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quote:Originally posted by mfratto:and just for the record, this "sport" reeks of commericalism -- think of the money that goes into doing it. this is not a money-free sport -- at the very least, you need two (gps and computer) and possible three (car/truck) and maybe more very expensive pieces of equiptment to "play." Then there is buying all the fun stuff, shirts, hats, etc. And there is nothing wrong with it, but there isn't much these days that isn't commercial -- unless you mean a walk through with woods -- with no gps, no cache, and no other "goodies." For some of us, when we talk about "commercialism" in this forum we don't mean the money we spend to PLAY the sport. we are talking about the caches that are commercial. Big difference. By your definition, everything about our lives is commercial. That's not what we mean.

I should also add here that my first cache has been found by the park rangers... From what I'm told they signed the log book and replaced the cache. I would like to talk to them about it and I certainly will when I get back there (3 1/2 hours away).. I am somewhat embarrassed that I did not ask for permission prior but feel it would be best to admit my haste and thank them for their acceptance. In general it's so hard to get addresses and phone numbers of contact people though. I have tried emailing the state parks service and they refered me to another webpage that looped me back to them. Ttepee

More thoughts-- yeah, who in the NPS would really know? With all due respect to Buzbon, did he talk to the 'right' guy? And who knows what opposite answer another fellow might give if asked the same question? I'm all for respecting property rights and all the laws that make sense to me in this world-- or ignoring the ones that don't affect me or I think are ridiculous. That being said, I sincerely doubt the NPS has a policy on geocaching-- for the simple reason that they have no experience with it more than likely, and if they did, they'd simply apply (I'm guessing) some regulation that would apply to being fined for failing to remove trash. I will suspect that the jury is out.

Well having just finished our first one my roomate and I have decided to create one of our own as well. What I am wondering, for you Ames residents, have you had to recieve persmission from the Parks and Rec office to do this? or should our first step be to talk to them?

ckpackers like myself, removal of all vehicles from necessary trailheads in remote desert will necessarily remove all human contact from vast tracts of desert lands... Well, gee. Maybe you just won't get to see everything in your lifetime. You have my sympathies, but the overall health of the environment is FAR more important than your (and my) selfish human desire to "conquer" it. quote:Since human habitation has been going on in the U.S. deserts for approximately 4,000 years the idea that all humans are better kept away for fear of potential environmental damage is absurd. The absurdity is yours. Talk about uninformed. You should read just a little about the historic population of the North American deserts. You'll learn that there were NOT millions of inhabitants with "vehicles" roaming the deserts. In fact, the wheel did not even exist on the continent until it was brought by Europeans. Your lack of knowledge is going to make it very difficult for you to prove your argument.

ckpackers like myself, removal of all vehicles from necessary trailheads in remote desert will necessarily remove all human contact from vast tracts of desert lands... Well, gee. Maybe you just won't get to see everything in your lifetime. You have my sympathies, but the overall health of the environment is FAR more important than your (and my) selfish human desire to "conquer" it. quote:Since human habitation has been going on in the U.S. deserts for approximately 4,000 years the idea that all humans are better kept away for fear of potential environmental damage is absurd. The absurdity is yours. Talk about uninformed. You should read just a little about the historic population of the North American deserts. You'll learn that there were NOT millions of inhabitants with "vehicles" roaming the deserts. In fact, the wheel did not even exist on the continent until it was brought by Europeans. Your lack of knowledge is going to make it very difficult for you to prove your argument.

I had a Magellan GPS 310 for our first cache hunt yesterday and it worked pretty good. But I wanted the thousandths, so I was told the etrex (yellow) was the way to go. I got that and did our 2nd hunt today. I think the trees were a little thicker, but not dramatically. I kept getting 'weak signal' messages and it took an unfun amount of time to find the cache. And in the car - yesterday I was comparing the 310's speed to my speedometer, no problem. Today, I had to hold the etrex up to the window. Looking at the signal strength of each satellite on the etrex, I get maybe 3 strong signals when I was standing in a baseball field sized open area, in the center. Yesterday, the 310 woudl talk of tracking 5-9 satellites (not sure how strong the signals were for all of them though! I've read a bunch of threads about the etrex and am really confused on moving up again to the 315. Any thoughts?!

I'm looking to buy my first GPS system. I was looking at the GPS 315 and thought it sounded decent. Not knowing the least bit of anything about them, it sounded good. I've read a lot of you talk very good about it and was wondering what a good price is for it. The one I saw was $150, is that a good buy?

This controversy regarding 'commercial geocaching' or 'virtual caches'-- what's the point here, bottom line, for us all? Why do we geocache? My answer is below... ? it's fun! Am I having fun? ? it gets me outdoors and to places I've never been-- it helps me to discover my world! ? it gives me a fuller understanding of the technology of GPS... expands my experience in general web and other tech... I like gadgets that have practical applications. ? but am I having fun and getting some exercise? There are the keys... for me! If I go to a cache that's commercial-- like the coffee shop in question... if it's labeled as commercial, then fine! I'll take my chances by going. If some guy thinks that the coffee shop is great, well hell! Fine, I don't mind! Finding a place by virtue of GPS tech is the challenge. Better yet would be instructions on the web announcement page to enter the shop and ask for the cache (a real one!) from someone behind the counter. Inside could be coffee drink coupons provided the geocacher/coffee shop enthusiast. That works for me! C'mon guys! Purism is fine, and for me, I don't care if the GPS coordinates are the most gorgeous waterfall in California or some greasy dive in San Francisco that has the best calamari I'll ever taste. Point is, I don't have an address to check-- only GPS coords. If Joe Geocacher likes Coffeeshop X or Restaurant Le Spoon de Greese, I don't mind if he posts it on the site. The getting there is the thing. Still, a physical cache would be damned preferable. I want the cacher to work a LITTLE bit-- talk to the proprietor or staff of the commercial spot s/he likes, and set up a PHYSICAL CACHE. Tell the staff or proprietor to expect occasionally folks with little 'cell phones' coming to the store. Can't be bad for business-- they may even use the service or goods available there! I'm planning a series of waypoints and cache for my wife. I'll start with her going to my friend's house (give her the key) where she will then have instructions to get the GPS I'll leave there with the pre-programmed waypoint stops on her trip toward her final present. I'll send her to a coffee shop I like-- with instructions to speak to the staff and make some identifying request so that she can access the cache. From there, another item she must take to the next waypoint on her schedule. And so forth-- where she finally ends up at the massage/hot tub studio we occasionally go to. Now, I wouldn't post this on the geocaching site-- it's just for her. Look, geocaching is all about having fun, getting out and getting exercise, and seeing the new stuff in the world to see. Having fun. Is there something wrong with the Planet of the Apes search promotion? Naah. It looks like fun. So, ask yourself-- what's the point of geocaching except to enjoy yourself? If coffeeshop owner puts out a commercial cache, that's one thing. You as a poster make your choice. If I see an ad in the paper for a new restaurant with NO address or phone number,other than good food provided at reasonable prices, whoa! Cool! (not good promotion, really, but cool. How many of us have GPS devices?) But, imagine! First it was email addresses, then websites. Soon it'll be... GPS coordinates? Are we having fun yet? Lots of possibilities with this technology-- and I'm already working them into my personal life with my wife. Gives me a chance to be 'clever' and creative-- another cool thing about the technology! Well? Are you having fun? Well?

Reading all the problems folks are having with caches being plundered, has anyone thought of designing one to be "in plain sight" yet still unseen? Like hiding your house key in what looks like a rock or putting your cash in a fake coke can? I would think a frosting bucket painted like a tree stump would hide nicely. Do all caches need to be outdoors? Could you talk the local law enforcement to store a cach - they are open 24/7/365 and no one would cheat! Even one of those 24 hour gas stops might help out. Get creative and let me know your ideas!

quote:Originally posted by bwolv:Heee heee, (TSlack200) I'm glad we reached the same answer! Hey! You dropped a 0 in my handel! Didn't we just talk about this.

quote:Originally posted by bwolv:Heee heee, (TSlack200) I'm glad we reached the same answer! Hey! You dropped a 0 in my handel! Didn't we just talk about this.

Green is sold out. I'll probably get more in 3 weeks. I didn't have enough cash to make a huge run of hats, but was able to finagle a larger run this time. The stone hats in two tone colors are now out of stock at the manufacturer (though we do have a few left in stock here), so we'll be getting stone sandwich hats - same color on the outside but not two-tone. We're also getting a stone bucket cap. Sorry, can't talk about the secret item yet Jeremy

Green is sold out. I'll probably get more in 3 weeks. I didn't have enough cash to make a huge run of hats, but was able to finagle a larger run this time. The stone hats in two tone colors are now out of stock at the manufacturer (though we do have a few left in stock here), so we'll be getting stone sandwich hats - same color on the outside but not two-tone. We're also getting a stone bucket cap. Sorry, can't talk about the secret item yet Jeremy

quote:Originally posted by jeremy:I had a talk with one of these companies about using their tracking devices and making them hitchikers, but they wanted me to pay for them. Yuk. They can get expensive. Battery power would be the biggest concern. You'd have to have an extremely low power device, solar powered, or nuclear to keep it going for any good deal of time. Jeremy Nuclear powered beer? We truely are a superior civilization. :~) Take that you peksy Apes! ------------------ -Iron Chef _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ agefive.com/geocache/ ~ Fe-26 Lets Drive Fast and Eat Cheese!

I had a talk with one of these companies about using their tracking devices and making them hitchikers, but they wanted me to pay for them. Yuk. They can get expensive. Battery power would be the biggest concern. You'd have to have an extremely low power device, solar powered, or nuclear to keep it going for any good deal of time. Jeremy

I'm with BKDotCom. I use the "Information [?] symbol. I hadn't thought about using two different symbols for "un-found" and "found". But, I think that is a good idea. Maybe we could talk the manufactures into a software/firmware upgrade that would meet our needs. Anyone know any product planning managers at Garmin, Magellen, etc.?

I'm with BKDotCom. I use the "Information [?] symbol. I hadn't thought about using two different symbols for "un-found" and "found". But, I think that is a good idea. Maybe we could talk the manufactures into a software/firmware upgrade that would meet our needs. Anyone know any product planning managers at Garmin, Magellen, etc.?

Kimbo, I'll be glad to help. I often go cache hunting with the kids and Jen. And the 2 caches I've placed so far are within 300 feet from a parking area :-). Email me if you wanna talk about it. Jose

Kimbo, I'll be glad to help. I often go cache hunting with the kids and Jen. And the 2 caches I've placed so far are within 300 feet from a parking area :-). Email me if you wanna talk about it. Jose

Ok, so now that the Etrex and Palm can talk, what software is available to make use of this? ------------------ Peter Scholtz www.biometrics.co.za

I just want to say I had a blast and really enjoyed the picnic day. I'm glad the weather held and most of all, it was fun meeting all of you. I hope to post a lunch cache in the future, so I (sans kids) can talk more about cool caches that I'm working on and other silly topics. Glad I could help, hope you all had fun, and we'll definitely do it bigger and better next year! What ideas would you like to see next year? What would you like to contribute to next year's annual picnic? [This message has been edited by bigkid (edited 21 July 2001).]

I bet I could talk some Atlanta people into driving up to join you!

I've told people about GPS systems, which is a little redundant. Doesn't really matter, most of the people I talk to have no idea even when I say the long name - and I still have to explain what it is and what it does.

I got my first e-mail account and used PICO and PICOPINE as the e-mail editing program; and I used a text based web browser (Lynx). This was back in late 1992-93 when colleges were starting to get people into the concept of looking things up on the net. The idea was so new, there wasn't a way to cite information gathered on the 'net for research papers. I had a fondness for fooling around on GOPHER, and I actually enjoyed playing chess on the Internet Relay Chess server... I made many great friends, none of which I still talk to...Oh well, C'est la vie...