TahoeJoe

Do you, really? I sure don't. I never expect it. Pens freeze in the winter and dry out in the summer. Pencils break. They poke holes in baggies. Pencil sharpeners rust in the wild. Both pencils and pens can be stuck in the pockets of a previous finder. Photos of a find are technically not acceptable per the guidelines, although some cache owners may accept them. But they don't have to. Bring a pen. Bring three pens. I never realized that pencils and pens were so difficult to use in geocaching. I guess I’ve just been fortunate with most of the caches I’ve found. Perhaps we need to use thicker Baggies with pencils or better yet, crayons…. Wait they might melt on a hot day! All this thinking is giving me a headache. I think I need to clear my head and go out geocaching; I hope the cache has something to sign the logbook with!

I think it's up to the CO to provide something to sign the log book. I'm not a fan of caches so small a pencil won't fit and the log book gets filled up after 10 visits. If you're going to make a cache so small, accept a photo.

Gee, those things have never happened to me. But I have lost pens, so I carry at least 3. I've lost my shoe(s) on two different occasions with the pictures to prove it. I still don't carry a spare pair with me. Back in the vehicle now, that's a different story. I've loaded the kids in the car and forgotten their shoes and had to turn back.

I've been out riding my bike before and decided to find a cache while not having a pen. I'm one of those people that seldom carry a pen with me, I'm pretty much digital these days. I've yet to ever delete a log as I don't take the game that serious and don't sweat the little things in life. If someone chooses to claim they visited my cache and did not, that's their problem. The only time I could see deleting a find is if they wrote something inappropriate.

Well said, much more interesting to read about the person's interests than bragging about what they've done.

Forget about it and move on to the next cache. I wouldn't flag it to be archived, their might be some compailing reason that he has not taken care of the issue. No harm in giving him more time.

Geocaching has evolved since I started. I don’t care if the location is somewhat off, in fact I enjoy looking around for where the geocache could possibly be hidden. It would take some of the fun out of it if the coordinates were always spot on. If you’re all about numbers, I can see where slightly off coordinates could be an issue (I'm glad I'm not about numbers ). If the coordinates are too far off your logs will reflect this and you can make corrections. Let’s not overcomplicate things or the game becomes no longer enjoyable.

Usually when I go out looking for caches, I only have a couple in mind that spark my interest. It would be difficult to forget to log them. If you were along a power trail, I could see how you might easily miss a log or two.

If you are all about numbers, you are going to miss out on what's around you. It reminds me of when I go mountain biking with certain friends, they are all about how fast you can get through the trail. I myself like to enjoy what's around me and get off my bike and explore when i find something interesting. That one of the aspects of geocaching that attracted me in the first place. I find it funny that virtual caches were banned years ago but a cache in a micro container with no pencil or swag thrown in a bush every quarter mile is acceptable. Location, location, location is what makes a cache attractive to me. I guess the game has involved into a numbers game for most of the geocaching population. As long as that trend continues numbers will be what the game is all about.

I remember when I started (or back in the day ) when I knew almost all the players in my area and introduced the game to several friends. Being very active outdoors it was the perfect match for me to discover new places to hike to. Our little local group would help each other with maintenance and would occasionally run into each other as there were very few caches in the area and we would be excited when a new cache would pop up in the area. 90 percent of the caches were hidden in ammo cans and the rest were usually Tupperware containers. When we would log a cache back then we tended to be honest about what we thought of the placement and container with the intent of making the game and hides better. If I were to find nearby caches today and be honest in my logs, I would not be very well liked and probably be banned from the game as being perceive as rude. To me the game was about taking me to new interesting places or learning something new about a location. To my friends and myself it was never about numbers. I recently placed a new cache which involves a moderate hike and it has sat there for 4 weeks with no visits. The location is like an island surrounded by an ocean of unimaginative (for the most part) geocaches. What a shame as the cache sits at a locally interesting place with breathtaking views (there was a cache nearby about ½ mile away that I logged that was wonderful and gave me hope). This presents a good argument it’s all about numbers. We need us old-timers who remember what it was like to keep a little bit of the past alive in the game. I’ll continue to play but plan to be much more selective in my finds and plan to scope out some new locations for possible cache placements with the intent of placing some additional quality caches in our area.

A waiting period? Are we buying a firearm or geocaching? I've seen great caches placed by new players just as I've seen poor caches placed by seasoned players. To me it's more about the thought process of the individual when placing a cache. I don't see how a waiting period would change this. Perhaps reviewers are overwhelmed with the amount of new caches awaiting approval and poor caches are getting through. If this is the case, we should have more reviewers where needed.

You have my vote for the old school trail! I tried one power trail nearby and it was not for me. To each his own, but to me a cache that does not take me to somewhere interesting or spark my interest is not worth finding. The one power trail I tried was obviously placed to increase finds and I found it boring and monotonous.

Some of these challenge caches sound very similar to locationless or virtual caches which were banned years ago with the difference being having a physical cache with a logbook to log your challenge. Bring back the Yellow Jeep!

Hiking and mountain biking to new places or learning new local history.

Pehaps along with a test, new geocachers should also be fingerprinted and have a background check run on them. If they pass the background check, they can apply for a license which has to be renewed every 3 years. If there was a fee associated with this license, say around $100.00 this would weed out future poorly placed caches. For the test, I was thinking a 500 word essay where the applicant would have to interview at least 10 other geocachers with 1000 finds or more and ask them what makes a good geocache. We wouldn't want to make it easy for new people excited about the game.

My favorite virtual of all time would have been the "Yellow Jeep". I really enjoyed the virtual caches and wish we still had them. My most popular and visited cache is a virtual. If I remember they were dropped because they were not considered a true geocache.

I haven't seen trash in caches for years, but then again it's difficult to leave trash in a micro. I actually remember being annoyed with trash in caches when I first started. I guess you can't change how clean people are.

I totally agree that the game has changed and micros have gotten out of control. Seems to me that I remember in the golden years of geocaching, the goal of the game was for a cache to take you to an interesting place or teach you a bit of local history with an ammo can at the other end with a big log book to log your thoughts and to give you the opportunity to trade items. I for one could sit for an hour and enjoy reading the logbook entries. I actually enjoy reading the physical logbook way more than reading the online logs. Somewhere along the line things changed and the new goal appears to be about numbers with a micro logbook with only enough room for a name and absolutely no opportunity to trade items anymore (disappointing for the kids). I don't wish to place blame on any one party, but as a teacher it reminds me of when I teach a lesson. If a lesson strays from the direction I intended, it's my responsibility to get it back on track. Perhaps the majority of our community like the way things are, but I sure miss the way things used to be. I'm still playing the game but I'm going to start being much more selective on my hunts. You might say I'm going back to what I enjoyed about the game in the beginning. I'm also going to start placing some interesting traditional size caches in my area and see what happens.

Go for it and in your description state that the satellite coverage is spotty. You might also want to give a strong hint.

I guess only newbies are irresponsible, wasn't everybody a newbie once? Sure but this is the classic example of logic not working the other way around. We were all newbies once but not all of us were irresponsible newbies. Back in the day anyone who was sufficiently interested to go out with an expensive GPS was already more invested in the game than the person who downloaded a free app on their smartphone and didn't even bother to read guidelines. Of course if people download the free app and assume there's some Cache Fairy who puts all these little boxes out there, maybe they assume the idea is to find the cache and take it away with you so you can rehide it somewhere else (which many people I've talked to about geocaching have assumed, and have been surprised when I've said the idea is to sign the log and put it back where you found it), and have no skin in the game anyway so don't really care about the future of the sandwich box under the tree as long as they get to take part in the "geocaching experience" for a few days before giving up and going on to something else, it's hardly surprising that caches disappear or get trashed. He's 100% correct Joe. The newbies of today are not the newbies of 2002. Groundspeak most likely has the numbers, but they'll never release them. I wouldn't doubt 95% of people you see who joined within the last couple years with 50 finds or less downloaded a smartphone app. And many of them never visit the website. It's become nearly universal they're going to drop a lame 2 word or less find log on your cache. And many of them do think there is a cache fairy who puts those gamepieces out there, not a regular player like themselves. And yes, a 12 year old or so newbie found my 2004 mini Jasmer challenge for his very first find (he obviously didn't qualify), took it with him, and hid it as his own cache 4 miles away. Me, I studied this website for almost a month before joining the day of my first find (still don't know why I did that). It's a whole new world out there, trust us. That's the other thing I'm seeing in my area - kids playing. Some even say they are 12 years old, or they are in grade school or the go to the public school across from the park. I'm guessing most of them are not caching with their parents. In the olden golden days the only way to play was with a GPS unit. GPS receivers were/are expensive so it was the adults who were playing and they might include family members but the adult was in charge. Now most kids under 18 have a cell phone and most of those are smartphones. Download the free app and off you go - no parental supervision required. You have valid points and it appears that I’m still looking at things as they were 10 years ago. It’s true that for the most part 10 years ago geocaching was limited to those who could afford an expensive GPS device. My first GPS was the Magellan 315 which cost around $150.00 back in 1999. From what I have read it looks like anyone with a smart phone can download the free geocaching app and geocache without even having an account (not good). I have caches out there that have been around for 12 years and have not had the issues that other have been frustrated with. More than likely I haven’t had the problems because most of my caches are remote or are not accessible without an adult to get there. I have one cache that has only been logged 22 times in 12 years. The game has become much too commercialize for my taste but my two young sons really enjoy the game. It’s been difficult to find ammo can caches anymore (at least in my area) with 99 percent of the caches being micros. Perhaps PMO caches are a way to bring geocaching back to its roots.

I might be old school, but I have always enjoyed the ammo can. In urban settings, I understand the use of micros, but in the middle of the forest a micro is like looking for a needle in a haystack. Several of my caches I have placed (ammo cans) are going on 12 years now and they are as good as the day I placed them. This includes being buried under several feet of snow all winter. To each his own though.

That is a worst-case scenario. My point stands. Either way, for a year's worth of enjoyment, it's not a lot...eight cents a day. Unfortunately where I teach the worst case scenario is the norm, 65 percent of the population live below the poverty level.

I totally agree with you. Back when I started micros were the exception and ammo cans were the norm. Micros were placed where ammo cans would not work.Very few of the most recent caches I have found have not been worthy of finding.

I would like it, but then again I liked virtual caches.

Is it possible it was moved unintentionally nearby? Perhaps someone did not replace it in it's original location.