interested, this is when all the other events appeared in the games a. Tumbling a. Certain black-and-white era mat events (hands up callisthenics) had all the acrobatic verve of school gymnastics certificate six, which, I recall, featured skills as demanding as the 'forward roll' and the gravity-defying 'standing up'. Tumbling, however, was no such primary-school farce. American Rowland 'Flip' Wolfe took gold in Los Angeles thanks to his revolutionary backflip with double twist, only to see the event flick-flack off the floor and into gymnastic history. b. running deer shooting b. The men's single-shot running deer competition was one of 15 shooting sports events on the Shooting at the 1908 Summer Olympics programme.[1] A deer-shaped target made 10 runs of 75 feet, with the shooter firing one shot during each run. The runs lasted about 4 seconds each and took place 110 yards distant from the shooter. There were three concentric circles on the target, with the smallest counting for 4 points, the middle for 3, and the outermost for 2. A hit outside the circles but still on the target (except on the haunch) counted for 1 point. The maximum possible score was thus 40 points. c. horseshoes (throwing) HAS NOT BEEN AN OLYMPIC EVENT. d. club swinging d. Not in fact a night out for bored couples, but an event that involved swinging a club festooned with ribbons very quickly around the body and head, in a complicated routine. At the 1932 Games, American George Roth displayed a level of dedication seldom seen in the modern Olympic era. It was the Great Depression and Roth was unemployed and hungry. Yet he won gold. Seconds after being awarded his medal in front of 60,000 spectators, he walked out of the stadium in Los Angeles and hitchhiked home. e. tug of war e. Entertainment for West Country cider heads during the summer fête? Tell that to the ancient Greeks, renowned for their physical and intellectual stamina, who staged their first tug in 500BC. In modern Olympic rules, a team of eight had to pull the opposition six feet to win, but if no such drama had occurred after five minutes, the side who had pulled their opponents the furthest triumphed. London 1908 saw the sport at its most intense, when America were beaten in just a few short seconds by Great Britain. The unhappy losers accused Team GB, all of them policemen, of wearing illegal spiked boots, so we offered them a rematch in our socks ... and still stuffed them. f. under water swimming f. The men's underwater swimming was an event on the Swimming at the 1900 Summer Olympics schedule in Paris. The 1900 Games were the only occasion such an event was held. It was held on 12 August 1900. 14 swimmers from 4 nations competed. It was not featured at later Olympic games because of lack of spectator appeal g. 200m obstacle swimming g. The men's 200 metre obstacle event was an event in the 1900 Summer Olympics held in Paris. The 1900 Games were the only occasion such an event was held. It was held on 11 August and 12 August 1900. Twelve swimmers from five nations competed.There were three obstacles throughout the 200 metre course. Swimmers had to climb over the first two (a pole and a row of boats), and swim under the third (another row of boats)

Thanks for the link. I'd never see such a list and had wondered. Dolphin? interesting. There are many dolphin statues on Florida's west coast and likely on other parts of the U.S. coast. I assume that's the reference? I found a "gravity plug" marker type (now destroyed). Wondered about the marker name at the time. It was an antenna, now decommissioned and removed. What about it was "gravity plug" I dunno. There are find X number of marker challenges. I own one in FL, there's at least one in Colorado https://coord.info/GC4V2V1 (If you ever get a chance to visit Washington D.C., be sure to check out the benchmark listings. Some interesting marker types within the range of normal tourist walking.)

I'm not sure I follow, you might have to spoon feed it to me. I think your answer and quote doesn't apply to my question 1) and 4), just to my 2) and 3). I think you're saying it could have been a different marker and updated with Horiz later, so it might not have a triangle? That wouldn't be mentioned in the records? If I understand correctly about the symbol: since the records don't mention magnetism, or gravity, it's definitely not marking the tide, it's not a reference mark, and not a state mark, that eliminates a bunch of possibilities. On page 12, figure 28, that leaves: triangulation, and maybe these 4: azimuth, traverse, geodetic, topographic. So a triangle with a dot or maybe: crossed arrow, larger triangle with a dot, crossed line, or empty circle. (I'm not sure all of those disks existed in 1930 though.) A crossed line does closer match the questionable description of "cross hairs." Thanks for that tip, as I noticed PB&PP marks with a triangle on them say "$250 fine for disturbing" whereas those with a circle say "$250 fine for disturbing benchmark." That could be important. Is there any way to reverse engineer what the original symbol was? Regarding Azimuth, reference marks, long RM marks: would those all be documented and in the NGS database and come up in a search? Or could there be some undocumented azimuth/rm disks kicking around in the same area and I'm barking up the wrong tree with HV4826? If they are 1/4 mile away from triangulation stations, maybe the mystery marker is a reference marker for BOWEN, or maybe CIA TANK. Though BOWEN's paperwork listed 2 RMs about 75 feet away, not 1/4 mile. Thanks!

The key is the Order of the stations, as shown on the NGS data sheets. For older measurements, this will be the relative accuracy compared to other stations in the area. For newer, GPS derived, data they may give both the local accuracy and the accuracy relative to the world as measured in the NAD83 latest refinement. Try to use First Order stations. Is the student just needing a distance, or is lat-lon also critical? How far apart should they be? The most accurate distances, maybe down to a millimeter, are for calibration baselines, of which most states have at least one, although some of them (like the one nearest me) have been allowed to deteriorate. Baselines often go out to near a mile. On the sidetrack of vertical accuracy, there are two problems with GPS elevations. The first is that since you don't have satellites both above and below the accuracy is poorer than for horizontal where you can have satellites in any direction. The second and more fundamental reason is that GPS measures a different kind of elevation than does optical leveling. Optical leveling follows the surfaces of constant gravity and measures with respect to the theoretical "sea level" geoid underground. GPS has no knowledge of gravity and computes the elevation above the mathematically perfect ellipsoid model. NGS is working on the conversion between systems by getting more gravity data in the 10-year GRAV-D program.

I can contribute a bit on the gravity stations: They are very important to our Department of Defense and NASA, since knowing the exact gravity gradients in various areas of the earth are critical to proper space (orbital or ballistic) navigation, and other "scientific reasons". Large efforts were undertaken starting at the beginning of the "space age". Of course there were gravity measurements previously, but these measurements, coupled with critical location (i.e. accurate geodetic position) had just become more important. I have seen gravity stations more commonly near DOD or NASA installation. BDT: Any near such facilities near your gravity station grouping? Above is a very short summary (by me, no research) of a very complex subject. (BTW: Happy Veteran's Day to the other Vets out there!) EDIT: DaveD beat me to the punch on gravity, and with more survey related details (thanks!), but I'll stand by the above as well.

Your description of horizontal is essentially correct. While heights can be determined using vertical angles, the most accurate heights and hence the bench marks set by NGS and others comes from differential leveling. You can find some images of Coast Surveyors and NGS crews "running levels" on our history site -- http://www.photolib.noaa.gov/cgs/deter1.html. Gravity observations are a significant part of the data required to map the shape of the geoid and provide corrections for the leveling observations. Currently there are several ways of observing gravity, including: absolute and relative terrestrial gravity, airborne gravity and space-based systems such as the Gravity Recovery and Climate Experiment (GRACE). Gravity observations also provide an understanding of the relationship between the geoid and the ellipsoid from which horizontal coordinates are computed by providing the deflection of the vertical which is the angular difference between a normal to the ellipsoid and a normal to the geoid at the same terrestrial point. Magnetic observations were originally conducted by the Coast & Geodetic Survey but the function was transferred to the U.S. Geological Survey in the '70s. While magnetic observations have numerous applications, in surveying they provided a way for surveyors using a compass to be able to adjust or correct their instruments for the difference between geodetic and magnetic north.

I've been using one for almost exactly a year now (it was on such a good offer back then I upgraded from a perfectly decent etrex20) . The only issue I've had is the tiny sliding/pivoting metal memory card door, which somehow got itself loose and fell out when I was changing AA cells in the field ... as I've only ever opened the memory card door once ( to install a card with osm maps on when I got the device) the only way I can imagine this happened is if some time earlier I dropped the device when no cells were in place, jarring the memory card door at just the right angle to partially open by itself, then next time I opened the back to change the cells the flap was at a position to finish opening and gravity did the rest ... I got it back in, but it doesn't hold the card tight against the contacts any more , so there is a tiny square of paper folded up and between the AAs and the metal holder now to keep it snug, without that my maps (which I have on that card ) are unavailable, but the device works fine otherwise. So I'll be very careful in the future with how I treat that tiny metal door ! Apart from that small mechanical problem, I've had no issues , it's quietly steered me to around 1000 geocaches.

I kind of get where you're coming from. I like putting out multicaches and I enjoy designing them with surprises along the way. But, I like fun surprises. Using a prop or something humorous at a waypoint/final. I wouldn't put out a multi that has you blindly following an unknown number of stages and along the way, you will encounter a stage that you need to know theoretical physics to solve or a death defying climb (mainly because I'm useless at either of those things). If I had something that I would consider difficult or dangerous, I would warn you in the description. I want my caches to be fun, not perilous. But, I've been looking for multicaches that do bring me to something I cannot do. For those, I simply turn and leave. I know I got as far as I'm going to go with that cache and it's ok if I don't end up finishing it. I don't think ill of the CO for putting a cache like that out. I chose to hunt it. Anytime I go looking for a cache, I accept the reality that I may not be able to find it or that I may not be up to the task, be it physically or mentally.

Without gravity observations there would be no way that NGS (USC&GS) could provide accurate heights (bench marks) for the country. These observations are vital to the proper reduction of leveling observations. They are also an important part of the horizontal component of the reference frame as they help in the determination of what's call the Deflection of the Vertical. This allows for the accurate determination of the relations between the Earth's gravity field and the determination of coordinates on a mathematical reference surface -- the ellipsoid. NGS is currently involved in a historical undertaking to observe gravity from space platforms (GRACE, GOCE), airborne, absolute, marine and relative measurements to form the foundation for a new national vertical datum based purely on gravity data- bench marks from NGS will become a thing of the past. This effort is describe in detail on the NGS web site (http://www.ngs.noaa.gov) and search for GRAV-D (Gravity for the Redefinition of the American Vertical Datum)

I used a Galaxy s5 until it got in a gravity storm, and currently an older LG of some type. I set my phone's Location Service to use GPS only. This makes a huge difference in areas where I am on the edge of a cell tower's coverage. Try doing this before you spend the $ on a new phone that may perform no differently.

Buttermilk--the thrill of something so old and linked to the earliest days of US History, https://www.geocaching.com/mark/details.aspx?PID=LX4113 Dayton Harris Gravity Station--the rarest kind of disk, and it's in the middle of Death Valley! I was FTF on a benchmarking challenge (find 10 of the 11 kinds of disks), but darn it I just didn't want to find them all even though I'd already completed the challenge! I had a great trip to Nevada and California and explored Death Valley just so I could find that benchmark, https://www.geocaching.com/mark/details.aspx?PID=GS0206

or maybe Waymark Code: WMJPFQ Icarus, whose official name is MACS J1149+2223 Lensed Star 1, is the farthest individual star ever seen. It is only visible because it is being magnified by the gravity of a massive galaxy cluster, located about 5 billion light-years from Earth.

I never gained weight. Gravity just became stronger. An example of what has happened over the years is present in fossil records. Back when there was much less gravity when the dinosaurs roamed the earth, the dinosaurs got HUGE because gravity had little effect on them. As gravity increases, the animals become smaller and smaller. It also explains why mice exist. They are the next evolution of global dominant species. Their small size won't affect them as gravity gets stronger and stronger. Larger animals won't be able to support themselves and will become extinct, leaving mice in charge.

What about people like: The Hygenic Cacher - will find a cache as long as it doesn't involve handling anything too nasty. If it's a clean container in a clean location that's fine but no reaching into spiderwebs or moving around wet and dirty logs or anything. The Lazy Cacher - will gladly find endless caches as long as they can park within about 50 feet. If you can reach the cache from the driver's seat without having to get out of the car, so much the better. The Psycho Cacher - will place or hunt caches in the most improbable of locations, only accessible by a series of death-defying manoeuvres where one false move would lead to certain death at the hands of Gravity. The Safe Cacher - the opposite of Psycho Cacher, this type will only attempt caches that are readily accessible with both feet firmly on terra firma. They may consider reaching above their head, as long as they don't have to reach too high. Shares many characteristics of Lazy Cacher - you never know what dangers you might face if you're more than 100 yards from the car.

I'm attempting to further my education here, so I thought I'd expose my level of ignorance and ask a few questions.... I thought I knew a lot about surveying and the uses of survey marks, but after reflecting on it, I find that I really don't know much about them. Hopefully some people who know more than I can explain some or all of these things. Horizontal control and Vertical control marks are aspects of geodetic surveying but Cadastral is not. Geodetic surveying determines the position of points with respect to the Earth's geoid, longitude and latitude. Cadastral surveying only relates to local and distant borders, I think. Techniques I think I understand very basically how horizontal control is done - either by measuring distances, azimuths, and vertical angles, or by using GPS, and then using an adjustment program to resolve a net of such control points.. Vertical control also uses the measurement of distances and vertical angles, or perhaps just distances and something else, I don't know. Whether or not angular measurements are used at all is unknown to me. In any case, it is also adjsuted by a computer program to resove a vertical control net. Cadastral surveying is even more of a mystery to me than vertical control. I can find no explanation on the internet as to how it is done. Certainly distances and horizontal angles are used, but I don't know what's done about the vertical component. Does a property on a mountainside have more surface area compared to the same 'size' property on flat land, or is it the same surface area? I don't know if cadastral surveying can make use of GPS technology. Another puzzle to me is why the central and western U.S. has a lot of cadastral marks while the eastern third doesn't seem to have many cadastral marks. I realize that the borders of the western 2/3 of the country tends to have been laid out on grids, but both the whole country has borders. It would seem that the more complex eastern third would be more in need of cadastral marks. Uses It's pretty obvious that geodetic control is involved with mapmaking, and cadastral surveying is involved when property (private or municipal) borders and boundaries need to be established or re-established. Beyond that generality, I'm not sure of exact uses, for instance, if a new building is to be built, is geodetic surveying or cadastral surveying required, or both? Railroads and bridges tend to have vertical control marks. Is it that no one cares if a bridge is moved downstream a bit by a storm or car accident, just so it isn't any lower or higher? Is it a grade issue, where car roads and railroads need to be messured in terms of vertical distance for some reason? Are the marks established to help build these roads, or are they established after construction, as some aspect of maintenance? I can see that if a building is to be built, it must be located well within its proper property boundaries, and cadastral surveying does that, but what then are geodetic horizontal control points for besides making paper (or computer) maps? Do cadastral systems ultimately depend on geodetic control? Even more obscure Even more obscure are magnetic stations and gravity stations. Are these remnants of scientific research projects? There are gravity anomalies that warp the geoid but what do these stations do? There's a mountain road vaguely near here that has at least 20 gravity stations on it. There's no mining there anymore, if there ever was much, so what was the curiousity that was or will be satisfied by these gravity stations? What does a gravity station do that a vertical control bench mark does not do?

I know what you're saying, Gungadoy! I went after what I was hoping was a gravity station in Iowa that hadn't been visited by the NGS in nearly 40 years. It turned out to not be a gravity station, but it really was a thrill when I dug the Azimuth Mark out of the mud, poured water on it, and it appeared before me. Now, the 2 marks had witness posts, so it wasn't a hard job to find them, still I really enjoyed being the first to recover them after so many years. There were only coordinates for the main mark, so I did follow the directions to find the Azimuth Mark. I would like to go after something with a full set sometime, maybe I'll buy my own economy metal detector in the new year! You might have to dnf a cache, but you know it's been found recently. I went 100 miles out of my way just to see if this mark still existed, and lo and behold it did! The drive and hunt were worth it! LF1239, recovered 8/24/15

I completed Gungadoy's challenge--it was a lot of fun finding the old, hard to find marks! Here's my state survey from Deland, Florida, and there are pics of the location, etc., in my log. It's AQ1245. I'm including my magnetic disc from West Virginia, HY0008. Gungadoy pointed out a Gravity Station reference mark in northern Florida, BE0315, and a Topographical Disc, AG1367 near Tampa--as he noted, it's tough to find one outside an airport. I used those to complete the challenge. I really need to get to California to get that last disc, the elusive Gravity Station!

Maybe we can use them as an example when we appeal because a reviewer will not publish our listings with proximity, commercial, and railroad issues. Sounds like there were three strikes. Were the problems real or not? "Commercial" is debatable in some cases, but railroad and proximity are almost always clear cut. Looks commerical to me. This morning it made me want coffee and toast, now I'm ready for a craft beer. "Between Milan Coffee Works, the Mother Loaf, and Original Gravity Company. Residents are able to purchase handmade quality products. These three businesses are owner operated and offer phenomenal products. Milan Coffee Works roasts and brews its own coffee from raw coffee beans. The Mother Loaf bakery has the most amazing artisan breads around. Original Gravity is a destination for beer enthusiasts; all their brews are made in house and they offer a family friendly environment so everybody can enjoy. If you haven’t already tried products from these companies, we hope you will make a trip back soon."